You Might Be A Leftist If...

[MagicMtnDan]

-You believe John Ashcroft poses a greater danger to America than Osama bin Laden
-You think President Bush lied to the nation but his predecessor did not.
-You believe President Bush is too dumb to be President and Arnold Schwarzenegger is too dumb to be Governor of California, but the Dixie Chicks, Martin Sheen, Alec Baldwin, Barbra Streisand, Eddie Vedder and Jeanine Garofalo are qualified to discourse at length on foreign policy.
-You believe all conservatives are racist, but do not think minorities can ever succeed without Affirmative Action.
-You can't decide which is worse: the Patriot Act or the Patriot Missile.
-You believe Saddam Hussein, Kim Jong Il, and Yasser Arafat were fairly and democratically elected, but President Bush was not.
-You root for prisoners when they escape from our oppressive prisons, but oppose allowing poor children to escape from failing public schools.
-You support every kind of "diversity" on campus, except political orientation.
-You support banning the smoking of tobacco and legalizing marijuana.
-You are enraged by the so-called mistreatment of Muslim prisoners (who have gained weight while dining on their specially prepared Koran-approved meals) at Guantanamo Bay, but believe the world should have stood idly by while Saddam Hussein filled mass graves.
-You have found where the right to an abortion is written in the Constitution but cannot find where the Constitution provides for a right to keep and bear arms.
-You support campus speech codes that ban pick-up lines and amorous gazes, but never spoke out against President Clinton's physical sexual harassment in the White House.
-You applauded Jimmy Carter for talking about human rights in foreign policy but opposed George W. Bush for doing something about human rights.
-You believe that trial lawyers taking 33 to 40 percent of a plaintiff's recovery in lawsuits is just about right, but the federal government taking this amount of our income in taxes is not nearly enough.
-You believe the former Governor of a New England state with 608,827 people is more than adequately experienced to be President in 2004, but the Governor of a Southwestern state with 21,325,018 people was completely unprepared in 2000.
-You agree with Toni Morrison that President Clinton was "the first black President," but didn't criticize Al Sharpton for recently labeling President Bush a "gang leader."
-You believe we could get more truth out of the Pentagon if only Don Rumsfeld were replaced by Mohammed Al-Sahhaf.
-You believe evangelical Christians are destroying America but don't feel threatened by the radical Wahabbi sect of Islam.
-When it comes to violent crime, you believe in hating the crime but loving the criminal.
-You support unlimited appeals for convicted criminals, but believe it is undemocratic for Californians to reverse their earlier mistake of electing Gray Davis.
-You believe U.S. exports of genetically modified foods pose a greater threat to African nations than corrupt dictators like Zimbabwe's Mugabe.
-You believe welfare is a fundamental human right and workfare is a human rights violation.
-You believe religion is a scourge on our society, but becoming one with Mother Nature by merging with the universal consciousness and harmonizing with lunar reverberations will save us.
-You believe President Bush is an environmental criminal for poisoning the water with arsenic, but have never complained about Saddam Hussein's devastating Iraq and Kuwait's environment by setting intentional oil well fires and committing genocide against the Marsh Arabs by draining their wetlands.
-Your car sports the bumper sticker saying that "it will be a great day when our schools have all the money they need and the military has to hold bake sales," but oppose allowing the U.S. military to volunteer recruitment tables on college campuses because of their "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy.
If the above has successfully profiled you, congratulations! You have won a one-way ticket to Paris aboard the massive cruise ship, "The U.S.S.R. Michael Moore." Your ticket will be held at the nearest Dennis Kucinich for President rally. Matricular consular ID cards issued by foreign governments will be gladly accepted as identification.

[HighRoller]

You might be a Democrat if:
You protested against war but now support a "war hero", John Kerry.
You spent six months investigating Bush's war record, but won't take two days to read John Kerry's book "New Soldier".
Agree John Kerry is the "middle class" candidate, even though his net worth is over half a billion dollars....
You support Theresa Heinz Kerry's desire to have women's voices heard, but deny unborn women in the womb the right to life...
You espouse "morals" and "values", but your biggest hero is Bill Clinton, an admitted adulterer and liar and the only standing President to ever be impeached while in office.

[Kilrtoy]

or if you move your shit to ME-HE-CO to save money and kill american jobs...

[MagicMtnDan]

There's so much right on target in the list - I like this one, "-You believe that trial lawyers taking 33 to 40 percent of a plaintiff's recovery in lawsuits is just about right, but the federal government taking this amount of our income in taxes is not nearly enough."
Where are all the John supporters?

[Dr. Eagle]

That's good... and not a lot of spin there at all...

[eliminatedsprinter]

You forgot one of the oldest and most accurate of the generalizations about the left. They are very generous with other peoples money.....

[gnarley]

Originally posted by HighRoller
You might be a Democrat if:
Agree John Kerry is the "middle class" candidate, even though his net worth is over half a billion dollars....
You support Theresa Heinz Kerry's desire to have women's voices heard, but deny unborn women in the womb the right to life...
You espouse "morals" and "values", but your biggest hero is Bill Clinton, an admitted adulterer and liar and the only standing President to ever be impeached while in office.
This just might stir up a few of you and I was once a registered Republican. Most of us aren't on the 20% side of far left or far right are we? That might make us 60% of center and actually agree on most issues I bet!
So what is middle Class??? Does anyone have a definition? I was listening to the Kerry speech when he mentioned the "middle class" and I wanted to hear who or what the middle class is! Maybe Kerry is the middle class candidate??? After all GW in now way comes from an underprivileged family now does he???
If you’re going to make a quote get it right or you’re just spouting off with rhetoric and if you post something that you may have done you might just be a hypocrite.
Heinz Kerry is not shy about telling people that she required Kerry to sign a prenuptial agreement before they were married. John Kerry may not have check writing privileges on the Heinz catsup and pickle fortune, but he is certainly a willing and uncomplaining beneficiary of it.
Wouldn’t you do that if you had a lot of money to protect? She sounded pretty smart for doing that didn’t she?
How does Mrs. Heinz Kerry spend John Heinz's money? There were a few listed but I bet it wasn't all of the groups that she contributes to and was probably written with a definite bias. Is her philanthropy as bad as the Bush’s ties to Saudi Arabia and the favorable treatment they receive courtesy of the Bush’s?
What’s wrong with being a beneficiary of that wealth? Doesn't GW enjoy being a beneficiary of his family's wealth and receive some preferential treatments because of who he is and knows? Who here would take preferential treatment?
What’s wrong with having women’s voices heard? Don't women have rights like the rest of us?
Denying unborn women in the womb the right to life, you mean babies? Isn't that a personal choice, the same type of personal choice that would tell anyone what they can do with their own body, their own life?
How many of you here espouse "morals" and "values", but can't admit that you have been an adulterer or a liar? It seems like the bible thumpers do this more than anyone. Don't a lot of the religious right (Republicans) preach "morals and values" and some of them have had affairs or sleep around and lie about it then get divorced? What makes them any better? At least the former president had the balls to come out and say he did something wrong, didn't he??? How many of us here can admit we are ever wrong?

[eliminatedsprinter]

I can't give you a definition of "middle class" that is specific enough to use for something like a "targeted tax break" etc.. That is one reason I don't trust politicians who promise such things. I do know how the government and many Democratic party politicians defines "rich" they base that on the upper economic quartile. Basically that means any individual that makes over approx 33k per year or any family that brings in over approx 60k per year. That is why any significant (or even the most modest of) tax breaks can be demagogued as being a "tax bereak for the rich".

[Dr. Eagle]

Originally posted by gnarley
So what is middle Class???
Heinz Kerry is not shy about telling people that she required Kerry to sign a prenuptial agreement before they were married. John Kerry may not have check writing privileges on the Heinz catsup and pickle fortune, but he is certainly a willing and uncomplaining beneficiary of it.
How does Mrs. Heinz Kerry spend John Heinz's money? There were a few listed but I bet it wasn't all of the groups that she contributes to and was probably written with a definite bias. Is her philanthropy as bad as the Bush’s ties to Saudi Arabia and the favorable treatment they receive courtesy of the Bush’s?
What’s wrong with being a beneficiary of that wealth? Doesn't GW enjoy being a beneficiary of his family's wealth and receive some preferential treatments because of who he is and knows? Who here would take preferential treatment?
What’s wrong with having women’s voices heard? Don't women have rights like the rest of us?
Denying unborn women in the womb the right to life, you mean babies? Isn't that a personal choice, the same type of personal choice that would tell anyone what they can do with their own body, their own life?
How many of you here espouse "morals" and "values", but can't admit that you have been an adulterer or a liar? It seems like the bible thumpers do this more than anyone. Don't a lot of the religious right (Republicans) preach "morals and values" and some of them have had affairs or sleep around and lie about it then get divorced?
At least the former president had the balls to come out and say he did something wrong, didn't he??? How many of us here can admit we are ever wrong?
Lets see, where to start:
1. Al Gore said that the "wealthy" needed to pay more taxes. When pressed on that he said that meant someone making over 70K.
Mr, Kerry has said he would raise taxes on anyone making over $200K. How many on this board would be considered wealthy? Don't know, but with what real estate and cars cost, you have to make over 100K just to survive.
2. Heinz Kerry may have gotten a pre-nup.. but that only covers what was made BEFORE they were married. So he is benefiting from whatever stream of income she has coming from the "Heinz fortune".
3. This Bush/Saudi connection creating favorable treatment for the Saudi's is a fantasy of Michael Moore.
4. Who is Heinz-Kerry that she should be a voice to be heard? Is she some political expert? Is she a scholar? I see no credibility behind the outspoken viewpoints.
5. Abortion rights is always going to be controversial. I happen to think in most cases early term it is the mothers choice. I am glad that "partial birth" abortions have been halted... that was a brutal and greusome practice.
6. This one PISSES me off. Republicans do not = the religious right. I have been a Republican since 1975. I have never been to Church in that time, I don't listen to any particular religious viewpoint. Typical Liberal stereotyping.
7. Billybob Clinton would have NEVER admitted ANYTHING had it not come out and had he not gotten CAUGHT! Get a grip, he wouldn't have admitted anything had he not gotten caught with his pants down (so to speak).

[SB]

I like that list. There was another one that had a few more:
You believe AIDS is caused by a lack of federal funding.
You believe "WEST WING" is not liberal.
You believe city dwellers care about nature, but hunters and fisherman don't.
You supported interfering in South Africa, but not anywhere else.
BTW I vote Repub. I could have respected Clinton if he said: 1. Yeah I did it, so what? OR 2. None of your damn business.

[gnarley]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dr. Eagle
Lets see, where to start:
1. Al Gore said that the "wealthy" needed to pay more taxes. When pressed on that he said that meant someone making over 70K.
Mr, Kerry has said he would raise taxes on anyone making over $200K. How many on this board would be considered wealthy? Don't know, but with what real estate and cars cost, you have to make over 100K just to survive.
You can't use personal property such as cars or real estate holdings in determining income. Nonetheless how do you compare middle class income earners in the most expensive areas of the country to the least expensive? It just isn't fair and those that do live in the expensive areas get slammed for it even if it means they can't afford to buy a home.
2. Heinz Kerry may have gotten a pre-nup.. but that only covers what was made BEFORE they were married. So he is benefiting from whatever stream of income she has coming from the "Heinz fortune".
What’s wrong with that? Anyone running for president better have deep pockets somewhere! Lets not forget Bush also benefits from deep pockets somewhere also doesn't he?
3. This Bush/Saudi connection creating favorable treatment for the Saudi's is a fantasy of Michael Moore.
Is it? If you do a search on the Bush Family and Saudi you can find all kinds of info, more than I want to read.
4. Who is Heinz-Kerry that she should be a voice to be heard? Is she some political expert? Is she a scholar? I see no credibility behind the outspoken viewpoints.
She should only be heard if she has something credible to state. I don't think she stated she should be heard but desired to have women's voices heard (taken way out of context). I think she is somewhat aloof and out of touch with reality myself but she is highly educated and may be more intelligent than most of us here, how many of us can speak 5 languages fluently?
5. Abortion rights is always going to be controversial. I happen to think in most cases early term it is the mothers choice. I am glad that "partial birth" abortions have been halted... that was a brutal and greusome practice.
Though it may be as you state “gruesome” is it yours or my right to force our views on another person if that choice does not directly affect us? Wasn’t that ban recently overturned?
6. This one PISSES me off. Republicans do not = the religious right. I have been a Republican since 1975. I have never been to Church in that time, I don't listen to any particular religious viewpoint. Typical Liberal stereotyping.
Have you ever heard of the religious LEFT? The religious right are Republicans
7. Billybob Clinton would have NEVER admitted ANYTHING had it not come out and had he not gotten CAUGHT! Get a grip, he wouldn't have admitted anything had he not gotten caught with his pants down (so to speak).
There are not to many people with the moral fortitude to come out and say or admit they have done something wrong this should include presidents, though most probably have never admitted anything without first being advised. Though I don’t agree with his behavior it was more of a personal fault than one of national consequences. Lets not forget that Clinton was not impeached as HighRoller pointed out, it was only hearings and there are some presidents that have done way worse things than getting a BJ under the desk

[Dr. Eagle]

Once again we will have to agree to disagree.
But a few points:
1. The mention of personal property as it relates to income was meant only as a guage of what it costs to live in the fine country of ours. Many two income families make well over 150K and still have trouble saving money because of ridiculous housing costs.
2. The Religious right are for the most part Republicans true, but they represent 10-20% at the most of the Republican ranks. There are just as many whacked out leftist anarchists and/or athiests... many of which subscribe to the more racdical green or communist parties.
3. Taking the life of a viable baby is wrong. Was that law stricken down? I must have missed that.
4. Impeachement of a president means the bringing of charges by the Senate for trial. It does not me the REMOVAL of a president. Mr. Clinton is the second president (Andrew Johnson being the other) See below:
Impeached Clinton Wants Apology!
CNSNews.com
Tuesday, Oct. 31, 2000
President Clinton says congressional Republicans owe the nation an apology for his impeachment.
The lame duck president also said that, despite statements by Republicans, impeachment is over.
"They haven't necessarily put their abuse of power behind them," Clinton said in an interview in Esquire magazine's December issue, in which he is photographed seated with his legs spread apart in what can best be described as a Monica's-eye view.
Clinton claimed the investigation into his affair with Monica Lewinsky and his subsequent perjury and impeachment were not about pursuing the truth or the best interests of the American people. Clinton said, "Unlike [the Republicans], I've apologized to the American people for what I did wrong, and most Americans think I paid a pretty high price. ...
"They never apologized to the country for impeachment. They've never apologized for all the things they've done. ... But folks, I think that they haven't necessarily put their abuse of power behind them."
Rather, he said, it was about politics, power, "the Republicans and their welfare" as a party.
When told of the Clinton comments on his impeachment, Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott, R-Miss., said, "That's absolutely bizarre, but it shows you something about his thinking and the judgment that he has.
"Look, he disgraced the office. He did things in the Oval Office that just absolutely are still incredible, and then he lied about it. You know, we didn't want to go through it."
Lott also said on ABC's "This Week" on Sunday, "If there is any apology to be made, he owes it over and over again for what he put the country through."
Reprinted with permission of CNSNews.com

[Dr. Eagle]

Oh yeah, and as for the Bush/Saudi thing.... everything I see on the internet has democrat/liberal fingerprints all over it...
Like I should have said:
Democrats motto = tell a lie loudly and long enough... sooner or later someone will believe it.

[eliminatedsprinter]

The "Religious Left" worships government......

[Dr. Eagle]

Originally posted by eliminatedsprinter
The "Religious Left" worships government......
Along with all the athiests and commies...:rolleyes:

[gnarley]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dr. Eagle
Once again we will have to agree to disagree.
But a few points:
1. The mention of personal property as it relates to income was meant only as a guage of what it costs to live in the fine country of ours. Many two income families make well over 150K and still have trouble saving money because of ridiculous housing costs.
People do have choices and if the home that was purchased puts them in a bind they can always try buying down. I didn’t say give up the jobs and in some cases there may be few choices available but there are always choices.
2. The Religious right are for the most part Republicans true, but they represent 10-20% at the most of the Republican ranks. There are just as many whacked out leftist anarchists and/or athiests... many of which subscribe to the more racdical green or communist parties.
This wasn’t about how many whacko’s are on either side. You said “Republicans do not = the religious right” I was just pointing out that The Religious right are Republicans.
3. Taking the life of a viable baby is wrong. Was that law stricken down? I must have missed that.
You say its wrong, but you don’t make the laws. Is it your right to oppress the rights of another person that does not directly affect you solely because you think it is wrong? It might be wrong, it might be sick, but it is not your right to force someone else to do what you think is right.
4. Impeachement of a president means the bringing of charges by the Senate for trial. It does not me the REMOVAL of a president. Mr. Clinton is the second president (Andrew Johnson being the other)
I know exactly what an Impeachment proceeding is, that is why I pointed it out to HighRoller that Clinton was not Impeached (removed from office) though one might want to say in loose grammar without proper word form that Clinton was impeached (the bringing of formal charges) and then acquitted or was impeached indicating past tense without clarifying the proceedings were unsuccessful. We all in fact know that the impeachment proceeding against him were unsuccessful, hence he was not impeached with success. Let’s not question those that brought the proceedings against Clinton. A lot of them probably did a few bad this also but just didn’t get caught with their pant’s down. Lets not forget Former Sen. Strom Thurmond a Republican had an affair with a black woman in 1925 and she had a child that Sen. Thurmond quietly supported most of her life. Oh the dark secrets of Politicians.
Oh yeah, and as for the Bush/Saudi thing.... everything I see on the internet has democrat/liberal fingerprints all over it...
Like any Republican is going to yell out to everyone HEY DID YOU KNOW the BUSH’S ARE IN TIGHT WITH THE SAUDI’S??? I doubt it. There are lots of things that both sides don’t want heard, so one will always speak out against the other if they can and try to discredit the opponent right? This is elementary, of course it came from the left

[Dr. Eagle]

As I said, your opinion differs from mine on most everything.
This is one place you are dead wrong though. Bill Clinton was IMPEACHED. He was not removed from office, but impeachment means that charges were brought and a trial was held.
3 entries found for impeachment.
im·peach ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-pch)
tr.v. im·peached, im·peach·ing, im·peach·es
To make an accusation against.
To charge (a public official) with improper conduct in office before a proper tribunal.
To challenge the validity of; try to discredit: impeach a witness's credibility.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Middle English empechen, to impede, accuse, from Anglo-Norman empecher, from Late Latin impedicre, to entangle : Latin in-, in; see in-2 + Latin pedica, fetter; see ped- in Indo-European Roots.]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
im·peacher n.
im·peachment n.
Usage Note: When an irate citizen demands that a disfavored public official be impeached, the citizen clearly intends for the official to be removed from office. This popular use of impeach as a synonym of “throw out” (even if by due process) does not accord with the legal meaning of the word. As recent history has shown, when a public official is impeached, that is, formally accused of wrongdoing, this is only the start of what can be a lengthy process that may or may not lead to the official's removal from office. In strict usage, an official is impeached (accused), tried, and then convicted or acquitted. The vaguer use of impeach reflects disgruntled citizens' indifference to whether the official is forced from office by legal means or chooses to resign to avoid further disgrace.
Word History: Nothing hobbles a President so much as impeachment, and there is an etymological as well as a procedural reason for this. The word impeach can be traced back through Anglo-Norman empecher to Late Latin impedicre, “to catch, entangle,” from Latin pedica, “fetter for the ankle, snare.” Thus we find that Middle English empechen, the ancestor of our word, means such things as “to cause to get stuck fast,” “hinder or impede,” “interfere with,” and “criticize unfavorably.” A legal sense of empechen is first recorded in 1384. This sense, which had previously developed in Old French, was “to accuse, bring charges against.”
Go ahead and argue all you like, it's in black and white from the dictionary.

[Dave C]

Dr Eagle is correct.
Impeached is akin to an indictment.
Then you either plead, stand trial and are acquitted or found guilty.
upon dispostion you were still "indicted"
hence the term impeached but not removed.
BTW the charges included "perjury" before a court. Remember the $90,000 fine he paid? Had he not committed perjury I would have said it was a witch hunt too.

[gnarley]

Originally posted by Dr. Eagle
As I said, your opinion differs from mine on most everything.
This is one place you are dead wrong though. Bill Clinton was IMPEACHED. He was not removed from office, but impeachment means that charges were brought and a trial was held.
DE, you are RIGHT! We do not agree on most everything. If you make a point there is most likely a counter point to yours and as such I try to point them out :wink: though you don't seem to like it.
Now we are getting to semantics, I know what the definition says (read below in bold). I am dead wrong by saying the bringing of formal charges?
This statement should be qualified with a guilty verdict or acquittal of charges if stating someone was impeached, as it was past tense and we know this was.
DE, your not even religious, why are you so far to the right? I bet you won't even answer.

[Dr. Eagle]

Originally posted by gnarley
DE, you are RIGHT! We do not agree on most everything. If you make a point there is most likely a counter point to yours and as such I try to point them out :wink: though you don't seem to like it.
Now we are getting to semantics, I know what the definition says (read below in bold). I am dead wrong by saying the bringing of formal charges?
This statement should be qualified with a guilty verdict or acquittal of charges if stating someone was impeached, as it was past tense and we know this was.
DE, your not even religious, why are you so far to the right? I bet you won't even answer.
We are not into semantics that was the entire point. Impeachment is the bringing of charges. Clinton was impeached. Period. He was impeached but not removed from office by the senate.
No I am not religious that's a fact. You seem to have confused conservative values with the church(es) somehow. So you can't be a conservative if you don't subscribe to the Billy Grahm journal? The religious right is a small faction of conservatives. In fact most of my conservative friends are not religious either, perhaps there are a few that are. You seem so hung up on this religious right viewpoint... perhaps it is time that you re-examine that little view of the world that you have.
The fact is that conservative values are the right values for me and for this country.
If you want to hang with the socialists of the world... that's fine with me. In that case, we are sworn enemies, and I will oppose you and those of your ilk everywhere and in any way I can... because you seem to think government is the solution for everything. I think government can do only a few things well. Grow itself and siphon from the economy.
You think schools should teach right from wrong... no... they can only re-inforce behavior at best. Right from wrong is taught by a parent or family member that leads by example, a role model.
Regardless, no we won't likely ever agree... and that's just fine.

[Debbolas]

:D

[Dr. Eagle]

:D

[gnarley]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dr. Eagle
The fact is that conservative values are the right values for me and for this country.
That’s pretty funny LMAO…. They might be right for you, fine but who left and made you president? You sound just like G W Bush. The last I looked I thought we had a Democracy. Somewhere near the middle, not to conservative and not to liberal would be a better choice I would think.
If you want to hang with the socialists of the world... that's fine with me.
You know some, why not introduce me? I might learn something new, I have an open mind, do you?
You seem to think government is the solution for everything. I think government can do only a few things well. Grow itself and siphon from the economy.
You are quite wrong about me again; you think that I think government is the solution for everything??? I hope not or we're all in trouble. Government certainly does grow and suck money from most of us and is extremely inefficient. But we do need government, without it anarchy would prevail and you know where that leads don't you? Maybe stop trying to think what other people are thinking.
You think schools should teach right from wrong... no... they can only re-inforce behavior at best. Right from wrong is taught by a parent or family member that leads by example, a role model.
I never said they should teach what you have said, but they could and it might help and couldn't hurt, could it?
So are you saying that orphans and kids who are abandoned are never taught right from wrong or morals and values because they have no family to teach them? I have met a few orphans and underprivileged kids who had no family but sure knew the difference between right and wrong and had strong morals also. They didn’t learn them from any family!
Regardless, no we won't likely ever agree... and that's just fine.
I do agree to that, you seem to have a closed mind and I have an open one. Have a good night :D

[Dr. Eagle]

Originally posted by gnarley
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dr. Eagle
The fact is that conservative values are the right values for me and for this country.
I do agree to that, you seem to have a closed mind and I have an open one. Have a good night :D
1. well gnarley, just in case you didn't know about what this is, it's called an opinion. Different from yours of course...
2. Now I am LMAO... you are the one with the narrow view. Conservative must be a bible thumper, Abortion is always OK, educational progress should be measured by how much money can be thrown at it. Yeah, you're really open minded...

[Dr. Eagle]

Originally posted by ShockwaveBob
Or if you live in CA but have your boat registered in AZ to avoid paying your fair share of property taxes.
I love that.... fair share. After being born and raised here, I plan to move from this state because of exactly that attitude.

[Dr. Eagle]

Well, lets see... since I don't register anything out of state... I guess that means I pay for all the so cal types that do... is that the logic? I have never registered anything out of state to dodge a state tax. I just find the whole personal property tax to be... well... a class divider. That's the problem I have, besides the term "fair share".
I guess we are stuck with it, the tax has been in place for years... just never agreed with the premise it was based on.
Now that I re-read your posting... you are absolutely right. I was mixing thoughts together. Clarity is key as they say.
I just hate that term "Fair Share"... sorry it's a personal dislike. Who determines what is "fair"? Perhaps it is really just paying your tax burden like the rest of us.
Hell, I even told the DMV the real amount I paid for my jetski that I bought in Nevada... so I paid the Use Tax when I registered it and property taxes on it every year.

[phebus]

You Might Be A Leftist If...
If you look in the mirror, and more of your right ball sack is exposed. :D
Oh sorry, my bad, I didn't realize you were talking politics on a boating group

[Dr. Eagle]

Originally posted by phebus
You Might Be A Leftist If...
If you look in the mirror, and more of your right ball sack is exposed. :D
Oh sorry, my bad, I didn't realize you were talking politics on a boating group
How about, your right engine has lost some HP?

[phebus]

Or, if your a NASCAR driver. Not too many right turns!!

[Dave C]

thats a typical liberal stereotype of conservatives.
CONSERVATIVES ARE NOT ALL BIBLE THUMPING DEMAGOGUES
I thought you had an open mind. IF you did you would not believe in this stereotype.
Originally posted by gnarley
DE, your not even religious, why are you so far to the right? I bet you won't even answer. [/B]

[eliminatedsprinter]

Gnarley seems like a guy with very strong opinions. I can't think of a single term that is farther from what I have read here, from him, than "open minded". I nearly fell off my chair laughing when I read that one. I am not religious, and I'm not even a republican. However, I do agree with the conservative view of limited government and their emphisis on the rights of the individual, rather than the lefts view of collective rights. I hope that doesn't make me a tightie rightie, or a fanatical bible thumper.......;)
P.S. Gnarly. If my mentioning you specifically in this mannor offends you and if we ever meet at lake, I owe you a beer. Because it is not my intent to offend or hurt feelings, but rather to just debate ideas...:cool:

[gnarley]

Originally posted by Dr. Eagle
1. well gnarley, just in case you didn't know about what this is, it's called an opinion. Different from yours of course...
2. Now I am LMAO... you are the one with the narrow view. Conservative must be a bible thumper, Abortion is always OK, educational progress should be measured by how much money can be thrown at it. Yeah, you're really open minded...
Still laughing at you DE :D your getting desperate and quote chopping to try to infer that I agree with you that conservative values are the right values for you and for this country. Sorry you might think you’re cool and witty but it just shows desperation.
That’s OK I, can see a desperate person here who doesn't like showing his true colors, I understand, you can be right all you want, you need to be.
DE, when you make a statement and don't qualify it at that time as an opinion it is not necessarily an opinion, when you do so after the fact it's back peddling. Do you feel like your back is in a corner? You act like it and will probably want to repost something that is incorrect yet again attacking me because I have a differing opinion than you and will speak up against you. Just because you live here doesn't mean you're right or own the forum.
You thought that I was a Socialist left winger because I disagreed with you, you were wrong. So you thought I must be a Conservative, bible thumper that supports abortion and wants to throw money at education? Wrong again.
Try thinking out of your box, people don’t always need to fit a mold of right or left. I can see good ideas & opinions from both sides but the country needs balance or we become a religious state or one in anarchy, neither is free or very productive.
Sorry but I feel the need to say this, IMHO DE you are just a loudmouth who doesn’t like being disagreed with and must feel the need to live your life on this board to comment on everything. It must be hard for you only having this outlet. You remind me of a child in school who tries to bully everyone vying for attention, it must kill you to not have the last word or be wrong, I am sorry for you and apologize.

[JakeAisA]

Originally posted by ShockwaveBob
Or if you live in CA but have your boat registered in AZ to avoid paying your fair share of property taxes.
Property taxes are real property. Registering your boat goes to the DMV.
Have you ever seen that pie chart in the DMV that shows the allocation of "your DMV fees"? The DMV posts this chart as evidence of how well "your" money is being spent. What's so evil about that chart is that very little of your money actually goes to the DMV, the CHP or roads and highways! Most of the money goes to non-vehicular related budgets--like the General Fund. And as you know, the General Fund is just the open coffer that our wise elites in Sacramento can spend on absolutely anything they want.
Besides, if your like me, and you use your boat in another state, why should I give California bureaucrats my money to spend on Welfare, Government Education, CA EPA crackdowns, Government Healthcare and other transfer payment programs, police and regulatory programs that undoubtedly target people like me anyway? I have a responsibility to make sure the Soviet Socialist Republic of California extorts as little as MY money as possible.
It's obviously immoral to register your boat in California if you can get it registered in another state. I don't accept your premise ShockWaveBob that we're doing something wrong by registering boats in states we don't live in. We shouldn't accept guilt that isn't ours.
I don't look to the government for moral approval or direction. I distrust government. Just becuase they have power doesn't make them right.

[Dr. Eagle]

Originally posted by gnarley
Sorry but I feel the need to say this, IMHO DE you are just a loudmouth who doesn’t like being disagreed with and must feel the need to live your life on this board to comment on everything. It must be hard for you only having this outlet. You remind me of a child in school who tries to bully everyone vying for attention, it must kill you to not have the last word or be wrong, I am sorry for you and apologize.
Thanks for your opinion again... I guess IMHO... you need to look in the mirror... needless to say... what's the use! Oh.. and you are very wrong, about a lot of things... especially your psychotherapy. And if that is a feint at an appology... I accept! (I know better... really...)

[gnarley]

Originally posted by eliminatedsprinter
Gnarley seems like a guy with very strong opinions. I can't think of a single term that is farther from what I have read here, from him, than "open minded". I nearly fell off my chair laughing when I read that one. I am not religious, and I'm not even a republican. However, I do agree with the conservative view of limited government and their emphisis on the rights of the individual, rather than the lefts view of collective rights. I hope that doesn't make me a tightie rightie, or a fanatical bible thumper.......;)
P.S. Gnarly. If my mentioning you specifically in this mannor offends you and if we ever meet at lake, I owe you a beer. Because it is not my intent to offend or hurt feelings, but rather to just debate ideas...:cool:
eliminatedsprinter, I am not offended at all :cool: Glad I could give you a laugh. What comes out in these few paragraphs is only a slight glimpse of me and in no way is it a complete picture.
I do have strong opinions and feel I am in the middle of the road so to speak. There is a stereotype for most republicans; I don't know if there is one for Democrats, I am neither. I don’t like the bible thumpers or the lettuce heads, but they do serve a purpose and help keep things in check. I base a lot of my feelings and opinions on those stereotypes; though not fair it fits the majority I think.
I don't need to apologize if I offend anyone do I? I have the right to offend and I am tired of needing to be PC, but if I have offended you I might. This is America and we do have the right to speak our mind and question others who spew rhetoric without qualifying it. We have the right to form opinions and change opinions. I may listen to anyone’s opinion for a while if they state it’s their opinion, especially if they have good supporting information and it is engaging. I find little of that here unfortunately.
I would love to see a more limited government and limits on spending and ways for Government to stop waste while ensuring fairness and equality.
The funny thing here is when I read something that is thought provoking or way off base I may ask a question to the poster. It seems many times they can’t or won’t ever answer the question which I feel further discredits their position and opinion making them hot airbags.
Our system isn’t perfect, but it’s all we have and I would be happy to sit and drink a few with you and discuss boats and politics if we ever meet.

[eliminatedsprinter]

Gnarley
Thanks.
You are correct there is no need to be PC. The reason I don't want to offend you is because I want to be polite, not PC. I figure you come on these boards for fun and because you want to talk to people who share your common intrest in boating. I don't find getting personally insulted to be much fun. :cool:
As far as steriotyping goes, yes of course there are steriotypical Democrats. They are the tree hugging, anti buisiness, tax raising, socalist, supporters of the hyper regulated welfare state, looney leftists.;) You know the type, like Nancy Pelosi, Maxine Waters, and up until a short time ago;) John Kerry.They are just as far out left as Strom Thurmand and Jessie Helms were right....
I am far from an extremist, so Therefore, I would never vote for any of the people whom I have mentioned above. I am a liberal in the classic dictionary sense. That is why I am appalled that the party to which I am registered has stopped thinking with an open mind and just started blindly following the 100+ year old failed ideology of the political left. I am horrified that one of our 2 major parties have given leadership positions to people like Nancy Pelosi, and "former" clansman Robert Bird...Just look what a mess the Democratic party has made of our state and all of our major cities....Oh well enough of this sh!#, perhaps I'll see you on a lake and have that beer. Now that is a party I can still support.:cool: :D