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Tremor Therapy
09-08-2004, 02:37 PM
So I got up Sunday to a super hot slab, and found out today, that my hot water line has burst somewhere under my dining room. Now the insurance company wants to tear up the slab, patch the leak, and then re-tile.
The plumber is telling me that this is exactly that....only patching the problem, and that I should re-route the hot water lines through the first story ceiling and drop down to each of the water outlets.
The jack hammer patch route is approximately 2k, and the complete hot water re-route is 7k. Any of you have any experience or knowledge about which way I should go?

JetBoatRich
09-08-2004, 02:52 PM
M.F.V. has a plumbing shop :2purples:

bigerich
09-08-2004, 03:38 PM
I did service plumbing for a few years, and my thoughts are that whoever your plumber is, may be trying to rip you off. Since they have not jackhammered the floor up yet, right?? He has no idea what he is going to find. I have done many slab leak repairs, and have never had to go back to one. Sometimes, it is a better bet to re-route the lines, however, that is not always the best option. Just my thoughts. Is the plumber you are dealing with one of the "big guys"?? If so, be careful, incase each service tech may be paid on commission, and he may make more money by selling a complete repipe???

rivercrazy
09-08-2004, 03:41 PM
BE VERY CAREFUL making a water claim on your insurance. Not only will they drop you like a hot potato come renewal time. But if you sell the house, you will be required by law to disclose the fact that you had a insurance claim relating to a water problem.
Proceed with caution

77charger
09-08-2004, 04:46 PM
BE VERY CAREFUL making a water claim on your insurance. Not only will they drop you like a hot potato come renewal time. But if you sell the house, you will be required by law to disclose the fact that you had a insurance claim relating to a water problem.
Proceed with caution
I am in the water proofing biz and yes dave is right.It becomes a mold issue=very bad.Mandelon is a contracter in sd i would talk to him i deal with plumbers too problem is i really cant remember the names.

Aqua Boogie1
09-08-2004, 04:48 PM
Talk to the flying Vee's.

Ziggy
09-08-2004, 04:51 PM
I rerouted mine when it leaked...Found the manifold(usually in the wall under the water heater) and isolated which line and where it led to. Mine happened to be going to the bathrooms so it was simple to reroute. Capped off the leaking line at the manifold and where it entered the wall in the bathrooms to prevent an ant super-highway. The line leading to kitchen and laundry were not the leaking culprits so those never were touched.
The Flyin' V's are plumbers..they should be able to help ya.

Jordy
09-08-2004, 04:54 PM
I know the V's are plumbers. They should be able to help you. :D

Sportin' Wood
09-08-2004, 04:56 PM
Hard to say which way to go. There is a lot of things that would make a difference. How old the house is. Soil condition. so on and so on. My feeling is that I would repair the first leak and if it happens again I would repipe.
( if it where my house)
I would also look into PEX piping as an alternative to a copper repipe. I like Vangaurd better then the rest. I would use the Maniblock system as I belive it is the best PEX product.( the pipe has the best rating and I like the installation best) This May require less damage to your home as it is real flexable and easier to install. Maniblock also uses home runs to each fixture, so there would be no joints in the wall. It is my experience that you dont have to wait as long to get hot water with this product. Down side is that your water may be a little warm on the cold side at first as it heats up in your attic on hot days. You also can delete the angle stops with mani bloc that seem to always fail when you are on vacation.
Sounds like a crap shoot. IMHO I would just fix it .

bchbum
09-08-2004, 05:04 PM
There are tools that can locate the leak to less than a foot . Make a small workable hole , cut out the bad piece & silver solder the repair .

Mrs. casean
09-08-2004, 07:05 PM
So I got up Sunday to a super hot slab, and found out today, that my hot water line has burst somewhere under my dining room. Now the insurance company wants to tear up the slab, patch the leak, and then re-tile.
The plumber is telling me that this is exactly that....only patching the problem, and that I should re-route the hot water lines through the first story ceiling and drop down to each of the water outlets.
The jack hammer patch route is approximately 2k, and the complete hot water re-route is 7k. Any of you have any experience or knowledge about which way I should go?
I work in Escondido for a family owned small co. and we do repipes and reroutes all the time. If you want the number I'd be more than happy to give it to you and/or set up an estimate for you. It is better to reroute the lines only becuase the pipes can bust the next day or year... there is just no guarantee that you are out of the woods for future slab leaks. And then you are at it double if not more. Anyhow... that is my .02 about your situation, we do free estimates and talk about it on our website and I know my boss would be happy to talk w/ you over the phone too to help you out further if you want it or need it still., the price you mentioned sounds a little steep from our usual repipes/reroute, however it all depends on the square footage and so forth..... Good luck.

spute
09-08-2004, 07:15 PM
So I got up Sunday to a super hot slab, and found out today, that my hot water line has burst somewhere under my dining room. Now the insurance company wants to tear up the slab, patch the leak, and then re-tile.
The plumber is telling me that this is exactly that....only patching the problem, and that I should re-route the hot water lines through the first story ceiling and drop down to each of the water outlets.
The jack hammer patch route is approximately 2k, and the complete hot water re-route is 7k. Any of you have any experience or knowledge about which way I should go?
i just got done with the exact same thing. mrs. flying vee diagnosed the thing in a 10 minute post exchange. i agree with the plumber, reroute the piping if you can. and, depending on how much it is to do it, try like hell not to file the claim. water claims lead to mold potential and if you move or when your policy expires, they got you by the short hairs. it happened to me when my house flooded. and depending on what the pipe size is, ask your plumber to put a larger pipe up there...you'll get better water pressure! :smile:

Boatcop
09-08-2004, 07:19 PM
Is slab piping a common technique out there now?
All the places I did in my youth as a plumber's apprentice were in-wall runs. My house here is also all in wall (or ceiling) piping. I re-piped about 2 dozen townhouses in Torrance in the '70s.
I can't see any advantage (other than insulation, maybe) to having the pipes in the slab, especially when leaks happen. Doesn't the alkali in the concrete eventually eat away at solder joints?

spute
09-08-2004, 07:31 PM
Is slab piping a common technique out there now?
All the places I did in my youth as a plumber's apprentice were in-wall runs. My house here is also all in wall (or ceiling) piping. I re-piped about 2 dozen townhouses in Torrance in the '70s.
I can't see any advantage (other than insulation, maybe) to having the pipes in the slab, especially when leaks happen. Doesn't the alkali in the concrete eventually eat away at solder joints?
i cannot figure it out either. somewhere, someone decided it was a great idea to run plumbing thru post-tension slabs in the greater orange county and northern san diego counties!

bigerich
09-08-2004, 07:55 PM
Is slab piping a common technique out there now?
All the places I did in my youth as a plumber's apprentice were in-wall runs. My house here is also all in wall (or ceiling) piping. I re-piped about 2 dozen townhouses in Torrance in the '70s.
I can't see any advantage (other than insulation, maybe) to having the pipes in the slab, especially when leaks happen. Doesn't the alkali in the concrete eventually eat away at solder joints?
Yes, a lot of plumbing is run under the slab. I would say the main reason is speed and cost. much faster to throw some pipe under the slab than to deal with drilling holes, and getting all your pipes to the proper location in a framed house. I can't see any other advantages, and it is something I have rarely seen in a custom home, mostly done in tract homes, I think.

Mrs. casean
09-08-2004, 08:12 PM
Yes, a lot of plumbing is run under the slab. I would say the main reason is speed and cost. much faster to throw some pipe under the slab than to deal with drilling holes, and getting all your pipes to the proper location in a framed house. I can't see any other advantages, and it is something I have rarely seen in a custom home, mostly done in tract homes, I think.
From what I have noticed it does seem to be used be done under the slab in the tract housing... makes no sense to me... bummer for homeowners who experience... never anything you want to have to deal w/.

PlyaPlya22
09-08-2004, 08:31 PM
So I got up Sunday to a super hot slab, and found out today, that my hot water line has burst somewhere under my dining room. Now the insurance company wants to tear up the slab, patch the leak, and then re-tile.
The plumber is telling me that this is exactly that....only patching the problem, and that I should re-route the hot water lines through the first story ceiling and drop down to each of the water outlets.
The jack hammer patch route is approximately 2k, and the complete hot water re-route is 7k. Any of you have any experience or knowledge about which way I should go?
Get with the Flyin Vee's they know what's up?

JetBoatRich
09-08-2004, 08:46 PM
Is slab piping a common technique out there now?
All the places I did in my youth as a plumber's apprentice were in-wall runs. My house here is also all in wall (or ceiling) piping. I re-piped about 2 dozen townhouses in Torrance in the '70s.
I can't see any advantage (other than insulation, maybe) to having the pipes in the slab, especially when leaks happen. Doesn't the alkali in the concrete eventually eat away at solder joints?
It does seem that more harm than good can happen :confused:
My neighbor had a leak that went undetected for a while. it was running under his slab and out towards the street. Actually undermined the drive way, which sunk in and had tobe replaced. This was on top of his internal repairs, walls, floors, etc.

ROZ
09-08-2004, 09:28 PM
Alan, If you have an attic crawlspace that you can crawl through and have an easy access to you water heater from up there, I'd consider re routing. I know you know how to sweat pipe from the old landscaping days, save yourself a grip and make the change yourself. PM the flying V's for some info!!!

Mandelon
09-08-2004, 10:12 PM
We do a lot of repipes. Mostly for folks who have slab leaks or who have poly butylene piping. The acid in the soil eats away at the copper and can cause pin hole leaks, it seems. The water soaks up through the slab and through any nearby penetrations.
I would make sure you run a dehumidifier for several days to ensure the slab is fully dry again. I have seen many cases where moisture continues to move up from the soil through the slab. When it comes up under particle board cabinets in can cause nasty mold growth. don't take shortcuts.
If you have one leak, another may not be too far behind. Its not positive, but if soil conditions are bad it may be quite likely.
I would do the repipe and sleep soundly.......
Did the quote include drywall repair?

Sportin' Wood
09-09-2004, 05:28 AM
Yes, a lot of plumbing is run under the slab. I would say the main reason is speed and cost. much faster to throw some pipe under the slab than to deal with drilling holes, and getting all your pipes to the proper location in a framed house. I can't see any other advantages, and it is something I have rarely seen in a custom home, mostly done in tract homes, I think.
I can think of about 200 homes in Rancho Sante Fe that are rolled copper(underslab) and not tract houses.
Cost is the major factor in rolling copper.If it is done right you should never have a problem. Poly sleeve should be applied to all underground piping and there should never be any joints soldered below the slab. As with anything else finding good help is harder and harder. I have seen 3 kinds of slab leaks Copper pipe pitting. caused by soil conditions. tears in the polysleeve or it was not applied.
electrolisis (sp) at locations where the copper is touching rebar or the wire mesh in the slab.
or kinks in the copper or other trade damage. all 3 caused by poor workmenship IMHO.
This is why I try and use PEX piping when I can. Its so easy to install my 7 year old can do it.

ROZ
09-09-2004, 08:44 AM
I can think of about 200 homes in Rancho Sante Fe that are rolled copper(underslab) and not tract houses.
Sylvester and/or Weir Bros. homes use these products?
Apparently even Rancho Sante Fe has budget custom homes ;) :D