More Gibson Muffler Results

[Dana Marine Products]

We just ran a 27' V bottom with a 720 HP blower motor with the Gibson clamp on mufflers (4"). The boat was ran with and without mufflers, the results were the same, 5400 rpm, 84 MPH. They sounded great and passed at 88 db. administering the new CA dockside test method. Eliminator boats also ran a 28 Daytona at 117 MPH on Thursday at Elsinore. That boat had twin 525's. The boat ran the same with and without the Gibson clamp on's. More tests to come...

[Not So Fast]

Good to see all the results Dana. You said in a reply to "Magic Transom Pictures" that the Gibson is straight thru so no water back up, correct? That is what makes me nervous in a lot of these mufflers because the water flow is definetly disrupted and not straight thru as Merc designed. In the clamp-on version can they truly just be clamped on and not have to remove the internal flapper on the stock exhaust?? NSF Thanks :2purples:

[Dana Marine Products]

The clamp on versions can be installed within minutes as long as there is proper clearance. No modifications on the existing tips is necessary. We've seen alot of the different systems available and there are 3 necessary qualifications in our eyes,
1. Will it meet the new CA state law?
2. Will it hurt performance?
3. Last but not least...Price. We feel it is unfortunate that alot of good hard working people buy a very expensive boat and then get hit with this. The Gibson line is affordable without sacrificing any key components.
Gibson not only meets the above qualifications, they exceed them.

[Daytona100]

The clamp on versions can be installed within minutes as long as there is proper clearance. No modifications on the existing tips is necessary. We've seen alot of the different systems available and there are 3 necessary qualifications in our eyes,
1. Will it meet the new CA state law?
2. Will it hurt performance?
3. Last but not least...Price. We feel it is unfortunate that alot of good hard working people buy a very expensive boat and then get hit with this. The Gibson line is affordable without sacrificing any key components.
Gibson not only meets the above qualifications, they exceed them.
Do you have any pics of the muffs?

[phebus]

Gibson mufflers
http://www.danamarineproducts.com/partimages/GB-110001%20-%20NEW-1.jpg

[Dana Marine Products]

You can view the clamp on models at www.danamarineproducts.com. The clamp on models are shown in the new products and the standard products section. The complete line along with additonal installed pictures are first priority Monday AM.

[Dana Marine Products]

Thanks Phebus!!!

[Big Bear]

Those look pretty clean. They actually clamp on to the existing tips instead of replacing them, right? What are the chances of losing them under hard acceleration like happened to the IMCO in the Hot Boat tests? Advantage recommended the HPI's which they are putting on their boats for my 496, but the tests seem to show a loss of power. I know everyone is going to give props to their product. I am looking for opinions of real people who have used these products on their own boats. I thought about Rex Marine silencers. I think they are one of the cleanest looking units but people have written to me telling me to expect a loss of 150 RPM. I'm not very fast to begin with, can't afford to lose any more.

[Craig]

I think the Gibson's may look OK on mine, I don't know. I'm really concerned about the noise with the blower motor and the tips so high up. I guess I can cut off part of the tip prior to bolting on the muffler to reduce the amount it sticks backwards.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/30161a.jpg

[Dana Marine Products]

The Gibson clamp on's grip very good. They've been tested for this issue, but I would strongly suggest checking the bolts every so often. Gibson also makes transom mount versions.

[Dana Marine Products]

Craig, the noise level of your boat will vary on how radical the cam is and how high it idles. The lower the idle, the lower the noise. These are just two things that can effect the noise level. From everything on the market, besides the Livorsi Northstar system, the Gibson's will be your best option.

[Big Bear]

The clamp-ons are $499 right? How much are the transom mounts and how much of a bitch are they to mount? Do you have any pics of the transom mount mufflers?

[Not So Fast]

so nothing inserts into the existing tip where it would hinder the internal flapper right, not trying to be repiticious but gotta know these things for SURE! also what are the measurements, it looks pretty phat NSF :2purples:

[OutCole'd]

so nothing inserts into the existing tip where it would hinder the internal flapper right, not trying to be repiticious but gotta know these things for SURE! also what are the measurements, it looks pretty phat NSF :2purples:
The clamp on's will go right over your existing tips no problem. The real problem here is with the swim step on the Magic's. They actually trim the top off the flange on the stock tips to get it to clear. The Gibson "Bullets" are 6" in Diameter and I am not sure if they will clear.http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/1075the_very_begining_026.jpg
http://www.danamarineproducts.com/partimages/GB-110001%20-%20NEW-1.jpg

[Dimarco21]

We just ran a 27' V bottom with a 720 HP blower motor with the Gibson clamp on mufflers (4"). The boat was ran with and without mufflers, the results were the same, 5400 rpm, 84 MPH. They sounded great and passed at 88 db. administering the new CA dockside test method. Eliminator boats also ran a 28 Daytona at 117 MPH on Thursday at Elsinore. That boat had twin 525's. The boat ran the same with and without the Gibson clamp on's. More tests to come...
What was the db reading before installing the Gibson mufflers? I have a 800 HP blower motor w/ 4" exhaust above water line and tested at 108 db.
Will these mufflers make me pass? Thanks.

[schiada96]

Are bolt ons legal?

[OutCole'd]

Are bolt ons legal?
Yes, switchables are not.

[Dana Marine Products]

The transom mount Gibson's are also $499.00. If you have the clearance and a little extra time, the transom mounts would be the cleanest installation. The transom mounts are pretty easy to install, just time cunsuming. A single engine application with everything easy to get to would take roughly 1-2 hours to install. The actual muffler between the transom mount and the clamp on's are the same length, 12". The clamp on's are little longer overall because of the clamp section. When using the clamp on's , nothing needs to be modified on the existing tips, as long as you have clearance. The mufflers will not interfere with any internal flappers. As Out Col'd stated, the clamp on's and transom mounts are legal. These are not switchable mufflers. Switchable systems are where you run into a problem. If the flange on stock tips have to be modified with Magic applications, your best bet is with the clamp on's. Keep in mind, your transom is not flat. Most transoms are at least 12 degree. When you clamp a muffler on it's on a downward angle, pulling it away from the bottom of the swim step. I don't have a solid answer as to whether they will fit, but from the pics, it looks like it would. (as long as the Aqua Step doesn't cause a side clearance problem)

[Dana Marine Products]

Dimarco, the 720 HP application was 103 db at idle. As previously stated, there is a lot of variables that will change the noise level. It's hard to say whether they will get you legal or not. From my expirience you only have 2 options, Gibson or Livorsi. These are the only two systems that will flow freely and have the ability to get you close to passing. The only way to be sure is to get checked. I wouldn't mind making arrangements with you to try a set of Gibsons on your boat. It's an offer, free of charge. Drop me a line if you're interested.

[cola]

Why aren't the Gatilins a option. :rolleyes:
Thanks, Mike

[Not So Fast]

WOWEE, this is a lot of info but pretty info good. now I'm sure I dont want to put mufflers on my boat-- will they fit--will I get reversion--can I get a loan to pay for them, way to many questions, I think I'LL JUST GO BOATING TOMORROW&^%^%$ AND I WONT SWEAT THE SMALL SHIT. NSF :2purples:

[OutCole'd]

Why aren't the Gatilins a option. :rolleyes:
Thanks, Mike
From the teck at Magic, I heard that the gatlins were not making there 496 legal, and at $995.00 + labor. :2purples: I'll pass.

[Dimarco21]

Dana Marine Prod. check your PM's

[Dana Marine Products]

The Imco Gatlin's are free flowing. From my expirience they will not meet the new CA laws.

[Daytona100]

Off the subject but I have a set of your billet swimsteps without the rubber inserts. Can I add them and how much? Also can I have them reanodized or chromed? :mix:

[Dana Marine Products]

Daytona, the rubber inserts cannot be added to those steps. The steps are machined totally different. The rubber inserts require special pockets that they push into. The non rubber steps are machined all the way through. Re-anodizing or re-powder coating is no problem. Give us a call we can go over the pricing.
951-279-5005

[Danhercules]

what about O/T's will they fit on them? Any numbers or tests done with O/T's?

[Dana Marine Products]

O/T headers are a different ball game.Gibson mufflers will not work. There is a new muffling system in the developement stages from Bassett that will get you legal. Every motor has different noise charactoristics. So there's no 100% guarantee. Bassett has a prototype, they have been tested, and they did pass. They have some bugs to work out, but they will be available in the near future. Dana Marine Products will be distributing them when they are available..

[life's a river]

Do they test for noise at WOT or at an idle?

[RiverDave]

Welcome to ***boat Dana! :) It's nice to see suppliers on here answering questions! :)
RD

[Not So Fast]

Great point River Dave, also are you the inventor & maker of the bezels for CPS stereo remotes that I have seen here and if so how do we get them?? do you have backstock?? NSF :2purples:

[RiverDave]

Great point River Dave, also are you the inventor & maker of the bezels for CPS stereo remotes that I have seen here and if so how do we get them?? do you have backstock?? NSF :2purples:
I wouldn't say "inventor" becuase it's just a bezel. ;) But yes I made the original bezels and yes I have them in stock. So as to not hijack Dana's muffler thread I'll shoot you a pm. :)
RD

[Dana Marine Products]

The dockside test is performed at idle. So get that idle as low as you can. The higher the idle, the higher the noise reading.

[life's a river]

Thanks for the reply DMP. Are they giving tickets if you are on the lake and db,s are too high? No warnings? Does anybody know if they are checking at lake Mojave?
LAR

[Dana Marine Products]

I can't speak for the county mounty's, but I would assume they will be checking for noise levels. We did have a customer getting harrassed at the end of last summer on Mojave.

[rvrhlic]

Is switchable exhaust only illegal in CA? What is the law in AZ?

[OutCole'd]

Is switchable exhaust only illegal in CA? What is the law in AZ?
I believe both.

[Dana Marine Products]

I don't know the AZ law. The noise levels in AZ are a lot easier to pass then the new CA law. From my understanding, the CA law can be patrolled into AZ for 3 miles into a waterway. Switchable systems are usually pretty expensive, and may not be as effective as some of the new muffler technology.

[Nordicflame]

Dana, do these mufflers have internal flappers?
Dave

[boatnam2]

i was down at laveycraft yesterday and the gibson seems to be the muffler of choice.it was kinda weird seeing all these new boats with big old mufflers being put on them.

[burtandnancy]

DMP, what about the Merc warranty?

[Dana Marine Products]

The Gibson mufflers do not have an internal flap. Extreme caution must be taken with any clamp on or transom mount muffler. Most internal flappers are inferior and tend to blow out. With a muffler behind the flap, the flap could blow out and plug up the exhaust. Internal flapper failure is so common Mercruiser instated a manditory double flapper install on all new boats a few years ago. Internal flappers with a muffling device behind it = BIG potential trouble. The external clamp on flappers are very reliable, not the most attractive, but very functional.

[WILD LAVEY]

would the external rubber flappers fit on these mufflers?

[Dana Marine Products]

As for Mercruiser warranty, I can't comment on their behalf. My opinion is that Mercruiser should have 3 concerns,
- Is the muffler causing too much exhaust back pressure?
- Is the muffler causing too much water backup in the system?
- Does the muffler have or have the ability to accept a reliable flapper to prevent back wash through the muffler?
The above questions would pertain to safe operating conditions for Merc's engines. A second group of questions comes up when discussing the new CA law.
- Will the muffler meet the new CA law?
- Will the muffler rob power?
- Will the muffler rob your check book?
We chose to distribute the Gibson Muffler line because we can answer every one of the above questions with the right answer.

[DogHouse]

Anyone know if there's a 4.5" clamp-on version available or in the works? If so I'm definitely interested. I got tossed out of the marina last summer even with my CP Super Cyclone mufflers. This summer will be ticket time unless I do something different soon.
Thanks,
-Brian

[Dana Marine Products]

Wild Lavey, the external clamp on flappers will fit on all Gibson Bullet style mufflers. They will not fit on the Power Curves.

[Dana Marine Products]

Hey Doghouse, the 4.5" clamp on's are almost done. They've got them in production and I should have them available within 1-2 weeks. I've got a waiting list going, give me a call Monday, I can put your name down and call you when they're ready.

[OutCole'd]

Anyone know if there's a 4.5" clamp-on version available or in the works? If so I'm definitely interested. I got tossed out of the marina last summer even with my CP Super Cyclone mufflers. This summer will be ticket time unless I do something different soon.
Thanks,
-Brian
Brian, what type are going to clear your swim step? have you looked at the Power Curves?

[DogHouse]

Ok, will do, thanks!
-Brian

[DogHouse]

Brian, what type are going to clear your swim step? have you looked at the Power Curves?
I don't have an issue with the swim step on mine because my system uses 4.5" dry pipes that extend 9.5" beyond the transom. With the angle, I could run a nearly 10" diameter muffler. The Power Curves are a good idea but just a little too funny looking IMO!
-Brian

[OutCole'd]

I don't have an issue with the swim step on mine because my system uses 4.5" dry pipes that extend 9.5" beyond the transom. With the angle, I could run a nearly 10" diameter muffler. The Power Curves are a good idea but just a little too funny looking IMO!
-Brian
I agree, they are not the coolest looking set up, but seem to work good and avoid any clearnce issues. I still plan on just goijng without till I get hassled by the man. Damn the man...

[locogringo]

what is there to do with a 1500 HP motor. Is that completely unpassable?

[OutCole'd]

what is there to do with a 1500 HP motor. Is that completely unpassable?
Give up.
Shut it down & row whenever you see the man.

[Dana Marine Products]

We've got billet paddles, powder coated to match your rigging. At least you'll look good when rowing.

[locogringo]

Give up.
Shut it down & row whenever you see the man.
lmao

[DogHouse]

It's just another social injustice perpetrated by the man to keep a brutha down...
:D

[locogringo]

We've got billet paddles, powder coated to match your rigging. At least you'll look good when rowing.
Hey, it's not in my boat, I have a 500HP. I was just wondering what all these guys with mega HP are going to do.

[Not So Fast]

FYI; Buddy just took delivery of new boat with HP500/ Gatlin muff's. Did not pass the Marina's test, 89.3 and they would not let him launch. Don't go there! Now what??? It sucks and whether the muff makers want to admit it or not I'm hearing more and more stories of reversion!!! NSF :2purples: :2purples:

[Dana Marine Products]

I don't know if your buddy is aware, but once the marina fails you and turns you away, they also black ball your I.D. numbers. If he plans on using the boat in that marina I would advise that he make the necessary modifications and go back ASAP. They'll re-test you, but can you imagine what it will be like trying to get re-tested on spring break or Memorial Day? We had a boat that had previously failed and they let us re-test, but that was in the middle of winter with no line to get in. It's going to get ugly down there this year.

[OutCole'd]

It's just another social injustice perpetrated by the man to keep a brutha down...
:D
Damn straight, fo shizzle

[Not So Fast]

Thanks Dana, I dont think he wil be going back there. the point is this, OK he failed their freekin test but it was pretty close and all this was going to be was a shake down test, you would think on a weekday with bad weather and the lake virtually empty that the guy would have said go ahead, WRONG, although nicely said he was told to pull out and NO LAUNCH. I sure hope that EVERYBODY understands that all of this commotion about mufflers came about because of the Marina's unlawful test's and all of the coverage on the boards. Yes CA. has a new law but most of the publicity or at least a lot of it has come from the situation at the Marina and they dont even run either test correctly!!! How can anyone except the pontooner's still go there even thou they have passed their unlawful tests. BOYCOTT, you bet, as much as I hate to be towed anywhere at any time I would prefer that to pulling into this Marina for whatever. NSF :2purples: :2purples: :2purples: :2purples:

[BoatFloating]

I don't know if your buddy is aware, but once the marina fails you and turns you away, they also black ball your I.D. numbers. If he plans on using the boat in that marina I would advise that he make the necessary modifications and go back ASAP. They'll re-test you, but can you imagine what it will be like trying to get re-tested on spring break or Memorial Day? We had a boat that had previously failed and they let us re-test, but that was in the middle of winter with no line to get in. It's going to get ugly down there this year.
Dana, get to work and get off the computer.... I see you had enough time to make a outboard bracket for that awesome cat at Lakeland....
:D

[Dana Marine Products]

I'm Bob, VP, G.M. of Dana Marine Products. Dana is buried under a mill right now, the chips are a flyin'. You liked that O.B. bracket? Pretty wild stuff.
On the marina subject, We've ran three boats through there to test the marina's personel and they were very nice, all our boats passed and we were boating. I agree the version of their law is not right, but if you administer the new CA law 88db at 3.3 ft behind the transom you'll get the same results 10 ft behind the boat at 86 db. The extra 7 feet behind the boat is just about perfect to drop 2 db.
- Use mufflers that are known to pass
- Test yourself before going all the way to Havasu
- Make sure they administer the test 10 feet behind the boat
Complying with their request although is somewhat B.S., is not that difficult to do.

[Big Bear]

What are the chances of reversion with the Bullets. And not to sound like a dummy (first boat) how do you know if that is happening?? I'm guessing the best chance of that happening would be getting all the way out of the throttle and having the wake wash up to the transom. I put my stock flappers back on but I notice my stock tips had internal flaps but the muffs do not.

[BoatFloating]

I'm Bob, VP, G.M. of Dana Marine Products. Dana is buried under a mill right now, the chips are a flyin'. You liked that O.B. bracket? Pretty wild stuff.
It came out pretty nice. Tell Dana Rocky said thanks for making mine for me.....
:hammerhea

[Dana Marine Products]

Reversion can happen a couple of different ways. As far as water washing back up through the tips/mufflers, without the proper installation angle and flappers it can happen fairly easy. Mercruiser put out a news letter to the OEM's a few years ago stating that they must double flap the exhaust tips to cover warranty. They did that because the internal flappers fail so easily. The external clamp on flapper is plenty of flapper and they are very reliable.
The revesion concerns that are coming up with the mufflers is because the water is backing up in the exhaust hose, the water simply can't get out fast enough. Some of the after market muffling devices are too restrictive and don't flow enough water. If your existing exhaust tips have internal flappers, I would advise removing them if you install a clamp on muffler. If a flapper blows out of a standard exhaust tip, it simply blows out, there's nothing to stop it in the tip. With the muffler installed, the flap can break out and plug off the exhaust. Not only will this stop the exhaust from getting out, but it's like building the Boulder Dam in your exhaust tip. Use the external clamp on flapper and you'll be good to go.

[WILD LAVEY]

Wild Lavey, the external clamp on flappers will fit on all Gibson Bullet style mufflers. They will not fit on the Power Curves.
right on, ill see you guys next week. is there anyone there i should ask for?

[Dana Marine Products]

Come on down, I'm Bob, I'll be there 8-6 if not later. If I happen to out running around, there's always someone there to help you.

[Essex502]

I'm Bob, VP, G.M. of Dana Marine Products. Dana is buried under a mill right now, the chips are a flyin'. You liked that O.B. bracket? Pretty wild stuff.
On the marina subject, We've ran three boats through there to test the marina's personel and they were very nice, all our boats passed and we were boating. I agree the version of their law is not right, but if you administer the new CA law 88db at 3.3 ft behind the transom you'll get the same results 10 ft behind the boat at 86 db. The extra 7 feet behind the boat is just about perfect to drop 2 db.
- Use mufflers that are known to pass
- Test yourself before going all the way to Havasu
- Make sure they administer the test 10 feet behind the boat
Complying with their request although is somewhat B.S., is not that difficult to do.
The bigger problem with the B.S. testing is that the test is administered next to a concrete wall that causes an increase in the noise. Nor does the test compensate for the noise of the other boats nearby. You might be surprised at the results you get on a busy day in summer. We re-tested a boat that originally failed during late summer when there was a lot of other boats nearby in the Marina and found that in the late fall with no one arround and cooler temperatures the boat now passed. Gee...consistency?
Factors to consider...
Noise levels change with air temperature.
Noise levels change as the noise source is closer to structure.
Noise levels change with the presence of other noise sources.
Noise levels change with dual motors.
All of these factors work against the boater when the B.S. test is administered by Marina personnel in the manner they are currently practicing. This also doesn't address their violation of the lease the Marina has with the State to provide launch priviledges to all boaters.

[Dana Marine Products]

100% Agreed, There are alot of variables when talking about noise. Get the wind blowing 15 MPH and watch the noise difference. The noise can register up to 2 db's louder in cold weather compared to hot. There's no argument that the marina is not testing consistantly. If they were, there would be taped off markings on the dock so the guy stands in the same spot every time when administering the test. As previously stated, make sure they measure off the 10 feet from the transom. When we were there, the guy had the meter all over the place, up-down-left-right. No doubt it's a joke. But all of our boats passed and the guy was very nice to us.