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caroftheweek
03-08-2005, 04:53 PM
I am looking to add on another family room and another master suite to our house. I need to figure out what kind of money I am looking at to do this. Might possibly build another garage in the back of the property for the truck and trailer. I have heard horror stories about generals taking the money and running and obviously want to avoid that. Any good people cruising around this site who might be able to help???
Thanks, Ryan

JetBoatRich
03-08-2005, 04:55 PM
Talk to Mandelon :wink:

spectratoad
03-08-2005, 04:55 PM
Just remember, "Progress Payments". That way they don't have all the money at once. They get paid as it goes. That may save you from losing any money. I think most generals though are pretty good and honest. Good Luck, I will be doing the same here soon.

MRS FLYIN VEE
03-08-2005, 04:57 PM
there are a few on here but I for one can not recomend anyone we work with.. our contractors are really expensive and they are asses.. plus I think you would be better off with someone from here.. they are all nice. :wink:
most contractors will do most of the work , plumbing, electrical, framing, and all that so get bids. but do not go with the lowest unless you trust them.. and never give too much money upfront.
just my 2 cents.

Mandelon
03-08-2005, 05:01 PM
There are tons of horror stories. Bad contractors are indeed a hazard. Bad customers are no fun either....
Try to get referrals from friends or neighbors...check with BBB they are online too.
Contractors board has some good advice online and you can check licenses, insurance and bonding info as well as complaints at www.CSLB.ca.gov.
No more than $1000 or 10% downpayments allowed, and progress payments as the work progresses and reaches specific milestones.
Such as Escavation, forms up and inspected, slab poured, framing completed, etcetera. Ask for and require lien releases or pay for the material yourself if you don't trust your guy.
Feel free to pm me questions, call or email me.
Prices vary from area to area but $150 and up is common for remodels now....

Schiada76
03-08-2005, 05:04 PM
By Law:
Make sure they use a HOME IMPROVEMENT CONTRACT
$1,000.00 deposit or 10% whichever is less
Contractor cannot bill for more than 100% of work completed
Get all your Lien releases UNCONDITIONAL before paying
Make sure sure employees sign releases
Get wet copies of Workers Comp and Liability
You actually have the contractor by the short and curlies if you play it right.
PM me your address and I'll send you some paperwork that will help.

thesunking
03-08-2005, 05:18 PM
I am looking to add on another family room and another master suite to our house. I need to figure out what kind of money I am looking at to do this. Might possibly build another garage in the back of the property for the truck and trailer. I have heard horror stories about generals taking the money and running and obviously want to avoid that. Any good people cruising around this site who might be able to help???
Thanks, Ryan
After screening numerous GC's we hired a worthless outfit that was dumber than 10 buckets of SHIAT! They sure did a good job at selling the project and assuring us that they were indeed qualified for the scope of work. I had better luck talking to a rock instead of communicating with the so called "PM". Anyway, the work performed was to downsize the existing vinyl liner swimming pool (20' X 40') that was built in the early 80's by the previous home owner and build a new plaster pool (kidney shape 16' X 30') with spa, coping, tile, deck, plumbing, electrical, filter, pump and heater. Just make sure you cross your T's and dot the I's before finalizing who you reward the job to.
So far, we've had 2 great summers enjoying the new pool and equipment?

Mandelon
03-08-2005, 06:20 PM
By Law:
Make sure they use a HOME IMPROVEMENT CONTRACT
$1,000.00 deposit or 10% whichever is less
Contractor cannot bill for more than 100% of work completed
Get all your Lien releases UNCONDITIONAL before paying
Make sure sure employees sign releases
Get wet copies of Workers Comp and Liability
You actually have the contractor by the short and curlies if you play it right.
PM me your address and I'll send you some paperwork that will help.
For an UNCONDITIONAL lien release you'd better be paying in cash....cuz no body ought to release their lien rights until the check is known to be good. You can have a lien release that is conditional upon the check clearing.
Written contracts ....spell out everything....if it isn't written down it didn't happen. A conversation guarantees you nothing......make them write it and sign it.

GHTRIM
03-08-2005, 06:30 PM
Mandelon is correct. I'll only add one more thing... You can go on line and get a copy of an AIA contract this contract is a very fair contract that will bind yourself and your contractor. Any contractor that will not agree to work with an AIA contract may have something to hid. If you want to PM me I will e-mail you a copy we use... It is very simple and to the point and would be very acceptable for your application. Otherwise, I would take all of the pointers Mandelon has given. The place you will want to ask for help is when looking at their (the contractors) subs bids (Three compeditive bids should be your requirement) to ensure all is covered and the General isn't hidding monies... This is VERY easy to do.... Trust me..

INFINITEJJ
03-08-2005, 08:05 PM
For an UNCONDITIONAL lien release you'd better be paying in cash....cuz no body ought to release their lien rights until the check is known to be good. You can have a lien release that is conditional upon the check clearing.
Written contracts ....spell out everything....if it isn't written down it didn't happen. A conversation guarantees you nothing......make them write it and sign it.
Unconditional liens and labor releases are good progress type of releases. Any G.C. would be a fool to give an unconditional without a check that has already cleared. Mandelon is defenatly right, conditional upon payment is good in the progress stage. When the job is complete and everybody is happy and paid in full then comes the unconditional.
P.S. Don't be afraid of the registerd mail that you will be gettin'. (preliminary notices)
P.P.S. And $150.00 per foot is right in the ballpark + or -

77charger
03-08-2005, 08:15 PM
i work with contractors on a daily basis i can say there are a few who have no clue to what they are doing,some just sub out everything with out even picking up a tool.
Dont get me wrong there are also more than few who work hard and do know what they are doing who also do good work(mandelon included).
I only waterproof showers and some of the jobs i pull to some of the contractors dont even have the framing right or left the old thrashed blocking that is rotted outor have no idea what to do (but when they talk to you on the phone they know everything).While the good ones have the framing done properly,staight,and in good condition.

Mandelon
03-08-2005, 08:25 PM
Mandelon is correct. I'll only add one more thing... You can go on line and get a copy of an AIA contract this contract is a very fair contract that will bind yourself and your contractor. Any contractor that will not agree to work with an AIA contract may have something to hid. If you want to PM me I will e-mail you a copy we use... It is very simple and to the point and would be very acceptable for your application. Otherwise, I would take all of the pointers Mandelon has given. The place you will want to ask for help is when looking at their (the contractors) subs bids (Three compeditive bids should be your requirement) to ensure all is covered and the General isn't hidding monies... This is VERY easy to do.... Trust me..
AIA can be a tough one. We have gone with it on many occassions. However, keep in mind if you come across as a hardass customer, some contractors might walk away. After enough years in the business I don't need to take on every job, we can pick and choose. Sometimes we get the guy who wants penalties in the contract and tight deadlilnes. That can be OK, we aren't afraid of that, but sometimes the customers turn out all difficult, impossible to please and cause delays and try to pin them on me.....so sometimes we just say no....folks who have been through it before are easier to deal with.
Our motto is: After dealing with other contractors you will see that we suck less. :p
I usually don't get three subs to bid on jobs....I have subs I have used for years and I trust them for the most part. Loyalty is really key. They show up quick and I pay em quick. That makes it work. We do most of our stuff in house anyway.

plaster dave
03-08-2005, 09:05 PM
AIA can be a tough one. We have gone with it on many occassions. However, keep in mind if you come across as a hardass customer, some contractors might walk away. After enough years in the business I don't need to take on every job, we can pick and choose. Sometimes we get the guy who wants penalties in the contract and tight deadlilnes. That can be OK, we aren't afraid of that, but sometimes the customers turn out all difficult, impossible to please and cause delays and try to pin them on me.....so sometimes we just say no....folks who have been through it before are easier to deal with.
Our motto is: After dealing with other contractors you will see that we suck less. :p
I usually don't get three subs to bid on jobs....I have subs I have used for years and I trust them for the most part. Loyalty is really key. They show up quick and I pay em quick. That makes it work. We do most of our stuff in house anyway.
You are so right I turn down maybe 2 or 3 job a month cause the people have unreasonable expectations about what can be done and done correctly. I cant tell you how many times I give someone a price and they say that I am double the other guy's bid but without fail I get a call to come fix the cheaper guys work. I always get a good laugh cause when I'm done I have a new client for life. Sorry for rambling on.

ROZ
03-08-2005, 10:29 PM
After screening numerous GC's we hired a worthless outfit that was dumber than 10 buckets of SHIAT! They sure did a good job at selling the project and assuring us that they were indeed qualified for the scope of work. I had better luck talking to a rock instead of communicating with the so called "PM". Anyway, the work performed was to downsize the existing vinyl liner swimming pool (20' X 40') that was built in the early 80's by the previous home owner and build a new plaster pool (kidney shape 16' X 30') with spa, coping, tile, deck, plumbing, electrical, filter, pump and heater. Just make sure you cross your T's and dot the I's before finalizing who you reward the job to.
So far, we've had 2 great summers enjoying the new pool and equipment?
Did your contractor have the C53 license or was he a "general" contractor ?

thesunking
03-08-2005, 11:07 PM
Did your contractor have the C53 license or was he a "general" contractor ?
He's under the C53 license. I actually didn't have a problem with his subs, all work ranging from structural rebar to finish plaster was cake. Pool contractor was left with the task of all finish flat work, coping, tile and starting new equipment up. This is where the job went SOUTH.
Are you in the business?

caroftheweek
03-08-2005, 11:20 PM
Thanks everyone for your replys. Right now i am just trying to get an idea of what the numbers would add up to. $150 per sqare foot, good number to start with. When we are ready I will contact you Mandelon to get more detailed questions answered, if I may. Need to figure out the money situation. Thanks again.
Ryan

ROZ
03-09-2005, 12:35 AM
He's under the C53 license. I actually didn't have a problem with his subs, all work ranging from structural rebar to finish plaster was cake. Pool contractor was left with the task of all finish flat work, coping, tile and starting new equipment up. This is where the job went SOUTH.
Are you in the business?
Looking to book a date to take the c53 now....
Surprised he didn't use subs for the coping, tile, and deck... Equiptment is pretty straight foward and usually isn't a problem...
Feel free to ask if you ever have questions about your equiptment.....

thesunking
03-09-2005, 04:55 AM
Looking to book a date to take the c53 now....
Surprised he didn't use subs for the coping, tile, and deck... Equiptment is pretty straight foward and usually isn't a problem...
Feel free to ask if you ever have questions about your equiptment.....
SWEET!
Maybe someday I'll step up and go for my C17!
Good Luck

haulina29
03-09-2005, 07:09 AM
Most Home owners want things done for free , a friend of a friend said it should cost this much etc . the 10 percent down rule means nothing because the next day you can get whatever is in your contract if it is written that way . The ten percent down was to protect home owners from being wined and dined and handing over large somes of money with out thinking it through , I am a GC most GCS i know wouldnt even look at anything in 150 per sg foot range . 200 and up for remodel 150 a foot and your gonna have problems .Most of what we are doing is 225 to 350 a foot and everybody is happy . All high quality subs clean job sites fences insurance etc . Also the open bid policy is a good way to go I always show the home owner the bids and every job has a detailed spec book spelling out every nut and bolt . Saving a few grand in most cases isnt worth the head aches Mitch

GHTRIM
03-09-2005, 09:39 AM
AIA can be a tough one. We have gone with it on many occassions. However, keep in mind if you come across as a hardass customer, some contractors might walk away. After enough years in the business I don't need to take on every job, we can pick and choose. Sometimes we get the guy who wants penalties in the contract and tight deadlilnes. That can be OK, we aren't afraid of that, but sometimes the customers turn out all difficult, impossible to please and cause delays and try to pin them on me.....so sometimes we just say no....folks who have been through it before are easier to deal with.
Our motto is: After dealing with other contractors you will see that we suck less. :p
I usually don't get three subs to bid on jobs....I have subs I have used for years and I trust them for the most part. Loyalty is really key. They show up quick and I pay em quick. That makes it work. We do most of our stuff in house anyway.
First of all your motto LMFAO!!!! That is funny... I understand your concerns regarding AIA but I only told him about it because it will give the guy a starting point. I agree with the loyalty to subs as well. I use many of the same sub for a majority of my projects but I am required to get three compeditive bids in all trades and this becomes very difficult if you never try a new sub that is qualified low.
:)

caroftheweek
03-09-2005, 10:02 AM
I must be naive to this. I was figuring adding on a great room and another master bed/bad. Roughly 800-1000 sqft. I find it hard to believe that this addition would cost $120k - $150k at minumum. But i am not in the biz so what do I know. In my mind I was thinking I could get this done for around $100k. Apparently I am wrong. I am not planning on doing anything else to the rest of the house and the additional rooms are nothing fancy. So is it still considered a remodel? Please enlighten me so I can have a clear vision before i take this on. Thanks everyone.
Ryan

GHTRIM
03-09-2005, 10:10 AM
I would call some recommended "remodel" contractors and get a bid for exactly what you want.. You may be suprised. This way you will know exactly what it will cost. Then make your call as to weather you can afford it or not.

OC-PARTYCAT
03-09-2005, 10:41 AM
In my mind I was thinking I could get this done for around $100k. Apparently I am wrong.
Ryan
nope, your right. you should be able to get someone in there that can do it for about 100k.
Use the AIA contract and add some additional provisions to it. Make sure you make a schedule and have the GC sign it. Time is of the essence. there are way too many guys that milk a job for months that should only take a month or so.
Because the addition is so small, I would also hold 15% retension on the GC. that way, he will get the job done much faster and with higher quality.
Im very fluent with contracts. Make sure you also state that it is turn key and the plans may not represent all that needs to be done to complete the job per all applical codes but is included. All assumtions, oversights and itentions by the Architect and owner are also included.
There are alot of additional provisions that should be added to the standard AIA contract that will lock or get the GC by the nuts if he signs it, and he will.
Take everyones advise on here and it should go real smooth for you. Take the time to write the contract and follow all release/lien rights and laws.

canuck1
03-09-2005, 10:51 AM
AIA can be a tough one. We have gone with it on many occassions. However, keep in mind if you come across as a hardass customer, some contractors might walk away. After enough years in the business I don't need to take on every job, we can pick and choose. Sometimes we get the guy who wants penalties in the contract and tight deadlilnes. That can be OK, we aren't afraid of that, but sometimes the customers turn out all difficult, impossible to please and cause delays and try to pin them on me.....so sometimes we just say no....folks who have been through it before are easier to deal with.
Our motto is: After dealing with other contractors you will see that we suck less. :p
I usually don't get three subs to bid on jobs....I have subs I have used for years and I trust them for the most part. Loyalty is really key. They show up quick and I pay em quick. That makes it work. We do most of our stuff in house anyway.
Mandelon called it right with this post, some people have unrealistic expectations that nobody could meet,some customers are great but sometimes it is just better to write the customer a check for 10 grand and walk away before you even start

victorfb
03-09-2005, 11:14 AM
sq. ft pricing is the norm for most contractors, but dont get fooled. a remodel can very in prices . it all depends on what you want. a living room is by far cheaper than a kitcken or bathroom. and multiple rooms with the same sq.ft measurments as a single living room will also be alot more as the materials and man hours increase tremendously. ALWAYS ask for referals. check on the contractors work and work ethics with some of his recent clients. i for one used to carry 4 to 8 files of my recent clients in my briefcase so i can give the info to a potential client, and they can check on my work. from my experience it has been if the contractor doesnt swing the hammer along with the rest of his crew, then he is more times than not much more expensive than someone that does. of course this only pertains to remodels and single dwelling construction. the larger contractors that do multi dwellings are just that "contractors" and hire foreman to run the actual job. as for the $1000 max initial payment, dont think that is to start construction. thats basically to cover start up fees. $1000 wont buy much in materials and the average contractor/carpenter cannot afford to foot the bill to start contruction then wait to get reimbursed later and pay his guys. just be fair with your contractor and you will be surprised how fair he will be with you. remember "REFERALS"!!!! and talk to atleast 3 of his recent clients.

canuck1
03-09-2005, 11:21 AM
$1000 doesn't usually even cover permits

Mandelon
03-09-2005, 11:26 AM
Mandelon called it right with this post, some people have unrealistic expectations that nobody could meet,some customers are great but sometimes it is just better to write the customer a check for 10 grand and walk away before you even start
Ha! That is so true. There's been a few jobs where it would have been easier to pay the customer and never have taken the job. I've gotten wiser over the years, and if I get a bad vibe during the initial meeting it won't go much further than that.
Basic rooms are cheaper than kitchens and baths for sure. A basic living room or family room should be at the lower end of the price range. No plumbing, or fire places, wacky roof tie ins or fancy stone work......will make it cheaper.
A design build firm will be more aware of what can be built than an architect. I have seen some plansets done by architects that are just stooopid. They cost more to build. Try to find a builder that can do the plans in house and they will be simpler and easier (cheaper) to build.

canuck1
03-09-2005, 11:35 AM
Or someone that says I have done alot of building before...means I watched Bob Villa on tv and I will second guess everything your people do and change my mind 32 times....and it only took them 1/2 hour to finish a 35000' house on tv

OC-PARTYCAT
03-09-2005, 12:45 PM
a reputable comapany will not need any money up front.
They should have enough capital for payroll and overhead. They should have credit with their suppliers that net, at least, 30 days.
You dont want anyone working on your house that doesnt have atleast these two things.

haulina29
03-09-2005, 12:49 PM
A design build is the only go . We have a in house design build team and if we dont draw we do not build it . If you have to have a contract drawn to encourage the contractor to finish you are probably trying to get it done for free . Pay the going rate get a reputable contractor and you will be fine . Also most contractors do not bid per sq ft, they would loose there ass but after a few years you know what your average is.

Schiada76
03-09-2005, 02:08 PM
For an UNCONDITIONAL lien release you'd better be paying in cash....cuz no body ought to release their lien rights until the check is known to be good. You can have a lien release that is conditional upon the check clearing.
Written contracts ....spell out everything....if it isn't written down it didn't happen. A conversation guarantees you nothing......make them write it and sign it.
Conditional release aint woth chit to the homeowner.
You can write a bad check to a sub or supplier get the conditional and the homeowner is still on the hook. States the same in the HI Contract.
Ditto on the in writing, in fact we encouage homeowners to carry a clip board with us walk throughs. Helps jog their memories.
I'm sure Mandelon has had some of those "forgetful" homeowners.
Mandelon, PM me and I'll tell you how to get an Unconditional Release any time you want out of a sub or supplier. :D

Schiada76
03-09-2005, 02:11 PM
Mandelon is correct. I'll only add one more thing... You can go on line and get a copy of an AIA contract this contract is a very fair contract that will bind yourself and your contractor. Any contractor that will not agree to work with an AIA contract may have something to hid. If you want to PM me I will e-mail you a copy we use... It is very simple and to the point and would be very acceptable for your application. Otherwise, I would take all of the pointers Mandelon has given. The place you will want to ask for help is when looking at their (the contractors) subs bids (Three compeditive bids should be your requirement) to ensure all is covered and the General isn't hidding monies... This is VERY easy to do.... Trust me..
AIA contract is NOT LEGAL for home improvement in California.

Schiada76
03-09-2005, 02:18 PM
Unconditional liens and labor releases are good progress type of releases. Any G.C. would be a fool to give an unconditional without a check that has already cleared. Mandelon is defenatly right, conditional upon payment is good in the progress stage. When the job is complete and everybody is happy and paid in full then comes the unconditional.
P.S. Don't be afraid of the registerd mail that you will be gettin'. (preliminary notices)
P.P.S. And $150.00 per foot is right in the ballpark + or -
GC's (IE Primary contractor) don't and are not required to give Lien releases.
The required releases come from SUB contractor's and Suppliers ONLY.
Your check is a guarantee that you have paid the GC. That is all you need.
If the GC does NOT pay his sub/supplier YOU are responsible for the debt whether or not you can prove you paid the GC.
GET UNCONDITIONAL releases from the subs through the GC. The GC can bounce a check to the sub, give you a CONDITIONAL and skate with you still owing the sub!

OC-PARTYCAT
03-09-2005, 02:19 PM
Conditional release aint woth chit to the homeowner.
You can write a bad check to a sub or supplier get the conditional and the homeowner is still on the hook. States the same in the HI Contract.
Joint checks will clear that up...unless you make em bond the job, but thats just more costs to the homeowner.

Schiada76
03-09-2005, 02:24 PM
Joint checks will clear that up...unless you make em bond the job, but thats just more costs to the homeowner.
If the owner is writing joint checks the GC's got a serious problem.