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View Full Version : Bravo or B-Max on the ill-fated HTM??



funkcity
01-26-2002, 12:40 AM
So if......
Those motors were pumping out 950 HP apiece, doesn't that number alone require a Number 6 drive to hold up at all?
B-Max, or XR or Imco or Teague drives,
in- theory are just not going to take that power for very long.
What were they running??

roln 20s
01-26-2002, 01:24 AM
That is not true- the B-Max is rated at a little over a 1000 horse-power. And I know that HTM frequently used B-Max drives for their racing- so it definately would not surprise me if they had them on that boat. But then again, only the facts will tell us! Also- I have seen people with the Bravo XR with different bearings and shafts that run right around a 1000 horse-power and are doing just fine. It all depends on intended purpose- but HTM was very experienced with drives and even have their own upgrade bravo line! It could have been some of those! The facts will tell us- especially since the boat has been pulled up from the bottom of the lake!

Bill in Las Vegas
01-26-2002, 07:35 AM
They may have been running there own new outdrive that they are promoting. This was developed by them becouse they were breaking the B-Max units. See ther advertisement in the last Hot Boat.

OneTime
01-26-2002, 08:17 AM
I was told by a reliable sorce that the boat had HTM built XR drives at the time of the incident.

Jrocket
01-26-2002, 08:56 AM
Hey One Time....Are you also "Jokers Wild Promotions"?...

RumRunner
01-26-2002, 09:20 AM
roln 20s
Where have you seen a HP rating on a B-Max? I've never seen one, and they won't give one if you call them.

hcb26
01-26-2002, 10:38 AM
one time is right the boat had xr drives on it at the time of the accident but from what I saw from pictures of the boat I highly doubt they lost a drive.

Bill in Las Vegas
01-26-2002, 06:11 PM
I don't want to start any crap or over speculate but they may have broken a power steering pump belt. This happened to steve a few weeks before the Regatta and put him into a severe left turn causing serious bruising to his right side. I mention this becouse he told me about it and advised on replacing it every year and checking it before each outing.

SK48
01-26-2002, 07:20 PM
Don't want to start rumors, heard supposed
GPS #'s does anyone know how fast the boat
was going ???

Cat & Mice
01-27-2002, 12:06 AM
Does anyone know what happens to a B-max when the motor shuts down??
I had one of my motors shut down and I was doing 125mph and the boat just starting moving left and I stopped it with some effort but it was not to bad. I have Imco Extreme drives. The motor that shut down was not the motor with the power steering pump. I have full Hydro. steering to the helm. The next time I had a motor hit the rev limiter and shut down it was the motor with the pump. That was a complete different deal. I was going about 115mph and it was very hard to keep from hooking, It took everything I had I am 6ft 5in and 240 lbs not a small guy. It was also very scary because it was at the start of a Poker Run and there where about 100 boats behind me not thinking I was going to turn right including a 40ft Skater that just missed me but I took his rooster in the face (that hurts at 100mph). Any way I was able to get the drive out of gear and restart the motor (not easy when I am still fighting the wheel. It was very hard and things happend in a blink of an eye. When I was back in gear and I hammered the throttle I looked down and I was still going over 100mph. Anyway the point is I wonder what would happen if I was doing 150mph, I really don't know how I pulled it off at 115mph It really was Lady Luck.
Not at all trying to say that this happend to the HTM guy's but this was one of "MY" expreiences.
Even though I have fixed the problem I am putting a priority valve and a pump on each motor in case something like this happens again.
Pyle

Bill in Las Vegas
01-27-2002, 07:39 AM
That is a scary story you describe and you obviously new your boat well to control it under those circumstances. QUESTION since hind sight is 20 20 vision would it have been safe to pull the kill switch lanyard and ride it out. Could or would the sponsons guide the drives straight.

JBJ7457
01-27-2002, 08:59 AM
CAT & MICE
"The motor that shut down was not the motor with the power steering pump."
I don't know much about twin engines but you say the engine with the power steering belt broke. The way you say it ,it sounds like only one engine has power steering. Well if that's the way it was on the HTM boat the engine I saw out of the HTM crashed boat still had the belt on it looked nice and tight, but do not know if it had 2 power steering pumps(both engines)units or not.
JBJ

JBJ7457
01-27-2002, 09:08 AM
When I say (you) said I was referring to:
Bill in Las Vegas
--------
I don't want to start any crap or over speculate but they may have broken a power steering pump belt. This happened to steve a few weeks before the Regatta and put him into a severe left turn causing serious bruising to his right side. I mention this becouse he told me about it and advised on replacing it every year and checking it before each outing.
Cat & Mice I was referring to the engine (only one engine)with the power steering.
JBJ

Cat & Mice
01-27-2002, 10:12 AM
Bill,
I have considered that but I still think it was the best to keep going. I know that one time a Jetskier went right in front of me and I got out of the Throttle fast and the boat did some funky things. When you are going that fast the sponsens are not in the water at all. If you look at my pics of my boat takin buy Hot Boat I was only going 60mph and look at how little of the boat was in the water.
I actually got alot of experiance with the motor shutting down because when we where Mapping the EFI for the first time it kept shutting down the one of the motors. I had to restart at higher speeds about 10 times. So I had that program down.
Your question is a good one, I also think it might have helped to back off the motor that was runnig, but If you have ever had 100 boats at wideopen coming at you, your first thought it to get the heck out of the way fast. I sure did not want to be a sitiing duck.
JBJ7457, No the belt in my boat was fine, I was saying the motor stopped running and since almost all boats only have 1 motor with a pump then if that motor shuts down you are screwed. The first time I had a motor go it was the one without the pump so I still had power steering from the other motor.
Pyle
Boy I need to read my post before I hit submit, I suck at typing.
[This message has been edited by Cat & Mice (edited January 27, 2002).]

Bill in Las Vegas
01-27-2002, 07:11 PM
The incident before the Regatta was in his SS24 which of course is a single engine. I mentioned it becouse Steve was so serious about the importance of checking the belts and replacing them every year. aso Originally posted by JBJ7457:
When I say (you) said I was referring to:
Bill in Las Vegas
--------
I don't want to start any crap or over speculate but they may have broken a power steering pump belt. This happened to steve a few weeks before the Regatta and put him into a severe left turn causing serious bruising to his right side. I mention this becouse he told me about it and advised on replacing it every year and checking it before each outing.
Cat & Mice I was referring to the engine (only one engine)with the power steering.
JBJ

Bill in Las Vegas
01-27-2002, 07:46 PM
Cat @ Mice
Thanks for that explanation. At those speeds I wouldn't want anyone driving up my back. Don't you love those EFI's once you get it mapped in. The only time I have ever had a problem was that I was running off of both battery's and one had a bad cell. This made the computer sense undervoltage so it retarded the timing and enriched the fuel to protect the engine. My transom was alway's black and I lost alot of MPH. New battery's and all was well again. Just a little personnel experience that someone may find interesting.EFI's must have good voltage,clean cable connections and grounds.
I have a Whippled 454 Mag Mpi in my HTM SR24.

badbug
01-28-2002, 08:37 AM
I have imco full hydraulic steering and lost a distributor gear at 100 plus mph and boat just sat down and went straight as an arrow when motor died. Why do some people have problems with their boats going crazy when they lose power at high speeds with hydraulic steering? Is it that they don't have full hydraulic or what? Need to know. Yall are scaring me with this. What exactly is the real deal here?

spectras only
01-28-2002, 09:30 AM
If you have a single engine ,I don't see any problem with the engine stalling.On the other hand with twin engines ,over 100MPH there's no time to raise the leg out of the water and the drag would cause the boat to turn into the direction of the failed engine.That's the same scenario to take off or land with a twin engined aircraft in case of engine failure.With a hydraulic steering system [manual]I don't think it's as much of a problem to hold on as is with a power steering pump setup.One thing is for sure,if I had a twin engine setup in a boat ,I would have a pump on both engines [loose a mile or two in topspeed].Just my worthless 0.02 cents http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

Cat & Mice
01-28-2002, 02:09 PM
BadBug, spectras only is right, if you have a single it is no problem. With twins the motor that is still running pushes the boat towards the downed engine side and also the drag of the drive on the stalle motor also pulls you the same way. It's like sand cars that have a seperate brck for each side of the rear axle, if you apply brake to one side it will make you turn in that direction.
spectras only, You are right about the twin pumps but Merc does not sell 2 pumps when you order a twin engine setup. That is why I bring it up. I will for sure have two pumps on my boat soon. You also have to inlcude a priority valve as well. I would also be suprised if the HTM boat had two pumps and a valve.
Pyle

roln 20s
01-28-2002, 03:05 PM
RumRunner-
I initially heard around a 1000 horsepower from DCB at last years LA Boat Show. They had one on their Mach 26 with the Teague 1000 (featured in Powerboat cat shootout). They said that it can easily handle 1000 hp. In the Feb 2001 ***boat shop tour of BMax: they never say a horsepower- but they just tell of the boats that are running the drives and the power they have. They mention a couple of HTM's in the 1300 hp range- but as i read earlier in this post- someone heard that he was breaking the BMax's probably with this amount of power. BMax talked about drives most of their drives being on boats ranging from 500-1000 hp (feb 2001). I don't have one and don't know anyone who does, but it doesn't surprise me that they will not put a HP limit on their drives since they are so many different HP and torque amounts. If i find anything else out- i'll post it!

Tantrum
01-28-2002, 03:12 PM
Singles can have problems as well. Not exactly relevent to the HTM situation because you guys are right on and the HTM obviously had twins. In a single engine if the motor siezes or the drive comes apart and locks, you could have a problem on your hands. This will cause big drag on the back of the boat lifting the transome and dig the nose. Boat can get real squirly.

25 Eagle
01-28-2002, 03:37 PM
If it is true that the boat had no interior, then three guys all rolling to that side of the boat didn't help things either. IMHO

havasu boat builder
02-14-2002, 07:09 PM
all merc motors come with pumps, the boat factory removes one upon intsall.................hydraulic steering and a tie bar will help(knowing the hp, that was hopefully the case)................everything posted so far is pure speculation until the second motor comes up