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Her454
06-24-2005, 10:13 AM
In light of the latest Dog (Pit Bull) attack in San Francisco where the mother left the child with a dog that had bit the child previously that day......and then killed him later while left along with the dog...
What do you think should happen to people and or animals that attack and kill people? SF is now banning Pit Bulls from the city limits......Im not sure thats the right approach, but maybe a start?
I think that dogs should be put down, period. The owners should be prosecuted depending on the circumstance but most certainly prosecuted if the animal had a history of aggression and the owner with negligence. Unfortunatly this is most of time difficult to prove as it does not get documented until its too late.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 10:16 AM
In a case where their is documented problems with an animal or a breed, the owner should be prosecuted heavily.
I could keep a tiger at my house and think he's a total sweetheart but if it gets out and kills a neighbor's kid, I would deserve to have my nuts cut off.

Wonderboy
06-24-2005, 10:19 AM
Every case will be different, but in this one the mother is clearly at fault. She left her child with the dog that had bitten the child earlier in the day? WTF? I say several years jail time for her.

oldbuck40
06-24-2005, 10:20 AM
shoot the damn dog and feed the parents to the lion's,see if they like it. poor kid. i dont mean for this to sound bad but if the dog act's like this from the way it was treated then what do you think the child would have acted like when he or she grew up! its not the dogs fault,but it sure is the parents!

syke-o
06-24-2005, 10:22 AM
the parents need to be punished...

Her454
06-24-2005, 10:22 AM
Mother of mauling victim feared family dog
Shut boy in basement while she ran errands
Monday, June 13, 2005 Posted: 2:43 AM EDT (0643 GMT)
Nicholas Scott Faibish, 12, was mauled to death by his family's two pit bulls on June 3.
SAN FRANCISCO, California (AP) -- The mother of a 12-year-old boy killed in his own home by one of the family's two pit bulls says she had been so concerned about one of the dogs that she shut her son in the basement to protect him.
Maureen Faibish said she ordered Nicholas to stay in the basement while she did errands on June 3, the day he was attacked by one or both of the dogs.
She said she was worried about the male dog, Rex, who was acting possessive because the female, Ella, was in heat.
"I put him down there, with a shovel on the door," Faibish said in an interview with the San Francisco Chronicle. "And I told him: 'Stay down there until I come back.' Typical Nicky, he wouldn't listen to me."
Nicholas apparently found a way to open the basement door.
Despite her concerns about Rex that day, Faibish told the newspaper: "My kids got along great with (the dogs). We were never seeing any kind of violent tendencies."
Faibish found her son's body in a bedroom. He was covered in blood from several wounds, including a major head injury.
No charges have been filed.
"It's Nicky's time to go," she said in the interview. "When you're born you're destined to go and this was his time."
Ella was shot to death by a police officer the day of the attack.
Rex was taken to a shelter, but Faibish said she wanted him put down.
************************************************** *******
"Nicky's Time to Go" was helped along by the mothers negligence. What an assinine thing to say, even grief stricken.

Sleek-Jet
06-24-2005, 10:23 AM
A dog behaves as it was raised... so who raises the dog??? Yep, the owner. Therefore the owner should be help liable for the actions of the dog.
If a dog has a history of bitting and agressivness, and then it goes out and attacks or kills a person, the owner should be held to the same level as if he or she attacked a person with a deadly weapon.
It's a little thing adults like to call responsibility. If you want to own a viscous or aggresive dog, then you need to be ready to take ownership of the dog's actions.

Deano
06-24-2005, 10:25 AM
There are some pretty f**ked up people in this world..
I had a secretary last year that told me her pit attacked her 7 y/o daughter but, she said her daughter deserved it because she was f'in with it..
How stupid is that..I have three dogs and if they even growl at any of my kids, for any reason, they get the shit kicked out of em and if it happens again they are gone.
that crazy bitch needs to go to jail.....fukin locking her son in the basement, holy shit

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 10:28 AM
The dogs were misbehaving so they locked their son in the basement? LMAO! :D :D :D
Hey Traci, I just bought the property next to you and will be moving in with my collection of snakes. Don't worry, they won't come over and kill you, your daughter, and your animals... these are very gentle snakes and I've given them a lot of love. :)

Her454
06-24-2005, 10:49 AM
The dogs were misbehaving so they locked their son in the basement? LMAO! :D :D :D
Hey Traci, I just bought the property next to you and will be moving in with my collection of snakes. Don't worry, they won't come over and kill you, your daughter, and your animals... these are very gentle snakes and I've given them a lot of love. :)
I was wondering who purchased that property..... Im glad you treat your snakes well and give them lots of love, but if they cross my fence I'll blow them to shit. Even if they're just being friendly..................;):)
Welcome to the Hood..............

RiverDave
06-24-2005, 10:56 AM
The dogs were misbehaving so they locked their son in the basement? LMAO! :D :D :D
Tom, unfortunately I don't have time to get into the debate with you today.. LOL Comparing a pit to a snake though.. That's kind of a stretch.
I'd just like to point out the mentallity of the dog owner.. (I.E. your post above) Kind of makes you wonder about how the dogs were raised? Can't blame an entire breed becuase a few mental people own them..
I'm sure your not going to understand the mentallity, but that's like saying we should ban all guns becuase a crazy person might get there hands on one?
RD

HCS
06-24-2005, 11:02 AM
You see the size of the heads on those dogs on the news? :sqeyes:
I don't know who in there right mind would want to own dogs like that.
Obviously she was not in her right mind.

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:02 AM
Tom, unfortunately I don't have time to get into the debate with you today.. LOL Comparing a pit to a snake though.. That's kind of a stretch.
I'd just like to point out the mentallity of the dog owner.. (I.E. your post above) Kind of makes you wonder about how the dogs were raised? Can't blame an entire breed becuase a few mental people own them..
I'm sure your not going to understand the mentallity, but that's like saying we should ban all guns becuase a crazy person might get there hands on one?
RD
That was the point of my thread RD, the mentality and how the owners should, in MY opinion be held responsible. I dont think its fair to single out a single breed either but statistics prove that there are more FATALITIES from Pit Bull Attacks than any other breed. Not more attacks, but fatalities. Hence the reason for the ban in SF and other cities that are considering the same. I know you love Neva, but I also think that when the time comes for you to bless us all with mini RD offspring and Neva became aggressive toward the child, that you would make a decision. UNLIKE most of the cases we are reading about in the paper, they made excuses, ignored the aggression etc. The results are deadly and in the end, its the owners fault.

chrissy
06-24-2005, 11:05 AM
Once again we have IRRESPONSIBLE DOG OWNERS, giving the breed a bad name.As the owner of a Pit bull, this subject drives me insane. These people have no clue about the breed. IF my dog ever showed any aggression or bit anyone he would be gone. The saddest thing about this is Pits really love people. You have to understand what kind of dog they are and spend time with them, train them etc. HATE THE DEED-NOT THE BREED!!!!!!!!

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:07 AM
Once again we have IRRESPONSIBLE DOG OWNERS, giving the breed a bad name.As the owner of a Pit bull, this subject drives me insane. These people have no clue about the breed. IF my dog ever showed any aggression or bit anyone he would be gone. The saddest thing about this is Pits really love people. You have to understand what kind of dog they are and spend time with them, train them etc. HATE THE DEED-NOT THE BREED!!!!!!!!
Chrissy, Not my intention to bash Pit Owners. I know many Pits that are great dogs. I prefer Shepherds, you prefer Pits. To each his own and thats what makes the world go round. What makes it safe tho, and we both agree, are RESPONSIBLE OWNERS.

HCS
06-24-2005, 11:09 AM
What gets me is the female dog was in heat. The male dog was humping on the female when the kid intervened, so the dogs turn on him.
What's that have to do with the way the dogs were raised??????? :eat:

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:12 AM
What gets me is the female dog was in heat. The male dog was humping on the female when the kid intervened, so the dogs turn on him.
What's that have to do with the way the dogs were raised??????? :eat:
Its ok because they were in heat?

topless
06-24-2005, 11:16 AM
The mother should be prosecuted for her stupidity. Why the hell would you leave a child alone in a house with aggressive acting dogs....no matter what the breed. Oh maybe it was because she knew it was her sons time to go.

Norseman
06-24-2005, 11:18 AM
In light of the latest Dog (Pit Bull) attack in San Francisco where the mother left the child with a dog that had bit the child previously that day......and then killed him later while left along with the dog...
What do you think should happen to people and or animals that attack and kill people? SF is now banning Pit Bulls from the city limits......Im not sure thats the right approach, but maybe a start?
I think that dogs should be put down, period. The owners should be prosecuted depending on the circumstance but most certainly prosecuted if the animal had a history of aggression and the owner with negligence. Unfortunatly this is most of time difficult to prove as it does not get documented until its too late.
I think the owners should be put down!!!!!!! :angry2:
The dogs should go to rehab!!!! :D

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:18 AM
Oh maybe it was because she knew it was her sons time to go.
That just blew me away...........how stupid can you be? She sounds a few bricks short of a load anyway to lock her son in a closet WITH A SHOVEL......

ROZ
06-24-2005, 11:20 AM
Its ok because they were in heat?
I think he's refrencing Chrissy's hate the deed not the breed refrence.. Maybe natural for a dog to get mad at someone intervening with copulation or feeding time..

chrissy
06-24-2005, 11:20 AM
What gets me is the female dog was in heat. The male dog was humping on the female when the kid intervened, so the dogs turn on him.
What's that have to do with the way the dogs were raised??????? :eat:
It has everything to do with the way they are raised!!! Pits are also called the bully breed. I have raised my dog to be totally submissive to me so I would never have any problems. I can't believe that women can even live with herself after what happened to her son.

HCS
06-24-2005, 11:26 AM
Its ok because they were in heat?
This subject gets really sour with me. Iv'e owned alot of different dogs.
From a German Sheppard to Labradors.
The German Sheppard was known to bite people when startled. Same with my Lab. He bit the mail man on a couple of different occations.
None of my dogs ever ete people to death !
Pit Bulls get a bad rap because they should. Everytime this kind of thing happens it's always a damn Pit Bull. The breed of dog defintely needs to be evaluated. Their deadly.

ROZ
06-24-2005, 11:26 AM
It has everything to do with the way they are raised!!!
Not necessarily... Any animal can become aggressive at any point at time...

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:30 AM
This subject gets really sour with me. Iv'e owned alot of different dogs.
From a German Sheppard to Labradors.
The German Sheppard was known to bite people when startled. Same with my Lab. He bit the mail man on a couple of different occations.
None of my dogs ever ete people to death !
Pit Bulls get a bad rap because they should. Everytime this kind of thing happens it's always a damn Pit Bull. The breed of dog defintely needs to be evaluated. Their deadly.
Lets ask this question: If for some reason law enforcement needed to use force with you or a loved one that included a patrol dog - for whatever reason, would you want a trained German Shepherd or a trained Pit Bull that were raised the same?
I would want the Shepherd.

Norseman
06-24-2005, 11:30 AM
In a case where their is documented problems with an animal or a breed, the owner should be prosecuted heavily.
I could keep a tiger at my house and think he's a total sweetheart but if it gets out and kills a neighbor's kid, I would deserve to have my nuts cut off.
It's not a problem with the breed it's a problem with the owners!!!! :messedup:
Any dog can be made mean and aggressive, no breed is born that way.
The problem with pit bulls is the way they attack, they have VERY strong jaws and tend to hold on and shake. Other dogs behave differently so that the attacks maybe less violent.
Any dog can be aggressive given the right set of circumstances. But that said if mine acted aggressive towards the family she's be put down, member of the family or not!!!!! :squiggle:
Of course Goldens tend to be pretty mellow....... :D

chrissy
06-24-2005, 11:31 AM
This subject gets really sour with me. Iv'e owned alot of different dogs.
From a German Sheppard to Labradors.
The German Sheppard was known to bite people when startled. Same with my Lab. He bit the mail man on a couple of different occations.
None of my dogs ever ete people to death !
Pit Bulls get a bad rap because they should. Everytime this kind of thing happens it's always a damn Pit Bull. The breed of dog defintely needs to be evaluated. Their deadly.
An Alaskan Malumute killed a little girl in Colorado recently, should they get a bad rap too???

HCS
06-24-2005, 11:35 AM
Lets ask this question: If for some reason law enforcement needed to use force with you or a loved one that included a patrol dog - for whatever reason, would you want a trained German Shepherd or a trained Pit Bull that were raised the same?
I would want the Shepherd.
Exactly. That's why police dogs are Germen Shepperds. Their trainable.
You can teach them when to attack and when to stop!

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 11:36 AM
... if they cross my fence I'll blow them to shit. Even if they're just being friendly..................;):)
... but they just want to be loved. :confused: :(
If you treat them badly and they become mean, that will be your fault and I will hold you responsible for their behavior.
Tom, unfortunately I don't have time to get into the debate with you today..
Well then, I think it's likely that you will lose the debate.
Comparing a pit to a snake though.. That's kind of a stretch.
No it's not. It's just as arbitrary to compare a pit bull to a chihuahua as it is to compare a pit bull to a snake. If your love of your pet is sacred and if it's OK for you to prioritize your trust of your pet over the safety of your neighbors, then it's OK for me to prioritize my trust of my pet over the safety of my neighbors.
Don't worry Dave, my snake won't bite you and even if it does, there is anti venom. :cool:
I'd just like to point out the mentality of the dog owner..
I'm all about mentality.
Kind of makes you wonder about how the dogs were raised?
Dave... love will not change an animal's (or person's... for that matter) desire to do harm. An angry dog is an angry dog. Maybe you can sway their disposition a small amount but every breeder I've ever spoken with takes disposition being genetic as a given. Genetic... Dave.
Can't blame an entire breed because a few mental people own them..
No you can't. You also can't blame all snakes for being dangerous. The number of snakes that kill people each year is tiny compared to the total number of snakes.
.... so I'm going to assemble the most lethal mother focking group of nasty assed snakes I can find, move in next to you, and let them sun themselves on my lawn. Hey... they don't like to be caged.
Hell Dave, for you I'll even throw in a couple of dozen alligators. I know how much you love gators. Hey... you can't judge all alligators by the actions of a few gators.
I hope you enjoy my gator farm hissing at you every time you walk past my yard. Don't worry, Dave. They won't hurt you. I've given them nothing but love and kindness. They are really sweet misunderstood animals.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 11:37 AM
Its ok because they were in heat?
I've done some things when I was in heat that I wouldn't have believed I'd ever do.

NoCal NoBoat
06-24-2005, 11:38 AM
The mother was arrested yesterday/today and charged with felony child endangerment. She was still in jail this morning. Many Bay Area residents would have preferred that she be charged with manslaughter.

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:42 AM
Dog aggression is almost always preceded by some kind of warning, and there is usually a reason behind the attack. Its unfortunate that most owners - which appear to be Pit Owners in these fatalities, do not recognize the dog's behavior as aggression, or refuse to acknowledge it as a warning sign. The only exception I can think of is Springer Rage, a rare and highly controversial neurological condition (if it truly exists) that manifests itself as a spontaneous attack, followed by confusion, and then a return to normal behavior. This happened recently back east, BUT Pit Bulls are NOT prone to this condition. There are dogs of all breeds that may in fact be more aggressive than pits, but with fewer FATALITIES.

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:44 AM
Exactly. That's why police dogs are Germen Shepperds. Their trainable.
You can teach them when to attack and when to stop!
Its a fact that a dog named Maddie, a Bull Terrior still holds the records to obedience and a few other prize titles..... but that does not change the fact I wouldnt want one biting down on me if I had a choice.

chrissy
06-24-2005, 11:45 AM
Not necessarily... Any animal can become aggressive at any point at time...
That is true, ANY dog can be unpredictable. Both of my sons have been bitten by neighborhood dogs and they were all mutts. But if you take your dog ownership serisously like I do, you will train your dog and know your dog to prevent things like a dog attack from happening. I know that may sound silly to some people but I guess that means I'm just too responsible for my own good... :hammer2:

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:46 AM
Tom Brown, you are my hero. I wish I had a way with words like you do.
:D
..........but I still dont want your snakes or gators any where near me.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 11:49 AM
Dog aggression is almost always preceded by some kind of warning...
How can you take a dog into your home, love it, make it part of your family... and then hold it's life in the balance based on your judgment of it's actions?
Is fido just being stupid or is he turning into a killer?
I don't think it's possible to do that.
Look at convicted murderers. Their siblings and parents refuse to believe they could kill and defend their innocence with great passion.
I'm not a dog guy but I've lived with dogs that I have loved a lot. I'm pretty confident I couldn't decide to put a dog I loved down because of it's aggressive behavior unless the behavior was unbelievably blatant and I had a lot of encouragement to put the dog down from other members of the family. Holy cow, that would be hard. I don't think it's reasonable to expect people to do that.
I don't offer any solutions to this problem so I'm going to continue breeding gators and trying to buy property next to RD. Here Niva... come on over and play with Wally and friends.

Her454
06-24-2005, 11:55 AM
How can you take a dog into your home, love it, make it part of your family... and then hold it's life in the balance based on your judgment of it's actions?
I'm pretty confident I couldn't decide to put a dog I loved down because of it's aggressive behavior unless the behavior was unbelievably blatant and I had a lot of encouragement to put the dog down from other members of the family. Holy cow, that would be hard. I don't think it's reasonable to expect people to do that.
As a PARENT, I'm pretty confident that if you had a dog, and it growled, snapped or showed aggression toward your CHILD you would'nt find it that hard.
I've been in that very same position. I had the dog for 5 years and loved her dearly. I was pregnant and she snapped at a neighbors little girl for tugging on her while she slept. Tough Decision? IT HURT to do, but no it wasnt a tough decision. I wasnt ready to take that risk.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 11:57 AM
I'm sure your not going to understand the mentallity, but that's like saying we should ban all guns becuase a crazy person might get there hands on one?
Dave... I'm a Canadian. You know Canada? It's that permanently frozen glacier north of you where we have universal health care, greatly restricted gun privileges compared to the US, and a murder rate that is 1/3 that of God's own USA.
Yeah... I guess you could say I don't understand that mentality. :D

topless
06-24-2005, 11:59 AM
As a PARENT, I'm pretty confident that if you had a dog, and it growled, snapped or showed aggression toward your CHILD you would'nt find it that hard.
I've been in that very same position. I had the dog for 5 years and loved her dearly. I was pregnant and she snapped at a neighbors little girl for tugging on her while she slept. Tough Decision? IT HURT to do, but no it wasnt a tough decision. I wasnt ready to take that risk.I had a dog also when I was prego that did the same thing. I gave her to a family with older kids because this breed is KNOWN for snapping at children. I wasn't going to take any chances either. Props to you T.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 12:07 PM
IT HURT to do, but no it wasnt a tough decision. I wasnt ready to take that risk.
That doesn't imply that everyone could make that decision and it doesn't imply that your judgment will be infallible.
What about someone like me? Let's say I get a nasty assed dog that I really love and want to reform but it accidentally gets out and kills a neighborhood child before I manage to sweeten it? What's the judgment on that?
Maybe some risks are too dangerous to allow people to take with other people's lives? I wouldn't want a fireworks factory next door to me. The city wouldn't allow it... even if the factory owner promised that all possible safety procedures and measures would be taken.
I just don't think you can put all dogs in the same judgment kennel. If a rottweiler goes crazy, that has much larger implications than if a toy poodle goes crazy.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 12:08 PM
Hey Dave, you're badly losing this argument.

Wally_Gator
06-24-2005, 12:09 PM
As a PARENT, I'm pretty confident that if you had a dog, and it growled, snapped or showed aggression toward your CHILD you would'nt find it that hard.
I've been in that very same position. I had the dog for 5 years and loved her dearly. I was pregnant and she snapped at a neighbors little girl for tugging on her while she slept. Tough Decision? IT HURT to do, but no it wasnt a tough decision. I wasnt ready to take that risk.
Wasn't Tracy trying to quit or severely curtail her ***boat postings?

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 12:11 PM
Wasn't Tracy trying to quit or severely curtail her ***boat postings?
She was but we had an intervention. :D
Hey Wally... my gator comments were not meant to be derogatory to you or toward anyone with 'gator' in their user name. I apologize if my comments have caused offense.

Wally_Gator
06-24-2005, 12:12 PM
She was but we had an intervention. :D
Hey Wally... my gator comments were not meant to be derogatory to you or toward anyone with 'gator' in their user name. I apologize if my comments have caused offense.
What comments... Did I miss them? No offense here...

MILKMAN351
06-24-2005, 12:18 PM
A dog behaves as it was raised... so who raises the dog??? Yep, the owner. Therefore the owner should be help liable for the actions of the dog.
If a dog has a history of bitting and agressivness, and then it goes out and attacks or kills a person, the owner should be held to the same level as if he or she attacked a person with a deadly weapon.
It's a little thing adults like to call responsibility. If you want to own a viscous or aggresive dog, then you need to be ready to take ownership of the dog's actions.
EXACTLY. A GUY I WORK WITH HAS KIDS AND HAS BEEN RAISING AND BREEDING PIT BULLS FOR YEARS. BECAUSE OF WHAT THE MEDIA HAS HAMMERED INTO MY BRAIN, I THOUGHT HE WAS FULL OF SH*T ABOUT THEIR DISPOSITION UNTIL I SAW THEM. THEY ARE GREAT, BEAUTIFUL, DOCILE DOGS WHEN TREATED AND RAISED LIKE ANY OTHER DOG. AMAZING WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU DON'T BEAT AND ANIMAL OR CAGE IT AND POKE WITH A STICK. IN FACT, SEEING THEM IN PERSON, MOST PEOPLE WOULDN'T REALIZE THEY WERE PIT BULLS. MEDIA HAS FOCUSED ON PIT BULL ACCIDENTS AND TITLED THEM KILLERS, PROBLEM IS I'VE KNOWN MANY DOGS THAT HAVE HURT AND KILLED PEOPLE AND NOT ONE OF THOSE BREEDS HAVE EVER MADE THE NEWS. IT ONLY TAKES ONE INCIDENT AND THE MEDIA WILL POUNCE ON WHAT EVER IT IS REPEATEDLY EVERY TIME IT OCCURS REGARDLESS OF EVERYTHING ELSE GOING ON IN THE WORLD. DOGS, PEOPLE, WHATEVER.
A BUDDY OF MINE WAS SEVERELY ATTACKED BY A GERMAN SHEPARD ONCE.
HAD IT BEEN A PIT BULL IT WOULD HAVE BEEN A CIRCUS. THE DAMAGE WAS DONE REGARDLESS OF WHO OR WHAT DID IT. THE WHOLE PIT BULL PHENOMENON IS JUST AN EASY WAY FOR PEOPLE TO SHUN ALL RESPONSIBILITY FOR SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED BECAUSE OF THEIR IGNORANCE.
PEOPLE SHOULD ALWAYS BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE WETHER ITS DOGS OR CARS OR CHILDREN. ITS TIME TO NUT UP.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 12:25 PM
What comments... Did I miss them? No offense here...
RiverDave has a fear of alligators. You know... like HOSS has a fear of midgets. Anyway, I threw out the comments about raising a gator farm next door to RD because I new it would piss him off. :D
I can just imagine RD's bugged out eyes as he walks past my front gate with my gators all snapping and hissing at him. LOL!
It would be kind of like kids walking through my neighborhood being scared because one of my neighbors has a rottweiler that will bark like a crazy fool and scratch at the fence when someone walks by. It freaks the kids out so they don't walk through that alley too much.
Having a big mean dog that scares the shit out of people is a completely different thing than having a small timid dog. There are large dogs that are very well behaved and I think that's great. There are also large dogs that scare the shit out of people. I believe that is the intention of those dogs. I'm not so OK with that. Hell... I wouldn't want to live next door to a small yappy dog, either.
It's different on a farm. There's nobody around. In town, however, it's not OK if the dog makes too much noise or terrifies the neighborhood children.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 12:26 PM
I've been in that very same position. I had the dog for 5 years and loved her dearly. I was pregnant and she snapped at a neighbors little girl for tugging on her while she slept.
You must have beaten the dog. It wouldn't have done that unless it was mistreated. It's never the dog's fault... it's the owner's fault.
Personally, I think that a dog that attacks is always at fault... and the owner is always responsible.

Her454
06-24-2005, 12:28 PM
That doesn't imply that everyone could make that decision and it doesn't imply that your judgment will be infallible.
What about someone like me? Let's say I get a nasty assed dog that I really love and want to reform but it accidentally gets out and kills a neighborhood child before I manage to sweeten it? What's the judgment on that?
Maybe some risks are too dangerous to allow people to take with other people's lives? I wouldn't want a fireworks factory next door to me. The city wouldn't allow it... even if the factory owner promised that all possible safety procedures and measures would be taken.
I just don't think you can put all dogs in the same judgment kennel. If a rottweiler goes crazy, that has much larger implications than if a toy poodle goes crazy.
You are correct, not everyone can or will make that decision. Nor will we ever know if it was right. But I will sleep much better at night knowing I am not the owner of a dog that mauled my child or someone else's and that was the important issue to me in that situation.
If you get a nasty ass dog that your "trying to reform" than you are acknowledging a risk to yourself, and others around you, and the fact the dog needs "reforming" therefore you should take the proper precautions to ensure that dog does NOT get out and kill a neighborhood kid before you can sweeten it. If it does, the the judgement would be, and to quote you correctly......
I could keep a tiger at my house and think he's a total sweetheart but if it gets out and kills a neighbor's kid, I would deserve to have my nuts cut off.
you would deserve to have your nuts cut off.

topless
06-24-2005, 12:30 PM
You must have beaten the dog. It wouldn't have done that unless it was mistreated. It's never the dog's fault... it's the owner's fault.
Personally, I think that a dog that attacks is always at fault... and the owner is always responsible.Of course I beat the dog. Then I locked a chid in my basement but I was resposible and locked it with a shovel. :D

Her454
06-24-2005, 12:32 PM
You must have beaten the dog. It wouldn't have done that unless it was mistreated. It's never the dog's fault... it's the owner's fault.
Personally, I think that a dog that attacks is always at fault... and the owner is always responsible.
LMAO, my husband actually brought the dog home to me, he found her on the side of the road with road rash from being tossed from a truck we assume. She was an older, beautiful German Shepherd that I took in. Correction , It would have been my fault, had I kept her and something happened.........
Isn't it time for your nap? Your exhausting my patience and making me think way to damn much for a friday. :D

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 12:32 PM
...you would deserve to have your nuts cut off.
... that wouldn't help the dog but it would probably make my disposition much more pleasant.. :D

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 12:46 PM
Of course I beat the dog. Then I locked a chid in my basement but I was resposible and locked it with a shovel. :D
That's why you're the queen of the 909. :D
LMAO, my husband actually brought the dog home to me, he found her on the side of the road with road rash from being tossed from a truck we assume.
Don't you live in a semi-rural setting? If I lived outside of the city, I would definitely own at least one dog.
I think you're great Traci, and I know that you think long and hard about the safety of people around you, not just your own family. If all dog owners were as responsible as you, there would be no problems.
Isn't it time for your nap? Your exhausting my patience and making me think way to damn much for a friday. :D
Actually, I'm just about to head down to the cafeteria for a bran muffin. I've been working way too hard.

NorCal Gameshow
06-24-2005, 12:47 PM
there's got to be more to this story....
Did she lock her kid in the basement to protect him from the dog?
or, Did she lock the kid in the basement with the dogs guarding the door?

JennyG
06-24-2005, 01:02 PM
My dog is ferocious...lol
http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2724Holly_Wood_18_Email-med.JPG http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2724Holly_Wood_33_Email-med.JPG http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2724Holly_Wood_56_Email-med.JPG
Sorry guys I just figured out how to post pictures so its still amusing to me :)
PS.Hi Dad..this whole convo is reminding me of Jetson and Sheba...sad huh

moneypit
06-24-2005, 01:05 PM
In a case where their is documented problems with an animal or a breed, the owner should be prosecuted heavily.
I could keep a tiger at my house and think he's a total sweetheart but if it gets out and kills a neighbor's kid, I would deserve to have my nuts cut off.
Funny you talk about a tiger.. The guy that had a Tiger in the Moorpark/Simi valley area (the one that got loose). I think they are going to make an example of this man.
As for dog owners, its like owning a gun... It really depends o n the situation. Pitbulls shouldnt be exclusive or owners of them shouldnt be exclusive.. I have heard alot of stories about good pitbulls.. Its all about breeding and ownership.

Her454
06-24-2005, 01:09 PM
Don't you live in a semi-rural setting? If I lived outside of the city, I would definitely own at least one dog.
I own two dogs actually. I have about an 8 month old German Shepherd (Hemi) and a 4 year old Queensland (Scrappy, appropriatly named) .............. :) :) :) They keep the coyotes, skunks, racoons and snakes somewhat away........... and the cat takes care of the occasional tarantula in the garage. :yuk:

ELIMINAT THIS
06-24-2005, 01:25 PM
It has everything to do with the way they are raised!!! Pits are also called the bully breed. I have raised my dog to be totally submissive to me so I would never have any problems. I can't believe that women can even live with herself after what happened to her son.
Im sorry but we have had three pit bull attacks in the bay area in the last three weeks and the owners always say that same shit "this dog has always been the best family dog ever" it has never been aggressive .PitBull's are aggressive period (born that way) isn't that why the geto superstars have them.My brother had a pit for 4 years he was a great family dog (really he was) untill my son walked into him,when he was eating, the dog went for his throat and just missed got him on the upper right shoulder ripped a 1'' by 2'' piece of flesh off my son.BTW this dog was so submissive every time I walked up too him he would roll over and piss all over him self.A good friend of mine also had a pit same story great family dog untill he atacked a kid riding a skateboard,ripped his pants off,12 stitches in his leg and ripped his hand open.Yes he is getting his ass handed to him in court.I have one more story about pits ,its the same shit as the other two.One more thing if I left my son in the house with my male lab and a female dog in heat.I wounder if my lab would kill my son.My .05

Norseman
06-24-2005, 01:28 PM
RiverDave has a fear of alligators. You know... like HOSS has a fear of midgets. Anyway, I threw out the comments about raising a gator farm next door to RD because I new it would piss him off. :D
I can just imagine RD's bugged out eyes as he walks past my front gate with my gators all snapping and hissing at him. LOL!
.
I can just imagine your eyes when you open the gate and became gator snack!! :2purples:
It would be kind of like kids walking through my neighborhood being scared because one of my neighbors has a rottweiler that will bark like a crazy fool and scratch at the fence when someone walks by. It freaks the kids out so they don't walk through that alley too much.
Having a big mean dog that scares the shit out of people is a completely different thing than having a small timid dog. There are large dogs that are very well behaved and I think that's great. There are also large dogs that scare the shit out of people. I believe that is the intention of those dogs. I'm not so OK with that. Hell... I wouldn't want to live next door to a small yappy dog, either.
It's different on a farm. There's nobody around. In town, however, it's not OK if the dog makes too much noise or terrifies the neighborhood children.
We got our dog, a Golden Retrievor, when my daughter Jessie was going into 3rd grade. One of the main reasons was because of a really large Rottweiler that used to run loose in the neighborhood. The dog was very nice and very docil, but would roam free and always liked to say hello when it saw you outside. It was also very Large, 250 - 275 lbs. When Joan would walk Jessie to the bus stop Brutus would run over and say Hi, both my kids would try to hide or climb up Joan to get away. We got Daisy so that the kids would realize that dogs were not bad and that they should not be afraid of them.
They even learned to like Brutus.

HCS
06-24-2005, 01:29 PM
My dog is ferocious...lol
http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2724Holly_Wood_18_Email-med.JPG http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2724Holly_Wood_33_Email-med.JPG http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2724Holly_Wood_56_Email-med.JPG
Sorry guys I just figured out how to post pictures so its still amusing to me :)
PS.Hi Dad..this whole convo is reminding me of Jetson and Sheba...sad huh
Hi Jen. Here's my answer to Pitt Bulls.
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shells7/nigerians1.jpg
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shells7/nigerians2.jpg
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shells7/nigerians3.jpg

chrissy
06-24-2005, 01:49 PM
Im sorry but we have had three pit bull attacks in the bay area in the last three weeks and the owners always say that same shit "this dog has always been the best family dog ever" it has never been aggressive .PitBull's are aggressive period (born that way) isn't that why the geto superstars have them.My brother had a pit for 4 years he was a great family dog (really he was) untill my son walked into him,when he was eating, the dog went for his throat and just missed got him on the upper right shoulder ripped a 1'' by 2'' piece of flesh off my son.BTW this dog was so submissive every time I walked up too him he would roll over and piss all over him self.A good friend of mine also had a pit same story great family dog untill he atacked a kid riding a skateboard,ripped his pants off,12 stitches in his leg and ripped his hand open.Yes he is getting his ass handed to him in court.I have one more story about pits ,its the same shit as the other two.One more thing if I left my son in the house with my male lab and a female dog in heat.I wounder if my lab would kill my son.My .05
Pitt bulls are dog aggressive b/c they have been bred for fighting other dogs for generations. You can't take that out of them but they are NOT human aggressive.I don't know if these dogs you speak of had a substandard temperment and I would bet my life there were signs of this behavior all along.I can't believe your brother didn't know his dog was food aggressive. Sorry.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:11 PM
I can just imagine your eyes when you open the gate and became gator snack!! :2purples:
In this case, that would be a small price to pay.
Anyway, I love my gators. They wouldn't hurt a fly. :D

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:13 PM
Anyway, I love my gators. They wouldn't hurt a fly. :D
Unless they were in heat and the fly was pestering them. :D

syke-o
06-24-2005, 02:20 PM
Lets ask this question: If for some reason law enforcement needed to use force with you or a loved one that included a patrol dog - for whatever reason, would you want a trained German Shepherd or a trained Pit Bull that were raised the same?
I would want the Shepherd.
i would want the trained pit bull....

JennyG
06-24-2005, 02:20 PM
Yes dad we should all just get hyienas instead...lol. I bet with the right training their great pets...lol
I met a guy who breeds pit bulls..I almost got one from him last week because they were so well trained and sweet but I was scared I would come home some day and Holly would be eaten. Shes just too small. Holly loved the dog 2 it suprized me how good they got along. The guy swears if you take them to obeidience school and keep on them that they are great pets. He wont even give you a dog if you wont do the training school. He says you just have to let them know whos boss and socialize them early. I thought about it and talked it over with the guy we decided it wasnt right for me.Its true most the time I hear about a dog attacking some one its a pit. Deanna has one and says its a burden and I shouldnt get one. I just dont think a lot of people that own them are willing to put in to it what it takes to keep them under control. Plus you always hear storys about them snapping on their owners. I know when I see them Im a lil scared and I love dogs.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:21 PM
Unless they were in heat and the fly was pestering them. :D
Sure but I will watch for that behavior and put the gators down, should they come into heat during mosquito season.

C-2
06-24-2005, 02:22 PM
Damn, this late in the afternoon and I missed yet ANOTHER pitbull debate? :hammer2: :hammer2:
Family dogs, loving dogs, never did anything mean...until it killed a kid.
To me, it kinda sounds like you never know, until it happens. Who wants to take that chance?
Unless you know your dog's bloodline many generations back, you can't say how it was bred, period. Taking instinct out of an animal, even domesticated dogs, is not easy.
I currently have a cattle dog (heeler) and guess what it does - nips at heals and herds the cats. Go figure :hammer2: :hammer2:

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:23 PM
i would want the trained pit bull....
... and I would want you to get the pit bull.

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:23 PM
Sure but I will watch for that behavior and put the gators down, should they come into heat during mosquito season.
Or you could just lock them in RDs basement for everyones safety.

JB in so cal
06-24-2005, 02:23 PM
Hi Jen. Here's my answer to Pitt Bulls.
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shells7/nigerians1.jpg
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shells7/nigerians2.jpg
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shells7/nigerians3.jpg
holy mother effin son of a bitc* crap !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! shi*!!
What in the holy hell are those effin things??
where is that, the 909!!!???

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:24 PM
Damn, this late in the afternoon and I missed yet ANOTHER pitbull debate? :hammer2: :hammer2:
I had to start something, it was too quiet in here.....................

syke-o
06-24-2005, 02:25 PM
Im sorry but we have had three pit bull attacks in the bay area in the last three weeks and the owners always say that same shit "this dog has always been the best family dog ever" it has never been aggressive .PitBull's are aggressive period (born that way) isn't that why the geto superstars have them.My brother had a pit for 4 years he was a great family dog (really he was) untill my son walked into him,when he was eating, the dog went for his throat and just missed got him on the upper right shoulder ripped a 1'' by 2'' piece of flesh off my son.BTW this dog was so submissive every time I walked up too him he would roll over and piss all over him self.A good friend of mine also had a pit same story great family dog untill he atacked a kid riding a skateboard,ripped his pants off,12 stitches in his leg and ripped his hand open.Yes he is getting his ass handed to him in court.I have one more story about pits ,its the same shit as the other two.One more thing if I left my son in the house with my male lab and a female dog in heat.I wounder if my lab would kill my son.My .05
my .08.... your lab might just kill your son.. who the f*ck knows for sure...

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:25 PM
where is that, the 909!!!???
It kind of looks like the Rex Marine parking lot. :idea:

syke-o
06-24-2005, 02:26 PM
... and I would want you to get the pit bull.
thanks i already have the smaller english version :wink:

C-2
06-24-2005, 02:26 PM
where is that, the 909!!!???
hee hee :)

JB in so cal
06-24-2005, 02:26 PM
It kind of looks like the Rex Marine parking lot. :idea:
I can almost hear the dragsters!

topless
06-24-2005, 02:27 PM
Sure but I will watch for that behavior and put the gators down, should they come into heat during mosquito season.Why don't you just lput the fly in the basement and lock it with a shovel?

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:28 PM
my .08.... your lab might just kill your son.. who the f*ck knows for sure...
It might, but I can't recall any incidents of a lab mauling a child to death, have you?

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:28 PM
Why don't you just lput the fly in the basement and lock it with a shovel?
You can't beat the security of a good spade. :cool:

topless
06-24-2005, 02:29 PM
You can't beat the security of a good spade. :cool:
Why are you getting racial Tom? :rolleyes:

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:29 PM
You can't beat the security of a good spade. :cool:
LMAO.............. nothing like a good bran muffin to get you back in the saddle......

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:30 PM
Why are you getting racial Tom? :rolleyes:
:rollside: you are sooooooo brave...............and so bad.................... :)

topless
06-24-2005, 02:32 PM
:rollside: you are sooooooo brave...............and so bad.................... :)Thank you :D

H20Advantage
06-24-2005, 02:32 PM
It might, but I can't recall any incidents of a lab mauling a child to death, have you?
Actually there was one in the mid west fairly recently. Due to all of the inbreeding occurring with the labs some violent behaviors are now starting to be seen. Very important to track a dogs pedigree when getting a family dog.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:34 PM
Thank you :D
No... thank YOU. :D

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:34 PM
Actually there was one in the mid west fairly recently. Due to all of the inbreeding occurring with the labs some violent behaviors are now starting to be seen. Very important to track a dogs pedigree when getting a family dog.
THEY'RE PROBABLY BREEDING THEM WITH PITS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D
And Im sure Kalor meant pure bread breed labs.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:35 PM
lmao! :D

topless
06-24-2005, 02:38 PM
Actually there was one in the mid west fairly recently. Due to all of the inbreeding occurring with the labs some violent behaviors are now starting to be seen. Very important to track a dogs pedigree when getting a family dog.You have to make sure the dogs don't come from Arkansas. :2purples:

Indiansprings
06-24-2005, 02:38 PM
There is alot of ignorance comming out here. I know it is just a discussion, but, dont place blame on the breed. Most of you havent ever been around the breed, but seem very opinionated. That woman knew she had problem dogs. My heart goes out to the kid.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:42 PM
There is alot of ignorance comming out here.
We are in our element. :cool:
Most of you havent ever been around the breed, but seem very opinionated.
How do you know what breeds most of us have been around? Do you even know most of us?
Welcome to our element. :cool:

topless
06-24-2005, 02:43 PM
There is alot of ignorance comming out here. I know it is just a discussion, but, dont place blame on the breed. Most of you havent ever been around the breed, but seem very opinionated. That woman knew she had problem dogs. My heart goes out to the kid.
We are NOT placing blame on the breed. We are placing blame on..........YOU. Shame on you for saying most of us have never been around the breed unless you know us personally. :rolleyes:

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:43 PM
There is alot of ignorance comming out here.
I'm going to utilize my "3 day" policy before I respond to this.................... :D

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:43 PM
Shame on you for saying most of us have never been around the breed unless you know us personally. :rolleyes:
You're beautiful. :)

C-2
06-24-2005, 02:43 PM
There is alot of ignorance comming out here. I know it is just a discussion, but, dont place blame on the breed. Most of you havent ever been around the breed, but seem very opinionated. That woman knew she had problem dogs. My heart goes out to the kid.
I've been around dogs my entire life and have owned everything from Cockapoo's to Mastiff's, including Pits.
The only TWO dogs I ever had to put down for no other reason except they wanted to kill everything in sight......surprise surprise, the two Pits.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:44 PM
I'm going to utilize my "3 day" policy before I respond to this.................... :D
I recommend you take a mulligan. :D

topless
06-24-2005, 02:46 PM
I'm going to utilize my "3 day" policy before I respond to this.................... :D
He must be a newbie. Go easy on him T. :wink:

Indiansprings
06-24-2005, 02:46 PM
Sorry If I offended anyone with my comment. Just my opinion. :rolleyes:

topless
06-24-2005, 02:47 PM
Sorry If I offended anyone with my comment. Just my opinion. :rolleyes:
You know what they say about opinions don't you? :o

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:48 PM
I'm going to utilize my "3 day" policy before I respond to this.................... :D
No Im not, I changed my mind. Ignorance because we are stating opinions regarding a very controversial subject? Simple fact, the deaths being referenced are from Pit Bulls. The deaths resulted from the dog, A PIT, MAULING a person to death, and the owner in this case stating she even feared the dog.
No blame on the breed, even tho I am scared of them I think Im a pretty logical, fair person and you have not a ****ing clue as to what I have been around or what I have not. I still say its the OWNERS responsibility but the breed has HISTORY.
Ignorance is your making a blanket statement without apparently reading everything first.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:49 PM
Sorry If I offended anyone with my comment. Just my opinion. :rolleyes:
We're not offended. We're just admiring your headdress and war paint.

syke-o
06-24-2005, 02:50 PM
It might, but I can't recall any incidents of a lab mauling a child to death, have you?
yeah should i pull some up?? another htread just like this was up about a month ago and i found many on labs actually....

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:51 PM
One thing has been clearly decided in this discussion and that is that RiverDave has lost this argument.

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:52 PM
yeah should i pull some up?? another htread just like this was up about a month ago and i found many on labs actually....
Feel free, my original question was what should happen to the dog and/or owners in this situation, that includes Labs, Pits, Shepherds, Chiwawawas's whatever those yappy dogs are...........

syke-o
06-24-2005, 02:53 PM
Feel free, my original question was what should happen to the dog and/or owners in this situation, that includes Labs, Pits, Shepherds, Chiwawawas's whatever those yappy dogs are...........
the owners procescuted, and the dogs put down.. end of story.....

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:53 PM
One thing has been clearly decided in this discussion and that is that RiverDave has lost this argument.
He's probably out cruising the river drinking a few Beers (but not to exceed the legal limit and render him incapable on the river) pondering the subject.

topless
06-24-2005, 02:53 PM
No Im not, I changed my mind. Ignorance because we are stating opinions regarding a very controversial subject? Simple fact, the deaths being referenced are from Pit Bulls. The deaths resulted from the dog, A PIT, MAULING a person to death, and the owner in this case stating she even feared the dog.
No blame on the breed, even tho I am scared of them I think Im a pretty logical, fair person and you have not a ****ing clue as to what I have been around or what I have not. I still say its the OWNERS responsibility but the breed has HISTORY.
Ignorance is your making a blanket statement without apparently reading everything first.Damn T, I would hate to see what you would have told him if you weren't being easy on him. He should be very afraid now. :eek:

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:53 PM
the owners procescuted, and the dogs put down.. end of story.....
So where's all the Labs then? I have time..................

Windy
06-24-2005, 02:55 PM
I was mauled by my aunts German Shepard when I was 8 or 9. Chewed my face, and as I was crawling to get away he got my hand to. My parents rushed me to the ER. The dog was put down..apparently I wasnt the first one it attacked.
I am a huge dog lover...but I think my aunt and uncle did the right thing by putting the dog down....just my .2 cents.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:55 PM
the owners procescuted, and the dogs put down.. end of story.....
You know someone has a weak ass argument when they throw "end of story" in with their post. :D

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:55 PM
Damn T, I would hate to see what you would have told him if you weren't being easy on him. He should be very afraid now. :eek:
He's ok as long as he keeps that garlic around his neck.

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:56 PM
You know someone has a weak ass argument when they throw "end of story" in with their post. :D
I dont want to play any more either, too many of you are disagreeing with me and its pissing me off.
In fact, Im quitting ***boat.
End of Story.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:56 PM
He's probably out cruising the river drinking a few Beers (but not to exceed the legal limit and render him incapable on the river) pondering the subject.
... all the while thinking, "That focking Brown :mad: "

syke-o
06-24-2005, 02:56 PM
So where's all the Labs then? I have time..................
i dont......................

Indiansprings
06-24-2005, 02:57 PM
Her454, You seem very aggressive. Just my opinion. :confused:

Her454
06-24-2005, 02:57 PM
I was mauled by my aunts German Shepard when I was 8 or 9. Chewed my face, and as I was crawling to get away he got my hand to. My parents rushed me to the ER. The dog was put down..apparently I wasnt the first one it attacked.
I am a huge dog lover...but I think my aunt and uncle did the right thing by putting the dog down....just my .2 cents.
That must have been pretty traumatic Wendy. It sounds like it should have been put down before it had a chance to get to you.............

topless
06-24-2005, 02:59 PM
Her454, You seem very aggressive. Just my opinion. :confused:Don't make her mad injun boy. She'll bite your head off.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 02:59 PM
I dont want to play any more either, too many of you are disagreeing with me and its pissing me off.
I find intellect a turn on and I just came in my sock.
In fact, Im quitting ***boat.
LMAO!
End of Story.
All of you are wrong and I am right. End of story. :mad:
You kill me, Traci. :D :D :D

Her454
06-24-2005, 03:00 PM
Her454, You seem very aggressive. Just my opinion. :confused:
LMAO, if you say so. Im making friends left and right today. :D Aggressive................ :squiggle: :D

SoCalHD
06-24-2005, 03:01 PM
I hate to answer your original question and head back to being on topic, but I definitely think that the owner is responsible. That is the problem-everyone wants to blame something or someone else for THEIR mistakes/lapses in judgement!!
p.s. did anyone else pick up on the kids age???? 12.... What does that say about her in general??? Her parenting skills are such that she can't even stand to take the 12yr old along for some errands??? Instead she locks him in a closet?? Holy Crap!! LOCK HER UP!!!!.......DO IT, DO IT NOW!!

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 03:01 PM
Don't make her mad injun boy. She'll bite your head off.
... also if you accidentally bump her while she's eating.
I love this Springy Two Feathers guy. :D

HCS
06-24-2005, 03:01 PM
I was climbing over the neighbors fence when I was a kid. Their damn poodle bit me on the (f)ucking ankle! I had these little pin pricks right to bone.
I could have kicked that little shit head to kingdom come. :mad:

chrissy
06-24-2005, 03:02 PM
yeah should i pull some up?? another htread just like this was up about a month ago and i found many on labs actually....
I seem to remember several years ago when the things being said about Pits were said about Dobermans. Ever noticed how few and far between the dogs are now? Where's your buddy ChrisRodJr been hiding lately??? He's such a focker LMAO :devil:

Indiansprings
06-24-2005, 03:03 PM
Its just the Anchor Steam talking, Tom. :D

Her454
06-24-2005, 03:06 PM
Ok I've made Tom blow his wad in his sock, Geronimo thinks Im aggressive and Syko thinks Im just a straight up bitch. :)
You all have a great weekend and be safe...................

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 03:06 PM
Its just the Anchor Steam talking, Tom. :D
:D
You know what's funny in an ironic sort of way.... when a thread gets like this and everyone is throwing down, it wouldn't matter who wandered in here... they would get their ass chewed off. It would be just like trying to take food away from a bunch of ferocious dogs. :D
It's all cool, Indiansprings. I hope you're enjoying this thread as much as I am. :cool:

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 03:07 PM
You all have a great weekend and be safe...................
... end of story.

C-2
06-24-2005, 03:08 PM
Its just the Anchor Steam talking, Tom. :D
That's what I'm waiting for...Friday night, we're all obviously caged up at home...BRING ON THE DRINKS!!! Nothing like a bunch of drunks arguing about dogs, oops, owner responsibility.

Indiansprings
06-24-2005, 03:08 PM
Good times!

Her454
06-24-2005, 03:09 PM
ROTFLMAO...................OK Tom stop, you know Im addicted and Im trying to get out of here..............

Norseman
06-24-2005, 03:09 PM
thanks i already have the smaller english version :wink:
You own a pit???? :D

Flyinbowtie
06-24-2005, 03:09 PM
In light of the latest Dog (Pit Bull) attack in San Francisco where the mother left the child with a dog that had bit the child previously that day......and then killed him later while left along with the dog...
What do you think should happen to people and or animals that attack and kill people? SF is now banning Pit Bulls from the city limits......Im not sure thats the right approach, but maybe a start?
I think that dogs should be put down, period. The owners should be prosecuted depending on the circumstance but most certainly prosecuted if the animal had a history of aggression and the owner with negligence. Unfortunatly this is most of time difficult to prove as it does not get documented until its too late.
Mom has made it easy for the D.A. in this case to step right to the Felony child endangerment charge, and to the 2nd degree murder charge. I think they would find it difficult to make 1st degree, but done right I believe they could. Negligence is there, along with knowledge of the nature of the dog, but making it stick at trial would require a prosecutor with some spine.
In my career, I have only seen one breed of dog attack people in in unprovoked scenario, and I have only seen one breed of dog that seem to really be unsuitable for life around kids.
That would be the Pit Bull.
I have probably served around 500 high-risk felony search warrants, and the vast majority of those folks I have visited under those circumstances who had dogs had Pit Bulls.
As a matter of fact, while making a forced entry on one of those capers about 15 years ago, if my partner had not seen the dog coming and killed it, a pit would have taken my right leg off at the calf. The dog was about 12 inches from my butt when he fired.
He was a K9 officer, and had his Rot in the unit. He knew what the dog was going to do, and saved my ass, in a very literal sense. He was sick about it.
Animals that attack people and injure them in an unprovoked scenario should be put down.
People that own animals that attack people in an unprovoked scenario should face felony assault charges. I generally disagree with pretty much everything any politician in the bay area has ever said or done, but in this case, I understand it. It sucks that once again politicians are getting into the law-writing mode to deal with something that used to just be common courtesy based upon common sense.
I know that there are people out there that love this breed, and they cannot imagine their animal going sideways like the one mentioned above when it's dinner was interrupted, but it happens. I have respect for any dog owner who properly cares for and controls their animals.
I think that the media would make an issue out of any case where a dog mauls a child, and I think you could find statistical proof that a condierable number of cases like this involve the Pit Bull. I do not think this is a case where the media has blown things out of proportion.
Lots of this, like many other issues we are facing today, comes down to people taking responsibilty for their personal stuff. That would include their animals. I am probably a little biased, but my experience with aggressive pit bulls has usallly been accompanied by dealing with their irresponsible and aggressive owners, who find it humorous to scare kids and adults with their dog.
I cannot tell you the number of times I have had professional contact with people who have these dogs, and I have had to tell them to restrain the animal or I will kill it. I have only been forced to do that once.
I know of no K9 units on the street today that are Pit Bulls.
I have worked with a number of K9 Officers handling German Shepards, Rotweillers, and Mastiffs.
They were all trainable, retained their training and were controllable. When the handler put the dog on bite, he bit. When the handler called the dog out, the dog came off the bite. The dogs were dependable, and were able to function around children, our guys even took them into classroom settings at the elementary level for show and tell with the kids. The dogs could be walked through a crowded fairgrounds, and not be aggressive at all.
I trusted them.
I don't think you would want to try that with a Pit.
I simply don't think the breed is a a stage where they can be trusted to behave, and that is the fault of people who have brought the breed to this stage, not the dog.
Just like that tiger that bit that guy in Vegas a couple of years ago, the dog is just reacting to instinct.
People should know better.

topless
06-24-2005, 03:10 PM
ROTFLMAO...................OK Tom stop, you know Im addicted and Im trying to get out of here..............Thanks T, I was tired of talking about swingers anyway. :D

chrissy
06-24-2005, 03:10 PM
Ok I've made Tom blow his wad in his sock, Geronimo thinks Im aggressive and Syko thinks Im just a straight up bitch. :)
You all have a great weekend and be safe...................
I personally like aggressive women.... ;) :hammer2:

topless
06-24-2005, 03:13 PM
Mom has made it easy for the D.A. in this case to step right to the Felony child endangerment charge, and to the 2nd degree murder charge. I think they would find it difficult to make 1st degree, but done right I believe they could. Negligence is there, along with knowledge of the nature of the dog, but making it stick at trial would require a prosecutor with some spine.
In my career, I have only seen one breed of dog attack people in in unprovoked scenario, and I have only seen one breed of dog that seem to really be unsuitable for life around kids.
That would be the Pit Bull.
I have probably served around 500 high-risk felony search warrants, and the vast majority of those folks I have visited under those circumstances who had dogs had Pit Bulls.
As a matter of fact, while making a forced entry on one of those capers about 15 years ago, if my partner had not seen the dog coming and killed it, a pit would have taken my right leg off at the calf. The dog was about 12 inches from my butt when he fired.
He was a K9 officer, and had his Rot in the unit. He knew what the dog was going to do, and saved my ass, in a very literal sense. He was sick about it.
Animals that attack people and injure them in an unprovoked scenario should be put down.
People that own animals that attack people in an unprovoked scenario should face felony assault charges. I generally disagree with pretty much everything any politician in the bay area has ever said or done, but in this case, I understand it. It sucks that once again politicians are getting into the law-writing mode to deal with something that used to just be common courtesy based upon common sense.
I know that there are people out there that love this breed, and they cannot imagine their animal going sideways like the one mentioned above when it's dinner was interrupted, but it happens. I have respect for any dog owner who properly cares for and controls their animals.
I think that the media would make an issue out of any case where a dog mauls a child, and I think you could find statistical proof that a condierable number of cases like this involve the Pit Bull. I do not think this is a case where the media has blown things out of proportion.
Lots of this, like many other issues we are facing today, comes down to people taking responsibilty for their personal stuff. That would include their animals. I am probably a little biased, but my experience with aggressive pit bulls has usallly been accompanied by dealing with their irresponsible and aggressive owners, who find it humorous to scare kids and adults with their dog.
I cannot tell you the number of times I have had professional contact with people who have these dogs, and I have had to tell them to restrain the animal or I will kill it. I have only been forced to do that once.
I know of no K9 units on the street today that are Pit Bulls.
I have worked with a number of K9 Officers handling German Shepards, Rotweillers, and Mastiffs.
They were all trainable, retained their training and were controllable. When the handler put the dog on bite, he bit. When the handler called the dog out, the dog came off the bite. The dogs were dependable, and were able to function around children, our guys even took them into classroom settings at the elementary level for show and tell with the kids. The dogs could be walked through a crowded fairgrounds, and not be aggressive at all.
I trusted them.
I don't think you would want to try that with a Pit.
I simply don't think the breed is a a stage where they can be trusted to behave, and that is the fault of people who have brought the breed to this stage, not the dog.
Just like that tiger that bit that guy in Vegas a couple of years ago, the dog is just reacting to instinct.
People should know better.DELETE THIS BEFORE THE INJUN BOY READS IT. He'll throw his opinion around again. Then no telling what Her454 will do.

Tom Brown
06-24-2005, 03:13 PM
Mom has made it easy for the D.A. in this case to step right to the Felony child endangerment charge, and to the 2nd degree murder charge. I think they would find it difficult to make 1st degree, but done right I believe they could. Negligence is there, along with knowledge of the nature of the dog, but making it stick at trial would require a prosecutor with some spine.
In my career, I have only seen one breed of dog attack people in in unprovoked scenario, and I have only seen one breed of dog that seem to really be unsuitable for life around kids.
That would be the Pit Bull.
I have probably served around 500 high-risk felony search warrants, and the vast majority of those folks I have visited under those circumstances who had dogs had Pit Bulls.
As a matter of fact, while making a forced entry on one of those capers about 15 years ago, if my partner had not seen the dog coming and killed it, a pit would have taken my right leg off at the calf. The dog was about 12 inches from my butt when he fired.
He was a K9 officer, and had his Rot in the unit. He knew what the dog was going to do, and saved my ass, in a very literal sense. He was sick about it.
Animals that attack people and injure them in an unprovoked scenario should be put down.
People that own animals that attack people in an unprovoked scenario should face felony assault charges. I generally disagree with pretty much everything any politician in the bay area has ever said or done, but in this case, I understand it. It sucks that once again politicians are getting into the law-writing mode to deal with something that used to just be common courtesy based upon common sense.
I know that there are people out there that love this breed, and they cannot imagine their animal going sideways like the one mentioned above when it's dinner was interrupted, but it happens. I have respect for any dog owner who properly cares for and controls their animals.
I think that the media would make an issue out of any case where a dog mauls a child, and I think you could find statistical proof that a condierable number of cases like this involve the Pit Bull. I do not think this is a case where the media has blown things out of proportion.
Lots of this, like many other issues we are facing today, comes down to people taking responsibilty for their personal stuff. That would include their animals. I am probably a little biased, but my experience with aggressive pit bulls has usallly been accompanied by dealing with their irresponsible and aggressive owners, who find it humorous to scare kids and adults with their dog.
I cannot tell you the number of times I have had professional contact with people who have these dogs, and I have had to tell them to restrain the animal or I will kill it. I have only been forced to do that once.
I know of no K9 units on the street today that are Pit Bulls.
I have worked with a number of K9 Officers handling German Shepards, Rotweillers, and Mastiffs.
They were all trainable, retained their training and were controllable. When the handler put the dog on bite, he bit. When the handler called the dog out, the dog came off the bite. The dogs were dependable, and were able to function around children, our guys even took them into classroom settings at the elementary level for show and tell with the kids. The dogs could be walked through a crowded fairgrounds, and not be aggressive at all.
I trusted them.
I don't think you would want to try that with a Pit.
I simply don't think the breed is a a stage where they can be trusted to behave, and that is the fault of people who have brought the breed to this stage, not the dog.
Just like that tiger that bit that guy in Vegas a couple of years ago, the dog is just reacting to instinct.
People should know better.
You're in the right line of work. It's clear you love paper work. :D
Great post, FBT. :cool:

Flyinbowtie
06-24-2005, 03:18 PM
Actually, Tom, I dictate all my reports, which means smoebody else gets stuck with my ramblin'
Only when I have to high-speed hunt and peck it myself do I realize what a long-winded SOB I can be at times... :D

HM
06-24-2005, 03:22 PM
I am thinking this will all go away when Frenchie expands his Dog Servicing to the Bay Area. :idea:

Flyinbowtie
06-24-2005, 03:24 PM
HM, we are talking about San Francisco, you can probably already find the service available in the Tenderloin. :D

syke-o
06-24-2005, 07:13 PM
is this the end???

Rexone
06-24-2005, 09:03 PM
:D
You know what's funny in an ironic sort of way....
I hope holymoly doesn't see this.... end of story :smile:

HM
06-24-2005, 10:16 PM
I hope holymoly doesn't see this.... end of story :smile:
http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/290yahooflip2.gif http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/290yahooflip2.gif http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/290yahooflip2.gif http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/290yahooflip2.gif
:D :rollside: :D

wiskvp
06-25-2005, 08:39 AM
Her454, You seem very aggressive. :confused:
Maybe She needs to be put down
:2purples: :2purples: :2purples: :2purples:
Maybe I'll have to do it when I see Her454 in Aug.

Her454
06-27-2005, 07:38 AM
Maybe She needs to be put down
:2purples: :2purples: :2purples: :2purples:
Maybe I'll have to do it when I see Her454 in Aug.
Bring it baby. :)
FBT - EXCELLENT POST, Thanks for taking the time to respond......

wiskvp
06-27-2005, 08:23 AM
Bring it baby. :)
Oh don't worry I will
I'll only need 1 SILVER BULLET
;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)