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Big Warlock
07-30-2005, 09:28 AM
OK, is it just me?
Facts:
Our girl, 18, is down on a high school senior trip with chaperons.
Her parents say "yes, she was out drinking, but it's legal there and that's why they went there (Aruba) was to party!" (Quote on CNN 2 days ago.) The "missing" poster lists her departure from the bar at 01:30am.
Testimony of those in the bar is that she was pounding down Bacardi 151! She was plastered when she left the bar with three local men. But please, please remember that her parents insist that she is just a perfect angel. Never do anything wrong, ever, never! (Are they stupid or what???) Your 18 year old daughter is in a foreign country, in a bar, pounding 151s and then leaves with 3 local men to do what???? Hello? :(
So where were the chaperons? What about the other gilrs in the bar? Standing by their friends? :frown: Won't we think about holding them accountable? Or better the Aruban government? :sqeyes:
My opinion is her parents were the biggest problem in her life. Sorry to say but they are psychotic and she is definitely in a better place without them. They need to go look in a mirror and take their part of the blame on this. They absolutely do not understand the legal system in or out of our country. Those boys would have been freed long ago if they had been in the USA. Probably brought in for questioning and released!
I hope they solve the mystery. I hope they prosecute those involved, if there was someone involved. The possibilty that she fended off the boys and went for a swim while drunk off her a$$ is there. And the tide and current could have her anyplace. Hell, she might show up on a beach in a distant land. Her parents would want to sue that country as well. I only wish I was an attorney or detective on their vast payroll from contributions of other Americans. And what kind of jobs do they have to take off 60 days? Damn, that is pretty cool too.
And FOX news is losing credibility by having Gretta Van Duba$$ every night discussing a nothing story from a one sided view. I thought was only done by CNN and that other DumbA$$ Nancy Grace? (If there was any grace, God would remove her from the airwaves!)
Well I feel better now! Maybe back to work and make some calls. Who knows what I promised at Hooters last night. I am sure I am the proud owner of something.......... :mix:
Natalee, Godspeed!!!!!!

BowTie Rick
07-30-2005, 12:01 PM
Its not just you, I agree 100%. I personally think she did a number like in the first Jaws. Drunk, swim, drown, shark food. That is why there is no body and no one can definately point a finger at the boys she was with. Makes sense to me.

beer hunter
07-30-2005, 12:54 PM
This "little angle" had a 4.2 GPA and was a great kid by any measure. The fact that she was partying in Aruba and getting drunk doesn't mean she deserved to die (presumably). The parents are only trying to keep the spotlight on her case so they have a better chance of finding out what happened to their daughter. Hopefully they will and the perps will be brought to justice.
I'd be doing the same thing they are given the time and resources and I'm sure you would do the same for your child.

UltraStealth
07-30-2005, 01:59 PM
This "little angle" had a 4.2 GPA and was a great kid by any measure. The fact that she was partying in Aruba and getting drunk doesn't mean she deserved to die (presumably). The parents are only trying to keep the spotlight on her case so they have a better chance of finding out what happened to their daughter. Hopefully they will and the perps will be brought to justice.
I'd be doing the same thing they are given the time and resources and I'm sure you would do the same for your child.
I completely agree with this statement.

beer hunter
07-30-2005, 04:38 PM
I completely agree with this statement.
Thanks! :cool:

SUI-CY-COLE DIMARCO
07-30-2005, 04:44 PM
i agree also...

ratso
07-30-2005, 04:49 PM
Too much drinking can put even someone with a 4.2 GPA into a bad situation...

DansBlown73Nordic
07-31-2005, 04:03 AM
I saw the other night where they found Male DNA on her tooth brush....... :2purples:
Mom and Dad must realize she was doing more than just drinking.. :hammerhea

FHI-prez
07-31-2005, 04:55 AM
I think it's sad that people are still talking about it. If this was some trailer trash girl missing from the trailer park, would we have ever heard about it? Hell no. But since it's some attractive little rich girl vacationing in Aruba, a multi-national search ensues, including thousands of people and dollars. What a bunch of bullshit. I could understand why it would be big news on the island, but honestly little girls go missing every day in this country, this one getting so much GD attention is a slap in the face to the mothers and fathers of the other missing children that we never hear about. Frankly since apparently we can sue anyone, anytime in our retarded legal system, I think that the parents of a missing child since the little rich girl went missing, should sue CNN, MSNBC, the Holloways, etc for using too much airtime on the little Ho. Umm the girls dead, move on. I don't think she's playing hide and seek on the island.
Nick

bilgewiper
07-31-2005, 05:53 AM
4.2 GPA? I graduated 28 years ago and 4.0 was straight A's back then or so I thought.

havasu5150
07-31-2005, 05:59 AM
It can happen anywhere. I heard about an incident from some folks I camp with at Havasu. A group of freinds was partying at the Sandbar, one of the girls jumped on the back of some guys waverunner for a ride.....several hours later, the group is back at camp, they get a phone call from the girl.....dropped off at the marina.....in Needles, wearing nothing but a thong and pasties.....Yep that was safe.

HighRoller
07-31-2005, 06:26 AM
I think the real criminals here are the parents and the chaperones. Criminal negligence, that is. Just because your kid is 18 and "legally" an adult doesn't mean you stop protecting them. Yes, she could have gone anyways if they said no, but I do believe she was living at home and they paid for the trip so she wouldn't have gotten far in her defiance. Another classic case of parents trying to be a friend instead of a parent. My Dad got it right when he said that not protecting your children is the ultimate form of child abuse.
The chances are 50% that she's dead and 50% that she's been abducted and sold into prostitution in a foreign country. American boys and girls are in very high demand by the international sex traders. A little known fact is that 10% of all abductions here in the US are due to this. Sad. And careless parents make it easier for these predatory scumbags to stay in business every day.

Just Tool'n
07-31-2005, 07:30 AM
I was in Aruba in Apr, got there on a tuesday morning , departed from the Cruise ship mid morning.
Went into town, what a real dump. The best place I found was a little sidewalk bar. Sat there for a hour, drank 2 beers, talked to the bartender, she was dutch, said she came to Aruba 12 years earlier, she was on vacation, she said after one hour of vacation she deceided she was moving there. Guess it must have been better than Holland.
About 9:30pm went to Carlos & Charlie's, what a wild place, my type of place, what did not sit well with me was all of the teenagers up on the bar dancing on the bar getting shit faced. I thought about
" Where the hell are there parents"
Now I use to drink a little when I was a teenager, but nothing ever like this.
I think this is all part of the "Extreme" life style that the genoration "Y" 's have today, Tatoo's, they need the biggest & best of everything at 16 -21 years of age. IMHO
I feel sorry for her parents, she certainly did not deserve this type of ending.
Shame on her friends & the Chaporones. I hope they carry the greif of this for a long time, True friends would not of let this happen to her.
My God Rest Her Soul!

wsuwrhr
07-31-2005, 07:48 AM
Regardless of what she did, I think it is tragic that anyone loses their life at that age, on vacation, in a foreign country.
Her parents can't even put her to rest. They aren't even sure if she is alive.
Imagine waht she is thinking if she is alive and being held somewhere.
Brian

Big Warlock
07-31-2005, 08:16 AM
Horrible tragedy. Don't misread the thread! I also agree she is dead, shark food or slave trade. I believe in those theories.
I have to say I am bothered by you that say "4.2"??????? What school did you go to??? What is wrong with that number???? Hello? 4.0 is it kids! If your going to a school where they lower the standard for some and allow others to somehow "exceed" the numerical improbability, your part of the problem!!! Jeeeeeeesh........
And your right! If this was a girl out of the trailer park, this wouldn't be an issue. But we are going to send the FBI, on mine and yours dollar, and create an international icident because of a couple of moronic parents!! They are the ones who are in a foreign country and can't understand how they have their own laws and how being a US citizen doesn't matter much.
THIS IS THE PERFECT CASE OF THE UGLY AMERICAN!!!!! I see it all the time in Mexico. Throw their a$$es in jail for being too stupid! The situation they are in is one of their own doing. And blaming the Aruban government is just plain stupid!!
GodSpeed to Natalie. :cry:

locogringo
07-31-2005, 08:46 AM
Horrible tragedy. Don't misread the thread! I also agree she is dead, shark food or slave trade. I believe in those theories.
I have to say I am bothered by you that say "4.2"??????? What school did you go to??? What is wrong with that number???? Hello? 4.0 is it kids! If your going to a school where they lower the standard for some and allow others to somehow "exceed" the numerical improbability, your part of the problem!!! Jeeeeeeesh........
And your right! If this was a girl out of the trailer park, this wouldn't be an issue. But we are going to send the FBI, on mine and yours dollar, and create an international icident because of a couple of moronic parents!! They are the ones who are in a foreign country and can't understand how they have their own laws and how being a US citizen doesn't matter much.
THIS IS THE PERFECT CASE OF THE UGLY AMERICAN!!!!! I see it all the time in Mexico. Throw their a$$es in jail for being too stupid! The situation they are in is one of their own doing. And blaming the Aruban government is just plain stupid!!
GodSpeed to Natalie. :cry:
Uhmm, 4.0 is not it. You can achieve a higher numerical GPA if you do additional accelerated classes or other prerequisites which will boost your score higher. I know this for a fact because of when I was in school.
So, what you are saying here is that if I was a girl (sometimes I wish I was so I could play with my boobies all day) and was for the most part exemplary, decided to party for having graduated from the biggest accomplishment in my life as of yet, and drank to the point where my judgmnets were not the best that this is my own doing and since it is my own doing, whatever happens to me is forgivable by those acting upon me?
Stupid logic in my book. Imagine this is your daughter.

HighRoller
07-31-2005, 09:03 AM
I'm not blaming her for doing what she did. I really don't care what lazy parents let their kids do unless it affects me. I don't give a shyt if a supposedly responsible girl wants to do shots in a foreign bar and get drunk to the point of not knowing her name. That obviously is her right according to everyone. But along with that right comes the responsibility and a set of consequences. She paid the consequences for her actions and now her parents are painting her like the total victim because she was a stellar child. Well, stellar children with excellent parents don't end up in these messes. I feel bad for any parent who loses a child, but let's get a grip here. It wasn't like she was snatched off the street in her own neighborhood while innocently walking down the street. She and her parents made the bed and now they're sleeping in it.

goneboatin
07-31-2005, 09:03 AM
4.2 GPA? I graduated 28 years ago and 4.0 was straight A's back then or so I thought.
It pays to do extra credit!

Big Warlock
07-31-2005, 09:03 AM
As an engineer...it pains me to see this.
4.0 is awarded for all "A". Right? The cummulative total of all your grades, under the award numbers for grades can never exceed 4.0. Much like you can never get beyond 100% of the glass being full. Or you can't get more than 100 points on a 100 point test.
Yes, I am aware that they do give points for lots of other, positive work that kids do. However, in a grading system, it is impossible. I believe it is a liberal way of attempting to "even" the playing field. And yes, you don't have to tell me. I know they do it. I am saying it is wrong.
If it was my daughter, she wouldn't be in Aruba on a drinking and partying mission! Their addmission on national TV. I hate to think of anything bad happening to anyone. You miss the point my friend. Some of us are saying that the point is the parents, friends and chaperons. Whatever happened is horrible. How to prevent it? Hmmmmmmm, that part is easy.
Are you ok with your daughter going to Aruba or maybe the Mexican border to party and such because they tolerate or have no laws against it? And if your not ok with it, tell me why! Then re read your thoughts and you will be on track with some of us here.
Thanks!!

Jordy
07-31-2005, 09:28 AM
As an engineer...it pains me to see this.
4.0 is awarded for all "A". Right? The cummulative total of all your grades, under the award numbers for grades can never exceed 4.0. Much like you can never get beyond 100% of the glass being full. Or you can't get more than 100 points on a 100 point test.
Some accelerated classes, at least at the high school I went to were weighted. That is, an A in the class was 5.0 and a B was a 4.0 (like an A in a regular class). Some of the little brains in school would take a couple of weighted classes a semester and would end up with a 4.3 GPA or better. ;)

HCS
07-31-2005, 09:39 AM
Ahhhhh......she probably tapped into the computer and changed her grades.
Or maybe she gave the principle a blow job.
How's that. :D
In all reality though. My daughter moved away from home 2 years ago.
I worry about her all the time when I hear that kind of stuff.
I totally agree with the chaperon issue. She's too young to be out pounding down booze. Where were they?

goneboatin
07-31-2005, 09:46 AM
If it was my daughter, she wouldn't be in Aruba on a drinking and partying mission! Their addmission on national TV. I hate to think of anything bad happening to anyone. You miss the point my friend. Some of us are saying that the point is the parents, friends and chaperons. Whatever happened is horrible. How to prevent it? Hmmmmmmm, that part is easy.
Are you ok with your daughter going to Aruba or maybe the Mexican border to party and such because they tolerate or have no laws against it? And if your not ok with it, tell me why! Then re read your thoughts and you will be on track with some of us here.
Thanks!!
BW I agree with you completely.
I don't have daughters, only sons, but they won't be going to a foreign country to drink because it's legal there. I as a parent have the responsibility to do my best to protect my children, and allow them to grow and mature. But alot comes with experience....experience in this country.
Everybody remembers the first time they drank so much they got sick and couldn't remember the remainder of that evening. Well, you learned that you shouldn't drink so much - at least most of us did. Theres some people that never learned to drink without getting shit-faced. But this learning process should be done in the confines of your native country, with friends, in a familiar setting, in case things go bad. (By no means am I condoning having your kids drinking till they get sick as a learning process, it's only an example).
A small country needs all the incentives it can to bring in tourist dollars. But with those perks come caveats (sp) like lack of police protection, lack of non-corrup law enforcement officers (that don't give a shit that you are an American, and if you do tell them that, it usually means that they'll beat the shit out of you and take your money), laws here won't do anything for you over there. You need to remain in control. An 18 year old girl it seems only had one thing on her mind...to get f'd up.
It's a tragedy that this has happend, but as it has been said before in this thread, you must be a parent to you child first, their friend second. Why aren't the parents being charged for child endangerment? Because she's 18 and an "adult"? Well, it seems that she was still a dependent, that means the parents look out for her well-being. Hmmmm, what happened here?
I am done rambling-
:messedup:

RP1
07-31-2005, 10:00 AM
Uhmm, 4.0 is not it. You can achieve a higher numerical GPA if you do additional accelerated classes or other prerequisites which will boost your score higher. I know this for a fact because of when I was in school.
So, what you are saying here is that if I was a girl (sometimes I wish I was so I could play with my boobies all day) and was for the most part exemplary, decided to party for having graduated from the biggest accomplishment in my life as of yet, and drank to the point where my judgmnets were not the best that this is my own doing and since it is my own doing, whatever happens to me is forgivable by those acting upon me?
Stupid logic in my book. Imagine this is your daughter.
Well put Loco. The content of the original post is one of the most ignorant I have read in awhile...IMO.

Big Warlock
07-31-2005, 10:35 AM
And there lies the difference between us. I don't think this kid was an example to hold out to others. You guys keep talking about her grades and what an upstanding example she was. Huh? Can we reveiw the tape? The only place where her parents and I agree is the purpose of the trip and what happened prior to her dissappearance. And I agree something bad happened. But wait a minute, this could have been prevented. At her church, were they going to show videos of her trip to Aruba? Maybe her time at the bar? Or drunk and mackin out with the locals? (All that happened, by the parents information.) Or shall we put the parents up and re watch them saying that they understood the trip to be a party trip to Aruba because those poor kids were not allowed to act that way in the US.
You guys that claim to let your kids do this crap are the problem. And I see "your" kids all the time in Mexico. In a bar or a part of twon they have no idea how much trouble they are about to get into. Where I hang, I know the people, hang with the locals that call the shots. I am often embarassed to watch Amercian kids acting like they are rich and famous and can Sh*t all over people. But, while I sip my beer, I also watch them get hauled to jail, screaming about their rights and all. Really is worth the price of admission.
I once saw a guy screaming at an officer at the airport. I also waslistening to the radio traffic on his radio. Spanish being my first language, I informed he and his wife to move through NOW. H erefused to listen, told me to shut the f*ck up. Within two minutes he was hauled off by the federal police in Mexico. What can you do??? You try to help, but people are too stupid.
Again, just tell me this. Would you allow your boy or girl to go to Aruba, Jamaica, Mexico, etc. etc. to drink and party and act a fool? I am really curious to know that. Yea, you might have done it. Hell, we all have at some point. Doesn't mean your going to let your kid do it with your knowledge. Times have changed. Things happen.
Still crazy? Still the dunbest post you have read? :hammer2:

Big Warlock
07-31-2005, 10:36 AM
Go to the lake!!!! You'll need the time to get hooked up with us tomorrow. Stop helping me you f*cking nut!!!
I am on my way right now. Be in Hum Bug in about 2 hours. :argue:

wsuwrhr
07-31-2005, 07:32 PM
Well, stellar children with excellent parents don't end up in these messes. I feel bad for any parent who loses a child, but let's get a grip here. It wasn't like she was snatched off the street in her own neighborhood while innocently walking down the street. She and her parents made the bed and now they're sleeping in it.
High roller, buddy,
What difference does it make if she was on her street or any other, crimes are crimes, wherever they are perpertrated, unless of course she drowned on her own.
I have done plenty of stupid things, thank god at least three of them didn't kill me.
The point is she is(was) young and dumb, like ALL 18 year olds, maybe a little sheltered for her age, but nevertheless, not very streetsmart.
I think back to when I was 18, I thought I knew everything. The older I get, I realize that I didn't know SHIT back then.
Doesn't mean she should have paid for it with her life, especially if it was in the hands of someone else.
Brian

wsuwrhr
07-31-2005, 07:48 PM
But alot comes with experience....experience in this country.
Everybody remembers the first time they drank so much they got sick and couldn't remember the remainder of that evening. Well, you learned that you shouldn't drink so much - at least most of us did. Theres some people that never learned to drink without getting shit-faced. But this learning process should be done in the confines of your native country, with friends, in a familiar setting, in case things go bad.
Also brings up the point of where were her friends, or were they really her friends?
I have friends I have known since highschool, and others since, and it has been awhile for me, but I can't remember partying a single time that there wasn't a buddy around to watch your back.
So where we her buddies?
Whether she was rich, pretty, fat, or ugly doesn't matter to me, she was a woman, and she wasn't really old enough to know better.
The whole thing is tragic to me.
Brian

Boozer
07-31-2005, 07:53 PM
If anybody iso blame for this tragedy it is her friends!
I go down to Rosarito with some female friends from time to time and we party down. The agreement we have is if they ever want me to come back to a club with them then they don't leave my site unless it is to go to the restroom and most of all they do NOT ever under any circumstance leave with any guys other then the guys they came with.
This system works well. Everytime we have gone to Rosarito we always come back with every person we left with. The way these girls drink and party, if it were not for the system we have, would quite possibly end up the same way as this Hollaway girl.
No matter how drunk you get you need to have some sort of plan to make sure these things dont happen. Most importantly you need to have good friends watching out for you ESPECIALLY in a foreign country.

beer hunter
07-31-2005, 08:21 PM
I don't really have a problem with the administration of 'truth serum' in cases like this- do you?
Rio
Well, since it's Aruba...No :D

77charger
07-31-2005, 08:27 PM
lot of reading here but truth is parents dont know their children when they get away to party.Some kids will tell the truth others will not and parents find out unfortunitlely in a case like this.
Now i know why as long as i lived at home i had a curfew even if i was 20 years old.Now older myself i know the reasons for this.Kids in a foreign country IMO = bad news they dont understand the laws of other countries or the consequinces(sp) of the wrong doings.IT AINT A WRIST SLAP AND IT AINT THE USA.

SB
08-01-2005, 07:27 PM
This is tragic. Aside from assigning blame I have a comment: Why do we send kids to another country to party? Why don't we have a safe(r) place for them here? I would not send my 18 yr. old son or daughter away to college with a complete absence of knowledge about the effects of alchohol. The brain-dead response I get is:"oh, you condone underage drinking." Not really I just deal in reality.