Any Pilots in the house?

[jackpunx]

Do you still fly?
do you own a plane?
is it worth renting?
what do you do when you go?
are the costs the same as boating?

[Just Electric]

uh oh whats mark thinking of now

[jackpunx]

uh oh whats mark thinking of now
So! :D

[AzLakeLizard]

Do you still fly?
do you own a plane?
is it worth renting?
what do you do when you go?
are the costs the same as boating?
Send Mardonzi a PM or an Email, He is a pilot and we do rent planes to head do Phoenix or SLC or Havasu.. he posted some pics of when we flew down there last time.

[riverbound]

Do you still fly?
do you own a plane?
is it worth renting?
what do you do when you go?
are the costs the same as boating?
Hmmmmm.....I was thinking about pursuing the same thing. But I dont plan on jumping out of it though.

[Kachina26]

I am learning right now, I just did my first cross country solo to Havi. It was a blast! Just like boating, it can cost as much as you are willing to spend. As far as a plane, they seem to be more reasonable to purchase than a boat. I will most likely rent for awhile. A round trip to Havi from Apple Valley ran me $350 bucks, so it may be faster, but it definately ain't cheaper :D I may eventually buy a plane, but we'll have to see how the wife likes it first. I may be a permanent renter :(

[jackpunx]

I am learning right now, I just did my first cross country solo to Havi. It was a blast! Just like boating, it can cost as much as you are willing to spend. As far as a plane, they seem to be more reasonable to purchase than a boat. I will most likely rent for awhile. A round trip to Havi from Apple Valley ran me $350 bucks, so it may be faster, but it definately ain't cheaper :D I may eventually buy a plane, but we'll have to see how the wife likes it first. I may be a permanent renter :(
when they rent you a plane Wet.. say.. you rent if for a day.. and you fly say to.. another airport or something.. Hang out for the day and come back..
the flight time combined was only 2hrs.. but you have the plane all day..
how do they charge you for that?
PS.. congrats on the solo flight!

[Mardonzi]

There are pros and cons to renting as opposed to purchasing. The nice thing about owning a plane, is that it is one of the few toys that actually appreciates in value as well as always having it availible. The downside is when something goes wrong,, it is way expensive as well as the maintainence, hanger fees, and insurance.
I rent, and fly an average of 6 hours a month. This 6 hours saves me about 15 hours a month on the highway. That in itself is a plus.
The rental cost for the airplane I fly is 120.00 an hour/wet. When we actually go someplace fun instead of commuting, with 4-5 people, the costs are pretty cheap.
Living in the middle of everywhere like we do, flying opens up so many more options for travel and recreation that we would have if we drove. It takes me 5 hours to drive to Havasu and 1.5 hours to fly there. This has made it so we could run down on Saturday morning for a quick trip up the river, BBQ that night, then still be back home before noon on Sunday.
All in all, the only way that I could see to make it more enjoyable would be to get a float plane and both fly and boat at the same time...

[Mardonzi]

when they rent you a plane Wet.. say.. you rent if for a day.. and you fly say to.. another airport or something.. Hang out for the day and come back..
the flight time combined was only 2hrs.. but you have the plane all day..
how do they charge you for that?
PS.. congrats on the solo flight!
You only pay for the time on the Tach or the Hobbs meter unless the rental agency has an away from home minimum.

[SummitKarl]

far cheaper to rent than to own..
when I was doing it (flying from Carlsbad/Oceanside to Havasu) it cost around $200 to rent a 170 for the weekend
$3 to park at Havasu Airport + AvGas, hand back the keys and your done
decent used 170 is $70k or better + Hanger($1k a month min) + AvGas and the big kicker $7k-$15k overhauls every 1500-2000 hrs, not to mention planes simply nickel and dime you to death, they allways need something.
RENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Scotty]

when they rent you a plane Wet.. say.. you rent if for a day.. and you fly say to.. another airport or something.. Hang out for the day and come back..
the flight time combined was only 2hrs.. but you have the plane all day..
how do they charge you for that?
PS.. congrats on the solo flight!
Charge by the engine or engines hours... Not total time out.. Just when the prop is spinning...
We have a 210 Cessna that we fly from Corona airport to Parker in one hour unless we have a bad head wind... Lots of fun and so many places to go..

[Mardonzi]

How does that saying go.... If it Flys, Floats, or F*cks,,,, Rent it

[KLEPTOW]

I'm just getting started Ground school on DVD. I have 2 CFI's in the family that are pissed at me for waiting so long.
I’m looking to build my own and turn around and sell it after I have had the pleasure of flying it for a while. http://www.velocityaircraft.com/

[jackpunx]

Great info here..
I see its a little more to rent or learn on a larger plane...
would you learn on a smaller C and then get endorsed for a larger one later?
or just learn on the larger more expensive plane right away..
Actually I dont know if the more expensive plane is larger or just nicer and faster..
I got bit last week..
I skydive..My buddy who teaches at the DZ has a plane.. so I flew down with him from Whiteman to Perris, jumped all day and flew back.. se stopped in corona for fuel (cheeper) and flew home..
it was awesome!.. I want to do it.. I gave him $40 for gas.. and now Im kinda strung out..
I almost have my skydiving license.. (6more jumps).. but the whole flying thing has me by the nuts right now..
I could see my boats collecting lots of dust as a result of this.
If anyone here that flys wants to put some hrs on the books.. I got a couple of buddies and myself that will help you our with $$$ for rides to the DZ..
thanks
Mark
PS..
what is the average cost to obtain a license and are you guys instrument rated? (sp?)

[Kachina26]

My boat didn't get much use this year, I attribute part of that to the flying bug. I learned in a cessna 172 and don't think I would want to go in anything smaller.
The only IFR flying I'm gonna do for awhile is "I follow roads" :D just kidding. I don't plan to get instrument rated just yet. But I am going up under the hood again tommorow, it's a weird feeling at first.

[AzLakeLizard]

I guess Mardonzi had to log off and go back to work... :hammer2:
He is instrument rated!

[BAD ATTITUDE BOATS]

hey mark like that flying make sher you get something faster then your boat it sucks when your boat is faster then the plane.my old boss has his plane forsale 172 cess super clean low hrs. i think he wants 40 but with 160hp thay only go 120mph.i think you need a beach craft holds 6 and flys about170mph.ive seen them for about 85 to 125 depening on hrs and radios.you would make a great pilit.

[Mardonzi]

I had the luxury of starting in a Comanche 250 (Traded guided fishing trips for my private rating in this plane). Complex, Hi performance, and it probably took me 25 more hours of flight time to get my rating than it should have, not to mention spoiled the hell out of me. Its a real letdown to go to a Cessna 172 after that.
For those that will actually have to pay to rent a plane while learning, I'd go with the least complex plane you can. Fixed pitch, fixed gear, and basic radios to start with, then graduate up to the more complex stuff such as GPS's, constant speed props, etc...
Another good option is to join a flying club. That way you get exposure and access to lots of different types of aircraft...
As far as instrument ratings go, I would strongly suggest getting one. Not only will it make you a more proficient pilot, It facilitates flights into more congested airspace/ airports.

[2Driver]

Great info here..I got bit last week..
I skydive.. (sp?)
Never thought of it that way but it seem logical to learn to skydive before learning to fly. :D :D :D
We book a Cardinal RG in 100 hour increments. Then use those hours over a 12-24 month period. We did it through a guy at my wife's work. I tell you it is nice to just park it in the hanger and not deal with all the fees, mechanical cost etc.
My wife has her license with IFR, Multi-engine and even the float plane certification....I got that for her for X-mas from the guy in Havasu. All very fun. Personally I like boating better, when it breaks you just get towed back to the ramp. :rolleyes: But it is fun to get to places in 90 minutes that used to take most the day. Lake Powell for dinner?

[Sleek-Jet]

Not to be a smart ass... but we had a hell of a thread going a couple months ago about this very subject... try doing a search.
As far as the cost.... Flying is part of who I am, I usually don't consider the cost much, it just costs what it costs.
If you can, purchase an airplane, or a share of one, you will fly more that way, no doubt about it. I don't fly nearly as much as I did when I had my 182.
Barring that, a flying club isn't to bad of an idea either.
AVG cost of a private pilot is between 5000 - 7000 right now if you rent your way there.
Multi-engine commercial, instrument airplane is what it says on my ticket.

[jackpunx]

Not to be a smart ass... but we had a hell of a thread going a couple months ago about this very subject... try doing a search.
As far as the cost.... Flying is part of who I am, I usually don't consider the cost much, it just costs what it costs.
If you can, purchase an airplane, or a share of one, you will fly more that way, no doubt about it. I don't fly nearly as much as I did when I had my 182.
Barring that, a flying club isn't to bad of an idea either.
AVG cost of a private pilot is between 5000 - 7000 right now if you rent your way there.
Multi-engine commercial, instrument airplane is what it says on my ticket.
Your right .. I didnt think to do a search.. I will now..
thanks for all the replies.. I just got off the phone with a school.. they were a little on the expensive side for the school and the rental.
I'll call some more..

[jackpunx]

hey mark like that flying make sher you get something faster then your boat it sucks when your boat is faster then the plane.my old boss has his plane forsale 172 cess super clean low hrs. i think he wants 40 but with 160hp thay only go 120mph.i think you need a beach craft holds 6 and flys about170mph.ive seen them for about 85 to 125 depening on hrs and radios.you would make a great pilit.
Hey Ron,
Good to see you on here..
I'll let you know how it goes.. but if I get the plane... or the license.. I'll have to leave my boat at your house :D

[jackpunx]

Never thought of it that way but it seem logical to learn to skydive before learning to fly. :D :D :D
We book a Cardinal RG in 100 hour increments. Then use those hours over a 12-24 month period. We did it through a guy at my wife's work. I tell you it is nice to just park it in the hanger and not deal with all the fees, mechanical cost etc.
My wife has her license with IFR, Multi-engine and even the float plane certification....I got that for her for X-mas from the guy in Havasu. All very fun. Personally I like boating better, when it breaks you just get towed back to the ramp. :rolleyes: But it is fun to get to places in 90 minutes that used to take most the day. Lake Powell for dinner?
and those hrs are flight time?

[Kachina26]

Your right .. I didnt think to do a search.. I will now..
thanks for all the replies.. I just got off the phone with a school.. they were a little on the expensive side for the school and the rental.
I'll call some more..
I pay 86 an hour for a 1974 cessna 172 instument rated, the instructor just went up from 20 to 25 an hour. Ground school was $100, I just passed my written last Friday. :D The plane is cheap compared to others I've seen, it gets inspected and gone through on a regular schedule as required by law. Really, when you pay for it as you go, it's about the same as going to the river once a week. Heck, it's actually a little cheaper.

[Sleek-Jet]

OK, now that I'm home I can talk a little more. I think Kachina26 was who we were talking to earlier this year. :D
My biggest suggestion is get all the book work done early. Hell, go enrole in a ground school and get the writen out of the way. Everyone likes to go fly, no one like to do the book work.
Find an instructor that will teach the art of flying, not just the mechanics. Theres more to this than pushing knobs and yanking on yokes. Anyplace that still cuts off shirt tails when you solo is a good place to start Get an instructor who is in this game to teach, not gain hours to go off and fly regional jets for Mesa.
Fly at least a couple times a week. The more the better. You are learning a skill that is not instictive to humans, it's going to take some repation to get things right.
An instrument rating will make you a better pilot, period. The instrument rating makes you a smoother pilot, people will like riding with you more. :D

[Sleek-Jet]

I pay 86 an hour for a 1974 cessna 172 instument rated, the instructor just went up from 20 to 25 an hour. Ground school was $100, I just passed my written last Friday. :D The plane is cheap compared to others I've seen, it gets inspected and gone through on a regular schedule as required by law. Really, when you pay for it as you go, it's about the same as going to the river once a week. Heck, it's actually a little cheaper.
Good to hear you're still at it... :D
Soloed yet???

[jackpunx]

OK, now that I'm home I can talk a little more. I think Kachina26 was who we were talking to earlier this year. :D
My biggest suggestion is get all the book work done early. Hell, go enrole in a ground school and get the writen out of the way. Everyone likes to go fly, no one like to do the book work.
Find an instructor that will teach the art of flying, not just the mechanics. Theres more to this than pushing knobs and yanking on yokes. Anyplace that still cuts off shirt tails when you solo is a good place to start Get an instructor who is in this game to teach, not gain hours to go off and fly regional jets for Mesa.
Fly at least a couple times a week. The more the better. You are learning a skill that is not instictive to humans, it's going to take some repation to get things right.
An instrument rating will make you a better pilot, period. The instrument rating makes you a smoother pilot, people will like riding with you more. :D
thanks for taking the time to reply..
Im going to talk to the little woman tonight.. I may have to wait a little as Im just finishing my A licnese for skydiving..
but if things go well.. I'll start this winter sometime..
Maybe I'll go to the ground school and get the unfun stuff out of the way

[Sleek-Jet]

Sorry I was a little short on the reply earlier... I just go back from my review at work and wanted to get the fock out of there... :D
Here's the thread I was thinking about...
http://www2.***boat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90436&highlight=flying+lessons
Good plan to go ahead and get a jump on the ground school... (did I mention that before??? :D )

[jackpunx]

Sorry I was a little short on the reply earlier... I just go back from my review at work and wanted to get the fock out of there... :D
Here's the thread I was thinking about...
http://www2.***boat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90436&highlight=flying+lessons
Good plan to go ahead and get a jump on the ground school... (did I mention that before??? :D )
I found it after you scolded me for not searching :D

[Kachina26]

[QUOTE=Sleek-Jet]Good to hear you're still at it... :D
Soloed yet???
I just did my first cross country solo to Havi. It was a blast!

[Sleek-Jet]

I found it after you scolded me for not searching :D
If you have any questions, theres a couple of us around here that are just itching to talk airplanes... :D

[Sleek-Jet]

[QUOTE=Sleek-Jet]Good to hear you're still at it... :D
Soloed yet???
I just did my first cross country solo to Havi. It was a blast!
Cool, I forgot when you posted about getting the shirt tail clipped.
Cross countries are a kick... especially when you start thinking how long it would take you to do the same trip in a car. :D

[jackpunx]

If you have any questions, theres a couple of us around here that are just itching to talk airplanes... :D
I got lots of questions.. just not ready for the answers yet.. :D

[Havasteve]

Count Me in! Got My license 23 years ago, been ever since. rented all kinds of stuff. I bought a humble Cessna 150 8 years ago and have never had a regret. Before moving to Havasu full time in 2000 I made trips from Redlands Ca. allmost every weekend, it still took 2 hrs instead of 4 in a truck, burned 13 gallons of gas instead of 40. All depends on how fancy you can afford to be. I bought mine for less than 20k, it's paid for now and costs me 50 bucks to tie it down in Havasu, $400 a year to insure it and about $350 for a owner assisted annual inspections. It's a great thing to share, I love turning people on to it.
Anyway, I can talk for hours about flying, I'd offer rides but I have a cast on my foot.

[AZKC]

If you have any questions, theres a couple of us around here that are just itching to talk airplanes... :D
Just throw some guns in with the planes and you'll have a thread competing with HoneyMoney's thread :notam:
So since ya had your review you buying at Hooters :)

[2Driver]

and those hrs are flight time?
Yes those are 100 hours of flight time we book and pre-pay. I doubt we even use it in the time period I mentioned (now with the 4 year old and all.)

[Kachina26]

Cross countries are a kick... especially when you start thinking how long it would take you to do the same trip in a car. :DI spent more time thinking about places to land if my one and only engine quit :D

[Sleek-Jet]

Just throw some guns in with the planes and you'll have a thread competing with HoneyMoney's thread :notam:
So since ya had your review you buying at Hooters :)
Sure, you going to be there???

[Sleek-Jet]

I spent more time thinking about places to land if my one and only engine quit :D
Why worry, deal with it when it happens... :D
I was trying to get to So-Cal a couple years ago from Colorado. I'd been bucking headwinds the whole way and was just South of Kingman, going accross the hills when my engine did a serious hick-up... I swear that thing quit for a second. I bet there is still a crease in that seat where I sucked that cusion up... :D Ended up diverting to Vegas because of weather, but damn that's not a good feeling.
Mardonzi flyies that airplane a little now, I'll have to ask him one of these days.

[AZKC]

Sure, you going to be there???
Let me ck my Franklin :notam: and I'll call ya :idea:

[Mardonzi]

Why worry, deal with it when it happens... :D
I was trying to get to So-Cal a couple years ago from Colorado. I'd been bucking headwinds the whole way and was just South of Kingman, going accross the hills when my engine did a serious hick-up... I swear that thing quit for a second. I bet there is still a crease in that seat where I sucked that cusion up... :D Ended up diverting to Vegas because of weather, but damn that's not a good feeling.
Mardonzi flyies that airplane a little now, I'll have to ask him one of these days.
The "Dirty Bird"? or that god awful ugly C-182??

[Sleek-Jet]

The "Dirty Bird"? or that god awful ugly C-182??
The Dirty Bird... :D

[Mardonzi]

Yeah,, I had my little incident in that thing,, nothing like stuck rudder controls on short final with a crosswind,,,,

[Sleek-Jet]

Yeah,, I had my little incident in that thing,, nothing like stuck rudder controls on short final with a crosswind,,,,
I can only imagine.... The little incident over the hills was just the beginning... :D

[Mardonzi]

Well, that's why we practice....

[whiteworks]

Think with your nose down.

[SoCal_fun]

Mark,
I got my private and then Instrument about 12 years ago now. Trained down in Torrance and then at Sanat Monica for the Instrument. I had a C-150 that was a lot of fun to fly for a few years and got checked out on some of the bigger stuff.
I'd go for it, you only live once (as I know you know), it is a really rewarding experience. I have flown to a number of events and camped out, or stayed over and it is so much fun to be able to get back into your own plane and take off when your ready.
As was said before, the Instrument ticket is really the best way to go when the time comes, as it will make you a much safer pilot and give you a much clearer understanding of the way the 'system' works. It can get you out of trouble as well when the weather closes in (saved my but a couple times).
Hope you get into it, I would train in the C-172, it's probably the most common and then you can upgrade from tere pretty easy later on.
I have cut way down, just due to the kids and boating costing me so much, but one of these days...... :rollside:

[a catered life]

i generally take off every friday and saturday night about 7pm touchdowns are done with some guided help from the misses :crossx:

[AzLakeLizard]

Yeah,, I had my little incident in that thing,, nothing like stuck rudder controls on short final with a crosswind,,,,
Oh.. but he forgot to add that He had "ME" in there too!.. YIKES :eek:
Heading to the Rally in the Rockies... and I had to have a few drinks after that wonderful landing... (velco and duct tape came in really handy for keeping me on the bike after that one!...lol) :hammerhea

[Sleek-Jet]

Oh.. but he forgot to add that He had "ME" in there too!.. YIKES :eek:
Heading to the Rally in the Rockies... and I had to have a few drinks after that wonderful landing... (velco and duct tape came in really handy for keeping me on the bike after that one!...lol) :hammerhea
Everything must have turned out well though, both of you are still here... :D

[jackpunx]

Count Me in! Got My license 23 years ago, been ever since. rented all kinds of stuff. I bought a humble Cessna 150 8 years ago and have never had a regret. Before moving to Havasu full time in 2000 I made trips from Redlands Ca. allmost every weekend, it still took 2 hrs instead of 4 in a truck, burned 13 gallons of gas instead of 40. All depends on how fancy you can afford to be. I bought mine for less than 20k, it's paid for now and costs me 50 bucks to tie it down in Havasu, $400 a year to insure it and about $350 for a owner assisted annual inspections. It's a great thing to share, I love turning people on to it.
Anyway, I can talk for hours about flying, I'd offer rides but I have a cast on my foot.
You dont need your feet to flap your wings :2purples: Lets Go!...lol
J/K
I got your pm.. that actually sounds pretty affordable when you get the cast off.. Let me know.. I would love to go for a ride
thanks :wink:

[jackpunx]

I didnt realize there were so many of you!..
my mind is on overdrive about this whole thing.. :D

[jackpunx]

Mark,
I got my private and then Instrument about 12 years ago now. Trained down in Torrance and then at Sanat Monica for the Instrument. I had a C-150 that was a lot of fun to fly for a few years and got checked out on some of the bigger stuff.
I'd go for it, you only live once (as I know you know), it is a really rewarding experience. I have flown to a number of events and camped out, or stayed over and it is so much fun to be able to get back into your own plane and take off when your ready.
As was said before, the Instrument ticket is really the best way to go when the time comes, as it will make you a much safer pilot and give you a much clearer understanding of the way the 'system' works. It can get you out of trouble as well when the weather closes in (saved my but a couple times).
Hope you get into it, I would train in the C-172, it's probably the most common and then you can upgrade from tere pretty easy later on.
I have cut way down, just due to the kids and boating costing me so much, but one of these days...... :rollside:
Lets go!!... I got a couple of buddies that will pay for the plane if you fly us to Perris..
Sunday?

[Sleek-Jet]

Lets go!!... I got a couple of buddies that will pay for the plane if you fly us to Perris..
Sunday?
Be carefull about advertsing that your budies are paying for the plane and someone else is flying... the Feds love to catch people doing this. It's coloquially known as a "bootleg" charter
You're allowed to "equaly split the costs of operation" but everyone has to pay, most importantly the pilot.

[jackpunx]

Be carefull about advertsing that your budies are paying for the plane and someone else is flying... the Feds love to catch people doing this. It's coloquially known as a "bootleg" charter
You're allowed to "equaly split the costs of operation" but everyone has to pay, most importantly the pilot.
Yep.. thats what I meant :)
actually now that you have mentioned that.. everything I read say .. you can cary passengers but not for comercial use..
I have a question.
Another buddy and myself are thinking about doing this together.. He has a childhood friend that ownes a plane.
Do you think that flying with him while in school to sharpen up our skills and minimise costs on getting the liciense is a good/bad idea?
I understand the bennifits of working with a trainers as they are certified teachers.
but FAA minimums from what I have seen are less then 4k to get a license.. although I know the average is probably in the neighborhood of 7-10k.
what are your thoughts?
thanks

[Sleek-Jet]

Yep.. thats what I meant :)
actually now that you have mentioned that.. everything I read say .. you can cary passengers but not for comercial use..
I have a question.
Another buddy and myself are thinking about doing this together.. He has a childhood friend that ownes a plane.
Do you think that flying with him while in school to sharpen up our skills and minimise costs on getting the liciense is a good/bad idea?
I understand the bennifits of working with a trainers as they are certified teachers.
but FAA minimums from what I have seen are less then 4k to get a license.. although I know the average is probably in the neighborhood of 7-10k.
what are your thoughts?
thanks
Well... it depends... :D
Until you have your Private Pilot, you cannot act as Pilot in Command, you also can't carry passangers. Not being Pilot In Command, you can't log anytime as solo, so it won't count towards you license requiremants.
You could go out and do a little airwork with him, but like I said, any time won't go towards your 20 hours solo.
Now, I'm not saying it won't do you any good to go up with him a little. It's always a learning experience to see how other people do things, but it's not going to save you any money.

[jackpunx]

Well... it depends... :D
Until you have your Private Pilot, you cannot act as Pilot in Command, you also can't carry passangers. Not being Pilot In Command, you can't log anytime as solo, so it won't count towards you license requiremants.
You could go out and do a little airwork with him, but like I said, any time won't go towards your 20 hours solo.
Now, I'm not saying it won't do you any good to go up with him a little. It's always a learning experience to see how other people do things, but it's not going to save you any money.
Im just figuring the extra experience is better than not.. and not being able to log it is ok..
from what I understand .. Most people are not able to achieve what ever it is they need to to get a license with in the min FAA requirements.. I think this guy (being a friend and a lover of flying) would take us out. My hopes would be to try to get a license with in the min faa requirements..
Having said that and knowing how dangerous and important it is to understand everything I need to... I would not be upset if it took me longer..
just wondered what your thoughts were.

[Sleek-Jet]

Yep.. thats what I meant :)
actually now that you have mentioned that.. everything I read say .. you can cary passengers but not for comercial use..
You can carry passangers, and they can pitch in for expenses, as long as you don't get compensated for more than their share. For example, you and 3 other friends rent an airplane and fly to the River for the weekend. You are allowed to divide the total expenses for the airplane (i.e. what it costs to rent that bad boy) by 4, and each person can pay that ammount.
But that is not to say you can't use an airplane for a business trip and take employees/coleagues with you. You can even turn in to the IRS for re-imbersmant as business travel, just like a car.
Commercial as it's used in the regs is synonymous with "for hire".

[Sleek-Jet]

Im just figuring the extra experience is better than not.. and not being able to log it is ok..
from what I understand .. Most people are not able to achieve what ever it is they need to to get a license with in the min FAA requirements.. I think this guy (being a friend and a lover of flying) would take us out. My hopes would be to try to get a license with in the min faa requirements..
Having said that and knowing how dangerous and important it is to understand everything I need to... I would not be upset if it took me longer..
just wondered what your thoughts were.
If you really want to get your Private in 40 hours, your best bet would be do dedicate 3 or 4 consecutive weeks to flight training. Most people that I've known to do it in that amount of time have pretty much dedicated their existance to flying for a month or so. There was even a kid in Arizona a few years ago that did it over Spring Break, but he was fly 2 to 3 times a day for 7 days straight.
The main reason people take 50 - 60 hours to get their ticket is that some of that time is spent "re-learning" skills that have atrophied because they don't fly often enough. That's why I suggest you fly several times a week, otherwise you just end up spinning your wheels re-learning what you did last time.
What kind of airplane does this guy have???

[Kachina26]

If you really want to get your Private in 40 hours, your best bet would be do dedicate 3 or 4 consecutive weeks to flight training. Most people that I've known to do it in that amount of time have pretty much dedicated their existance to flying for a month or so. There was even a kid in Arizona a few years ago that did it over Spring Break one year, but he was fly 2 to 3 times a day for 7 days straight.
The main reason people take 50 - 60 hours to get their ticket is that some of that time is spent "re-learning" skills that have atrophied because they don't fly often enough. That's why I suggest you fly several times a week, otherwise you just end up spinning your wheels re-learning what you did last time.
What kind of airplane does this guy have???
Very true, I had my landings nailed, but I took 2 cross country trips in the last 2 weeks with very few landings and now I'm floating on my flares again :mad: I will get it down again, but it's gonna cost me. Also, go to sportys.com when you start your ground school and do the study buddy and the practice tests. Actual FAA questions and answers.

[jackpunx]

If you really want to get your Private in 40 hours, your best bet would be do dedicate 3 or 4 consecutive weeks to flight training. Most people that I've known to do it in that amount of time have pretty much dedicated their existance to flying for a month or so. There was even a kid in Arizona a few years ago that did it over Spring Break, but he was fly 2 to 3 times a day for 7 days straight.
The main reason people take 50 - 60 hours to get their ticket is that some of that time is spent "re-learning" skills that have atrophied because they don't fly often enough. That's why I suggest you fly several times a week, otherwise you just end up spinning your wheels re-learning what you did last time.
What kind of airplane does this guy have???
One buddy (skydive buddy) has a 182 with a big motor and the other is a friend of Knuckleheads .. not sure what kind of plane..
I just talked to my local school..
with instructor its 115.00 an hr..
260 I think for the privats package
and I can do all the groundschool/studying on my own.
she said on average it takes about 6 months flying a couple times a week. (about 60-70hrs).

[Sleek-Jet]

One buddy (skydive buddy) has a 182 with a big motor and the other is a friend of Knuckleheads .. not sure what kind of plane..
I just talked to my local school..
with instructor its 115.00 an hr..
260 I think for the privats package
and I can do all the groundschool/studying on my own.
she said on average it takes about 6 months flying a couple times a week. (about 60-70hrs).
That's probably about right. I would bet you'll do it in less than 60 hours though.
Is this part 141 or 61 flight training??
Did she say how much the airplane rental is without the instructor??
What does the 260.00 buy you, I'm assumming the ground school materials and what else??
Do the instructors charge for any class-room time??

[Sleek-Jet]

It is a Cessna Tubro 206 :rollside:
Nice.... I would stick with the 182 for any airwork though. Even then it's going to feel different than what you will be training in, but a little extra experiance never hurt.

[jackpunx]

That's probably about right. I would bet you'll do it in less than 60 hours though.
Is this part 141 or 61 flight training??
Did she say how much the airplane rental is without the instructor??
What does the 260.00 buy you, I'm assumming the ground school materials and what else??
Do the instructors charge for any class-room time??
Not sure what the 141 or 61 is
the airplane with out the instructor is 89 an hr I believe
the 260 get the books and log book.. not sure what else
the instr charge 25 an hr.
Knucklehead just orderd our free trining from sportys and we are going to get started on that..
I think for 49.00 I can go fly for a 1/2 hr for an introductory flight..
Now there are what they call certified Cesna centers... I think my local one is calle Vista..
they are a little more expensive.. they have a nicer more updated website..
and seem to have more planes and instructors..
would you let that sway you towards them vs a less expensive place in the same airport?

[Sleek-Jet]

Not sure what the 141 or 61 is
the airplane with out the instructor is 89 an hr I believe
the 260 get the books and log book.. not sure what else
the instr charge 25 an hr.
Knucklehead just orderd our free trining from sportys and we are going to get started on that..
I think for 49.00 I can go fly for a 1/2 hr for an introductory flight..
Now there are what they call certified Cesna centers... I think my local one is calle Vista..
they are a little more expensive.. they have a nicer more updated website..
and seem to have more planes and instructors..
would you let that sway you towards them vs a less expensive place in the same airport?
Part 141 schools have an approved curriculum, they also qualify for financial aid and GI bill money. Part 61 don't have a set curriculum, but are allowed to teach the required knowlege as they see fit. The check ride is the same no matter what. You can theoretically get you ticket in less hours from a 141 school (I believe 35 is the minimum).
Cessna Pilot centers will have newer equipment (both airplanes and class-room tools). But a 172 is a 172, weather it's 20 years old or 2. If the airplanes are clean and well maintained, I wouldn't have a second thought of going with the cheaper per hour place.
One suggestion would be to ask around the airport about any place you looking at going. Word travels fast if you know what I mean.

[sxpilot]

Im also a pilot, flew Mu-2's for 6 years for a company in Tulsa, then went on to American Eagle Airlines Inc. back in 98 flew the ATR 72/42 for a little over a year, then jumped into another Corp. position flying Turbo Commander 690A. That was all good untill they Bankruped and layed everyone off.
Flying is a part of me as well, always eager to talk planes and flyin. I agree with alot of what has been said, start with a 152/172 at first, the last thing you need is to become overloaded in the cockpit. Once you have a feel for things then stepup and take on a more challanging plane. Please be a smart pilot and get your Instrument Rating, if you plane on flying over 300 miles you will want to be trained and skilled in Inst flying. Cali is known for its fog and low cloud's as well as Smog and "Cumilous Granite"=rocks in clouds that can be as bad. VFR you say...in Cali it pushes the envelope of being VFR especially at night in the mountains, you will find yourself in trouble in no time flat. Just a fact!!!
I have well over 4000+ hours of 135 Intl Experiance, all weather, night and day, as well as 121 experiance flying people Intl. I have been trained in the most advanced flight sims on the planet "flight safety", pushed to the breaking point...let me just tell you, theres no substitute for a good well exp. flight instructor. As mentioned before find one that has years of exp. not just some kid trying to build time...nothing aganst kids, they are people too...
I wont bore you any more...need anything just ask...

[jackpunx]

Im also a pilot, flew Mu-2's for 6 years for a company in Tulsa, then went on to American Eagle Airlines Inc. back in 98 flew the ATR 72/42 for a little over a year, then jumped into another Corp. position flying Turbo Commander 690A. That was all good untill they Bankruped and layed everyone off.
Flying is a part of me as well, always eager to talk planes and flyin. I agree with alot of what has been said, start with a 152/172 at first, the last thing you need is to become overloaded in the cockpit. Once you have a feel for things then stepup and take on a more challanging plane. Please be a smart pilot and get your Instrument Rating, if you plane on flying over 300 miles you will want to be trained and skilled in Inst flying. Cali is known for its fog and low cloud's as well as Smog and "Cumilous Granite"=rocks in clouds that can be as bad. VFR you say...in Cali it pushes the envelope of being VFR especially at night in the mountains, you will find yourself in trouble in no time flat. Just a fact!!!
I have well over 4000+ hours of 135 Intl Experiance, all weather, night and day, as well as 121 experiance flying people Intl. I have been trained in the most advanced flight sims on the planet "flight safety", pushed to the breaking point...let me just tell you, theres no substitute for a good well exp. flight instructor. As mentioned before find one that has years of exp. not just some kid trying to build time...nothing aganst kids, they are people too...
I wont bore you any more...need anything just ask...
Lets go jump :D

[RiverDave]

I grew up in the back of an airplane heading to the river all the time. My old man had a few planes before he got a 210, then a T210, then a T210 Riley Rocket etc.. etc.. Any questions about the airplane game, give him a call, I'm sure he'd be happy to give you all the info you ever wanted and then some. He used to rent that T210 out so he knows quite a bit about that aspect as well.
RD

[sxpilot]

Lets go jump :D
How did I know that was coming... :D
Well right at the moment Im working on my Bi-annual, cleaning my house to go on the market, working a new job, and building airplanes...My plate is full...But we will just as soon as I can free up some time...
Dude you gotta get your ratings...it sounds like you are chompin at the bit...
Next year my goal is to start training for Aerobatic flight...at least take a few classes, loops, point rolls, hammer heads, tumbles, inverted flight, spins, and IAC flying...that should get me motivated to get back in the air..

[Mardonzi]

How did I know that was coming... :D
Well right at the moment Im working on my Bi-annual, cleaning my house to go on the market, working a new job, and building airplanes...My plate is full...But we will just as soon as I can free up some time...
Dude you gotta get your ratings...it sounds like you are chompin at the bit...
Next year my goal is to start training for Aerobatic flight...at least take a few classes, loops, point rolls, hammer heads, tumbles, inverted flight, spins, and IAC flying...that should get me motivated to get back in the air..
You'll love it,,, I've got 10 hours in a Pitts S2B and it is still the most memorable flying experience that I've ever had.
The guy that taught me lives in Salt Lake, flys for Scare West, and still teaches part time in the Pitts,,,

[sxpilot]

You'll love it,,, I've got 10 hours in a Pitts S2B and it is still the most memorable flying experience that I've ever had.
The guy that taught me lives in Salt Lake, flys for Scare West, and still teaches part time in the Pitts,,,
Ive been in a Zlin, for some Unusual attitude training and it was just awesome!!! Pitts S2B is a tiny little bastard...I love em'
Im trying to do the Extra 300 tandom 20hr program...Down in PHX
Cant wait :)

[whiteworks]

jp, I think I am starting to see the logic to your madness. it occurs to me that wearing a parachute while learning to fly isnt such a bad idea.

[Beer-30]

Did the private in 43 hours. Looks like I will finish up my instrument in 40-44.
580 total hours.
400+ of which is HP / Complex.
As a matter of fact, heading to Chandler, AZ and back tomorrow. Going to look at some parts at Arizona Speed and Marine. Leaving around 10am, will be back in time for dinner. It spoils you.
Taking this:
http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2433small.jpg
Looks like weather will be great.

[olbiezer]

hey guys been reading all of your threads .....25 yr air traffic controller here.....any questions on atc let me know.......we are just guys like yourselfs too ,....most are pilots also......have flown a t38 air force trainer to a cessna 150 in my day.......its fun but expencive lol think someone all ready said that :hammerhea

[sxpilot]

Did the private in 43 hours. Looks like I will finish up my instrument in 40-44.
580 total hours.
400+ of which is HP / Complex.
As a matter of fact, heading to Chandler, AZ and back tomorrow. Going to look at some parts at Arizona Speed and Marine. Leaving around 10am, will be back in time for dinner. It spoils you.
Taking this:
http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2433small.jpg
Looks like weather will be great.
Yes they do, little time machines they are...
ATC man my hats off to you sir....

[Havasu Fan]

Hey Darcy!
Flying is addicting!! Here is me in the front seat, nothing like flying upside down, we pulled +6 and -5 G's :cool:
I bought a share of a C172, Its just under $40/hr wet to fly.
http://www.pbase.com/johnvh/image/42652814.jpg

[502procharger]

here are my 2 toys. cherokee 160 and a l-29 jet trainer
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/1DSC03349.JPG

[olbiezer]

very nice 502......must cost a pretty pennie to fly a hour in that old jet.......

[502procharger]

125-150 gph dep on alt and how hard i run it. Not the most efficiant way to butn jet A but sure puts a smile on my face.

[jackpunx]

she said OK :D

[sxpilot]

Hey Darcy!
Flying is addicting!! Here is me in the front seat, nothing like flying upside down, we pulled +6 and -5 G's :cool:
I bought a share of a C172, Its just under $40/hr wet to fly.
http://www.pbase.com/johnvh/image/42652814.jpg
Hey man welcome to Hot Boat, the place that has the most Drama in the internet.. :D :D :D
Looks nice in the Eagle....dam..
Hey 502 real nice rides man...I bet when riding in the Jet you must have a grin Ear to Ear... :D

[sxpilot]

she said OK :D
Thats just great man!!! Now get with it and dont stop till you got your tickets...fly at least twice a week, and be studying the other 5 days, get the books out of the way asap!..
good luck, any questions just shoot

[KACHINA KEN]

How does that saying go.... If it Flys, Floats, or F*cks,,,, Rent it
Rental boats suck though :)

[olbiezer]

if u ever want to look up who owns a air craft look it up here http://162.58.35.241/acdatabase/NNum_inquiry.asp

[Kachina26]

Just did recovery from unusual attitudes last night while under the hood. What a trip! It was fun :D

[jackpunx]

Just did recovery from unusual attitudes last night while under the hood. What a trip! It was fun :D
what does that mean?

[jackpunx]

Thats just great man!!! Now get with it and dont stop till you got your tickets...fly at least twice a week, and be studying the other 5 days, get the books out of the way asap!..
good luck, any questions just shoot
LOL>. I will
I will wait a month or so, make some financial things right and then dedicate a schedule that will give me at least one morning before work and two after to fly..
then maybe weekends too..
my goal is to fly 3 times a week if not more..

[Mardonzi]

Rental boats suck though :)
So do Rental women,,, if you're lucky.....

[jackpunx]

So do Rental women,,, if you're lucky.....
COD... cash on delivery :D

[jackpunx]

Hey Darcy!
Flying is addicting!! Here is me in the front seat, nothing like flying upside down, we pulled +6 and -5 G's :cool:
I bought a share of a C172, Its just under $40/hr wet to fly.
]
how does a share work?
that seems very inexpensive

[Kachina26]

LOL>. I will
I will wait a month or so, make some financial things right and then dedicate a schedule that will give me at least one morning before work and two after to fly..
then maybe weekends too..
my goal is to fly 3 times a week if not more..
You wear a visor that prevents you from seeing outside of the cockpit, and you fly by instruments. Then the instructor takes control of the plane and has you put your head down and close your eyes. Then he turns the plane different directions, climbs, dives, varies the engine speed to get you disoriented. Then you look up, figure out by the instruments what is wrong and correct it. It's alot like being drunk when the room is spinning. I did pretty well with the recovery, I looked up one time to find the plane in a steeper bank than I had ever intentionally put it in :D 3 times a week would be perfect, I only go once or twice, and it makes it tough.

[jackpunx]

You wear a visor that prevents you from seeing outside of the cockpit, and you fly by instruments. Then the instructor takes control of the plane and has you put your head down and close your eyes. Then he turns the plane different directions, climbs, dives, varies the engine speed to get you disoriented. Then you look up, figure out by the instruments what is wrong and correct it. It's alot like being drunk when the room is spinning. I did pretty well with the recovery, I looked up one time to find the plane in a steeper bank than I had ever intentionally put it in :D 3 times a week would be perfect, I only go once or twice, and it makes it tough.
This is part of getting a privat's? not the IFR? (sp?)

[Mardonzi]

This is part of getting a privat's? not the IFR? (sp?)
There is some "hood time" required for your private as well as unusual attitude recovery.
You do the same thing while training for your instrument, they just take away a few of the instruments ie. Directional Gyro, Turn and Bank indicator, etc...

[Kachina26]

This is part of getting a privat's? not the IFR? (sp?)
Yes, you are required to do 3 hours of under the hood time. Just so that if you manage to get caught in a cloud (because they are so hard to avoid :rolleyes: ) you can get yourself out. It also teaches you to use your instruments and have faith in them regardless of what your body/brain is trying to tell you. It's nowhere near the training you actually need to fly ifr.

[Kachina26]

There is some "hood time" required for your private as well as unusual attitude recovery.
You do the same thing while training for your instrument, they just take away a few of the instruments ie. Directional Gyro, Turn and Bank indicator, etc...
yikes! I can understand why though, we lost a vacuum pump once and all we had was a turn coordinator. I wouldn't want to be in a cloud with just that.

[jackpunx]

Very interesting.. Things are slow here at work.. I think Im going to do an introductory flight today :D

[jackpunx]

Part of the airline's recent
settlement with the unions
was hiring handicapped
people.
The other day, passengers on
a small commuter plane were
waiting for the flight to
leave. Two men walked up the
aisle dressed in pilots'
uniforms and both were
wearing dark glasses. One
pilot was using a seeing-eye
dog, and the other was
tapping his way up the aisle
with a white cane.
Nervous laughter spread
through the cabin; but the
men enter the cockpit, the
door closes, and the engines
start up.
The passengers begin
glancing nervously around,
searching for some sign that
this is just a little
practical joke. None is
forthcoming.
The plane moves faster and
faster down the runway, and
people at the windows realize
that they're headed straight
for the water at the edge of
the airport.
As it begins to look as
though the plane will never
take off, that it will plow
into the water, panicked
screams fill the cabin.
At that moment, the plane
lifts smoothly into the air.
The passengers relax and
laugh a little sheepishly,
and soon they have all
retreated into their books
and magazines, secure in the
knowledge that the plane is
in good hands.
Up front in the cockpit, the
co-pilot turns to the pilot
and says, "You know, Bob, one
of these days, they're going
to scream too late, and we're
all gonna die."

[Sleek-Jet]

yikes! I can understand why though, we lost a vacuum pump once and all we had was a turn coordinator. I wouldn't want to be in a cloud with just that.
It keeps things interesting... :D

[Sleek-Jet]

how does a share work?
that seems very inexpensive
Untill a few years ago, it was known as a partnership agreement. You own and equal piece of the airplane, 1/4, 1/2, 1/3.. what have you... Usually the buy in is the percent of market value for the airplane.
Since most people don't fly enough to justify owning an entire airplane, going in with a couple people makes financial and practical sense as well. The airplane get's used a little more, everyone has their own set of keys and get's to say that they own an airplane at parties... :D (one of the perks of airplane ownership is bragging about it :D :D ).
I owned my 182 with another pilot, so we each had a financial responsibility for half the airplane. And when we sold it, we split the profit the same way. We also split the bills equally (insurance, hanger, maint) with each pilot paying his own operating expenses (fuel/oil). It worked out nice, and I could own more aiplane than if I would have bought my own outright.
The Biz jet people made the word "fractional" trendy, so now that's what everyone calls it.

[Sleek-Jet]

The only picture I have handy of my baby... I never should have sold her. (The kid that I'm holding is my niece, she's not for sale... :D) All we had left to do was repaint and that bird would have been better than new.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/115351T___Sidney.jpg

[jackpunx]

I started pilot school Monday.. Im on my second flight today.. :rollside:

[JustMVG]

Untill a few years ago, it was known as a partnership agreement. You own and equal piece of the airplane, 1/4, 1/2, 1/3.. what have you... Usually the buy in is the percent of market value for the airplane.
Since most people don't fly enough to justify owning an entire airplane, going in with a couple people makes financial and practical sense as well. The airplane get's used a little more, everyone has their own set of keys and get's to say that they own an airplane at parties... :D (one of the perks of airplane ownership is bragging about it :D :D ).
I owned my 182 with another pilot, so we each had a financial responsibility for half the airplane. And when we sold it, we split the profit the same way. We also split the bills equally (insurance, hanger, maint) with each pilot paying his own operating expenses (fuel/oil). It worked out nice, and I could own more aiplane than if I would have bought my own outright.
The Biz jet people made the word "fractional" trendy, so now that's what everyone calls it.
Since it was only the two of you, were there any usage problems? You know the old "I thought it was my day/weekend?" and you had to reschedule? Fractional ownership is a great way to go, and if you can start a small company, you can charter to yourself and friends. God i need to get current, i need some "Air" time, feel like getting back up there!!!

[Kachina26]

I started pilot school Monday.. Im on my second flight today.. :rollside:
Right on man! I'm going on Turkey day and again on Saturday, real close to my final check ride:D

[Mardonzi]

Congrats,,,, the check ride is just the beginning.....

[Sleek-Jet]

Since it was only the two of you, were there any usage problems? You know the old "I thought it was my day/weekend?" and you had to reschedule? Fractional ownership is a great way to go, and if you can start a small company, you can charter to yourself and friends. God i need to get current, i need some "Air" time, feel like getting back up there!!!
Don't say the "C" word... it's Part K operations now. :D That is, a group of private owners that have a professional crew fly the airplanes for them (Net Jets, Exec-Jet, ect...). Similiar rules to 135 operations, but you still have some of the flexibility of part 91 operations.
No, we never had any problems. Niether one of us used the airplane for business or to commute somewhere, so scheduling was never a factor. If I wanted to take the airplane for a week, I'd just call and see if the other owner had any plans. If he did, we worked something out. Not a big deal. The only time he wanted the airplane for sure, was Christmas Eve, he'd fly to his parents house for the day.
I probably wouldn't go more than 3, 4 people at the max. Anymore than that and you start to run into problems. I helped a friend here at work get his private last year, and now he's go the airplane bug. We're looking at going halves on an airplane sometime next year.

[Sleek-Jet]

I started pilot school Monday.. Im on my second flight today.. :rollside:
I was beginning to wonder what happened... Congrats on starting and keep at it, it's all worth it. :D

[JustMVG]

Don't say the "C" word... it's Part K operations now. :D That is, a group of private owners that have a professional crew fly the airplanes for them (Net Jets, Exec-Jet, ect...). Similiar rules to 135 operations, but you still have some of the flexibility of part 91 operations.
No, we never had any problems. Niether one of us used the airplane for business or to commute somewhere, so scheduling was never a factor. If I wanted to take the airplane for a week, I'd just call and see if the other owner had any plans. If he did, we worked something out. Not a big deal. The only time he wanted the airplane for sure, was Christmas Eve, he'd fly to his parents house for the day.
I probably wouldn't go more than 3, 4 people at the max. Anymore than that and you start to run into problems. I helped a friend here at work get his private last year, and now he's go the airplane bug. We're looking at going halves on an airplane sometime next year.
Sounds like a great plan, so our little plan to buy a used G-4 is not going to go anywhere is it :cry: :rollside:, oh well i'll spend the investment money on something else, details coming soon.... not what you might think... Have a good one Sleek!!!

[Sleek-Jet]

Sounds like a great plan, so our little plan to buy a used G-4 is not going to go anywhere is it :cry: :rollside:, oh well i'll spend the investment money on something else, details coming soon.... not what you might think... Have a good one Sleek!!!
Hey now, I found a GII but you weren't interested, remember??? :D :D
Right back at there Mike... have a good Holiday. :D

[Patyacht]

For current, ex and future pilots: http://guyrevel.free.fr/WGP/Haute-Voltige_au_Japon.wmv

[Sleek-Jet]

For current, ex and future pilots: http://guyrevel.free.fr/WGP/Haute-Voltige_au_Japon.wmv
Nice... now I want to go buy a Yak or Sukhoi... :D

[Kachina26]

I love seeing them things just hangin' on the prop!

[SoCal_fun]

I started pilot school Monday.. Im on my second flight today.. :rollside:
Hey thats great Mark!! Congrats!! Don't know about you but the first couple of times doing steep turns and such I came back sick as a dog.. :yuk:
You get over that and get used to it pretty quick though. I always came back sweaty though, high stress flying with an ex Navy pilot as an instructor!!
Keep us up to date, okay!! :rollside:

[JustMVG]

Hey now, I found a GII but you weren't interested, remember??? :D :D
Right back at there Mike... have a good Holiday. :D
Thanks, but if i remember it didn't come w the hush kit and smelled like a turkish bath, you don't want to know how i know what that smells like, and i was young and .... well never mind that part, besides isn't the G4 the new posh thing to show up in??? :p, besides i have a whole 5,200 bucks burning a hole in my pocket!!! Take care, hope you have a CAVU day next time ya get up there......

[mach1alaska]

Hey thats great Mark!! Congrats!! Don't know about you but the first couple of times doing steep turns and such I came back sick as a dog.. :yuk:
You get over that and get used to it pretty quick though. I always came back sweaty though, high stress flying with an ex Navy pilot as an instructor!!
Keep us up to date, okay!! :rollside:
The Best thing I did as a student pilot was to take aerobatics training and to get checked out in a taildragger. Even if you never use the training it will help your normal flying tremendously

[jackpunx]

thanks guys.. He's got me doing maneuvers .. We did the 45 bank turns (two 360's in opposite directions) and flying around a fixed object..
Along with all the other stuff.. He said I nailed both the banked turns and the object with out loosing or gaining more than 100' Alt
He's calling me a show off.. I told him its because of boating.. Today we are doing S turns over a road, Slow flight and something else I cant remember..
Kachina.. Good look on the check out.. How much longer do you have?
My instructor is also a skydiver.. so we are going to fly to the DZ, Jump all day and fly back.. Looking forward to that.. I’ve been doing it with another buddy.. but I cant log the hrs..
Right now Im on his schedule for 2 days a week.. but I was able to pick up some other open slots.. this week I have at least 3 days..
(trying to fly as often as possible)
I was joking around with my fiancé last night.. told her I was going to sell my fast boat.. She laughed and said.. NO WAY!..

[Beer-30]

We're looking at going halves on an airplane sometime next year.
If you will be looking for a very well setup-upgraded HP/Complex 6-place, let me know when you start looking. We may be ready to go to pressurized and would be selling the Lance. We have been kicking it around, but never really bite the bullet. We have the Lance so dialed-in. Unless you are one of the ones that doesn't like T-tails.

[Sleek-Jet]

thanks guys.. He's got me doing maneuvers .. We did the 45 bank turns (two 360's in opposite directions) and flying around a fixed object..
Along with all the other stuff.. He said I nailed both the banked turns and the object with out loosing or gaining more than 100' Alt
He's calling me a show off.. I told him its because of boating.. Today we are doing S turns over a road, Slow flight and something else I cant remember..
Kachina.. Good look on the check out.. How much longer do you have?
My instructor is also a skydiver.. so we are going to fly to the DZ, Jump all day and fly back.. Looking forward to that.. I’ve been doing it with another buddy.. but I cant log the hrs..
Right now Im on his schedule for 2 days a week.. but I was able to pick up some other open slots.. this week I have at least 3 days..
(trying to fly as often as possible)
I was joking around with my fiancé last night.. told her I was going to sell my fast boat.. She laughed and said.. NO WAY!..
Turns around a point is the first manuever that any newly minted private pilot will do... everyone always wants to circle their house... :D
If slow flight is on the menu, I bet stalls aren't to far behind. Keep the ball centered. And keep up the good work. :D
Beer 30... yeah, I don't like T-tails... :D Actually, that's a little more airplane than is practicle right now. I'm stearing towards 4-place fixed gear till the other guy builds a little more time.

[Kachina26]

Kachina.. Good look on the check out.. How much longer do you have?
2 more hours of practice until I'm eligible. I just did steep banks for the first time 2 weeks ago. I dunno if he forgot or what. I did well, he taught me to throw in a little up trim when starting the turn to keep from diving.
Gonna take my check ride in 2 weeks I hope :D

[jackpunx]

2 more hours of practice until I'm eligible. I just did steep banks for the first time 2 weeks ago. I dunno if he forgot or what. I did well, he taught me to throw in a little up trim when starting the turn to keep from diving.
Gonna take my check ride in 2 weeks I hope :D
A little trim up, little back pressure and a little gas... :)
Keep us posted.. thats awesome!.. Looking forward to being there.. so Im going to live through you for now :)

[jackpunx]

Turns around a point is the first manuever that any newly minted private pilot will do... everyone always wants to circle their house... :D
If slow flight is on the menu, I bet stalls aren't to far behind. Keep the ball centered. And keep up the good work. :D
Beer 30... yeah, I don't like T-tails... :D Actually, that's a little more airplane than is practicle right now. I'm stearing towards 4-place fixed gear till the other guy builds a little more time.
I almost called you last night.. .. He wants me to get ready for 45degree stalls..
whats the deal with that?
What is 1.2xVs1?
I know what Vs is.. but what is Vs1?
and are they saying to multiply that number by 1.2?

[Kachina26]

I almost called you last night.. .. He wants me to get ready for 45degree stalls..
whats the deal with that?
What is 1.2xVs1?
I know what Vs is.. but what is Vs1?
and are they saying to multiply that number by 1.2?
VS0 is stall velocity "shit out" ie flaps and gear
VS1 is stall velocity clean. 1.2 vs1 is vs1 + 20%, so yeah, take your vs1 speed times 1.2 :D
I bought the faa flying handbook at the beginning of all this to learn this stuff. Also get yourself a POH (handbook) for the plane you typically fly, it's helpful to have.

[Sleek-Jet]

I almost called you last night.. .. He wants me to get ready for 45degree stalls..
whats the deal with that?
What is 1.2xVs1?
I know what Vs is.. but what is Vs1?
and are they saying to multiply that number by 1.2?
There's Vso and there's Vs1. They are two more of the "V" speeds that you need to know.
Vso is the stalling speed in the landing configuration, i.e. the "Dirty" w flaps down, stall speed, wings level, with the engine idle or at low power. It's also the bottom of the white arc on the airspeed indicator.
Vs1 is the stalling speed with the airplane in a specified configuration, usually flaps up, in level flight with the engine at idle or low power. This is the speed at the bottom of the green arc on the airspeed indicator.
So, if your Vs1 is 50 knots, mulitply that by 1.2, which gives you 60 knots.
(If you're paying attention, you'll notice that that's about the airspeed that we're shooting for when we start our decent from the pattern altitude to landing.)
Clear as mud??? :D
Now on to the stall question. I think what he wants to go over with you is accelerated stalls. The purpose is two-fold. One, we want to show you that the airplane can stall at any airspeed, and two, how much stall speed changes depending on the angle of bank.
You'll usually set this up by flying level at our 1.2 * Vs1 speed in a clean configuration (or usually a little more, say 5 knots or so depending on the instructor), rolling the airplane into a 45 degree bank, and pulling swiftly, but smoothly, back on the yoke. This will change the angle of attack, and if done correctly and in coordinated flight, the top wing will give up first and as you recover you'll end up back in level flight.
Question for the day, why do you think the top (or outside) wing will stall before the bottom (or inside) wing???
They're a kick to do, but remember to stay coordinated.

[Kachina26]

There's Vso and there's Vs1. They are two more of the "V" speeds that you need to know.
Vso is the stalling speed in the landing configuration, i.e. the "Dirty" w flaps down, stall speed, wings level, with the engine idle or at low power. It's also the bottom of the white arc on the airspeed indicator.
Vs1 is the stalling speed with the airplane in a specified configuration, usually flaps up, in level flight with the engine at idle or low power. This is the speed at the bottom of the green arc on the airspeed indicator.
So, if your Vs1 is 50 knots, mulitply that by 1.2, which gives you 60 knots.
(If you're paying attention, you'll notice that that's about the airspeed that we're shooting for when we start our decent from the pattern altitude to landing.)
Clear as mud??? :D
Now on to the stall question. I think what he wants to go over with you is accelerated stalls. The purpose is two-fold. One, we want to show you that the airplane can stall at any airspeed, and two, how much stall speed changes depending on the angle of bank.
You'll usually set this up by flying level at our 1.2 * Vs1 speed in a clean configuration (or usually a little more, say 5 knots or so depending on the instructor), rolling the airplane into a 45 degree bank, and pulling swiftly, but smoothly, back on the yoke. This will change the angle of attack, and if done correctly and in coordinated flight, the top wing will give up first and as you recover you'll end up back in level flight.
Question for the day, why do you think the top (or outside) wing will stall before the bottom (or inside) wing???
They're a kick to do, but remember to stay coordinated.
That was a much more complete answer, thank you. I never did stalls in a bank. I'm gonna ask about that. I never did dutch rolls either until my buddy showed me them in his plane. He learned them when he was getting checked out on the old Champ taildragger they have. I hear it's much more important to stay coordinated in that thing. He already ground looped it once :D

[Sleek-Jet]

That was a much more complete answer, thank you. I never did stalls in a bank. I'm gonna ask about that. I never did dutch rolls either until my buddy showed me them in his plane. He learned them when he was getting checked out on the old Champ taildragger they have. I hear it's much more important to stay coordinated in that thing. He already ground looped it once :D
Those older airplanes remind you what those things at the end of your legs are for... :D

[jackpunx]

Thanks for the reply..
When you say coordinated.. You mean Ruder and ailerons?
So far my instructor has said not to worry about it yet..
so all my turns have been on the wheel only..
but all the instruction in the handbook is saying to be coordinated.. One time I tried it.. but I felt the tail chase me around... That’s when he said.. Don’t worry about it yet..lol

[Sleek-Jet]

Thanks for the reply..
When you say coordinated.. You mean Ruder and ailerons?
So far my instructor has said not to worry about it yet..
so all my turns have been on the wheel only..
but all the instruction in the handbook is saying to be coordinated.. One time I tried it.. but I felt the tail chase me around... That’s when he said.. Don’t worry about it yet..lol
:rolleyes:
I'm sure your instructor is just trying to overload you on doing to many things at once
Yeah, staying coordinated is important. And yes it has to do with the ailerons and rudders togather. On modern airplanes you can get away with alot more than older ones. 172's have lots of diehederal and the rudder's aren't quite as effective. But, you do need to get in the habbit of leading the turns with your feet, and keeping the ball centered in the climbs. It's more of a pressure on the peddle than an actuall movement during normal flight. Now, when you get to doing more airwork, you'll be pushing things around more, because that's the point.
Hopefully your instructor will go over all this, but you want to "step on the ball" in the turn and bank. If it is showing displaced to the left, add a little left rudder and visa versa. When you get to doing slow flight, you'll use more rudder, so it's comming pretty quick.
Now, drop you ass in an old champ or cub, and don't use the rudders, and the nose will acturally turn the opposite way of the aileron input due to adverse yaw and several other factors. In fact, on the older airplanes, you fly more with your feet.

[jackpunx]

:rolleyes:
I'm sure your instructor is just trying to overload you on doing to many things at once
Yeah, staying coordinated is important. And yes it has to do with the ailerons and rudders togather. On modern airplanes you can get away with alot more than older ones. 172's have lots of diehederal and the rudder's aren't quite as effective. But, you do need to get in the habbit of leading the turns with your feet, and keeping the ball centered in the climbs. It's more of a pressure on the peddle than an actuall movement during normal flight. Now, when you get to doing more airwork, you'll be pushing things around more, because that's the point.
Hopefully your instructor will go over all this, but you want to "step on the ball" in the turn and bank. If it is showing displaced to the left, add a little left rudder and visa versa. When you get to doing slow flight, you'll use more rudder, so it's comming pretty quick.
Now, drop you ass in an old champ or cub, and don't use the rudders, and the nose will acturally turn the opposite way of the aileron input due to adverse yaw and several other factors. In fact, on the older airplanes, you fly more with your feet.
makes sense...
So far I have not had to step on the ball much other than take off's and climbs with power..
This actually makes some sense.. and pops up another question.. Ive seen lots of footage of trick or war style planes that were able to fly upside down or perpendicular to the ground.. In the 172 I cant seem to wrap my head around that.. If I bank.. the plane turns that way.. I’m sure there’s a way.. but I cant figure out how to get the plane to go straight while in a bank.. :rolleyes:
I probably shouldn’t be worrying about that right now.. but I think it would help me understand more about how and why planes fly..
Its like trying to explain trim to someone who has know experience..
Well.. Im the 5 year old in this converstion..LOL :)

[Sleek-Jet]

makes sense...
So far I have not had to step on the ball much other than take off's and climbs with power..
This actually makes some sense.. and pops up another question.. Ive seen lots of footage of trick or war style planes that were able to fly upside down or perpendicular to the ground.. In the 172 I cant seem to wrap my head around that.. If I bank.. the plane turns that way.. I’m sure there’s a way.. but I cant figure out how to get the plane to go straight while in a bank.. :rolleyes:
I probably shouldn’t be worrying about that right now.. but I think it would help me understand more about how and why planes fly..
Its like trying to explain trim to someone who has know experience..
Well.. Im the 5 year old in this converstion..LOL :)
Mak sure you're below Va (oh great, another V speed.. :D ) and Stomp on the opposite rudder... if you're turning right, stomp on the left rudder and turn the yoke even farther to the right to hold the bank. It's what's known as a forward slip. And before long, you'll be doing them for landings. :D
Remember what Kachina said about his buddy doing dutch rolls??? It's the same idea, but you are always rolling the airplane from one bank to another, using the rudders to keep the nose pointed straight.

[SMFRiverRat]

Thanks for the reply..
When you say coordinated.. You mean Ruder and ailerons?
So far my instructor has said not to worry about it yet..
so all my turns have been on the wheel only..
l
Not to worry about it yet?
I would suggest looking for a new instructor.

[SoCal_fun]

Not to worry about it yet?
I would suggest looking for a new instructor.
I'm sure that, like sleek-jet says, he just doesn't want to overload Mark yet. BUT, if you try doing accelerated stalls without any rudder input, you might end up with a little spin training thrown in when you wern't expecting it, LOL!! :rollside: (most likely, the instructor has been working the rudders for you). Don't worry, coordinated flight comes pretty easy once you start doing it, it's not some major concept to learn. I'm sure your instructor is fine. Best of luck, and rememeber to have fun too!!

[Beer-30]

Not to worry about it yet?
I would suggest looking for a new instructor.
Hell, I didn't really start doing coord turns 'till 100 hours or so. Not that big a deal unless you are doing turns on the stall horn all the time.

[Charley]

If anyone is looking to learn how to fly my business partner is an instructor and also owns his own piper...he actually flys between corona and fullerton to work..lucky devil... great guy and very reasonable.... PM me if you are interested or email him direct at kenny@stage-tech.com
PS mark good luck Bro!

[Kachina26]

Not to worry about it yet?
I would suggest looking for a new instructor.
I wouldn't go that far, just be aware of the power on stalls that everyone is talking about and make sure to "step on the ball" and you'll do fine. Also remember, it usually doesn't take alot of rudder to coordinate things, just add a little pressure or reduce the pressure you are adding. I remember pushing on the controls when I first started. I learned the art of finese(sp) on my cross country flights to Havi, got to do something with your time :D Come to think of it, my microsoft flight trainer waits for awhile before suggesting using rudders on your own. BTW that is a good program to use in between flying and you can fly other planes.

[Kachina26]

Oh, and do yourself a favor. Go get your class 3 medical cert if you haven't done so. You have to have it before you solo. If they find something that's gonna keep you from flying, it's better that they do it before you spend all that cash on lessons.

[Beer-30]

Oh, and do yourself a favor. Go get your class 3 medical cert if you haven't done so. You have to have it before you solo. If they find something that's gonna keep you from flying, it's better that they do it before you spend all that cash on lessons.
Yup. Good advice. And in my opinion, even better advice, if you haven't taken your written test yet, go to one of the traveling seminars. My friend just went to this one http://www.aviationseminars.com/ for his private, and was overjoyed.
I went to a different one for my Instrument and will do one for the Commercial - without hesitation. Best $300 I ever spent; aviation wise. One weekend and it's done. They even had the test setup for Sunday for whoever wanted to take it right then.
I did the Sat/Sun IFR seminar from a different place. They came right to the Holiday Inn Select, here in town. I scheduled the computerized test for the following Monday. Got 85%. The coolest thing is, at least the one I took, allows you to sit through the course again free whenever you want. He used a good example of - just prior to your checkride. If he happens to be in one of the nearby states when I go to take the checkride, I will definitely sit through it again. Regardless, it is so nice to have the written out of the way. This is the one I took. Currently, he is only doing IFR. www.aviationtestprep.com

[rrrr]

I'm sure that, like sleek-jet says, he just doesn't want to overload Mark yet. BUT, if you try doing accelerated stalls without any rudder input, you might end up with a little spin training thrown in when you wern't expecting it, LOL!!
Heheh, that's what I was thinking too. :220v: :220v:

[jackpunx]

Not to worry about it yet?
I would suggest looking for a new instructor.
I have been "stepping on the ball" the whole time.. He just didn’t want to concern me with leading my turns with it at the beginning. On all my accents and descents or crabs I have been using the rudder..
I flew this morning and asked about it.. He said I was doing it already and the ball has been staying in the middle..
Today was pretty windy.. 30+kts .. We did the flight pattern exercise(fly outside the rectangle).. I had to use the rudder on that.. But for the most part.. the plane keeps itself pretty straight. (Other than crab crawling)
Tomorrow we'll work on a couple more maneuvers and then on to stalls. He said we'll concentrate on it then.. but for now I’m doing really well.
He was flying into the wind.. We dropped the flaps and flew the plane a 16kts.. Kinda wild

[jackpunx]

I'm sure that, like sleek-jet says, he just doesn't want to overload Mark yet. BUT, if you try doing accelerated stalls without any rudder input, you might end up with a little spin training thrown in when you wern't expecting it, LOL!! :rollside: (most likely, the instructor has been working the rudders for you). Don't worry, coordinated flight comes pretty easy once you start doing it, it's not some major concept to learn. I'm sure your instructor is fine. Best of luck, and rememeber to have fun too!!
thanks.. im having a blast so far.. :rollside:

[jackpunx]

If anyone is looking to learn how to fly my business partner is an instructor and also owns his own piper...he actually flys between corona and fullerton to work..lucky devil... great guy and very reasonable.... PM me if you are interested or email him direct at kenny@stage-tech.com
PS mark good luck Bro!
Thanks Charley

[jackpunx]

Yup. Good advice. And in my opinion, even better advice, if you haven't taken your written test yet, go to one of the traveling seminars. My friend just went to this one http://www.aviationseminars.com/ for his private, and was overjoyed.
I went to a different one for my Instrument and will do one for the Commercial - without hesitation. Best $300 I ever spent; aviation wise. One weekend and it's done. They even had the test setup for Sunday for whoever wanted to take it right then.
I did the Sat/Sun IFR seminar from a different place. They came right to the Holiday Inn Select, here in town. I scheduled the computerized test for the following Monday. Got 85%. The coolest thing is, at least the one I took, allows you to sit through the course again free whenever you want. He used a good example of - just prior to your checkride. If he happens to be in one of the nearby states when I go to take the checkride, I will definitely sit through it again. Regardless, it is so nice to have the written out of the way. This is the one I took. Currently, he is only doing IFR. www.aviationtestprep.com
do you suggest I start this now? I have only less than 3hrs on my books..
I just orderd Sporty's private pilots training on DVD..

[Sleek-Jet]

I have been "stepping on the ball" the whole time.. He just didn’t want to concern me with leading my turns with it at the beginning. On all my accents and descents or crabs I have been using the rudder..
I flew this morning and asked about it.. He said I was doing it already and the ball has been staying in the middle..
Today was pretty windy.. 30+kts .. We did the flight pattern exercise(fly outside the rectangle).. I had to use the rudder on that.. But for the most part.. the plane keeps itself pretty straight. (Other than crab crawling)
Tomorrow we'll work on a couple more maneuvers and then on to stalls. He said we'll concentrate on it then.. but for now I’m doing really well.
He was flying into the wind.. We dropped the flaps and flew the plane a 16kts.. Kinda wild
If it blows hard enough... you can back up... :D
When's the next lesson???
And yes, get the medical as soon as possible. They are good for 2 years anyways, so what the heck.

[jackpunx]

[QUOTE=Sleek-Jet]If it blows hard enough... you can back up... :D
When's the next lesson???
QUOTE]
Tomorrow :D
Im trying to get 3 days a week.. but so far... Ive only been able to get two..

[Sleek-Jet]

[QUOTE=Sleek-Jet]If it blows hard enough... you can back up... :D
When's the next lesson???
QUOTE]
Tomorrow :D
Im trying to get 3 days a week.. but so far... Ive only been able to get two..
Cool... I miss-read the previous quote on the written (not the medical, but get one of those if you haven't, can't solo without one). The weekend cram courses are a good way to go to get the written out of the way. Several of the places offer a pass gaurantee, but I wouldn't think you have to many things to worry about. The Sporty's DVD's will help and you can use all of that to prep for the check ride.

[Beer-30]

do you suggest I start this now? I have only less than 3hrs on my books..
I just orderd Sporty's private pilots training on DVD..
No, not yet. Just watch the DVDs a few times through. After you get your Medical, you will have 20 or so hours, I would assume. Once you have a good grasp on the theories and systems, it will make more since to you. Although I am sure one could go into one of these "cold", it is much easier if you are 50% or so there. My instructor has been a CFII for 25 years. He is a reader and doesn't really believe in these weekend courses. Don't let an instructor fool you. I learned more in that weekend than I would have learned reading all of the info myself. Getting the stress of the written out of the way has helped me immensely.

[Beer-30]

Beer 30... yeah, I don't like T-tails... :D Actually, that's a little more airplane than is practicle right now. I'm stearing towards 4-place fixed gear till the other guy builds a little more time.
Interested in a tweaked and dialed 182?

[Sleek-Jet]

Interested in a tweaked and dialed 182?
Stop....
.... what year??? :D

[jackpunx]

Its in German .. but pretty funny (http://www.hackermovies.de/...s/HM_RacingBeats.wmv )

[Sleek-Jet]

Its in German .. but pretty funny (http://www.hackermovies.de/...s/HM_RacingBeats.wmv )
... it doesn't work either. :rolleyes: Looks like part of the address is missing...

[Mardonzi]

Sleek,, should we confuse the lad with the meaning of a "stabilator"??
On a serious note,, get the written out of the way soon. I'd suggest going back over the dvd course for the module you are training in as you are doing it also. A hands on approach to what you are learning for the written will definately help down the road.
You can also take the Gleim CD-Rom study course. I did that for my commercial and ended up with a 98% after studying the CD for about 3 weeks.

[Sleek-Jet]

Sleek,, should we confuse the lad with the meaning of a "stabilator"??
yeah, and "Anti-servo" tabs... :D
Nah... sounds like JP is kickin' ass. He's asking the right questions anyway.

[Mardonzi]

yeah, and "Anti-servo" tabs... :D
Nah... sounds like JP is kickin' ass. He's asking the right questions anyway.
Both him and K26,,,,
When I did my private, I made the mistake of stopping and starting. Lost CFI's that way and had to do a bunch of retraining to show what I knew.
Hitting it like they are will save bunches of money for Avgas and beer,,,

[Beer-30]

Stop....
.... what year??? :D
1961 / 2003. Complete rebuild. Originally O-470, 230HP. Now IO-470 ported, polished, flowed - 293HP. 3-Blade Scimitar. Pre-oiler, finewire plugs, EDM800 monitor with fuel flow / linked to GNS-530.
Garmin 340 audio panel, dual panel-mounted Bose-X headsets. KX-155 2nd com/nav.
New upholstery. Stripped to metal and painted. Gap seals. New windows.
Pics coming up.

[Sleek-Jet]

1961 / 2003. Complete rebuild. Originally O-470, 230HP. Now IO-470 ported, polished, flowed - 293HP. 3-Blade Scimitar. Pre-oiler, finewire plugs, EDM800 monitor with fuel flow / linked to GNS-530.
Garmin 340 audio panel, dual panel-mounted Bose-X headsets. KX-155 2nd com/nav.
New upholstery. Stripped to metal and painted. Gap seals. New windows.
Pics coming up.
Man... that is exactly where I was going with my '59, except I was going to do the Texas Skyways 0-520 conversion.
Long range tanks???

[Beer-30]

55 gal. Don't know if you would call that long-range or not. Went to WY with it. Could've gone non-stop, but would have been 6 hours. 'bout 7 gal/hr at 15,500. 155 true.
It was a flying plane before we tore it down, here is the initial tear down:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2433012sm.JPG
Then, in the middle, before the stripes:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2433001sm.JPG
And the final version. Don't have any pics of the panel right now.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/243312small.JPG

[AirtimeLavey]

Cool thread - please keep us updated. I'd like to be doing this too, but looks like at least another year before I get the chance. :cry:
I take the kids down to Cable airport freq. for breakfast on the w/e's, and talk about how cool it will be to fly somewhere for breakfast, ski trips, Havasu, etc. :cool:
Thinking I'd like to eventually get into a Bonanza or something along those lines.
Good luck.

[Sleek-Jet]

55 gal. Don't know if you would call that long-range or not. Went to WY with it. Could've gone non-stop, but would have been 6 hours. 'bout 7 gal/hr at 15,500. 155 true.
It was a flying plane before we tore it down, here is the initial tear down:
55 gal was the standard tanks on those airplanes with 50 usable. If you can find the long range tanks, they were 65. I always figured my 59 was a comfortable 4 hour airplane, anymore than that and I wanted to be really close to where I was going. I was going to put the tip tanks in when we went with the bigger engine.
Nice looking bird though. How soon are you looking to sell it?? I can tell you right now that I'm a good 6 to 9 months away from getting real serious about anything. I've got a couple bills I need to get paid off.

[jackpunx]

55 gal was the standard tanks on those airplanes with 50 usable. If you can find the long range tanks, they were 65. I always figured my 59 was a comfortable 4 hour airplane, anymore than that and I wanted to be really close to where I was going. I was going to put the tip tanks in when we went with the bigger engine.
Nice looking bird though. How soon are you looking to sell it?? I can tell you right now that I'm a good 6 to 9 months away from getting real serious about anything. I've got a couple bills I need to get paid off.
How long before I could get insured on something like this?

[jackpunx]

Cool thread - please keep us updated. I'd like to be doing this too, but looks like at least another year before I get the chance. :cry:
I take the kids down to Cable airport freq. for breakfast on the w/e's, and talk about how cool it will be to fly somewhere for breakfast, ski trips, Havasu, etc. :cool:
Thinking I'd like to eventually get into a Bonanza or something along those lines.
Good luck.
Speaking for K26 and myself .. we are having a blast.. :) and BSin with these other guys that have lots of experience with this has been a great help.. so come on and join the club!
I guarantee that if you go for one of those 49.00 intro rides.. (You fly the plane).. You will find yourself doing it sooner than later :p
Good luck.. and keep us posted
Mark

[Sleek-Jet]

How long before I could get insured on something like this?
You should have no problem with a private pilot. You'll have to pay a little more until you get some hours, but once you get a couple hundred hours and an instrument rating, you'll be paying less than you do for the boat.
My last insurance premium on my '59 was 1100.00. That was 60,000 hull value and 1 million/300,000 per liability. I could have gotten 1 million/smooth liability for an extra couple hundred a year.
I got all my financing and insurance through AOPA. If you have a medical, you can join. www.aopa.org . Saved me about 10% annually on the insurance.

[jackpunx]

You should have no problem with a private pilot. You'll have to pay a little more until you get some hours, but once you get a couple hundred hours and an instrument rating, you'll be paying less than you do for the boat.
My last insurance premium on my '59 was 1100.00. That was 60,000 hull value and 1 million/300,000 per liability. I could have gotten 1 million/smooth liability for an extra couple hundred a year.
I got all my financing and insurance through AOPA. If you have a medical, you can join. www.aopa.org . Saved me about 10% annually on the insurance.
so the answer here is .. fly for a year.. get rated and then start thinking about an HP or larger plane?
My goal is to get into a C206 or 210.. or something that seats 5 or 6 People, holds a little more weight and has a little longer range than a 172.. My thinking is.. If I fly my family to the river.. the luggage will over load us..
how do you suggest I get to my goal and how long will that take?
or do you have any other suggestions on planes
I would like to rent for a while before I buy.

[Sleek-Jet]

so the answer here is .. fly for a year.. get rated and then start thinking about an HP or larger plane?
My goal is to get into a C206 or 210.. or something that seats 5 or 6 People, holds a little more weight and has a little longer range than a 172.. My thinking is.. If I fly my family to the river.. the luggage will over load us..
how do you suggest I get to my goal and how long will that take?
or do you have any other suggestions on planes
I would like to rent for a while before I buy.
Personally, I think you'd be pretty happy with a 182. Insurance isn't a problem, since they have fixed gear, and they will haul just about anything you can get in the cabin. And it's hard to load them outside the CG envelope, short of putting anvil in the back.
I don't know how many people your planning on taking either. A 210 is barely a 6 place airplane. Take a look at the back two seats, and it had better be small adults or kids you're stuffing back there. Insurance and maintenance double when you start folding the gear. So your operating expenses go up as well.
A 206 is an honest 6 place, and has the cargo doors which makes getting in and out of the back that much easier. Number of seats plays a part in the insurance game as well, so expect to pay more for the
If you're not hauling any more than 4 people, I'd stick with a 182. They are cheaper to buy and cost less to insure. The 182 and 206 are about the same speeds. And comming from So-cal to Parker or Havasu, you'll only see about a 20 minute time disadvantage versus the 210, at about half the operating cost.
Total time in the airplane type plays a big role in insurance, almost as much as total time PIC. After a few years and a little time in the airplane, insurance will lower on anything you buy. Insurance companies like to see that instrument rating as well. And if you step up to something like a 210, it's almost mandatory.
As far as renting, most places require either 200 hour TT or a couple hour checkout (usually 5 or so) to rent any hi-performance airplanes (182's, Piper Dakota's, ect..). You might try getting checked out in a 182 and taking it on a couple overnight trips somewhere to see if it will fit your needs.
If you want to own an airplane, I would look at picking up a 182 after you get your PP ticket and using that airplane to get your instrument rating.
Getting your instrument should take another 40 hours or so, and you don't have to fly with an instructor all the time. Any rated pilot can fly as a safety pilot while you practice under the hood. You just can't fly an actual IFR until you get your ticket, without and instructor.

[Beer-30]

My goal is to get into a C206 or 210.. or something that seats 5 or 6 People, holds a little more weight and has a little longer range than a 172.. My thinking is.. If I fly my family to the river.. the luggage will over load us..
how do you suggest I get to my goal and how long will that take?
or do you have any other suggestions on planes
I would like to rent for a while before I buy.
My suggestion, from personal experience and hours of studying planes, is get one of these:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2433small.jpg
This is our other bird; a 1978 Piper Turbo Lance II. AKA; PA-32RT-300T. Some don't like T-tail airplanes, due to no propwash across the elevator. The elevator, or stabilator in this instance, only becomes active with airspeed. I, personally, have not missed the propwash/tail thing at all.
These are known as the suburbans of the sky. This is our long-range plane, we fly from CA to WY about 12 times/year along with several other places. I have personally piloted this plane over 450 hours. We have put on every speed-mod available and this new motor is up from 300HP to 398HP. Even with the old motor, I had 5 adults, luggage and full fuel from Visalia, CA to Ogden, UT. Rate of climb was anemic, but it was a solid trooper. On the return trip, I had the same load. But, it was 95 degrees in Ogden, which made the density altitude around 9300 feet. I was about 300lbs OVER the gross weight of 3600lbs. I only got 200ft/min climbing out over the Great Salt Lake, but it got us there without complaining.
Now, I don't do this scenario often, but it is nice to know it will do it. Last year, my folks put a Polaris 90 quad in the back and flew it to WY. Very spacious cabin. Very comfortable. We true out about 186 knots at 17,500 - 78%HP.
My buddy / insurance guy / just bought an A36TC turbocharged Bonanza with tip-tanks. One of my favorite planes. It can still handle 4 peeps and small luggage, but the cabin is tight. Nothing is free. A smaller cabin equals more speed. Stock, it is still 5-10kts faster than a modified Lance. However, two full grown men will touch shoulders in the front seats. Not so in the Lance. We are so spoiled with the room inside, that we don't miss the speed.
Also, you would pay for the Beech name. Believe me, I would not mind having an A or B36TC myself, I am not knocking them. In fact, that same friend has me on his insurance and wants me to borrow the plane any time I want to. I haven't flown it yet, but I will soon. But here is the dealio. A well equipped, mid-time engine lance will be in the neighborhood of $120-150K. A similar Bonanza or 210 will be around $180-225K. The money saved will buy a lot of fuel and you have the roomier cabin and larger payload.
They make a fixed gear version of the Lance, called the Cherokee-Six. They are only around $10-20K cheaper, and not worth losing the speed - in my opinion. I am a little biased, though.

[Sleek-Jet]

Pipers suck.... :D

[Sleek-Jet]

OK... not really. :D
Nothing wrong with a straight leg Lance/Cherokee 6, or maybe a Cherokee 235. In fact, I think the old Cherokee 6/260 has the most usefull load of just about any single engine airplane, something like 1400lbs or so. Used to be you could pick up a nice Piper for 10 - 15 grand less than a comparable Cess-pool, but those days are gone I think.
I'm not a fan of folding gear... to many headaches.

[Beer-30]

Nice looking bird though. How soon are you looking to sell it?? I can tell you right now that I'm a good 6 to 9 months away from getting real serious about anything. I've got a couple bills I need to get paid off.
We are just kinda kicking around the selling part. I have a cousin that is looking at getting into flying, so he is toying with the idea of buying it. It is nice having both planes, but we really only use the Lance, so it is kind of redundant. The 1800ft/min no-flap initial climb is fun, though!
We had Lycon in Visalia do the motor(s) (the Lance, too). It is nice having them local. Got to watch the whole build of the motor(s). On the Lance, at their suggestion, they got us a Lycoming factory-reman. That got us all new turbo, wastegate, exhaust, injector system, etc. Then, they tore it apart and re-balanced everything, touched up the cam, ported polished and flowed the cylinders and changed pistons.
On the 182, they built it from scratch using the original case, crank, and rods. Did their own pistons and cam, and their usual cylinder work. The Lance did 398 on their dyno, and the 182 did 293. No STCs to deal with, other than the injection for the 470 and the 3-blade prop(s).

[Sleek-Jet]

On the 182, they built it from scratch using the original case, crank, and rods. Did their own pistons and cam, and their usual cylinder work. The Lance did 398 on their dyno, and the 182 did 293. No STCs to deal with, other than the injection for the 470 and the 3-blade prop(s).
Who's STC did you use for the IO-470??? Or did you do a one time deal???

[Beer-30]

OK... not really. :D
Nothing wrong with a straight leg Lance, or maybe a Cherokee 235. Used to be you could pick up a nice Piper for 10 grand less than a comparable Cess-pool, but those days are gone I think.
I'm not a fan of folding gear... to many headaches.
Now, you can barely beg me to get into a fixed gear. That is the one thing I don't like about the 182 is dragging those damn feet every where you go!
I have seen too many Cessna gear issues. I like to watch the grass-hopper legs fold up, but all too often, they don't unfold.
I just had a gear issue in the Lance, going into North Las Vegas. I had the cousin that wants to buy the 182 and his wife with me. I get vectored around and on the extended base leg, I flip the switch down. Nothing. No "In-Transit / Gear Unsafe" light, nothing. No "three-green". Checked the dash lights, they were off so it wasn't just that the gear lights were dim. I still was carrying the extra 25kts that I normally lose with the gear down. I asked for a fly-by and the tower said I was still slick underneath. Damn. I asked to get vectored to an area out of their way to fly some circles and look at stuff. Found the 5amp "gear light" breaker out. Wouldn't go back in. No electrics to the gear.
Luckily - and another reason we bought this particular plane - the gear take electrics to hold it up, not put it down. Even if you threw the battery out the window, the gear will come down eventually as pressure bleeds off. So, I did the emerg proceedure - slow to 103kias or less (I did 90) and press down on the gear pressure release valve. Viola! I felt the gear come down and lock. One more fly by request, to which they said the gear looked good in their eyes. Still no green lights, but they locked because the landing was uneventful.
Ended up being a frayed wire that goes to a switch on the nose gear. It was up along the cowl, where I couldn't see during a ground inspection afterwards. I made sure and topped off the tanks and took off for home. The gear couldn't come up, so I was a 182 the whole ride home.

[Beer-30]

Who's STC did you use for the IO-470??? Or did you do a one time deal???
I don't know the name of it or the number. Lycon did it. Oddly enough, it is actually a kit that puts a Lycoming injection system on a Continental. No more carb icing and each fuel nozzle is tuned for that cylinder. Took awhile to do that.

[jackpunx]

hhhhmm well I guess I'll either need a partner.. Or I'll have to get a 172/182.. or something in that range..
my concern is not so much that I'll be carrying six people.. its more of the .. I'll be carrying 4 with luggage..
to cut fuel in half is not all that attractive.. but it is what it is..
Oh .. my budget is less than 80k unless I sell one of the boats...
Not in a huge rush right now.. but I Imagine in the next year I'll be ready. Unless someone wanted to trade my for my boat :p

[Sleek-Jet]

I have seen too many Cessna gear issues. I like to watch the grass-hopper legs fold up, but all too often, they don't unfold.
This brings up another point on airplane ownership... maintenence... don't skimp. People really like to find the cheapest and quickest shop on the field to do their work. That's fine with a 172 or Cherokee (to a point), but you start getting into something Turbo-charged, or that has retract, and you're in for an expensive wake up call.
Cessna gear is just as reliable as any other make, but you have to have someone willing to go the extra mile to make sure everything is properly rigged. I've got a couple mechanics that all they work on is Cessna stuff (for the most part). The first thing they do when they get a new 210 in the shop is put it on stands and swing the gear. After a couple days work, they have it all working properly. It's amazing the work some shops let go out the door. The newer style (1978 and up) Cessna retract system is more tollerant of sloppy maint.
But the point of this little diatribe is that you want to spend your money where it counts, and the maint. shop should be at the top of the list.

[Sleek-Jet]

hhhhmm well I guess I'll either need a partner.. Or I'll have to get a 172/182.. or something in that range..
my concern is not so much that I'll be carrying six people.. its more of the .. I'll be carrying 4 with luggage..
to cut fuel in half is not all that attractive.. but it is what it is..
Oh .. my budget is less than 80k unless I sell one of the boats...
Not in a huge rush right now.. but I Imagine in the next year I'll be ready. Unless someone wanted to trade my for my boat :p
For that money, I'd look at a 182 or Cherokee 235... both will haul 4 full seats and all the baggage you can put in them, and lots of gas, no problem.

[jackpunx]

My suggestion, from personal experience and hours of studying planes, is get one of these:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2433small.jpg
This is our other bird; a 1978 Piper Turbo Lance II. AKA; PA-32RT-300T. Some don't like T-tail airplanes, due to no propwash across the elevator. The elevator, or stabilator in this instance, only becomes active with airspeed. I, personally, have not missed the propwash/tail thing at all.
These are known as the suburbans of the sky. This is our long-range plane, we fly from CA to WY about 12 times/year along with several other places. I have personally piloted this plane over 450 hours. We have put on every speed-mod available and this new motor is up from 300HP to 398HP. Even with the old motor, I had 5 adults, luggage and full fuel from Visalia, CA to Ogden, UT. Rate of climb was anemic, but it was a solid trooper. On the return trip, I had the same load. But, it was 95 degrees in Ogden, which made the density altitude around 9300 feet. I was about 300lbs OVER the gross weight of 3600lbs. I only got 200ft/min climbing out over the Great Salt Lake, but it got us there without complaining.
Now, I don't do this scenario often, but it is nice to know it will do it. Last year, my folks put a Polaris 90 quad in the back and flew it to WY. Very spacious cabin. Very comfortable. We true out about 186 knots at 17,500 - 78%HP.
My buddy / insurance guy / just bought an A36TC turbocharged Bonanza with tip-tanks. One of my favorite planes. It can still handle 4 peeps and small luggage, but the cabin is tight. Nothing is free. A smaller cabin equals more speed. Stock, it is still 5-10kts faster than a modified Lance. However, two full grown men will touch shoulders in the front seats. Not so in the Lance. We are so spoiled with the room inside, that we don't miss the speed.
Also, you would pay for the Beech name. Believe me, I would not mind having an A or B36TC myself, I am not knocking them. In fact, that same friend has me on his insurance and wants me to borrow the plane any time I want to. I haven't flown it yet, but I will soon. But here is the dealio. A well equipped, mid-time engine lance will be in the neighborhood of $120-150K. A similar Bonanza or 210 will be around $180-225K. The money saved will buy a lot of fuel and you have the roomier cabin and larger payload.
They make a fixed gear version of the Lance, called the Cherokee-Six. They are only around $10-20K cheaper, and not worth losing the speed - in my opinion. I am a little biased, though.
Very nice plane.. very roomy .. I saw them for from 100k-150... I could probably pull that off.... If endorced.. are they easy to rent?
How much do you guys spend on maint a year?

[AirtimeLavey]

Speaking for K26 and myself .. we are having a blast.. :) and BSin with these other guys that have lots of experience with this has been a great help.. so come on and join the club!
I guarantee that if you go for one of those 49.00 intro rides.. (You fly the plane).. You will find yourself doing it sooner than later :p
Good luck.. and keep us posted
Mark
Soon, but not right now. About to get married in June, and still working on a damn fixer I bought for some reason. :hammerhea
I did actually start lessons about 20 years ago. Got about 13 hours, and the instructor said I was close to being ready to solo. Glad he thought so, cause I didn't. I think he was more into logging time, than really teaching. Then I went and got a girlfriend, and somehow didn't seem to have any more time or money to spend on myself. :hammerhea
Flew hang-gliders (only low altitude) a few times, and real gliders as well. Almost joined a flying club in Hemet for the gliders. That was cool. Less focus on the engine, and more just enjoying the flying. All that started after parachuting a couple of times and wanting more control over where I landed. :D

[Beer-30]

This brings up another point on airplane ownership... maintenence... don't skimp. People really like to find the cheapest and quickest shop on the field to do their work. That's fine with a 172 or Cherokee (to a point), but you start getting into something Turbo-charged, or that has retract, and you're in for an expensive wake up call.
Cessna gear is just as reliable as any other make, but you have to have someone willing to go the extra mile to make sure everything is properly rigged. I've got a couple mechanics that all they work on is Cessna stuff (for the most part). The first thing they do when they get a new 210 in the shop is put it on stands and swing the gear. After a couple days work, they have it all working properly. It's amazing the work some shops let go out the door. The newer style (1978 and up) Cessna retract system is more tollerant of sloppy maint.
But the point of this little diatribe is that you want to spend your money where it counts, and the maint. shop should be at the top of the list.
Absolutely. Every annual we rebuild something. Last year, it was the main-gear system. Struts, springs, switches, hoses, brakes. This year - obviously - will be the nose gear. Probably the whole wiring harness for same. I noticed the wires down by the gear are getting brittle. I am sure we will do the pump and all the internal hoses and valves, also. It's about that time - 27 years old and all.

[AirtimeLavey]

Nice plane, Beer-30. My Dad flew a "t-tail" in the AF - C141.
I like the looks of it the "t tail", but hadn't thought much about a degredation of flight controls. :idea:

[Sleek-Jet]

Absolutely. Every annual we rebuild something. Last year, it was the main-gear system. Struts, springs, switches, hoses, brakes. This year - obviously - will be the nose gear. Probably the whole wiring harness for same. I noticed the wires down by the gear are getting brittle. I am sure we will do the pump and all the internal hoses and valves, also. It's about that time - 27 years old and all.
Don't you just love airplanes... :D
I dropped 5 large on my first annual, and most of the stuff was because of what was done on the last annual. I wasn't to happy, but gladly paid the bill, knowing the airplane was in better shape comming out of the shop.

[Beer-30]

Very nice plane.. very roomy .. I saw them for from 100k-150... I could probably pull that off.... If endorced.. are they easy to rent?
How much do you guys spend on maint a year?
An annual is going to be $2800-3000. Any additions are up from there. Insurance is pricey on anything HP/Complex. Ours shot up when Kennedy corkscrewed into the drink in the straight-tail version (PA-32R instead of PA-32RT). Once us two pilots had 300hrs in type, they dropped it significantly. My IFR rating should drop it some more. Then Commercial.
I am sure there is one or two for rent. Rare, though.

[Beer-30]

Nice plane, Beer-30. My Dad flew a "t-tail" in the AF - C141.
I like the looks of it the "t tail", but hadn't thought much about a degredation of flight controls. :idea:
I was concerned when transitioning, but after you realized that the airflow just takes place of the propwash, it flys the same. Kinda neat, actually - pull off some throttle and it doesn't nose down till speed bleeds off. I find it smoother and better for passenger comfort. The only real problem I see is if one tried to soft-field it much. No way to keep the nose light during taxi.
With the speed mods, short-field is not an issue. I think the shortest I have been on/off was 2350' at Oceano. The tricky thing about planes of this size is keeping in mind that you can fly into an airport that you can't take off from. It will land in 1500' or so, but it takes all of 1800+ to get out.

[AirtimeLavey]

The tricky thing about planes of this size is keeping in mind that you can fly into an airport that you can't take off from. It will land in 1500' or so, but it takes all of 1800+ to get out.
:2purples: That would suck!

[jackpunx]

An annual is going to be $2800-3000. Any additions are up from there. Insurance is pricey on anything HP/Complex. Ours shot up when Kennedy corkscrewed into the drink in the straight-tail version (PA-32R instead of PA-32RT). Once us two pilots had 300hrs in type, they dropped it significantly. My IFR rating should drop it some more. Then Commercial.
I am sure there is one or two for rent. Rare, though.
what do they do on an annual?
Inspect the plane and give you a list of things to fix in order to pass the annual inspection?
sorry for my ignorance.. but this is huge with reguards to a annual budget and if it makes sense to even own a plane.

[rrrr]

My suggestion, from personal experience and hours of studying planes, is get one of these:
This is our other bird; a 1978 Piper Turbo Lance II. AKA; PA-32RT-300T.
I would love to have a T Lance. Perfect for hauling anything and everything.

[Sleek-Jet]

what do they do on an annual?
Inspect the plane and give you a list of things to fix in order to pass the annual inspection?
sorry for my ignorance.. but this is huge with reguards to a annual budget and if it makes sense to even own a plane.
Pretty much.
A basic annual includes:
Engine:
Run up to warm the engine and make sure everything is working like it should.
Cleaning and gapping spark plugs (in this case 12)
Compression check (leak down)
Checking timming
Oil change
Propellar inspection
General inspection and repair of the engine and all the accesories (belts, fluid hozes, and ducting)
Turbo/Exhaust inspection
and finally a good shop will wash the engine and fire wall down.
Airframe:
Open up all the inspection panels and visually inspect the internals of the airframe. (this takes a while)
Inspect all the control's and cables
Inspect landing gear and mechanisms (i.e. they put it on stands and swing the gear)
Inspect all fluid lines
Check all the instruments on the run-up
Check all of the lights
Generally inspect the condition of the airframe.
There's always going to be something that needs fixed or replaced (brake linnings, tires, belts, ect...) along with an AD or two that needs to be done.
2300 for a complex airplane is a pretty good deal for a basic annual. Of course any parts you would need would be on top of that.

[jackpunx]

another question
with a plane like this or even a 182
dont I need a High performance and complex aircraft rating?
how do I get that?
Im going to talk to my instructor today about all this..
He called me this morning and asked if I could change my appt today so that we could fly another plane.. He said that it was not as automated as what we have been flying.. (manual flaps and 150 hp VS 180 )... I asked him if it was safe...He said "yes".. so.. I got a conference call today so.. I'll be flying that one today.. :)

[Sleek-Jet]

another question
with a plane like this or even a 182
dont I need a High performance and complex aircraft rating?
how do I get that?
Im going to talk to my instructor today about all this..
He called me this morning and asked if I could change my appt today so that we could fly another plane.. He said that it was not as automated as what we have been flying.. (manual flaps and 150 hp VS 180 )... I asked him if it was safe...He said "yes".. so.. I got a conference call today so.. I'll be flying that one today.. :)
You don't need a specific rating, but you do have to have an endorsment in your log book for anything over 200 hp and constant speed prop (that's high performance). I don't think there is anything in the regs specifically requiring a complex sign-off, but your insurance company will require one. I guess you do, check my next post...
Yes, a 182 will require a high performance sign-off, but any instructor can do that.
Manual flaps rock... you'll like them.

[jackpunx]

just found a good read on the rating
http://www.avweb.com/news/airman/184264-1.html

[Sleek-Jet]

I also stand corrected on the complex endorsment, I guess you do need one. :D
e) Additional training required for operating complex airplanes.
(1) Except as provided in paragraph (e)(2) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of a complex airplane (an airplane that has a retractable landing gear, flaps, and a controllable pitch propeller; or, in the case of a seaplane, flaps and a controllable pitch propeller), unless the person has—
(i) Received and logged ground and flight training from an authorized instructor in a complex airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative of a complex airplane, and has been found proficient in the operation and systems of the airplane; and
(ii) Received a one-time endorsement in the pilot's logbook from an authorized instructor who certifies the person is proficient to operate a complex airplane.
(2) The training and endorsement required by paragraph (e)(1) of this section is not required if the person has logged flight time as pilot in command of a complex airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative of a complex airplane prior to August 4, 1997.
(f) Additional training required for operating high-performance airplanes.
(1) Except as provided in paragraph (f)(2) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of a high-performance airplane (an airplane with an engine of more than 200 horsepower), unless the person has—
(i) Received and logged ground and flight training from an authorized instructor in a high-performance airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative of a high-performance airplane, and has been found proficient in the operation and systems of the airplane; and
(ii) Received a one-time endorsement in the pilot's logbook from an authorized instructor who certifies the person is proficient to operate a high-performance airplane.
(2) The training and endorsement required by paragraph (f)(1) of this section is not required if the person has logged flight time as pilot in command of a high-performance airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative of a high-performance airplane prior to August 4, 1997.

[Beer-30]

I would love to have a T Lance. Perfect for hauling anything and everything.
......and we do.

[Beer-30]

182, 206 time is HP only. HP includes the variable prop. Complex throws the gear in.

[nobling]

just found a good read on the rating
http://www.avweb.com/news/airman/184264-1.html
JP, ive just finished reading this thread its all killer info, and after yesterdays first trip in the friendly skys Im hooked, selling boat, sandcar, motorhome, ect.....Thanks for the instructor, the dudes my kind of people.Cant wait for monday!! :)
Oh what nite is study nite?????? :cry:

[Sleek-Jet]

JP, ive just finished reading this thread its all killer info, and after yesterdays first trip in the friendly skys Im hooked, selling boat, sandcar, motorhome, ect.....Thanks for the instructor, the dudes my kind of people.Cant wait for monday!! :)
Oh what nite is study nite?????? :cry:
I'd keep the Boat and just fly to it... :D
Good luck on the rating. If you have any questions, let us know.

[jackpunx]

JP, ive just finished reading this thread its all killer info, and after yesterdays first trip in the friendly skys Im hooked, selling boat, sandcar, motorhome, ect.....Thanks for the instructor, the dudes my kind of people.Cant wait for monday!! :)
Oh what nite is study nite?????? :cry:
LOL>>>
Sleek..
He went on his first flight yesterday.. Got him strung out like a research monkey :p
Hooked him up with my instructor so now we can study together :)
NB,
Come over tonight.. Your wife is having that party and mine is going to it.. if she doesn’t have you working.. just bring the kids down and we'll hang and study a little bit..
Welcome to the club!
Kachina 26 is soloing and getting ready for his check out..we have to keep up with him :p
Yesterday We did landing patterns.. What a blast!..I was actually taking off flying the pattern and landing myself..
Im flying again tomorrow.. I thought I was hooked before.. Now I cant think about anything else :rollside:
we"ll be flying by summer time

[jackpunx]

I'd keep the Boat and just fly to it... :D
Good luck on the rating. If you have any questions, let us know.
After talking to my CFI.. He said its only a few hrs to get the HP/complex rating..
but its harder to find a 182 type of plane to rent..
I'll have better luck renting a twin (they have one at the school and he's buying one that he'll rent to me)
Carries more weight, more range and said that with the right training its safer...
they have a Beechcraft-Duchess BE-76 its 180 an hr
and they have a PA-28R-200 that is 106 an hr..
Im not going to worry to much about it now ..
but
whats the deal on the PA-28R-200?
I know think it is 200hp and has retractable gear..
so I need the complex and HP rating.. I assume its faster and has more range.. does it cary more weight as well?

[Kachina26]

I like the last one, but there are plenty of funny ones.
Though I Fly Through the Valley of Death ..I Shall Fear No Evil. For I am at 80,000 Feet and Climbing!
(Sign over the entrance to the old SR-71 operating base Kadena , Japan ).
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You've never been lost until you've been lost at Mach 3.
(Paul F. Crickmore -test pilot)
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The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.
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Blue water Navy truism:
There are more planes in the ocean than submarines in the sky.
(From an old carrier sailor)
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If the wings are traveling faster than the fuselage, it's probably a helicopter -- and therefore, unsafe
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When one engine fails on a twin-engine airplane you always have enough power left to get you to the scene of the crash.
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Without ammo, the USAF would be just another expensive flying club.
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What is the similarity between Air Traffic Controllers and pilots? If a pilot screws up, the pilot dies; If ATC screws up, ...the pilot dies.
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Never trade luck for skill.
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The three most common expressions (or famous last words) in aviation are: "Why is it doing that?", "Where are we?" and "Oh Sh**!"
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Weather forecasts are horoscopes with numbers.
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Progress in airline flying: now a flight attendant can get a pilot pregnant.
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Airspeed, altitude and brains. Two are always needed to successfully complete the flight.
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A smooth landing is mostly luck; two in a row is all luck; three in a row is prevarication.
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I remember when sex was safe and flying was dangerous.
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Mankind has a perfect record in aviation; we never left one up there!
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Flashlights are tubular metal containers kept in a flight bag for the purpose of storing dead batteries
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Flying the airplane is more important than radioing your plight to a person on the ground incapable of understanding or doing anything about it.
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When a flight is proceeding incredibly well, something was forgotten. Just remember, if you crash because of weather, your funeral will be held on a sunny day.
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Advice given to RAF pilots during WWII:
When a prang (crash) seems inevitable, endeavor to strike the softest, cheapest object in the vicinity as slow and gently as possible.
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The Piper Cub is the safest airplane in the world; ...it can just barely kill you.
(Attributed to Max Stanley, Northrop test pilot)
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A pilot who doesn't have any fear probably isn't flying his plane to its maximum.
(Jon McBride, astronaut)
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If you're faced with a forced landing, fly the thing as far into the crash as possible.
(Bob Hoover - renowned aerobatic and test pilot)
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If an airplane is still in one piece, don't cheat on it; ride the bastard down.
(Ernest K. Gann, author & aviator)
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Never fly in the same cockpit with someone braver than you.
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There is no reason to fly through a thunderstorm in peacetime.
(Sign over squadron ops desk at Davis-Monthan AFB, AZ, 1970).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
The 3 best things in life are: a good landing, a good orgasm, and, a good bowel movement. The night carrier landing is one of the few opportunities in life where you get to experience all three at the same time.
(Former Navy aircraft carrier pilot.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
If something hasn't broken on your helicopter, it's about to.
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Basic Flying Rules: Try to stay in the middle of the air. Do not go near the edges of it. The edges of the air can be recognized by the appearance of ground, buildings, sea, trees and interstellar space. It is much more difficult to fly there.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
You know that your landing gear is up and locked when it takes full power to taxi to the terminal.

[Sleek-Jet]

After talking to my CFI.. He said its only a few hrs to get the HP/complex rating..
but its harder to find a 182 type of plane to rent..
I'll have better luck renting a twin (they have one at the school and he's buying one that he'll rent to me)
Carries more weight, more range and said that with the right training its safer...
they have a Beechcraft-Duchess BE-76 its 180 an hr
and they have a PA-28R-200 that is 106 an hr..
Im not going to worry to much about it now ..
but
whats the deal on the PA-28R-200?
I know think it is 200hp and has retractable gear..
so I need the complex and HP rating.. I assume its faster and has more range.. does it cary more weight as well?
Twins... now you're talking real money... :D They are safer if you keep up on your training. That would be engine out procedures and training at least every 6 months or so, and keeping your instrument currancy up, and flying on a very reagular basis. I've got my Multi license, but wouldn't think about jumping in a twin and commiting aviation without a couple hours with an instructor. It's been to long since I flew one.
OK, about the Arrow (PA-28R)... the regs say HiPerf is more than 200hp, so you don't need an HP sign-off, just a complex sign-off. (Isn't this fun :D )
The reg also says "an engine of more than 200 horse power". That means you wouldn't need a HP sign off for the Duchess either since it runs 180/side. Total installed HP does not matter in the eyes of the regulations. (see, I told you it was fun :D )
And remember, the complex and HP endorsments are sign-offs, not ratings. The Private Pilot is a rating. Pretty much all an endorsment entails is sitting down with an instructor for an hour or so, and then flying the airplane a little with him, maybe one or two hours.
If your looking to either own or rent a complex airplane, building complex time would be more important after you get your private.

[AirtimeLavey]

I like the last one, but there are plenty of funny ones.
Though I Fly Through the Valley of Death ..I Shall Fear No Evil. For I am at 80,000 Feet and Climbing!
(Sign over the entrance to the old SR-71 operating base Kadena , Japan ).
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You've never been lost until you've been lost at Mach 3.
(Paul F. Crickmore -test pilot)
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The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.
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Blue water Navy truism:
There are more planes in the ocean than submarines in the sky.
(From an old carrier sailor)
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If the wings are traveling faster than the fuselage, it's probably a helicopter -- and therefore, unsafe
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When one engine fails on a twin-engine airplane you always have enough power left to get you to the scene of the crash.
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Without ammo, the USAF would be just another expensive flying club.
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What is the similarity between Air Traffic Controllers and pilots? If a pilot screws up, the pilot dies; If ATC screws up, ...the pilot dies.
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Never trade luck for skill.
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The three most common expressions (or famous last words) in aviation are: "Why is it doing that?", "Where are we?" and "Oh Sh**!"
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Weather forecasts are horoscopes with numbers.
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Progress in airline flying: now a flight attendant can get a pilot pregnant.
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Airspeed, altitude and brains. Two are always needed to successfully complete the flight.
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A smooth landing is mostly luck; two in a row is all luck; three in a row is prevarication.
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I remember when sex was safe and flying was dangerous.
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Mankind has a perfect record in aviation; we never left one up there!
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Flashlights are tubular metal containers kept in a flight bag for the purpose of storing dead batteries
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Flying the airplane is more important than radioing your plight to a person on the ground incapable of understanding or doing anything about it.
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When a flight is proceeding incredibly well, something was forgotten. Just remember, if you crash because of weather, your funeral will be held on a sunny day.
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Advice given to RAF pilots during WWII:
When a prang (crash) seems inevitable, endeavor to strike the softest, cheapest object in the vicinity as slow and gently as possible.
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The Piper Cub is the safest airplane in the world; ...it can just barely kill you.
(Attributed to Max Stanley, Northrop test pilot)
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A pilot who doesn't have any fear probably isn't flying his plane to its maximum.
(Jon McBride, astronaut)
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If you're faced with a forced landing, fly the thing as far into the crash as possible.
(Bob Hoover - renowned aerobatic and test pilot)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
If an airplane is still in one piece, don't cheat on it; ride the bastard down.
(Ernest K. Gann, author & aviator)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Never fly in the same cockpit with someone braver than you.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is no reason to fly through a thunderstorm in peacetime.
(Sign over squadron ops desk at Davis-Monthan AFB, AZ, 1970).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
The 3 best things in life are: a good landing, a good orgasm, and, a good bowel movement. The night carrier landing is one of the few opportunities in life where you get to experience all three at the same time.
(Former Navy aircraft carrier pilot.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
If something hasn't broken on your helicopter, it's about to.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Basic Flying Rules: Try to stay in the middle of the air. Do not go near the edges of it. The edges of the air can be recognized by the appearance of ground, buildings, sea, trees and interstellar space. It is much more difficult to fly there.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
You know that your landing gear is up and locked when it takes full power to taxi to the terminal.
Funny stuff, there. Hope to never realize any of it.

[jackpunx]

Twins... now you're talking real money... :D They are safer if you keep up on your training. That would be engine out procedures and training at least every 6 months or so, and keeping your instrument currancy up, and flying on a very reagular basis. I've got my Multi license, but wouldn't think about jumping in a twin and commiting aviation without a couple hours with an instructor. It's been to long since I flew one.
OK, about the Arrow (PA-28R)... the regs say HiPerf is more than 200hp, so you don't need an HP sign-off, just a complex sign-off. (Isn't this fun :D )
The reg also says "an engine of more than 200 horse power". That means you wouldn't need a HP sign off for the Duchess either since it runs 180/side. Total installed HP does not matter in the eyes of the regulations. (see, I told you it was fun :D )
And remember, the complex and HP endorsments are sign-offs, not ratings. The Private Pilot is a rating. Pretty much all an endorsment entails is sitting down with an instructor for an hour or so, and then flying the airplane a little with him, maybe one or two hours.
If your looking to either own or rent a complex airplane, building complex time would be more important after you get your private.
Good stuff :)
Not looking to deviate from my PP rating.. just trying to plan ahead a little.
My instructor said the HP/complex wont be an issue.. so I'll cross that bridge when I get to it..
I'll do the IFR and then think about multi when that is all done..
for now Im having a blast with the 172

[Sleek-Jet]

for now Im having a blast with the 172
That's the important part... :D :D

[Kachina26]

I've got my check ride scheduled for next Sunday at 10am! Keep your fingers crossed, say a prayer or whatever you can do for me :D I think I'm gonna puke :220v: The Checkride guy is having me plan a flight to Bakersfield, of course we'll divert long before then.

[Sleek-Jet]

I've got my check ride scheduled for next Sunday at 10am! Keep your fingers crossed, say a prayer or whatever you can do for me :D I think I'm gonna puke :220v: The Checkride guy is having me plan a flight to Bakersfield, of course we'll divert long before then.
Fock that, tell him your going to buy him a beer at Buck Owen's place... :D
You'll do fine. Let us know how it turns out.

[Kachina26]

Fock that, tell him your going to buy him a beer at Buck Owen's place... :D
You'll do fine. Let us know how it turns out.
I was gonna say I never heard of Buck, but google is a great thing. I remember that music, my parents listened to it. But I don't think I'll ask him that, after all 8 hours bottle to throttle. :cry:

[maxwedge]

Hey good luck on your check ride!. :rollside:
One of the most satisfiying things I've ever done is flying. Love it! Unfortunately it's been too expensive for me lately, and the owner of our local FBO is the possibly the biggest asshole I've ever met in my life. I don't really feel like he deserves another dime of my money (or anyone elses' for that matter), so I haven't been up in a few years. :cry:

[jackpunx]

I've got my check ride scheduled for next Sunday at 10am! Keep your fingers crossed, say a prayer or whatever you can do for me :D I think I'm gonna puke :220v: The Checkride guy is having me plan a flight to Bakersfield, of course we'll divert long before then.
Good luck.. You'll do fine (thats what they keep saying anyway..lol)
I found this last week.. kinda scared the hell out of me.. then I thought.. well.. if they can do it.. I can too..
http://www.dauntless-soft.com/checkrideforum/default.asp
I was supposed to fly friday .. but the weather locked us out..
I'll be back up today.. cant wait...

[Sleek-Jet]

I took my Private, Instrument, and Commercial check rides with an examiner that is both a lawyer and a judge... that was fun. :D
I had no hope of answering any questions in regards to the regs correctly. No matter what I said, he had another way of interpreting the rules. He always made the point of saying that as long as I didn't come up with some response out of left field, I would be fine, and I was. But it made for an interesting couple of hours.

[jackpunx]

I took my Private, Instrument, and Commercial check rides with an examiner that is both a lawyer and a judge... that was fun. :D
I had no hope of answering any questions in regards to the regs correctly. No matter what I said, he had another way of interpreting the rules. He always made the point of saying that as long as I didn't come up with some response out of left field, I would be fine, and I was. But it made for an interesting couple of hours.
what kind of stuff did he make you do?
tell us the story :)

[Sleek-Jet]

what kind of stuff did he make you do?
tell us the story :)
Everything in the PTS... :D
But as an example. On the Private check ride, my flight plan was down to El Paso. So, he asks me "Were is the highest point on the El Paso sectional?"... So, I flip the sectional over, find the highest quadrant altitude and open the chart up and say "Here it is, right there."
Well, if you look at the El Paso sectional, the gov'ment has teathered balloons all along the southern Boarder that reach to 15000 feet. Those are the highest obstructions, not the highest point. I opened up the map to one of the balloon locations. :rolleyes:
The highest point on the sectional is actually some mountain peak down in Mexico.

[SoCal_fun]

what kind of stuff did he make you do?
tell us the story :)
For my private, I was soooo nervous! I thought I was gonna faint on the walk around. I calmed down pretty quick once we got in the air though. The guy was by the book, and was very calm with me and we just performed all the required pts stuff just like the booklet says. I had gotten one of those little pts standards prep booklets and read it over and over a dozen times going through everything in my head.
The actual check ride was much easier than what I had imagined. I had praticed everything over and over in the air and was confident with it (thanks to a good instructor).
What was nerve racking was he was pretty quiet during the ride and then when we landed he told me to tie down the plane (c-172, N4922G, still remember it like it was yesterday) and meet him inside. Well, once I went inside, he had already gone back to do papaerwork and my instructors and buddies were there all asking "did you pass" and i had no idea! He hadn't said one way or the other... :rolleyes:
So I was nervous to say the least. I went back, sat down at the desk and had to ask him if I passed (of course, he says, what did you think.... :rolleyes: ). I was sooooooooooo relieved!!
He told me, and I always try to remember this and pass it along....
Your PPL, is a license to learn to fly!!! No go out and learn.
What he meant was, you have just learned the very basics of flight and the very basics of skills. Now use your license to go out and expand your training and skill and never stop learning and get lazy/complacent, because those guys are the ones you will be reading about in the crash reports!!
Long winded post, I know, but on more thing. It may sound morbid or whatever, but I subscribed to the aviation saftey reports (don't know if they still have them), and read all the accident reports I could. I wanted to know what had gone wrong on those accident flights so that I could recognize the problems eariler in my flight (if that same scenario were to occur). I believe it helped me out, as I can think of multiple occasions where I was in a situation that was dangerous or could become dangerous (bad weather, bad decisions, pressure) and I was able to recall some of those situations and what and why I didn't want to do, to keep from becoming a statistic.
Now, the Instrument rating was a whole nother thing alltogether, I'll tell that story sometime, but it had to be complete in two parts as it was difficult (for me anyway..).
Always remember, an accident is caused by a chain of events or decisions that have gone wrong. If you can keep youself aware of your situation (situational awareness) at all times and recognize one of those events on the chain and change it, you can avoid that accident. I know this to be true and have used it many times in my flying, even if it caused me embarrasment or to not make it to the destination that I wanted to get to.
Good luck guys!!!

[SMFRiverRat]

I opened up the map
:cry:
Ok Sleek....ya just failed...it's not a map! :rollside:
Just kidding ya

[Kachina26]

I found this last week.. kinda scared the hell out of me.. then I thought.. well.. if they can do it.. I can too..
http://www.dauntless-soft.com/checkrideforum/default.asp
Thanks for nothing! You got me all freaked out now! I don't know if I should even try yet, I only have 40 hours. My instructor says I'm ready and he hasn't had a student fail yet. The more I study, the more I realize what I don't know.
:cry:
OK, breathe..............

[SoCal_fun]

Thanks for nothing! You got me all freaked out now! I don't know if I should even try yet, I only have 40 hours. My instructor says I'm ready and he hasn't had a student fail yet. The more I study, the more I realize what I don't know.
:cry:
OK, breathe..............
See my eariler post. I only had 40.6 hours on my PPL checkride. I think many if not most instructors realize that the ppl is a license to learn. It doesn't mean you are the end all, be all, joe pilot. It just means you have got the basics down and are ready to begin honing your skills.
I'm sure you'll be fine. If not, you can try again in a couple weeks.

[SMFRiverRat]

Thanks for nothing! You got me all freaked out now! I don't know if I should even try yet, I only have 40 hours. My instructor says I'm ready and he hasn't had a student fail yet. The more I study, the more I realize what I don't know.
:cry:
OK, breathe..............
Relax amigo. I have a year and a half of hours and we are always looking something up or talking about something that has popped up. You will do fine.
I used to tell my students the day before a checkride to do the x- country plan the DE wants you to plan out, have a beer and go to bed. This time tomorrow you will have a new ticket.

[Sleek-Jet]

:cry:
Ok Sleek....ya just failed...it's not a map! :rollside:
Just kidding ya
Sorry... it's a chart... good thing we didn't get into scemantics, I still would have lost... :D

[olbiezer]

dont do what i did........took my private flying exam on april fools day........not a good thing to do examiner has way too much fun rubbing it in etc..........passed anyway lol

[jackpunx]

For my private, I was soooo nervous! I thought I was gonna faint on the walk around. I calmed down pretty quick once we got in the air though. The guy was by the book, and was very calm with me and we just performed all the required pts stuff just like the booklet says. I had gotten one of those little pts standards prep booklets and read it over and over a dozen times going through everything in my head.
The actual check ride was much easier than what I had imagined. I had praticed everything over and over in the air and was confident with it (thanks to a good instructor).
What was nerve racking was he was pretty quiet during the ride and then when we landed he told me to tie down the plane (c-172, N4922G, still remember it like it was yesterday) and meet him inside. Well, once I went inside, he had already gone back to do papaerwork and my instructors and buddies were there all asking "did you pass" and i had no idea! He hadn't said one way or the other... :rolleyes:
So I was nervous to say the least. I went back, sat down at the desk and had to ask him if I passed (of course, he says, what did you think.... :rolleyes: ). I was sooooooooooo relieved!!
He told me, and I always try to remember this and pass it along....
Your PPL, is a license to learn to fly!!! No go out and learn.
What he meant was, you have just learned the very basics of flight and the very basics of skills. Now use your license to go out and expand your training and skill and never stop learning and get lazy/complacent, because those guys are the ones you will be reading about in the crash reports!!
Long winded post, I know, but on more thing. It may sound morbid or whatever, but I subscribed to the aviation saftey reports (don't know if they still have them), and read all the accident reports I could. I wanted to know what had gone wrong on those accident flights so that I could recognize the problems eariler in my flight (if that same scenario were to occur). I believe it helped me out, as I can think of multiple occasions where I was in a situation that was dangerous or could become dangerous (bad weather, bad decisions, pressure) and I was able to recall some of those situations and what and why I didn't want to do, to keep from becoming a statistic.
Now, the Instrument rating was a whole nother thing alltogether, I'll tell that story sometime, but it had to be complete in two parts as it was difficult (for me anyway..).
Always remember, an accident is caused by a chain of events or decisions that have gone wrong. If you can keep youself aware of your situation (situational awareness) at all times and recognize one of those events on the chain and change it, you can avoid that accident. I know this to be true and have used it many times in my flying, even if it caused me embarrasment or to not make it to the destination that I wanted to get to.
Good luck guys!!!
Great story.. thanks for sharing it..
this goes to all of you
how many hrs did you have on your first solo?

[jackpunx]

Thanks for nothing! You got me all freaked out now! I don't know if I should even try yet, I only have 40 hours. My instructor says I'm ready and he hasn't had a student fail yet. The more I study, the more I realize what I don't know.
:cry:
OK, breathe..............
LMAO.. you'll be fine.. Your instructor wont set you up for fail..
You got it.. let us know how it goes :rollside:

[Sleek-Jet]

The biggest thing to keep in mind on the checkride, is that as far as the examiner is concerned, you are a licensed pilot. He's not expecting you to be the ace of the base, but wants to assure that you are safe and can handle the airplane within the parameters set forth in the PTS.
And if you mess any of the maneuvers up, say so. Quick story, I was doing my Lazy 8's on the commercial check ride and the examiner "distracted" me, he asked me a question about half way through the second half of the maneuver. I hosed it big time, ended up finishing about 300 feet high. I looked over at him and simply said that I had screwed it up. He chuckled and had me do it again, I nailed it the second time. Admiting that you did something wrong shows judgement.

[Mardonzi]

One other small word of advice, (and I say this because my DE pulled this one on me) don't make any assumptions. If you have a question about his instructions, ask him to clarify them. Also, just because he is from the FAA, and is a pilot, don't get complacent about your preflight checklist and briefing. My DE pulled the door shut on the cessna, but told me that it was closed. As I was finishing my run up and doing my final checklist, i did a double check on all the doors and low and behold, the door was closed, but not latched. I caught it due to the fact that I was following the POH to the letter on the checklists, but have known of people since that have failed due to this.
Another thing to know is make sure the paperwork for the aircraft current and in the aircraft.
Don't be afraid to use any resources that you have in the aircraft to answer any of his/ her questions. For example, you can use the POH for reference if he asks you about emergency procedures for the aircraft or even something as simple as a forgotten V speed...

[SoCal_fun]

The biggest thing to keep in mind on the checkride, is that as far as the examiner is concerned, you are a licensed pilot. He's not expecting you to be the ace of the base, but wants to assure that you are safe and can handle the airplane within the parameters set forth in the PTS.
And if you mess any of the maneuvers up, say so. Quick story, I was doing my Lazy 8's on the commercial check ride and the examiner "distracted" me, he asked me a question about half way through the second half of the maneuver. I hosed it big time, ended up finishing about 300 feet high. I looked over at him and simply said that I had screwed it up. He chuckled and had me do it again, I nailed it the second time. Admiting that you did something wrong shows judgement.
Ahhhh yes, reminds me of the old dropped pencil trick. DE asks for a manuver, then in the middle drops his pencil on the floor near you and asks you to pick it up for him. Oldest trick in the book, is a good reply.. LOL!!
Tell him your busy flying and he'll have to wait! LOL! :rollside:

[jackpunx]

I was reading the check ride stories.. I'll bring an extra pencil in my shirt pocket..lMAO

[Kachina26]

. After only 125 hours of training (80 Dual & 45 Solo)
Holy crap! This guy had more solo time than I have of everything, and he failed!On the bright side, he doesn't seem very smart based on what I read in his story. He did make a good point perhaps without even realizing it, be calm. :D

[jackpunx]

Holy crap! This guy had more solo time than I have of everything, and he failed!On the bright side, he doesn't seem very smart based on what I read in his story. He did make a good point perhaps without even realizing it, be calm. :D
Not sure if you have seen this yet.. somthing else to get strung out on
http://www.studentpilot.com/interact/forum/index.php?s=

[Beer-30]

Ahhhh yes, reminds me of the old dropped pencil trick. DE asks for a manuver, then in the middle drops his pencil on the floor near you and asks you to pick it up for him. Oldest trick in the book, is a good reply.. LOL!!
Tell him your busy flying and he'll have to wait! LOL! :rollside:
Just go inverted and tell him/her to hold out their hand and catch the pencil :crossx:

[SoCal_fun]

Just go inverted and tell him/her to hold out their hand and catch the pencil :crossx:
Thats a good one, hadn't thought of that...:D Sure pass, as long as you pull it off I guess... LOL!! :rollside:

[jackpunx]

So I went to get my FAA Medical.. All was well until I told them that I had Lasik surgery. No big deal.. He gave me some paper work to have my Dr. fill out and I’ll be on my way..
But he also let me know that I have a hernia!
Not what I was expecting to hear

[Sleek-Jet]

So I went to get my FAA Medical.. All was well until I told them that I had Lasik surgery. No big deal.. He gave me some paper work to have my Dr. fill out and I’ll be on my way..
But he also let me know that I have a hernia!
Not what I was expecting to hear
So, did he bust you on the hernia to, or just the Lasik???
OK, "bust" was a poor choice of words... :D

[jackpunx]

So, did he bust you on the hernia to, or just the Lasik???
OK, "bust" was a poor choice of words... :D
Just the lasik.. I already faxed all the paper work to my eye dr.. should have that sorted out in a couple days max..
but son of a bitch... I had no idea I had a hernia.. I thought I was just getting old and that pain was part of it..LOL
I got to get some skydiving out of the way before they cut me open.. :cry:

[Kachina26]

Just the lasik.. I already faxed all the paper work to my eye dr.. should have that sorted out in a couple days max..
but son of a bitch... I had no idea I had a hernia.. I thought I was just getting old and that pain was part of it..LOL
I got to get some skydiving out of the way before they cut me open.. :cry:
Get the gortex patch put in, you'll never bust it again. Or at least, that's what my surgeon told me. Good thing you did the med, could you imagine waiting to solo over a note from your doc?

[jackpunx]

Get the gortex patch put in, you'll never bust it again. Or at least, that's what my surgeon told me. Good thing you did the med, could you imagine waiting to solo over a note from your doc?
I have to go to my dr this week and see what he says..
It dosnt really hurt or anything.. but.. Im very gratefull they He caught it.. he said its common for people to have them and not know..
I remember you guys suggested I started on the med stuff.. Im glad I did now..
thanks :)

[Sleek-Jet]

I have to go to my dr this week and see what he says..
It dosnt really hurt or anything.. but.. Im very gratefull they He caught it.. he said its common for people to have them and not know..
I remember you guys suggested I started on the med stuff.. Im glad I did now..
thanks :)
My medical expired at midnight on the 1st of December. None of the ME's I can find down here will take me until after the first of the year. For the first time in almost 15 years, I'm not a pilot... :cry: :cry: :rollside:

[jackpunx]

My medical expired at midnight on the 1st of December. None of the ME's I can find down here will take me until after the first of the year. For the first time in almost 15 years, I'm not a pilot... :cry: :cry: :rollside:
OH NO!!...
fix that before it becomes permanant! :)

[Sleek-Jet]

OH NO!!...
fix that before it becomes permanant! :)
It won't be permenant... but I have worked my way around the calendar, and now my medical month will be the same as when I started (January)... :D

[Beer-30]

My medical expired at midnight on the 1st of December. None of the ME's I can find down here will take me until after the first of the year. For the first time in almost 15 years, I'm not a pilot... :cry: :cry: :rollside:
You could get in to Dr. Hagen or Dr. Komin at Shafter airport (KMIT). They have a large hangar / office on the field. Makes it nice (when current) to fly in and get the medical done.
Usually, when I call or stop by to make an appt, they schedule for the next day or day after that. Rarely more than a week.

[Sleek-Jet]

You could get in to Dr. Hagen or Dr. Komin at Shafter airport (KMIT). They have a large hangar / office on the field. Makes it nice (when current) to fly in and get the medical done.
Usually, when I call or stop by to make an appt, they schedule for the next day or day after that. Rarely more than a week.
If it was absulutely life or death that I get one, I could probably get in somewhere in PHX... or I know a Doc in ABQ that is always available. But, I'm pretty booked up this month, and I didn't plan on going up, so I'll just wait until January.
Thanks for the info though, I'll keep it mind if I ever get in dire straights for a medical. :cool:

[Kachina26]

Any pilots in the house?
One more now baby! :D:D:D

[hoolign]

yes yes ..me and my brudder are da bush pilots
I cut da bush....and my brudder...he pile-it

[jackpunx]

One more now baby! :D:D:D
Get the F out of here!!!
congrats!!! thats awesome!
Tell us the check out story :)
Thats a huge accomplishment..
who is going to be your first passenger?

[maxwedge]

who is going to be your first passenger?
Yes, who is the poor dumb motherf...er.. I mean the brave person with big brass ones. My mother was my first passenger, cause dad didn't trust me not to kill him lol. :)

[Kachina26]

Get the F out of here!!!
congrats!!! thats awesome!
Tell us the check out story :)
Thats a huge accomplishment..
who is going to be your first passenger?
The wife wants to be first, and she wants her first trip to be Havi. I think she's nuts! But, I got the plane reserved for next Saturday. I will post the checkride story in a bit, I have a busy afternoon, so it'll be awhile. Let me tell you that the DE was very mello, I would highly recommend you take your checkride with him Mark.

[Mardonzi]

One more now baby! :D:D:D
Hey,,, Congrats and welcome to the Family!!!!

[Kachina26]

Well, I called the DE a week in advance, he told me to plan a trip to Bakersfield. I got out the chart and discovered there was bakersfield municipal and Meadows BFL, I went with BFL. I scheduled the plane for 2 hours the day before my exam so that I could run through the whole checkride and all it's possibilities the day before, including my diversion after making the first checkpoint. I had gotten a tip that this particular DE likes to diverert to Hesperia airport. So, I got my chart out, measured the distance and plotted an initial course (that's not cheating, right?). Anyway, then I put on my hood and practiced flying by instruments, seemed kinda dangerous without someone to watch for traffic (it's just a joke people). I practiced my steep turns, power off stalls, turns around a point etc. I went back to the airport and totally nailed a slip landing, followed by some decent soft fields, ( I have a tough time with those) , then I did a beautiful short field landing.
The next day I got up early, finished off my flight plan with the most current weather and notams. I couldn't eat breakfast, but I forced down a protein bar and some water. I got to the airport and met my instuctor and a buddy who got his license the day I did my first solo. They did their best to put me at ease. The DE got back from his first checkride and had me go into the back room. He explained how things were going to work as well as all the possible outcomes of the oral. We talked a bit about how I got into flying, I queried him as to how long he had been flying and how he got to be an examiner. He typed my application into his laptop and then the conversation moved on into general questions about flying. Nothing very hard and occasionally when I wasn't quite giving the answer he was looking for ( not giving wrong answers, just not what he was looking for) he would kinda lead me in the right direction. We pulled out a chart and he asked me about airspace, where I could go, where I couldn't, who I had to talk to, how to avoid areas, what different things meant (like tower symbols). Then he asked to see my flight plan, I went over it and told him it was a no go due to poor visibility. He said he really had to get there and would be willing to pay if I could get him there. Obviously I told him that not only could I not fly there today, but I could not charge to do so. I was really feeling comfortable at this point, he did ask me about icing and I was ok with the info, but wish that I had better answers about the different types of ice. At one point he remarked that I was doing very well and asked if I self studied or if I had taken a ground school. He asked me about the airplane, had me describe the electrical system and the fuel system. We went over the logs for the plane, he had questions on required maintenance, once we determined that the plane was legal, we left to fly. I preflighted the plane on my own, he was talking to my instructor which was just fine by me! He got to the plane and I asked if I should do the passenger brief with him. He said no. We got in and he said "fire it up, let's go" I told him that he would have to shut his door and belt up :D Which he did, "let's go" he said again. "You need to put on your shoulder belt too", I replied. Fired up the plane and taxied out. Did my runup with my new fancy shmancy checklist. Went out for the short field take off, the plane was a little slow to pick up speed, but we made it up. ( discovered later that my new checklist had me set the park brake which I never do and did not say to release it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) We headed for BFL and I made my first checkpoint withing 40 seconds of what I had figured. Then we diverted to Hesperia ;) Then a little hood work ( he later told me that my scan was a little slow, but I meet the requirements) after that, we did steep banks. Now, my instructor taught me to roll out of the first one and directly into the next. The DE told me not to do that, he explained that that was for commercial level pilots. Fine by me, I never gained or lost more than 20 feet :D After that we did slow flight, just long enough to manuever to a point on the compass. Then came a power off stall and recover from slow flight. On to a no flap power on stall and then a simulated engine failure. Went through emergency procedures tried a "restart" and landed engine off at victorville. We took off, got a little altidude and did turns around a point. He asked which way to my home airport, I pointed it out and he asked if I was sure and pointed south and asked if perhaps it wasn't "that way". Nope, I told him, definately over there. We went back to APV and did a no flaps landing (slip), I nailed it. We went back around and did a not so soft soft field ( I figured I flunked at this point) he then had me do a soft field take off, but on the roll. I had never done one this way but I pulled it off. Came back around and did a short field with a full stop. I got it right, but, I've done better. We taxied back and he shook my hand :D
sorry for rambling, but I wanted to get the whole thing in there. Mostly so Mark won't read that BS website. This was pretty easy compared to what I had myself all psyched up over.

[INSman]

Well done Randy, can't wait to start and do some flyin' together !!!!! :cool:

[SMFRiverRat]

Pro pilot (http://worteldrie.com/flash/emergency.swf)

[jackpunx]

Great story..
that other website has me wanting to give up now..LOL>>
I flew this morning.. and somthing clicked... (on landings) :)
Congrats on this Randy.. its huge.. Cant wait to do a double date in catalina with you guys this summer.. Of course we'll fly there :)

[Sleek-Jet]

I knew a guy who busted his instrument check ride because of the pax brief. He explained to the examinar how to operate the seat belt and door, but she failed him because he didn't have her physically demonstrate she knew how to open the door and undo her seat belt... he was a little upset, not to mention out 400.00. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: And she waited until the checkride was over to give him the pink slip...
Good job on the ride... sounds like you nailed it. So, have you taken your wife up yet???

[SMFRiverRat]

I knew a guy who busted his instrument check ride because of the pax brief. He explained to the examinar how to operate the seat belt and door, but she failed him because he didn't have her physically demonstrate she knew how to open the door and undo her seat belt... he was a little upset, not to mention out 400.00. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: And she waited until the checkride was over to give him the pink slip...
And that would be the last time I would ever recommend that Designated Examiner to a student. We had one like that 10 years ago that did that twice. Never got a single referral from us again. Then came around and complained that we instructors (and the school owner) were not giving him any business.
To fail somebody on something like that is pure BS.

[Mardonzi]

And that would be the last time I would ever recommend that Designated Examiner to a student. We had one like that 10 years ago that did that twice. Never got a single referral from us again. Than came around and complained that we instructors (and the school owner) were not giving him any business.
To fail somebody on something like that is pure BS.
I don't seem to remember in the PTS that says you have to visually demonstrate, just that you need to preform a preflight safety briefing so as the passenger understands it. Section 1-II-B-4 of the PTS states "the objective is to determine that the applicant briefs occupants on the use of safety belts, shoulder harnesses, doors, and emergency procedures".
I know that if it was me, I would be talking to the local FSDO.

[Sleek-Jet]

And that would be the last time I would ever recommend that Designated Examiner to a student. We had one like that 10 years ago that did that twice. Never got a single referral from us again. Than came around and complained that we instructors (and the school owner) were not giving him any business.
To fail somebody on something like that is pure BS.
Yep.... but she had a contract with a college to do check-rides.. so if your number came up, she was your examiner.
I heard stories about her giving crazy stuff like partial panel back course approaches, stuff like that.

[Sleek-Jet]

I don't seem to remember in the PTS that says you have to visually demonstrate, just that you need to preform a preflight safety briefing so as the passenger understands it. Section 1-II-B-4 of the PTS states "the objective is to determine that the applicant briefs occupants on the use of safety belts, shoulder harnesses, doors, and emergency procedures".
I know that if it was me, I would be talking to the local FSDO.
Complaints to the FSDO fell on deaf ears from what I understand. :rolleyes:

[Mardonzi]

Complaints to the FSDO fell on deaf ears from what I understand. :rolleyes:
We're from the FAA and were're here to help???

[Sleek-Jet]

We're from the FAA and were're here to help???
shhhhh.... their listening...

[Mardonzi]

shhhhh.... their listening...
I was hoping that mispellling we're (were're) would throw them off and they wouldn't catch the sarcastic tone of my post