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jbone
06-13-2006, 04:35 PM
Can anyone tell me why my '01 4X4 excursion rotors keep warping?
I don't drive or brake hard and I tow a 3500-4000 boat with surge brakes. By the way, they will warp even when not towing. After I originally replaced the rotors with the slotted type, it took about 3 months to get the annoying shimmy in the front end. I just had them turned again about 3,000 miles ago and its back.
Is there a better rotor? I can't change out the whole system, but is there a strong reliable replacement rotor for this?
Thanks,
J

CBadDad
06-13-2006, 04:52 PM
Not trying to be a jerk, but maybe it's the way you drive.
I had the same problem in my '02 at around 25K miles. Took it to the dealer and they replaced "a bearing" because my ABS light came on.
I got the shimmy's again around 35K miles and it got worse until I took it to a regular mechanic. Changed the pads (used OEM parts) ant turned the rotars. They had some hot spots, but I haven't had the problem return (almost 20K miles)
Oh ya, I got divorced too and the exmonster doesn't drive it anymore...

Primetime
06-13-2006, 05:03 PM
I have a 01 350 and the same thing has happened to me twice.I went to bigger rottors and calipers and have not had a problem since. powerslot rottors

thom
06-13-2006, 05:12 PM
i have an 03 f250 and mine warp every 30k.. i now have 181,000 on it and tried better rotors and better pads and everything.. let me know if you find a fix.. ever 30k i turn the rotors and install new pads.. ive never touched the rear rotors or pads... just bought new rotors and pads for the rear today.

jbone
06-13-2006, 05:32 PM
Not trying to be a jerk, but maybe it's the way you drive.
Like I said, I don't drive or brake hard. In fact, I drive it like a baby. I can't afford to drive it any other way.
Oh, I forgot to say I have 35's on it with a 4 inch lift.
Still, any ideas on a good rotor/pad combination would be appreciated.
J

cc322
06-13-2006, 05:34 PM
Not trying to be a jerk, but maybe it's the way you drive.
I had the same problem in my '02 at around 25K miles. Took it to the dealer and they replaced "a bearing" because my ABS light came on.
I got the shimmy's again around 35K miles and it got worse until I took it to a regular mechanic. Changed the pads (used OEM parts) ant turned the rotars. They had some hot spots, but I haven't had the problem return (almost 20K miles)
Oh ya, I got divorced too and the exmonster doesn't drive it anymore...
Ithought You were gonna trade that in on a f-250 :rollside:

Primetime
06-13-2006, 05:55 PM
Go to a bigger rotor and caliper set up from power slot.

ToMorrow44
06-13-2006, 07:04 PM
Like I said, I don't drive or brake hard. In fact, I drive it like a baby. I can't afford to drive it any other way.
Oh, I forgot to say I have 35's on it with a 4 inch lift.
Still, any ideas on a good rotor/pad combination would be appreciated.
J
I have an 02 F250 with 30K miles on it and all its used for is towing a 7000lb boat/trailer and its never warped the brakes. That being said, I had an 01 F150 that warped the brakes a lot with no towing. A problem that you might want to check is the calipers. If dirt/debris gets in the pistons, they could start sticking. All it takes is a little sticking to heat up those rotors really quick. You said you put slotted rotors on it, but then had them turned. Maybe I'm mistaken but I don't think you can turn slotted rotors.
The last thing I can suggest is that the problem is coming from those 35s. Those big wheels/tires just hammer brakes. You may want to look into getting new calipers if the problem persists. Changing pads and turning rotors every 30K isnt normal by any means and there must be a fix somewhere.
-Tom
PS depending on how many miles are on your truck, you may want to check the master cylinder. To fix the problem, just start changing piece by piece of the entire brake system until it works. Just my .02

Panic Button
06-13-2006, 07:34 PM
I had the same problem with my 00 Ex. Found out that Ford changed the torque on the lug nuts from 150ft/#'s to 165Ft/#'s. I went thru 3 sets of rotors before my uncle (Ford Service Mgr) told me of the change. No problems after that.
PS I have a brand new set of crossed drilled & slotted rotors for all 4 wheels I'll sell real cheap...
http://www.lasvegas***boats.com/iB_html/uploads/post-4-00798-P4180106.JPG

jbone
06-13-2006, 08:16 PM
I had the same problem with my 00 Ex. Found out that Ford changed the torque on the lug nuts from 150ft/#'s to 165Ft/#'s. I went thru 3 sets of rotors before my uncle (Ford Service Mgr) told me of the change. No problems after that.
PS I have a brand new set of crossed drilled & slotted rotors for all 4 wheels I'll sell real cheap...
http://www.lasvegas***boats.com/iB_html/uploads/post-4-00798-P4180106.JPG
I heard that improper tourque could be a problem, but didn't believe it. Maybe it is true.
I think I will look into having the calipers looked when I put the new rotors on.
thanks for the input guys,
J

H20 Toie
06-13-2006, 10:11 PM
i had the same problem and it turned out that the rear brakes were not working at all once i got that fixed never had a problem with the fronts again

C-2
06-13-2006, 10:56 PM
Excursion Forum (http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=29)

jbone
06-14-2006, 12:19 AM
Excursion Forum (http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=29)
Great! Another forum to get hooked on.
J

redneckcharlie
06-14-2006, 12:38 AM
i've had the same problem with several of my f250's and f350's when i first got them. there is a difference between quality on the rotors. if you pick up a less expensive rotor from say autozone compared to a full line brake dealer, such as raybestos, there is a big difference in weight between the two. some people will disagree, but i religiously use premium ceramic pads. i routinely tow fourteen to sixteen thousand pounds. one of the major problems with these vehilces is the weight. if you can avoid jumping on the brakes when decelerating, it will prolong your breaklife. also, using someone that actually knows how to turn a rotor properly as opposed to say autozone, will greatly help. many places such as autozone and checker, can turn a rotor, and still exhibit the characteristics of warping. one other thing, the excursions and superdutys are prone to cooking the seals in the calipers. it is very inexpensive and easy to rebuilt the calipers on these vehicles. the typical rebuild kit is less than fifteen bucks a side. it is not a bad idea to do this at every brake change. :boxed:

CBadDad
06-14-2006, 04:05 AM
Ithought You were gonna trade that in on a f-250 :rollside:
Why would I do that? I love my Excursion.
I would like to pick up a V6 F150 to throw junk in and cruise around town in. Save the Excursion for hauling.

CBadDad
06-14-2006, 04:08 AM
Like I said, I don't drive or brake hard. In fact, I drive it like a baby. I can't afford to drive it any other way.
Oh, I forgot to say I have 35's on it with a 4 inch lift.
Still, any ideas on a good rotor/pad combination would be appreciated.
J
It probably omly takes one friggin panick stop to put a hot spot on it and cause the warping. Of course it could also be any number of other things that are posted here. Great info.
I too have a 4inch lift and run 35's. Perfect set up IMO.

Seadog
06-14-2006, 04:59 AM
Every rotor made for the trucks that era have been having that problem. I had two warranty replacements, went through Power Slots and two sets of pads, etc. My problem was I had a special bolt pattern that only some dealers stocked. I finally just had the local Firestone shop do a basic brake job and I have not had a problem since. My 93 F150 had a front brake job at 75k and both at 150k, so I think that I am not too hard on brakes.

Beer-30
06-14-2006, 10:52 AM
15 ft. lbs. is not going to change a thing. Sounds a little high anyway. Have always torqued the dually to 100, which is plenty. That's a lot of pressure.
I would say the tires are hurting you. The rotors, although slotted and even cross-drilled, were never designed for the extra rotating mass or leverage.
I had a similar problem, drive like a baby, kept warping. Ended up rear piston of master cyl had let go, so no rear brakes. Went out gradually, so I didn't even notice the pedal was way lower. W/O rears, fronts were heating up/warping.

jbone
06-14-2006, 01:48 PM
Thanks for all the info guys.
J

Biglue
06-14-2006, 02:20 PM
Braking on a truck is touchy as it is because of the weight distribution. The majority of the weight is up front and when you brake all the forces lunge forward with braking.
The shimying you guys are referring too is usually caused by pad imprints. How this happens is during hard braking or improperly bedding in new brakes. When you have new brakes installed wether it be rotors or pads or both you should bed them in. Especially when you get to the more agressive friction composites.
Here's an explanation in a nut shell.
When you brake hard and come to a complete stop you heat up your braking system tremendously. Well during that full/complete stop where you have the friction material applied to the rotors what happens is you transfer a coat of friction material onto the actual iron (the rotor's friction surface). Once you release the pedal and start moving forward again and you have to brake again, the friction applied to the rotors through the pads is costantly coming in contact with both the iron and the friction material imprint on the part of the rotor from that hard stop. This leads to the shimmying many of you are describing. It's an interupted friction contact......if you will.
What you do to eliminate that problem is make several agressive braking cycles. But you never come to a complete stop. Drive over to a desolate industrial area in the evening and do 8-10 60MPH to 0 braking cycles. NEVER COME TO COMPLETE STOP THOUGH. You should just coast through at a few MPH until you can gain speed and brake from 60 to 0 again. With these agressive stopping cycles what you do is actually coat the entire rotor braking surface with the friction material not just the one spot. This procedure should also be done when you have new brakes installed.
One problem Ford has had in the past with brakes is the piston material they used some some eras. I had an 01 F150 Supercrew that had real shitty braking and brake life. As it turns out, the pistons in the calipers were made of some "hard plastic" (forget the actuall name). What was happening is that the actuall hydraulic seal in the piston bore was wearing a dull spot onto the piston wall. Once that dull spot becomes bad enough the seal contact itself did not allow the piston actually retract. This led to the pad staying in contact with the rotor friction surfaces longer than normal. I never found out if those piston types were also used on the F250's or not but it's something you may want to look into.

Say10
06-14-2006, 02:44 PM
I had the same problem. I had put 20's on it and they keep telling me it was the size of the tires. Bullshi t . It was a 01 supercrew. Finally got tired and bought a 05 chevy HD. Problem solved...

pumpercaptain
06-14-2006, 02:48 PM
Well sign me up for the this one too...
I have an 02 250 with around 30k and the brakes have started doing the dance as well.
Ford hasn't made a descent rotor for many years according to my Dad who has worked in the auto industry (mostly for Ford) in years.
I have a 94 TBird SC that started doing the same thing my truck is doing and I replaced the front rotors and that solved the problem...
Thats what I'm going to try with the truck and see what happens.
I mostly just use the truck to pull my boat too...
I love my big truck, and would not consider anything else, but when you have to beat on the dash to get a CD to come out of the radio, brakes shimmy at 30,000, the power locks stick on the passenger side, paint is so thin that its wearing off of the door from pushing it closed, one has to consider this truck listed for $44,000???
I had to put an engine in my TBird at 120,000...
How come the Japanese can build a vehicle that runs and runs with few or no problems and we can't or won't???
I know this probably will start something but its the truth... everytime II try to balance myself to beat on my dash to get the CD's out during the shimmy dance I think about that... I'm driving a $44,000 truck and I have to beat on the dash to get the freakin discs out.
Other than that, I love the Super Duties and would probably buy another one!
:rollside:

CBadDad
06-14-2006, 02:56 PM
I love my big truck, and would not consider anything else, but when you have to beat on the dash to get a CD to come out of the radio,
My Cd player does the same f'n thing. I use a small screwdriver and lift the CD up and it slides right out. Hard to do pulling a boat down the I-10 at 70mph. Glad I have a 6 disc changer in there, otherwise it might cause an accident. :crossx:

Biglue
06-14-2006, 03:17 PM
I had the same problem. I had put 20's on it and they keep telling me it was the size of the tires. Bullshi t . It was a 01 supercrew. Finally got tired and bought a 05 chevy HD. Problem solved...
Same here. I had 22's on it. I did upgrade my braking system though. It stopped on a dime then. Even while towing. Check this brake system out.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/11276spam.jpg
BTW, buddy of mine had an 01 Silverado half ton. Both of us bought the trucks new within 4 months of each other. He never had to change brake pads and I went through 3 brake pad changes. Truck had 51K miles when I traded it in. I also bought a new Chevy 2500 HD.

ToMorrow44
06-14-2006, 08:16 PM
15 ft. lbs. is not going to change a thing. Sounds a little high anyway. Have always torqued the dually to 100, which is plenty. That's a lot of pressure.
I would say the tires are hurting you. The rotors, although slotted and even cross-drilled, were never designed for the extra rotating mass or leverage.
I had a similar problem, drive like a baby, kept warping. Ended up rear piston of master cyl had let go, so no rear brakes. Went out gradually, so I didn't even notice the pedal was way lower. W/O rears, fronts were heating up/warping.
I agree with you 100%. Torquing the wheels won't cause the brakes to warp unless you have one at like 120 and one at like 15. There has to be a big difference. And I too only torque the F250 wheels to 100ft lbs.
So check your master cylinders too. It took a while before I got my 01 F150 sorted out but in the end it took new front calipers, rotors, and machined rear rotors. This took place around 100K miles +/- a few thousand.

SHAKEN Not Stirred
06-14-2006, 08:25 PM
This is my second Excursion.....
I have 100K on this one.......
Have only replaced the rotors once, at about 65K.....
Oh.....and the head gaskets once.....Thanks Darryl.... :)
Later,
CJG
:)

jimslade
06-14-2006, 08:49 PM
If your running aluminum rims torque the nuts to spec, and check every 4 months, makes a huge difference. most warping has to do with how the rotor is dissipating the heat.

phebus
06-14-2006, 08:54 PM
Hey, it's a Ford, don't worry about it stopping, just be glad it's running :rollside:
(Sorry, but I'm surprised no one has taken a shot yet) :D

Seadog
06-15-2006, 12:56 PM
When they abandoned asbestoes brakes in the 90's, manufacturers switched to metallic. Everyone bitched because they squeaked, so they switched to a softer compound for the rotors. That is where ALL manufacturers started having warpage problems. I think the last couple years, they have worked things out, but it is not isolated to one manufacturer.