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View Full Version : Has cause been determined in Baja 30 Splitting & Sinking at L. Powell ?



Wake Havasu
12-20-2006, 01:14 PM
LAKE POWELL, Ariz. -
San Diego Vessel Assist used a remote operating vehicle (ROV) to retrieve a sunken 30-ft. powerboat from more than 400 ft. of water in Lake Powell Nov. 11.
The boat was salvaged at the behest of an insurance company after the vessel's hull allegedly split Sept. 15, killing a Colorado woman. The accident occurred in an area known as The Narrows, at the southwest portion of Lake Powell, near Page, Ariz.
"The boat was attempting to pass another vessel when it reportedly hit a wake at a high rate of speed, causing the hull to split," stated a Glen Canyon National Recreation Area release.
http://www.thelog.com/content/img/f199144/4.jpg

Wake Havasu
12-20-2006, 01:16 PM
I know why it went down but how could it split?
and was it wake of a tour boat?

ratso
12-20-2006, 01:17 PM
Wow... a thirty foot boat in 400 ft of water lifted in just over 5 weeks...:jawdrop:

squirt'nmyload
12-20-2006, 01:18 PM
:jawdrop:400 feet!!! fuccin later.....ya see...coulda had your boat back if you had insurance :hammer2:

OGShocker
12-20-2006, 01:23 PM
I was in Parker, 16 years ago, when Robby Gordon stopped by with a Baja he owned. He was jumping "white caps" on Havasu when his +30 Baja snapped in half. I told my buddy, "I might own another boat, but I'll never own a Baja".
sad to hear of the death on this wreck.

Big Warlock
12-20-2006, 01:30 PM
Wow

Biglue
12-20-2006, 01:39 PM
Looks like this thread could finally get some heat off Commander, Kachina and the likes. :D

Big Warlock
12-20-2006, 01:50 PM
Looks like this thread could finally get some heat off Commander, Kachina and the likes. :D
I wouldn't go that far! :D

spectras only
12-20-2006, 02:04 PM
No shit ! Friend has a 1998 29' er with 502's . Last year he landed on a 3-4 footer , the engines tore the stringers out and limped home on one keeping it from sinking :2purples: .

DeepVee
12-20-2006, 02:06 PM
I'd have to think that they stuffed the bow on a wave and either fractured the hull or stripped part of the deck off. This would flood and sink the boat pretty quick.

ratso
12-20-2006, 02:08 PM
Isn't BAJA what the Bayliner owners trade up to?

2forcefull
12-20-2006, 02:32 PM
Funny thing, I was look'n at 30' baja this morning thinking how good my 272 handled the ruff stuff,that the 30' should handle it even better!!! I used to jump that thing like a jet ski, guess I got lucky:eek: :eek: :eek:

2forcefull
12-20-2006, 02:35 PM
LAKE POWELL, Ariz. -
San Diego Vessel Assist used a remote operating vehicle (ROV) to retrieve a sunken 30-ft. powerboat from more than 400 ft. of water in Lake Powell Nov. 11.
The boat was salvaged at the behest of an insurance company after the vessel's hull allegedly split Sept. 15, killing a Colorado woman. The accident occurred in an area known as The Narrows, at the southwest portion of Lake Powell, near Page, Ariz.
"The boat was attempting to pass another vessel when it reportedly hit a wake at a high rate of speed, causing the hull to split," stated a Glen Canyon National Recreation Area release.
http://www.thelog.com/content/img/f199144/4.jpg
I keep look'n at this picture and it sure looks more like a 20'er to me
bet titties would know:idea:

spectras only
12-20-2006, 02:39 PM
Funny thing, I was look'n at 30' baja this morning thinking how good my 272 handled the ruff stuff,that the 30' should handle it even better!!! I used to jump that thing like a jet ski, guess I got lucky:eek: :eek: :eek:
My friend's 29 Baja is great in the rough , just shit happened . Prolly a bad layup/friday job :idea:

2forcefull
12-20-2006, 02:43 PM
My friend's 29 Baja is great in the rough , just shit happened . Prolly a bad layup/friday job :idea:
Yeah, I hear ya.
but look at that boat, 18'-20- baja at max , it's smaller than the rangers boat!!!

Decided Advantage
12-20-2006, 02:50 PM
Isn't BAJA what the Bayliner owners trade up to?
Bayliner and Baja are both divisions of Brunswick.
Bayliner owners move up to Bajaliners.

ChumpChange
12-20-2006, 03:00 PM
I keep look'n at this picture and it sure looks more like a 20'er to me
bet titties would know:idea:
Isn't that why the thread says 30?

2forcefull
12-20-2006, 03:04 PM
Isn't that why the thread says 30?
????????

ChumpChange
12-20-2006, 03:41 PM
????????
Look at the title of the thread:
Has cause been determined in Baja 30 Splitting & Sinking at L. Powell ?

spectras only
12-20-2006, 03:53 PM
but look at that boat, 18'-20- baja at max , it's smaller than the rangers boat!!!
Believe me , it's the shot angle . It could be a 29 or 30 footer . Look at this picture. My friend's boat is between the 36 Nor-Tech and the 40+ Fountain .
It looks like a 24 footer in the pic.
http://www3.telus.net/spectrasonly/06%20PBNW%20run%205
The flamed Nordic is a 35 footer and the Fountain behind it is a 29 footer.
http://www3.telus.net/spectrasonly/06%20PBNW%20run%206
The 29 Baja SST is a true 29' [ no integrated swimstep]

Kilrtoy
12-20-2006, 05:41 PM
Looks like this thread could finally get some heat off Commander, Kachina and the likes. :D
Why did they finally start building a better boat or at least up to bayliner specs:jawdrop:

Biglue
12-20-2006, 06:36 PM
Why did they finally start building a better boat or at least up to bayliner specs:jawdrop:
Yep....Haven't you seen all the orange on them lately? :jawdrop:

Ziggy
12-20-2006, 06:45 PM
Yep....Haven't you seen all the orange on them lately? :jawdrop:
C'mon Lue, you should know by now its all about the quanity of zipties.. :D

Kilrtoy
12-20-2006, 06:47 PM
Yep....Haven't you seen all the orange on them lately? :jawdrop:
But that is Krylon Orange
Not zippity do dah Orange

Biglue
12-20-2006, 06:50 PM
But that is Krylon Orange
Not zippity do dah Orange
That's how they keep them from costing as much as a house. :jawdrop: :)

Throttle
12-20-2006, 06:53 PM
I could not believe the size of those wakes from those tour boats in that area... to think 400 feet down, holy crap!

Brian
12-20-2006, 06:55 PM
powell tugboat cap came over for xmas drinks he knows the real story,NEWS AT 11:idea:
It's 11 somewhere. Give it up biatch!
:D

Brian
12-20-2006, 06:57 PM
...My friend's boat is between the 36 Nor-Tech and the 40+ Fountain...[ no integrated swimstep]
Your friend keeps good company!
:D

Ziggy
12-20-2006, 06:57 PM
But that is Krylon Orange
Not zippity do dah OrangeSee Lue, you thought I was joking about the Zipity Do ties, huh? :D

spectras only
12-20-2006, 10:18 PM
Your friend keeps good company!
:D
yeah , the Nor-Tech & Fountain kept the Baja afloat :D

Mardonzi
12-21-2006, 06:42 AM
:D
THE WIFE'S WHERE MAKING COOKIES,SORRY:D well the story i got was,a sales rep from B/J(women)was driving the boat,very fast(the tour boat was 1st trip with cat motors/cat mech's on board)and this women was jumping T/B WAKES:mad:30' from the wall and hit the 1st one and PILE DRIVED THE 2ND ONE HARD (i was told 65-70 mph) the boat came apart from the front the T/B turned around and picked up the guy, and the women (when the boat sank) got sucked into the cabin and went down with the boat,344' of water she was 20' feet off the bow just floating(dead 344' of water).just so some of you know,some of these T/B WAKES are 6'+ feet and if your not watching,YOUR WATCHING STARS;) any way that the story i got:idea:
The group that was on the boat is associated with Marine Max out of their Grand Junction office. They were out on a retreat and I got the same story from some NPS contacts as well.

AzLakeLizard
12-21-2006, 06:48 AM
Now you know why I "SCREAM" every time you go after those damned tour boats!!!!:jawdrop: :devil:

DeepVee
12-21-2006, 07:18 AM
You can't stuff the bow on a boat like this and expect to walk away. Maybe if the deck was glassed to the hull it would have held together but a screwed & glued deck to hull joint will seperate and fail under these conditions, filling the boat with water very quickly.
The tour boat wakes on Powell are fine as long as you have your senses about you when crossing them. The driver probably launched it nose up on one of the first big waves off the tour boat, got scared and pulled out of the throttles in the air and didn't get back on the throttles before re-entering the water. The boat came down nose up and clipped the drives on the next wave with no power which inverted the attitude of the boat, pushing the nose down and stuffing the bow on the next wave. You've gotta get back on the power and keep the momentum going as you re-enter or you're gonna break stuff. Powering back up just before or upon re-entry is not a gaurentee but it'll at least give you a chance of keeping the bow up and avoid stuffing.

Dan Lorenze
12-21-2006, 07:37 AM
At what point do you place the blame on the operator instead of the boat manufacture?.. Is this really Baja's fault for the drivers actions? People make poor decisions and mistakes, that's what I get out of this whole story. What impresses me is the fact that it was recovered in 400' of water. That same crew should go get Laters' boat. :yuk:

NdaWind
12-21-2006, 07:41 AM
On first trip out to Powell with our new boat we jumped on of those tour boat waves with KC. Luckily we hit it just right but I would NEVER do that again. I do remember looking over as we were going up and seeing titties and beer just idling his boat and thinking OH shit I followed the wrong guy.:2purples: :2purples:

Mardonzi
12-21-2006, 07:42 AM
You can't stuff the bow on a boat like this and expect to walk away. Maybe if the deck was glassed to the hull it would have held together but a screwed & glued deck to hull joint will seperate and fail under these conditions, filling the boat with water very quickly.
The tour boat wakes on Powell are fine as long as you have your senses about you when crossing them. The driver probably launched it nose up on one of the first big waves off the tour boat, got scared and pulled out of the throttles in the air and didn't get back on the throttles before re-entering the water. The boat came down nose up and clipped the drives on the next wave with no power which inverted the attitude of the boat, pushing the nose down and stuffing the bow on the next wave. You've gotta get back on the power and keep the momentum going as you re-enter or you're gonna break stuff. Powering back up just before or upon re-entry is not a gaurentee but it'll at least give you a chance of keeping the bow up and avoid stuffing.
You sound like you have some history here...

DeepVee
12-21-2006, 08:25 AM
You sound like you have some history here...
I conceded that the tour boat wakes had WON on Powell several years ago and now we just roll over them slowly and wave at the tourist, especially with kids on board.:D
My above statement is only my opinion and I'm not an expert.
Unfortunately I do have history with hitting buoys on Powell but that's another story. :eek:

Mardonzi
12-21-2006, 08:35 AM
Well, you gotta respect em, that's for sure. It will be interesting to see how this one plays out in the investigation.
On a seperate note,, Winter Solistice today,, days start getting longer from here on out and spring is just around the corner. We need to meet up with you guys one of these days out on the water besides just a quick wave..

DeepVee
12-21-2006, 08:55 AM
...We need to meet up with you guys one of these days out on the water besides just a quick wave..
We really wanted to get back up there this fall but I found an issue with our boat in late Sept. and decided to leave it on the trailer until it could be addresses. I'm currently scheduled to take the boat back to the factory in Sarasota next month to add some beef in the hull so I can have it back and ready to go by next spring. Next year for sure. We should be back on the lake by May.

Big Warlock
12-21-2006, 12:57 PM
You can't stuff the bow on a boat like this and expect to walk away. Maybe if the deck was glassed to the hull it would have held together but a screwed & glued deck to hull joint will seperate and fail under these conditions, filling the boat with water very quickly.
All boats are not built the same. We seem to have this argument on here every now and again. Instead of pointing fingers at our favorite boats per usual, I wish others could admit that boats are all buit differently. The key is to acknowledge this and then know the limitations of your boat.
I don't drive a top end boat. But I know what I like. And I really try to understand what my boat can and can't do. :)

Mardonzi
12-21-2006, 01:15 PM
I don't think anyone was passing judgement on Baja's hulls by that statement. Just a consideration. All boats, whether it's a MTI, DCB, or a Bayliner have different limitations. BW, you hit it right on the nose with the statement "The key is to acknowledge this and then know the limitations of your boat." From what I understand, these people weren't the owner of the boat and didn't have a bunch of behind the wheel time.

Misogynist
12-21-2006, 02:20 PM
I've crossed Lake Powell T/B wakes many times... they can be nasty when you get up close.... but they are tiny compared to crossing the wake of a passenger liner leaving the Port of Los Angeles out of Long Beach... I crossed a small one about the size of Powell's t/b's..... that was just the secondary wake... the main bow wake had to be over 20 feet tall.... that was scary... You had to approach it just fast enough that you wouldn't stall on the wave and slide back... and not so fast that you would launch over the top.

Desert Rat
12-21-2006, 06:42 PM
Anyone have any pics of these wakes? I be interested to see how big they are:jawdrop:

slowinhavasu
12-21-2006, 07:18 PM
Those Bay liners are tough....J and J salvage use a little twenty footer for all kinds of salvage efforts....I've seen that thing flying high in the worst mansoons, always brings them home....and yes it's bright orange, rattle can at that................:)

talkinghead
12-22-2006, 11:14 AM
It's possible that larger manufacturers have better quality control on their hulls than 'custom' builders. In addition, larger builders have the financial resources to maintain a staff of engineers who design and test hulls.

Big Warlock
12-22-2006, 11:47 AM
More likely than not you get what you pay for. There are not that many secrets in layups and how to do it. The engineering is in the hull design and reduction of drag. The two biggest designs in the past 20 years have been step hulls and cats (air entrapment hulls.)
But most of the accidents have to do with the person behind the wheel. I still learn something new every day. Cats still scare me.
I have nothing bad to say about Baja. I don't have a thing for them. Too many other boats I want before a Baja. But I haven't heard anything bad about them and this is the first incident I have heard of. I don't think they have a worse than industry record? They are not custom per sea, but plenty are built. Any input?

Sotally Tober
12-22-2006, 12:37 PM
I missed that one by a day. I was there on the 16th. Those wakes are huge. My brother and I like to jump them with the aquatrax at 60 mph in the open water. You can launch forever. I would never do this in the narrows though. I did not think the tour boats were supposed to put much of a wake through there. They are really fun in a houseboat. One time I hit one too straight on and had a tidal wave run through the boat. Sorry to here someone lost a life.

Sotally Tober
12-22-2006, 01:33 PM
"Maytag Straights" can be some real fun. I wonder how many boats have sunk through there. I heard a rumour that it is a couple a week in the summer.

Brian
12-22-2006, 02:46 PM
:D
THE WIFE'S WHERE MAKING COOKIES,SORRY:D ...
Wifes, as in plural? Man, I thought ONE was enough. Then again, you do live up there pretty close to Colorado City!
:D