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topless
02-26-2007, 03:05 AM
Since every one is ripping me to shreads on this subject, who here owns one and thinks they are loyal dogs? I for one think all dogs can be aggressive, mean, or the sweetest things on the planet. I used to have a Pomeranian that had puppies. When the puppies were old enough to go to new homes, one of them was mean as hell and would growl as soon as you walked up to him (maybe he was really a pit bull in disguise) Anyway, all domestic dogs are bred down from wild dogs like wolves so maybe we should just rid the world of all of them. OK haters rip me apart, I can hold my own.

jdf
02-26-2007, 03:13 AM
i have a red nose pit and she is a big baby

jdf
02-26-2007, 03:26 AM
i hear you ...what the hell are you doing up

ONAROLL
02-26-2007, 03:26 AM
Pit bulldogs are known for determination and agressiveness, I doubt there is any dog on the planet pound for pound more destructive in a human attack than a pit, I have owned a couple good pits, but they have no buisness around children and the elderly, turn your head for a split second while your two year old samples old pits dinner bowl, and chances are if they survive the attack they will have scars to remind you the rest of your life............I know you dont like my opinion you think people "create" these monsters for the sport of dog fighting, and they do, cause they are naturals for it.........

topless
02-26-2007, 03:28 AM
i hear you ...what the hell are you doing upI was asleep but woke up and HB started calling me.

topless
02-26-2007, 03:30 AM
Pit bulldogs are known for determination and agressiveness, I doubt there is any dog on the planet pound for pound more destructive in a human attack than a pit, I have owned a couple good pits, but they have no buisness around children and the elderly, turn your head for a split second while your two year old samples old pits dinner bowl, and chances are if they survive the attack they will have scars to remind you the rest of your life............I know you dont like my opinion you think people "create" these monsters for the sport of dog fighting, and they do, cause they are naturals for it.........
Let anyone sample any dogs dinner bowl that hasn't been properly trained and you'll get the same result.

jdf
02-26-2007, 03:30 AM
i think you may have a problem

ONAROLL
02-26-2007, 03:32 AM
Im not talking properly trained, Im talking about the natural tendencies of a given breed of animal..............

topless
02-26-2007, 03:47 AM
Im not talking properly trained, Im talking about the natural tendencies of a given breed of animal..............When I had my Rottie, she was 13 weeks old and my kids were babies. Every time I fed her, I would take her food away and then praise her so she wouldn't be food aggressive. It worked and she never ever did anything but look at anyone when they were around her food.

jdf
02-26-2007, 03:58 AM
topless you rule my dear ,,,,,,,,i have been around these dog's a long time it's all in the way they are raised

topless
02-26-2007, 04:03 AM
topless you rule my dear ,,,,,,,,i have been around these dog's a long time it's all in the way they are raisedThank you. My point here was that ALL animals are bred down from the wild ones and either you are the pack leader or they are. It is bad ownership that causes these attacks and not the animals fault.

jdf
02-26-2007, 04:06 AM
i wonder how many page's this will go ??????

topless
02-26-2007, 04:09 AM
i wonder how many page's this will go ??????Who knows? I do know that I am going to have to be ready for a good fight here pretty soon. Maybe I am part Pit Bull.

jdf
02-26-2007, 04:11 AM
if i know you you will hold your own ..........get them girl

topless
02-26-2007, 05:05 AM
if i know you you will hold your own ..........get them girl
I will but right now I'm going to go get my pit bull and go back to bed. (he is really just a terrier but pits are terriers too)

photo chick
02-26-2007, 05:20 AM
OK Bulltopless!!!:D :D
I happen to agree with you, a lot of the problem with Pitbulls lies in the owners. I had two Bull Tierriers (Spuds dogs) they were lovers b/c I am:D .
I wouldn't let a child around them when they ate, but they were around plenty of children and never hurt one!
I wouldn't let a child around my Beagles when they eat either though and they'd lick you to death before they'd ever hurt you.
RIP Caine & Magnum:(

Smokin Cigarettes
02-26-2007, 05:37 AM
My neighbor got 52 stitches in her face from her 14yo cocker spaniel..We have a 9yo pit at the farm that is a killer. He gets badgers, coyotes, and has even brought us turkeys. That being said, he has NEVER bitten or even growled at a human. Its all in the way you raise them.

Boomer 880
02-26-2007, 05:41 AM
Dogs are a lot like people, some can be pushed and pushed and never break or fight back. However, some will get in a fight, just to fight.
Most aggressive dogs have owners who think it is cool to have an intimidating animal, OR they are just too lazy to train a dog. I can not understand why some people want to own and animal or raise a child that is not a good citizen.
Finally, a lot has to do with breeding. If a dog has been bred to fight and raised to be agressive, they will be. We have three kids and two dogs, and I trust 100% that the dogs will never hurt the kids (and vice versa) because I work everyday with the dogs to make sure they are the best and happiest they can be.
I would not select a Pit as a family dog, but with a good breeder, a smart owner, and a lot of work, most any dog show his loving/trusting side and be a great pet.

Run_em_Hard
02-26-2007, 05:43 AM
My wife is a Vet. Tech. ans I hear all of her stories and we basically talk about animals way more than we should. There are far worse dogs than pits. Pits can be mean just like anyother dog, its all how they are raised. I would start a list of the dogs that are the meanest when they go to the clinic but I don't want to step on any toes.:devil: :devil:

SFV2RVR
02-26-2007, 05:50 AM
They are the best dogs i've ever owned! Its all the idiot owners who train them to fight who give them a bad name!

Old Texan
02-26-2007, 06:03 AM
My neighbor got 52 stitches in her face from her 14yo cocker spaniel..We have a 9yo pit at the farm that is a killer. He gets badgers, coyotes, and has even brought us turkeys. That being said, he has NEVER bitten or even growled at a human. Its all in the way you raise them.
Sorry, no offense, but I'd have to see a dog kill a badger in the wild with my own eyes to believe it.

photo chick
02-26-2007, 06:04 AM
Sorry, no offense, but I'd have to see a dog kill a badger in the wild with my own eyes to believe it.
I picked up on that one also.....hum??

NOTALENT
02-26-2007, 06:12 AM
Statistics show (at least last time I checked) that Labradors had the most recorded attacks. Most pitbulls are raised poorly or to fight, so no doubt they are going to eventually attack someone. If you raise them right with love they are some of the most loyal dogs kind dogs. The only reason its such a big deal when they attack is because they are able to inflict a whole lot more damage then all other dogs.
I thinke Chiwawas (or however you spell it) are the meanest dogs, but you can kick a field goal with them little fockers :D They wont cause much damage.

Old Texan
02-26-2007, 06:17 AM
For every responsible dog owner there are probably 10 that are not responsible. When animals are kept tied or penned with little attention they naturally become aggressive. If they get loose they often pose a threat.
If a small breed gets loose and becomes aggressive, generally no harm. If a pit or large breed get aggressive usually their is tragedy.
My experience with pits has been they are often unpredictable and this is why many communities and HOA's have banned or restricted them.
Due to a number of incidents TX is looking at passing a very
restrictive "agressive dog" ordinance. It may not be right or fair but something must be done to deal with the "irresponsible" owners.

x7734x
02-26-2007, 06:20 AM
I was attacked by a pit when I was 10 years old (i'm 29 now). that was the most trammatic experience in my life. I was within an inch of dying, he bit through my back and almost into my kidney also mauled my legs but didn't pierce the skin. I know it's not the breed of animal but I do find myself even to this day very timid around pits.
I do have one question did anyone hear about the baby girl I think it was in Texas (correct me if I am wrong) that had 3 toes on her foot knawed off by a 9 month old pit? Now I know that the baby had to be screaming in absoulte agony and the pit just kept knawing away.

My Man's Sportin' Wood
02-26-2007, 06:21 AM
Statistics show (at least last time I checked) that Labradors had the most recorded attacks.
I would like to see that source.
I had one of those fighting pitbulls try to come through my window at me while I was sitting at my kitchen table on my laptop. He is dead now, thankfully.
I honestly have seen great pitbulls, and I honestly believe that any dog put into a loving environment has the potential to be a good dog. But, I think that for the most part, they are more aggressive than a lot of other breeds. When I see a pitbull coming on my property at me, I am afraid. When I see a labrador, I am not. No way, no how. (We live in the boondocks, it happens all the time)

Smokin Cigarettes
02-26-2007, 06:27 AM
Sorry, no offense, but I'd have to see a dog kill a badger in the wild with my own eyes to believe it.
I hear you they are nasty. He has brought 2 up to the house that I know of. I would not think they were already dead. This is an ugly azz pit with many scars. I'll get some pics next time I am up there!

My Man's Sportin' Wood
02-26-2007, 06:31 AM
This is taken from doglaw.com which I got through an insurance agency
It is an adobe file, so I can't copy parts of it here. The # on the left is total incidents and the #s on the right are broken down. I don't think Labs compare with Pitbulls.
dog bite statistics as of 2006 (http://www.dogbitelaw.com/Dog%20Attacks%201982%20to%202006%20Clifton.pdf)

AZJD
02-26-2007, 06:53 AM
The most loyal dog I have ever owned. I have had 2 of them. Pitbulls are simply one of the strongest breeds of dogs. They are a direct extension of their owner. If an animal that is a sport breed is raised to be aggeressive it will be. Bully breeds are very loyal and good with kids.

AZJD
02-26-2007, 07:08 AM
And another thing. If you are commenting here do some research. Read a few books about the bully breed. These dogs are capable of doing damage by nature. This does not mean they are bred to attack.
If the a freaking Chihuahua was capable of doing damage I would fear them much more than a Pit. Every dog has a capability to be a dog. It is a chance every dog owner faces. Pitbulls are no exception to this, but they certainly don't have a predisposition to attacking kids or elderly!

HammerDown
02-26-2007, 07:23 AM
Two true stories...
this I personally witnessed when I was working on my boat. Just last Summer, and it happened in a matter of seconds, one of my neighbors (few doors down) Pit Bulls love children soooo much that when a little 5 year boy was simply riding is bike past their house (common rear driveway) the Dog tore through the rear screen door chased after the kid and locked down on the kids leg...and wouldn't let go until the owner ran out after him... I also ran after the dog w/a 4' hunk of pipe to free the jaws from the kids flesh.:mad:
Then, just a few weeks ago...another neighbor (further down the street) has one of these loving dogs, it went right through their outside front screen door when a mail carrier simply put the mail in the outside screen doors mail slot. The owner of the Dog said the mail carrier had no business delivering the mail w/the main door was open .:rolleyes:
Ohhhh yea...great animals.

All-Star
02-26-2007, 08:11 AM
My friends (Single mom) owns a pit. I think he is about 2 years old now. Really loving dog. The only problem(s) that I see that she has with him is... he is too strong for her. He takes her for a DRAG when she tries to walk him.
I understand the tendencies.... but there are other dogs that have certain negetive tendencies and I think they are all encompassed under the "PIT BULL" name. They do get blamed for a lot of things.
But When I was 13 there was a local pit bull that the owners could never keep in the house. That dog could jump out 6 foot fence to get to our dog that was in heat.... (Multiple times over the years) Then we would keep her in the house so he could not get to her.... so one night we we woke up by this dog jumping through our front window to get to her. We had to close all of the doors and tilt our kitchen table up on its side so he could not get into the rest of the house. It was scary.
We also saw that sme dog kill many, many many cats.
I personally think some dogs are wacked in the head. I had one dog... that is always described as lovable, loyal, good with kids, etc..... (Bichon Frise) he kept giving weird feelings when he would look at me all crazy like, and twice he snapped at me for no reason. SO he is history But I kept the other Bichon because she is so lovable and she is the perfect little dog.
You NEVER KNOW. I am pretty much affraid of ALL dogs, until I get to know them.
I think that this is the same thing as being prejudice. Like saying that a certain race is more violent then another because there are more violent crimes committed by a certain race. Or there are more of a certain race in prison, so they must be a crappy, violent race. NO... IT IS MOSTLY DUE TO THEIR ENVIROMENT, and then a small amount of genetics.:idea:
Just my opinion.

photo chick
02-26-2007, 08:20 AM
I was attacked by a pit when I was 10 years old (i'm 29 now). that was the most trammatic experience in my life. I was within an inch of dying, he bit through my back and almost into my kidney also mauled my legs but didn't pierce the skin. I know it's not the breed of animal but I do find myself even to this day very timid around pits.
I do have one question did anyone hear about the baby girl I think it was in Texas (correct me if I am wrong) that had 3 toes on her foot knawed off by a 9 month old pit? Now I know that the baby had to be screaming in absoulte agony and the pit just kept knawing away.
I remember that, I also remember thinking...where's the parents...a 3 year old alone for any amount of time with a dog???? The 3 year old was probably tormenting him!

HM
02-26-2007, 08:21 AM
I got rid of my Toy Beagle (under 13"), Daphne, because she was getting aggresive with my daughter who was 1 year old. She did not like kids in general, but if they didn't bother her, she didn't bother them. But, when my daughter came along, she decided it was time to establish dominance. Topless is very familiar with Daphne as she helped find a home for her. It was tough because she was my princess.
So, I picked up a Pit Bull/ Mastiff puppy from another board member. This dog is now a little over a year old and about 110 lbs....and still filling out. He scares the shiat out of people as he looks like a giant pitbull. But, he is a gigantic doofus. While I wouldn't call him docile, because he is a clutz, he loves the kids.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/447rocky.jpghttp://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/447rocky__1_.jpg

dmontzsta
02-26-2007, 08:33 AM
I grew up with a red nose pitbull, my parents got him when I was less than 1 year old and we had him until I was 13 years old.
When I was a little kid I used to ride his back like a horse and do all the stupid kid stuff, he never once snapped on me. He was only aggressive with men in uniform! :)

COELIMINATOR
02-26-2007, 08:35 AM
I remember that, I also remember thinking...where's the parents...a 3 year old alone for any amount of time with a dog???? The 3 year old was probably tormenting him!
I believe it was a 3 MONTH old child. That is sad.
Sam

photo chick
02-26-2007, 08:37 AM
I believe it was a 3 MONTH old child. That is sad.
Sam
OK that's even worse then..........where were the parents!!!!!!!

COELIMINATOR
02-26-2007, 08:38 AM
It is illegal to own a Pit in Denver.
Sam

HammerDown
02-26-2007, 08:58 AM
OK that's even worse then..........where were the parents!!!!!!!
The Pit Bull ate them...

photo chick
02-26-2007, 09:00 AM
The Pit Bull ate them...
:D :D :D :eek: :D :D :D

Sherpa
02-26-2007, 09:06 AM
I was bit by a german shepard while delivering papers on my route when I was
15.......
I was scratched up by a neighbor-kids black lab when I was about 11.
I've been chased numerous times by small packs of dogs, and was "corralled"
by about 6 dogs once while riding my little motorcycle....
I've never been bit or chased by a pit............
I would never turn my back ever on a pit.......... I won't allow my kids to
pet nor get near a pit.......
I'd have ZERO negative conscious about shooting a pit in the head if it ever
made an agreesive move towards anyone in my family. pretty much wouldn't
worry for a second about doing that to any animal though if I felt my family
were in danger.....
--Sherpa

AZJD
02-26-2007, 09:09 AM
I was bit by a german shepard while delivering papers on my route when I was
15.......
I was scratched up by a neighbor-kids black lab when I was about 11.
I've been chased numerous times by small packs of dogs, and was "corralled"
by about 6 dogs once while riding my little motorcycle....
I've never been bit or chased by a pit............
I would never turn my back ever on a pit.......... I won't allow my kids to
pet nor get near a pit.......
I'd have ZERO negative conscious about shooting a pit in the head if it ever
made an agreesive move towards anyone in my family. pretty much wouldn't
worry for a second about doing that to any animal though if I felt my family
were in danger.....
--Sherpa
Do you carry raw meat in your pockets or something? :D :D :D

38687
02-26-2007, 09:14 AM
For every responsible dog owner there are probably 10 that are not responsible. When animals are kept tied or penned with little attention they naturally become aggressive. If they get loose they often pose a threat.
If a small breed gets loose and becomes aggressive, generally no harm. If a pit or large breed get aggressive usually their is tragedy.
My experience with pits has been they are often unpredictable and this is why many communities and HOA's have banned or restricted them.
Due to a number of incidents TX is looking at passing a very
restrictive "agressive dog" ordinance. It may not be right or fair but something must be done to deal with the "irresponsible" owners.
Texas sux!!!

C-2
02-26-2007, 09:18 AM
About time we argued about dogz - there hasn't been a good dog thread for some time now....
I'm gonna sit this one out.
Looks like pit haters are doing fine and taking an early lead - I'm sure that'll change as the day progresses along....:D

Biglue
02-26-2007, 09:26 AM
Statistics show (at least last time I checked) that Labradors had the most recorded attacks. Most pitbulls are raised poorly or to fight, so no doubt they are going to eventually attack someone. If you raise them right with love they are some of the most loyal dogs kind dogs. The only reason its such a big deal when they attack is because they are able to inflict a whole lot more damage then all other dogs.
I thinke Chiwawas (or however you spell it) are the meanest dogs, but you can kick a field goal with them little fockers :D They wont cause much damage.
BUt then again Labs are far more popular and probably outnumber many other breeds people keep as pets. Our Lab is a very cool dog.

Screemy1
02-26-2007, 09:26 AM
I think that if you have a dog that slightly resembles a pit..... it just gives people ammo to sue you.... it is sad.... I had a pit mix with a pointer.... she was the best dog and never bit anyone.... she did get excited and would run towards people to greet them.... and of course people would freak out and think she was going to attack...... No matter what i did to train her.... she would still get excited and run up and sniff/greet. She never jumped up or licked.... just a sniff.... so I never was concerned.... Then of course that screwed me..... she was in my yard, on a long cable in the front with me as I washed a car... some church people including an old man came up to me trying to spread their word.... of course my dog runs up, never touching him.... but he gets scared and falls back on the driveway.... the fuc_er sued saying my PIT BULL attack him... what an a_ _ hole..... I had to have her put down or I would have lost my house insurance.... and that a hole got money because he couldn't stand on his feet...... I hate people who judge just becasue a dog looks scary to them, kind of a form of racism....:rolleyes:
so for now.... I prefer anybody I don't know to stay the **** off my property!!!!
oh yeah...... I would never keep a dog that was even the slightest aggressive towards people...... so NO, I do not condone people who keeps aggressive dogs..... as for dogs that charge at people from behind the fence..... why the heck would somebody keep that liability???

brianthomas
02-26-2007, 09:30 AM
I certainly believe labs have bit a lot of people but you can't just say they have bit more people than pits have as there are likely 20 labs in this country for every pit.
Pits have the ability to be very destructive to humans and are known to go off at the slightest thing even though the dog has been a total baby for all its life.
It all comes down to this, with all the great dogs in the world that are avilable to you why on earth take the chance of owning a pit?
Why chance it?????????????????
Could it possibly be worth the chance???????????

Biglue
02-26-2007, 09:33 AM
I had one of those fighting pitbulls try to come through my window at me while I was sitting at my kitchen table on my laptop. He is dead now, thankfully.
I had one charge at my daughter through a chain link fence. It it wasn't for that fence that stupid dog hit, my daughter would have been attacked for sure. She was just a toddler barely walking too. Scares the hell out of me just thinking about it.

77Woodbridge
02-26-2007, 09:36 AM
I call BS on "It's how you raise them", argument. It's in the dogs family tree. Aggressive dogs will be aggressive, regardless of how they are raised. I bought a pit without knowing the parents or about this. We got him at 7 weeks old a few days after school was out for the summer. My children and I took turns constantly handling the puppy and introduced him to cats, dogs and other people to socialize him. He was always in the house or traveling with us and crated when at school/work. We always reached into his bowl while he ate and took toys away from him as well. At 15 months old he starting becoming territorial. He started barking at neighbors and lunging at other dogs when out for walks. One day he picked up a rock while he was outside and carried it into the house. I tried to take it from him and he growled and then snapped at me when I yelled at him and reached for it again. After a week of talking to the Vet and others I decided to put him down. My children were 8,9 and 11 at the time. The absolute worst thing I've had to do...bar none. We never rough housed with him and he was fed Eukenuba from day one and treated as a member of the family. Sorry for the novel.

All-Star
02-26-2007, 09:40 AM
Oh and for the record... I have a lab/pit mix...
Best dog ever. Never would he bite anyone.
Infact, my crazy little dogs kick his arse.... and he just stands there and takes it.

photo chick
02-26-2007, 09:52 AM
I call BS on "It's how you raise them", argument. It's in the dogs family tree. Aggressive dogs will be aggressive, regardless of how they are raised. I bought a pit without knowing the parents or about this. We got him at 7 weeks old a few days after school was out for the summer. My children and I took turns constantly handling the puppy and introduced him to cats, dogs and other people to socialize him. He was always in the house or traveling with us and crated when at school/work. We always reached into his bowl while he ate and took toys away from him as well. At 15 months old he starting becoming territorial. He started barking at neighbors and lunging at other dogs when out for walks. One day he picked up a rock while he was outside and carried it into the house. I tried to take it from him and he growled and then snapped at me when I yelled at him and reached for it again. After a week of talking to the Vet and others I decided to put him down. My children were 8,9 and 11 at the time. The absolute worst thing I've had to do...bar none. We never rough housed with him and he was fed Eukenuba from day one and treated as a member of the family. Sorry for the novel.
Let me get this right, your dog growled and snapped at you once so you put him down?

syke-o
02-26-2007, 09:56 AM
i have a staffordshire bull terrier which is the english smaller version of the american pit bull terrier, which is referred to as "the nanny dog" referring to its fondness for children and how great they are around kids... i have 3 kids 4 and under and he wont even blink an eye when the kids terrorize him by jumpinig on him, pulling his tail, wrestling with him, poking him in the eye, whatever.. he just sits there and takes it.... i 100% trust him around any person or child.. i made sure he was socialized a t ayoung age by taking him to the dog park everyweekend and he also went to puppy training school to learn basic commands...
like alot of people have said on here, it is all on how they are raised and socialized as puppies, and that can be said for all breeds...
here is a good link..
http://www.pitbullproblem.tk/

77Woodbridge
02-26-2007, 10:00 AM
That's in addition to displaying other aggressive behavior. I was not going to come home one day and find my children mamed or dead because "something" triggered an attack. I wasn't willing to take that chance. It was not an easy decision, but it was the only one for me to make. Since dogs can't talk there is absolutely no way other than observing their behavior to assess threat potential. I wasn't going to gamble period.

photo chick
02-26-2007, 10:10 AM
That's in addition to displaying other aggressive behavior. I was not going to come home one day and find my children mamed or dead because "something" triggered an attack. I wasn't willing to take that chance. It was not an easy decision, but it was the only one for me to make. Since dogs can't talk there is absolutely no way other than observing their behavior to assess threat potential. I wasn't going to gamble period.
Not a choice I could ever make. I'm sorry you had to go through that!

COELIMINATOR
02-26-2007, 10:15 AM
That's in addition to displaying other aggressive behavior. I was not going to come home one day and find my children mamed or dead because "something" triggered an attack. I wasn't willing to take that chance. It was not an easy decision, but it was the only one for me to make. Since dogs can't talk there is absolutely no way other than observing their behavior to assess threat potential. I wasn't going to gamble period.
You made the RIGHT decision.
Sam

77Woodbridge
02-26-2007, 10:19 AM
Sorry but I believe that was your fault. My Rottie snaped at me once when she was 18 months old and I punched her in the nose, grabbed her face and yelled at her. She never did it again. Your dog was just showing who was leader of the pack and it wasn't you. You have to remember that dogs are still animals and some want to be the leader of the pack. Too bad for the dog.
So, you would expect my then 8 year old to be the alpha male? Come on...let's not and say that we did.

HammerDown
02-26-2007, 10:19 AM
Let me get this right, your dog growled and snapped at you once so you put him down?
Heck, if it were mine that dog would have tire tracks across its head.

photo chick
02-26-2007, 10:24 AM
Heck, if it were mine that dog would have tire tracks across its head.
I don't have children so maybe I shouldn't be arguing in here but my animals are my kids and I'd do anything for them!

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 10:29 AM
You know instead of my usual defense of pits.. Let talk about Dogs here for a second. Not the breed but the species as a whole. 77Bridge put his dog down becuase it started to show aggressive tendancies. I'm not going to pretend to know the whole story or that I was there.. I'll admit initially when I read the post I was like WTF? But being that he self admittedly said it was one of the hardest things he's had to do I'm sure there's more to the story.
99% of the time when a dog starts acting out like that though, or shows aggressive tendancies it's just a simple lack of communication between the animal and the owner. In the animal's mind IT'S THE BOSS, and they are making the decisions. If you can relay to the animal that not only is it not the boss, but it doesn't get the choice on making a decision but rather to follow your lead under all circumstances then you'll never have a problem.
Now I'm not exactly the dog whisperer over here so I can't say my pup is perfect. I can say I trust her completely around kids and other people, but other animals is another story, she either likes em or she doesn't and there doesn't seem to be an in between with regards to that. She makes up her mind and that's it.
I will however say though that I've done alot of reading with regards to the dog psychology and I realize that it's not her failing me, but rather me failing her as an owner and I'm trying to rectify that. I need to let her know that she doesn't get to make that choice, and once she understands that it won't be a problem anymore.
If your wondering if your Lab, Chow, Pit, Shepard, Collie etc.. thinks it's the boss or not there's a few simple questions that can answer that question.
When you open a door who goes through first? That's the boss.
when you take the dog for a walk, who's walking about front? That's the boss.
When it comes to a decision does the dog make it and then deal with the repercussions? Or does the dog look to you to see what's right?
If you've ever seen a homeless person with a dog, those dogs 9/10 aren't walking with a leash, and honestly could seem to careless about anything else going on around them except what their pack leader (homeless guy) is doing.
There's a guy called the "dog whisperer" aka Cesar Millan. He's got some very interesting things to note about dog psychology, and he's taken some of the most psycho animals on the planet and made them relatively dosile in his presence in a matter of hours. That being said how could it be the dog?
IT HAS TO BE THE OWNER in ALL INSTANCES short of mental illness in the animal. Maybe the owner has good intentions, but the fact of the matter is, if there's a lack of communication between the owner and the animal and it's a bully breed.. Well then there's a potential of a statistic.
Earlier in this thread All Star mentioned a woman whom has a dog that she can't control. That could very well end up being a statistic someday. :( Especially if she isn't going way out of her way (and I mean WAYYY OUTTA HER WAY) to get the best training money can buy. How can a dog look up to her as the pack leader when she can't even walk him? And most obviously just from the post her animal (dragging her) has already established that it's the boss.
RD

photo chick
02-26-2007, 10:35 AM
RD how's Neva doing...speaking of dogs?

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 10:39 AM
RD how's Neva doing...speaking of dogs?
Sleeping on my feet right now at work.. ;) I think she's doing a little better, she seems to be walking straighter (in my opinion), my g/f thinks she's about the same. I'm going to be taking her to the vet tomorrow at lunch so I'll definately let you know what they have to say! I want to ask them if there's anyway to test to see if she might've had a stroke.
RD

ZBODaytona
02-26-2007, 10:41 AM
Well said RD...heck i think that rule applies to more than just dogs..but that is another thread

HammerDown
02-26-2007, 10:47 AM
I don't have children so maybe I shouldn't be arguing in here but my animals are my kids and I'd do anything for them!
I also don't have any children and when I've had dogs in the past (most of my life) they were also treated and loved like they were part of me. I like Dogs...really, but this breed...nahhh no way.
When there's a breed of animal that has a history of attacking people as I've seen first hand a (4-5 year old child that was simply riding his bike in a common driveway) and know about on the same street...then maybe the ownership of such a breed should be reconsidered.
And here's another note...the owners of that dog have a little 5 year old girl and just now a newborn!
In their house, it's a horror movie just waiting to happen!

topless
02-26-2007, 10:50 AM
So, you would expect my then 8 year old to be the alpha male? Come on...let's not and say that we did.I never said that. What I did say is that if you don't show that you are in contoll that some dogs will take the initiative and be dominate. This does not just pertain to Pit Bulls but to ALL dogs.

Squeezing Spectra
02-26-2007, 11:04 AM
We have had 3 pits over the years and all have grown up with my neices and never a problem my current pit is 8 years old and still a great dog. :D
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q129/scupper500/motostuff/MVC-009S.jpg

Wmc
02-26-2007, 11:09 AM
I own a pit bull. My husband found him roaming through his company yard in compton 9 years ago. He was about 9 mos old when he brought Oliver home. We took him to the vet and had him neutered immediately. We have never had an issue with our dog. He has been raised with love and treated like one of the family. He plays with my moms pugs all the time. Never had an issue. Loves kids and people. I've never seen him get aggressive. http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2683IMG_0223_2_.JPG http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2683IMG_0223_2_.JPG

HEDJUG
02-26-2007, 11:10 AM
I don't care about the training methods.
I don't care about the amount of nice communications.
I don't care about any of that blabber.
What matters, is the dogs built in ablility to mangle everthing in front of it. Yes a mini schnauzer may take a swipe at you, but one slap in the nose & the dog runs & hides. A pit, rottie, chow, shepard & the like can't be stopped. They will attack you till they die, or you die & they have the ability to do it. Not one of those dogs has any buisness being around children & a few of them have no buisness being bred.
There is a big difference between a little ankle biter & a dog that can snap your leg bones in two.

Wmc
02-26-2007, 11:17 AM
I don't care about the training methods.
I don't care about the amount of nice communications.
I don't care about any of that blabber.
What matters, is the dogs built in ablility to mangle everthing in front of it. Yes a mini schnauzer may take a swipe at you, but one slap in the nose & the dog runs & hides. A pit, rottie, chow, shepard & the like can't be stopped. They will attack you till they die, or you die & they have the ability to do it. Not one of those dogs has any buisness being around children & a few of them have no buisness being bred.
There is a big difference between a little ankle biter & a dog that can snap your leg bones in two.
Well you keep your ankle bitter and I'll keep my loving pit bull.

topless
02-26-2007, 11:20 AM
I don't care about the training methods.
I don't care about the amount of nice communications.
I don't care about any of that blabber.
What matters, is the dogs built in ablility to mangle everthing in front of it. Yes a mini schnauzer may take a swipe at you, but one slap in the nose & the dog runs & hides. A pit, rottie, chow, shepard & the like can't be stopped. They will attack you till they die, or you die & they have the ability to do it. Not one of those dogs has any buisness being around children & a few of them have no buisness being bred.
There is a big difference between a little ankle biter & a dog that can snap your leg bones in two.Are you saying that any dog larger than a schauzer should be put to sleep because their owners might be negligent? You are one who has no business even owning a dog.

HM
02-26-2007, 11:21 AM
I don't have children so maybe I shouldn't be arguing in here but my animals are my kids and I'd do anything for them!
I know you say you would do anything for your animals, but when you have kids, it jumps to a whole new level. I have a sister who views her dogs and her horses as her children - and thinks she cares for them like they were. The problem is she thinks she can relate to the responsibilities of having children - and she really doesn't have a clue. Infact, she is bordering on being certifiably insane and she is loosing all respect at her job (where she is a VP and a Board Member) as she is turning into the preverbial cat lady....without the cats.
What was that movie...."The Truth about Cats and Dogs"
Repeat after me....
Us
Them
Us
Them
Us
Them
:D

blown65
02-26-2007, 11:23 AM
I don't care about the training methods.
I don't care about the amount of nice communications.
I don't care about any of that blabber.
What matters, is the dogs built in ablility to mangle everthing in front of it. Yes a mini schnauzer may take a swipe at you, but one slap in the nose & the dog runs & hides. A pit, rottie, chow, shepard & the like can't be stopped. They will attack you till they die, or you die & they have the ability to do it. Not one of those dogs has any buisness being around children & a few of them have no buisness being bred.
There is a big difference between a little ankle biter & a dog that can snap your leg bones in two.
I agree to a point. My parents owned two German Shepards while I was growing up. Those two dogs were the most protective dogs towards us kids. They are however a danger to others that would of messed with us. Very very owner protective. (We lived in the sticks, I'd never recommend owning that sort of dog in the city)
As for pits, they may be fine for some of ya and you have had good luck but myself I couldn't own one. Seems as the attacks from them seem to be quite a bit more vicious than an attack from a similar dog their size. That being said our 3rd one was the biggest baby ever. You could be a complete stranger and all that dog wanted to do is play fetch. I'm sure there are some complete docile Pits, you just don't hear much about them. (except of owners defending them)

photo chick
02-26-2007, 11:32 AM
I know you say you would do anything for your animals, but when you have kids, it jumps to a whole new level. I have a sister who views her dogs and her horses as her children - and thinks she cares for them like they were. The problem is she thinks she can relate to the responsibilities of having children - and she really doesn't have a clue. Infact, she is bordering on being certifiably insane and she is loosing all respect at her job (where she is a VP and a Board Member) as she is turning into the preverbial cat lady....without the cats.
What was that movie...."The Truth about Cats and Dogs"
Repeat after me....
Us
Them
Us
Them
Us
Them
:D
I don't have kids b/c I CAN'T relate to that responsibility, they scare the heck outta me!:D I'd rather stick to animals and view them as my kids. I am not certifiably insane though and I do know the difference! :D :) ;)

topless
02-26-2007, 11:33 AM
Growing up we had a German Shepard. Once we had a garage sale and sold my little sisters tricycle. When our dog saw the man leaving with it, she bit him on the ass. (I thought it was funny at the time)

HammerDown
02-26-2007, 11:34 AM
I http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2683IMG_0223_2_.JPG http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2683IMG_0223_2_.JPG
Cute pic but if I may say...maybe taking a chance.
Like someone else mentioned, Pit Bulls aren't some little ankle biters...if that dog decides he doesn't like kids sitting on his back anymore, he has the power to snap a leg or arm off in a NY second. (God forbid)

Evin Rude
02-26-2007, 11:37 AM
Here in Texas, at least 3 small children have been killed by pit bulls in less than a year, one less than 2 weeks ago. There have been many recent attacks by these dogs on children that did not result in death of the child. One grown man was killed by a pit bull. It was around Christmas time when he had went to a friends house to ask about adopting the dog and it attacked, crushing the mans throat and killed him. Sound like sweet family pets?
A small sample
http://search.chron.com/chronicle/openDocument.do?docRef=02_23_2007_2_pitbull23.x5&selectedPath=
http://search.chron.com/chronicle/openDocument.do?docRef=02_21_2007_2_b21dangerous_d ogs.x1
http://search.chron.com/chronicle/openDocument.do?docRef=04_05_2005_2_b05lege-dogs

MRS FLYIN VEE
02-26-2007, 11:38 AM
Pit bulldogs are known for determination and agressiveness, I doubt there is any dog on the planet pound for pound more destructive in a human attack than a pit, I have owned a couple good pits, but they have no buisness around children and the elderly, turn your head for a split second while your two year old samples old pits dinner bowl, and chances are if they survive the attack they will have scars to remind you the rest of your life............I know you dont like my opinion you think people "create" these monsters for the sport of dog fighting, and they do, cause they are naturals for it.........
my daughter and I would have to agree with this. She has over 50 stitch scars on her mouth alone. :( but she is still beautiful split second and she was just snipped at.
I don't hate all pits but that one was put down due to a nervous system gone wrong.:D

topless
02-26-2007, 11:40 AM
. Sound like sweet family pets?No, sounds like bad ownership.

Evin Rude
02-26-2007, 12:14 PM
Bad ownership is right.........but this is the way it goes down around here.
Pit Bulls are the dog of choice owned by gang bangers, drug dealers and just about anyone who wants to project the "I am a badass" image.
OK, so it just so happens that these fine citizens are also somewhat.......ummmmmm irresponsible (go figgure). They acquire these dogs as pups and when the dogs grow these irresponsible types find them to be a handfull and just flat dump them. Hummmm....pit bulls formerly owned by bangers running wild. Nice.
Now, who pays????
Well, so far small children do most of the paying, sometimes with their life. After the fact, the dogs owner cant be found and even if they could, wont cop to ownership. Who would of thought that?
Now the big question is, what to do?
Just like the one guy at the lake with the really loud boat that acts like an a$$hole, everybody with a zoom zoom boat ends up paying because of the new improved noise laws one a$$hole was responsible for causing.
Texas is about to slam all pit bull owners (and lots of other breeds) with some pretty serious requirements and penalties and you can bet all the good and honest owners will be the ones this hits.
Maybe though, we wont have any more dead children, killed by pit bulls. Somehow, I think that is good.

blown65
02-26-2007, 12:15 PM
No, sounds like bad ownership.
I dont buy that. Our three German Shepards were all raised nearly identical. Two were extremely defensive guard dogs, the third was the most passive dog you'd ever meet. I would bet money that some of these bad pits had nothing to do with how they were treated by their owners, but simply just a mean and a bad dog.

Wmc
02-26-2007, 12:22 PM
Cute pic but if I may say...maybe taking a chance.
Like someone else mentioned, Pit Bulls aren't some little ankle biters...if that dog decides he doesn't like kids sitting on his back anymore, he has the power to snap a leg or arm off in a NY second. (God forbid)
I'm a very smart dog owner, if I felt ever that my dog was getting snappish it would be time for him to go. I would never chance something to possibly happen to my children or anyone elses for that matter. My family and friends all love Oliver. He is a wonderful dog. I understand everyone's take on these dogs. He is part of our family and we love him. I'm not just going to get rid of him because of other pit bulls mishaps or wrong doings. I feel for those people that have been harmed by these dogs and killed, but just because of those instances, doesn't mean that all other pit bull dog owners must react and kill our dogs. That is rediculous to ask of us. I know a majority of pit bull dog owners are gang bangers and train their dogs to kill and hurt other, but we aren't!!!!

OCMerrill
02-26-2007, 01:31 PM
I suppose it would depend on the individual dog and its owner but....
I am not an aggressive dog owner. I dont torment my dogs, beat them with sticks and the like. Still, we had an issue..read on.
Sienna...our previous Lab (yellow) we got her as a 12 week old puppy back in '96 from a Lab rescue gal in Hesperia, Ca. This was a very cool dog, developed her "English words" over the years. Very smart. We got her before kids so when our daughter was born I was nervous. No problem, she was great. Years went by my son was born. Again everything was great.
Now fast forward to summer before last...we were camping in June Lake like we have done for years. Sienna goes everywhere with us and is constantly around people. On day three of the trip all the kids along with a few from another camp space were sitting on the ground, coloring. My dog of 9 years, while on her leash just snapped. Not the leash...the dog.
She pulled my wife off her chair, lunged at one of the campground kids and BIT him in the thigh. TOTALLY unprovoked. I owned this dog from 12 weeks until ll 9 years. Never a worry about this.
This brought on threats of being sued, doctor bills, paid quarantine, and then the VERY DIFFICULT DECISION to put her down. Think of it as the risk of leaving a loaded gun around. From that point on we just would never know.
Heart breaking experience. The fawking worst. My animal hurting someones else's kid.
So I ask all the experts WHY did she bite? :idea: Fact is only she knew.:idea:
Now...fast forward 4 months after all this went down we got yet another Lab puppy. This one black, still a female. Great dog now about 16 mo old. Just a pup and looking to be a good dog. Again just like the last she goes everywhere with us. But...I am gun shy about stranger kids hanging around.
So if a LAB can go sideways...so could any other breed.

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 01:43 PM
Then all of you that think it is the dog's fault then why don't you hand over your guns too, guns kill people not the guy that pulls the trigger right.

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 01:47 PM
http://myspace-100.vo.llnwd.net/01703/00/12/1703682100_thumb2.jpg
If I could post this i would if someone can make it go on the site I appreciate it if not watch this and how bad is one breed:confused:

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 01:48 PM
http://myspace-560.vo.llnwd.net/01691/06/59/1691449560_thumb1.jpg

C-2
02-26-2007, 01:50 PM
Then all of you that think it is the dog's fault then why don't you hand over your guns too, guns kill people not the guy that pulls the trigger right.
Yes put those on the list too.
Pit bulls
Guns
smokers
PWC's
Gays
Mexicans
.....did I leave anybody or anything out?

MRS FLYIN VEE
02-26-2007, 01:51 PM
Yes put those on the list too.
Pit bulls
Guns
smokers
PWC's
Gays
Mexicans
.....did I leave anybody or anything out?
lions
tigers
bears
:D

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 01:52 PM
http://myspace-560.vo.llnwd.net/01691/06/59/1691449560_thumb1.jpg

C-2
02-26-2007, 01:54 PM
Heart breaking experience. The fawking worst. My animal hurting someones else's kid.
.
Your logic does throw a wrench into everything. Sorry to hear about that, but your priorities are in the right place.
If my dog ever stares at my little sweetie wrong, and she survives my hands around her throat, she will be gone. Cowdog for the record.

My Man's Sportin' Wood
02-26-2007, 01:55 PM
99% of the time when a dog starts acting out like that though, or shows aggressive tendancies it's just a simple lack of communication between the animal and the owner. In the animal's mind IT'S THE BOSS, and they are making the decisions. If you can relay to the animal that not only is it not the boss, but it doesn't get the choice on making a decision but rather to follow your lead under all circumstances then you'll never have a problem.
When you open a door who goes through first? That's the boss.
when you take the dog for a walk, who's walking about front? That's the boss.
When it comes to a decision does the dog make it and then deal with the repercussions? Or does the dog look to you to see what's right?
Earlier in this thread All Star mentioned a woman whom has a dog that she can't control. That could very well end up being a statistic someday. :( Especially if she isn't going way out of her way (and I mean WAYYY OUTTA HER WAY) to get the best training money can buy. How can a dog look up to her as the pack leader when she can't even walk him? And most obviously just from the post her animal (dragging her) has already established that it's the boss.
RD
I would agree 100% Dogs by nature are pack animals. They need to know that they are at the bottom of the pack. Children do not need to be the "alpha male", but they need to be above the dog and the dog needs to know that. I had a really hard time doing this with my son who was 5 and our male lab. One way to do this is by letting the dog see the whole family eat, and then feed him/her after you all are done. That is how it is done in a pack. The leaders eat first, then on down the line.
If you don't tell them who the leaders are, they will tell you. This also goes for opening doors and walking them, as Dave said earlier.

C-2
02-26-2007, 01:55 PM
lions
tigers
bears
:D
Dare i say it.....
RHINO'S :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop:

MRS FLYIN VEE
02-26-2007, 01:56 PM
Dare i say it.....
RHINO'S :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop:
OH MY..:D

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 01:59 PM
Call me what you want whatever but i am a PROUD owner of pits and that is dumb, the comunist state of CA has SB 861, the right to destroy of pit bulls and ban breeding of them. But yet look at the big cities, how many Gangsters or whatever you wanna call them kill one an other every day why not ban people every day in LA i bet there are 4-5 guys killed over what nothing the color of their skin the color of bandana they wear, the what again but when there are less then 5 atacks in the united states per YEAR let's destroy a specific breed anyone in favor of this is an ignorant fool!!!

ONAROLL
02-26-2007, 02:01 PM
my daughter and I would have to agree with this. She has over 50 stitch scars on her mouth alone. :( but she is still beautiful split second and she was just snipped at.
I don't hate all pits but that one was put down due to a nervous system gone wrong.:D
During my career I have flown around thirty pitbull attacks, all critical, I have first hand sympathy for you and your daughter, ya just have to see the damage inflicted once you will never look at a pit bulldog as a pet again....Vic
and as a little info we use pits to hunt, 500 pound plus Russian boar can rip a man apart in a second, guess what we put between them and us? a good ole American Pit bull Terrior dressed in Kevlar......

MRS FLYIN VEE
02-26-2007, 02:02 PM
Call me what you want whatever but i am a PROUD owner of pits and that is dumb, the comunist state of CA has sb681, the right to destroy of pit bulls and ban breeding of them. But yet look at the big cities, how many Gangsters or whatever you wanna call them kill one an other every day why not ban people every day in LA i bet there are 4-5 guys killed over what nothing the color of their skin the color of bandana they wear, the what again but when there are less then 5 atacks in the united states per YEAR let's destroy a specific breed anyone in favor of this is an ignorant fool!!!
I know there are more than 5 attacks ayear by that kind of dog.. not all are reported.
But I see what you are saying. lets just drop a bomb in l.a and move to arizona.:D

YeLLowBoaT
02-26-2007, 02:03 PM
Something I have always found funny... why is it that ll dog owners say:" my dog would never do that"? No one knows whats going to happen tomarrow or even 5 mins from now.
If you read almost any account of a attack... you almost always see the owner saying "they never done anything like this before" or something simlar.
I made my mind up long ago, if I ever see a dog attacking anything, its dead. i don't care what kind of dog it is... If I ever happen to come apon a dog killing a child...the owner of that dog better hope the cops get to thier house before I do...the way I see it, they might as well just walked up and shot the kid.
I think what texas is doing is a great thing. IF it saves one life its worth it. I mean we are talking about dog here... whats more important the life of a humen or the life of a dog?

MRS FLYIN VEE
02-26-2007, 02:03 PM
During my career I have flown around thirty pitbull attacks, all critical, I have first hand sympathy for you and your daughter, ya just have to see the damage inflicted once you will never look at a pit bulldog as a pet again....Vic
and as a little info we use pits to hunt, 500 pound plus Russian boar can rip a man apart in a second, guess what we put between them and us? a good ole American Pit bull Terrior dressed in Kevlar......
Thank you.. she is doing great now.. she knows when she gets older she can have the scars lazored.. she calls them charactor scars.LOL!!:)

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 02:04 PM
Every Year in the USA
440,000 people die due to cigarettes!!!
40,000 people die in car accidents!!!
38,000 CHILDREN die in gun shot related injuries!!!
2,000 CHILDREN are killed by their own PARENTS!!!
3 people killed per year from Pit Bull attacks!!!
So where do we need to make changes in our society
where is the real problem???:idea:

MRS FLYIN VEE
02-26-2007, 02:05 PM
Every Year in the USA
440,000 people die due to cigarettes!!!
40,000 people die in car accidents!!!
38,000 CHILDREN die in gun shot related injuries!!!
2,000 CHILDREN are killed by their own PARENTS!!!
3 people killed per year from Pit Bull attacks!!!
So where do we need to make changes in our society
where is the real problem???:idea:
true and I agree..

YeLLowBoaT
02-26-2007, 02:07 PM
Every Year in the USA
440,000 people die due to cigarettes!!!
40,000 people die in car accidents!!!
38,000 CHILDREN die in gun shot related injuries!!!
2,000 CHILDREN are killed by their own PARENTS!!!
3 people killed per year from Pit Bull attacks!!!
So where do we need to make changes in our society
where is the real problem???:idea:
where did you get your info???
also how many children will be scared for life from pit attacks?

MRS FLYIN VEE
02-26-2007, 02:08 PM
where did you get your info???
also how many children will be scared for life from pit attacks?
I know of one for sure.

My Man's Sportin' Wood
02-26-2007, 02:11 PM
Then all of you that think it is the dog's fault then why don't you hand over your guns too, guns kill people not the guy that pulls the trigger right.
Your analogy is flawed. A gun doesn't have a mind to pick itself up and fire. A dog does. The two cannot be compared. With a dog, it pulls it's own trigger. With a gun, a person does. The gun is not the same as a dog, it is an inanimate object.
I hope no one thinks I am against pits. That is not the case. I would not have one because I am biased towards my goofy labs, but I judge each dog just as I do people, as an individual based on its own merit.

wright27
02-26-2007, 02:12 PM
I have owned 4 pits. IMO they are great dogs. Very loyal and loving dogs.
The problem I see is they are the bad ass of the dog world, so almost every low life looser in the hood has one or wants one. They can't raise there children or there dogs for that matter.

Debbolas
02-26-2007, 02:14 PM
Your analogy is flawed. A gun doesn't have a mind to pick itself up and fire. A dog does. The two cannot be compared. With a dog, it pulls it's own trigger. With a gun, a person does. The gun is not the same as a dog, it is an inanimate object.
I hope no one thinks I am against pits. That is not the case. I would not have one because I am biased towards my goofy labs, but I judge each dog just as I do people, as an individual based on its own merit.
Angie went to school :D Don't mess with her! ;)
(Hey, labs are goofy, aren't they :D)

ratso
02-26-2007, 02:15 PM
Every Year in the USA
440,000 people die due to cigarettes!!!
40,000 people die in car accidents!!!
38,000 CHILDREN die in gun shot related injuries!!!
2,000 CHILDREN are killed by their own PARENTS!!!
3 people killed per year from Pit Bull attacks!!!
So where do we need to make changes in our society
where is the real problem???:idea:
Cigarettes, cars, and guns don't have minds of their own.
The parents of the children should be in prison.
The Pit Bulls should be put down and the owners should be in prison.
I noticed you mentioned killed... what about maimed for life? Where are those stats? For the record, I own a chow.

My Man's Sportin' Wood
02-26-2007, 02:15 PM
(Hey, labs are goofy, aren't they :D)
I think Goofy was a black lab. I'm going to have to search now.

Debbolas
02-26-2007, 02:17 PM
I think Goofy was a black lab. I'm going to have to search now.
OMG!!
I was just thinking that :jawdrop:

ratso
02-26-2007, 02:18 PM
I have owned 4 pits. IMO they are great dogs. Very loyal and loving dogs.
The problem I see is they are the bad ass of the dog world, so almost every low life looser in the hood has one or wants one. They can't raise there children or there dogs for that matter.
I said it before...
Not all pit bull owners are pieces of shit... but most pieces of shit are pit bull owners.

wright27
02-26-2007, 02:18 PM
Dare i say it.....
RHINO'S :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop:
Rhino's and PWC are the same to me.
They both give people with no experience the opportunity to play were they don't belong.

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 02:19 PM
where did you get your info???
also how many children will be scared for life from pit attacks?
Ok but the government says we cannot beat our children, oh that means you cannot use a belt on your kids a$$ and look at kids these days they are hellion's... but there are 2000 kids yearly KILLED by their own parent's...
this weekend out at the races everyone near my pit was like oooohhhh sheeee is soooooo cute loook at her and petting her and loving on her, she is a year and a half and 60 lbs, noone there was even slightly intimidated by her well if they were they did not say nothing. so I saw no kids scared of her, and she was rolling around playing with a little girl that was maybe 4 so again you train a killer you get a killer, you raise your kids with discipline they will have it in their lives as well...
and most my facts come from:
http://www.sorryagain.com
http://www.understand-a-bull.com
http://www.workingpitbull.com
http://www.realpitbull.com
So yes I have read and do know what they are capable of but then again what are you capable of i get in your face with a loaded gun what are you going to do? Your going to shoot me before i shoot you yes, same as a dog you threaten in what they consider a threat them they act sometimes before you sometimes after if you train them not to feel fear of other's then they will not react to others and there will be no issues but you will always have an idiot in the bunch that has their dog to make them mean and scary.....

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 02:39 PM
They all are killers!!!
http://www.realpitbull.com/images/gallery/ace.jpg http://www.realpitbull.com/images/domino.jpg
http://www.realpitbull.com/images/gallery/clip_image002.jpg http://www.realpitbull.com/images/gallery/Chiefwearingsunglasses.jpg

Evin Rude
02-26-2007, 02:44 PM
Your analogy is flawed. A gun doesn't have a mind to pick itself up and fire. A dog does. The two cannot be compared. With a dog, it pulls it's own trigger. With a gun, a person does. The gun is not the same as a dog, it is an inanimate object.
Spot on!
Everyone that has one thinks its the best dog in the world and maybe so. The simple truth is these dogs are desired for their agressiveness by all the wrong types of people who then dump them when they become a problem.
Every week here in Texas there is another story of a small child attacked by pit bulls. 3 young children and one adult have been mauled and killed in less than a year. Most times there is no owner to hold responsible so the breed will be legislated against.
Like I said, I would think less mangled and dead children would seem to be a good thing to me. Maybe I am wrong.

rampgirl-top
02-26-2007, 02:47 PM
Chows & Pit Bulls and any mixed breeds like Chow-shepard are already treated like criminals in Texas. Prior to buying a house, I called about a couple rental homes and when inquiring about pets, they acted like I was an axe murderer because I have a chow-shepard mix. :(

YeLLowBoaT
02-26-2007, 02:49 PM
Chows & Pit Bulls and any mixed breeds like Chow-shepard are already treated like criminals in Texas. Prior to buying a house, I called about a couple rental homes and when inquiring about pets, they acted like I was an axe murderer because I have a chow-shepard mix. :(
In the defence of the home owner... those are big dogs and could do alot of damage to thier property.

rampgirl-top
02-26-2007, 02:55 PM
In the defence of the home owner... those are big dogs and could do alot of damage to thier property.
Well I know its already been said, but that is up to the owner of the dog. My dog is 55lbs and the only damage she does is leave a few hairs here and there.

syke-o
02-26-2007, 03:17 PM
there is also a problem with people lumping any attack by a dog that looks anything like a pitbull, as a pitbull.. there is actually an american pit bull terrier, an american stafforshire terrier, a stafforshire bull terrier, and a bull terrier(egg shape head) that everyone lumps together....
and i have a stafforshire bull terrier which
Description:
The Staffordshire Bull Terriers are have great strength for their size. They are stocky and muscular, but should also be active and agile. The breed is the 5th most popular dog in the UK (its place of origin), and it is the only breed to have the words 'totally reliable' in its breed standard. Furthermore, the Staffordshire Bull Terrier is one of only two breeds from over 190 recognized by the UK Kennel Club to have a mention of the breed's suitability with children

racecar.hotshoe
02-26-2007, 03:27 PM
Here is my story.The people across the street had two pits they were very good dogs untill there 5 year old was playing in the back yard and was attacked by one of the pits.to make a very long story short it took 250 stitches on the inside of the childs head and 350 on the outside to put him back together again.I will stick to my Rotts...............Sorry carry on,Mark

syke-o
02-26-2007, 03:31 PM
Here is my story.The people across the street had two pits they were very good dogs untill there 5 year old was playing in the back yard and was attacked by one of the pits.to make a very long story short it took 250 stitches on the inside of the childs head and 350 on the outside to put him back together again.I will stick to my Rotts...............Sorry carry on,Mark
rotts dont have the best reputation etiher my friend...:idea:

ratso
02-26-2007, 03:31 PM
Chows & Pit Bulls and any mixed breeds like Chow-shepard are already treated like criminals in Texas. Prior to buying a house, I called about a couple rental homes and when inquiring about pets, they acted like I was an axe murderer because I have a chow-shepard mix. :(
I ran across that because of my chow...:(

jdf
02-26-2007, 04:51 PM
I don't care about the training methods.
I don't care about the amount of nice communications.
I don't care about any of that blabber.
What matters, is the dogs built in ablility to mangle everthing in front of it. Yes a mini schnauzer may take a swipe at you, but one slap in the nose & the dog runs & hides. A pit, rottie, chow, shepard & the like can't be stopped. They will attack you till they die, or you die & they have the ability to do it. Not one of those dogs has any buisness being around children & a few of them have no buisness being bred.
There is a big difference between a little ankle biter & a dog that can snap your leg bones in two.
blow me bone head

racecar.hotshoe
02-26-2007, 05:27 PM
rotts dont have the best reputation etiher my friend...:idea:
Been to a rott fight latey?........I didnt think so.....:D

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 05:30 PM
You know the people on here arguing that pit's should be put down, shot, outlawed no longer bread etc.. It doesn't much matter what you say to them, they are going to think what they think. Especially on a message board where flared emotions and keyboard courage come into play. Sitting behind this screen guys on here say things like
"If a pitbull ever came near my child I'd shoot it and ask questions later"
These same people in some cases already have come by my house, and in others probably will swing by the house for a beer.. When they arrive they usually walk up pet the dog and say "What a beautiful dog! What kind is that?" In many cases that same viscious beast is often the entertainment for many random kids for hours on end.
You guys are right, all pits are dangerous.. Chow's are often recognized as the worst breed on the planet becuase they'll turn on their own families without warning.
I have a 3/4 pit 1/4 chow mix.. I'm screwed. She's a ticking time bomb waiting to happen. I'm going to go have her put down this week.
Thanks for swaying my opinion on how dangerous my dog is, had I known that she had been secretly planning to maul my unborn children I would've put her down a long time ago..
I'll definately check the AKC temperment list to see which breed is most likely to bite before I get my next dog.. Maybe a cockerspaniel? Nope those are at the top of the list.. Maybe a Lab? nope those are in the middle somewhere if memory serves.. Definately not a pitbull though. Wait a minute they are 3RD ON THE LIST!! From the bottom.. In terms of likeliness to bite a person in their lifetime. That's straight from the AKC, NOT SOME PITBULL ADOPTION skewed statistic.
Your 100% right about them all being viscious killers.. 3rd most likely dog to NEVER bite a human in there lifetime.
I'll admit it, My dog will flat fock shit up if it comes game day. Other dogs, coyotes, bobcats, intruder, someone attacking myself, g/f. I'm happy that she's more then capable to do that. It's nice to know that my g/f going on walks by herself atleast has some form of personal protection with her.
Difference between my dog and a gun? The dog DOES have a mind of it's own, and she has a sense of hearing, smell and night vision that rivals humans. What does that mean? Read below
4:00 in the morning you hear noises in your house. It's pitch black and you see someone holding something that shimmers in the little light that you have. If your a gun owner odds are your filling that guy full of hot lead. You shoot first turn on the lights and see a buddy of yours that just got in a fight with his g/f.. Figured he'd help himself to some pie before crashing out in your guest room.
If it's my house dog went out into the hall way recognized my friend.. Begged for some food and went back to bed, all the while I had a peaceful nights sleep.
I'd argue my dog is safer then owning a gun. 7 year old can play with my dog all day long. 7 year old could find a gun in a drawer and you got another statistic and a story for an aftershcool special movie.
The bottom line the people that are arguing that these dogs are the worst are simply uninformed. The peoples who's dogs begain to behave differently for unexplained reasons just don't understand their dogs. Bottom line they need to learn more about the psychology of dogs, and maybe talk to some specialists. Dogs don't do things for "no reason" as has been proclaimed in this thread. There's ALWAYS a reason, just most times we don't know what it is, and becuase their psychology is different then ours we usually believe it to be unprovoked.
RD

jdf
02-26-2007, 05:35 PM
rd ,well said

racecar.hotshoe
02-26-2007, 05:36 PM
rd ,well said
RD SUX............:D

Sherpa
02-26-2007, 05:37 PM
I'm a very smart dog owner, if I felt ever that my dog was getting snappish it would be time for him to go. I would never chance something to possibly happen to my children or anyone elses for that matter. My family and friends all love Oliver. He is a wonderful dog. I understand everyone's take on these dogs. He is part of our family and we love him. I'm not just going to get rid of him because of other pit bulls mishaps or wrong doings. I feel for those people that have been harmed by these dogs and killed, but just because of those instances, doesn't mean that all other pit bull dog owners must react and kill our dogs. That is rediculous to ask of us. I know a majority of pit bull dog owners are gang bangers and train their dogs to kill and hurt other, but we aren't!!!!
unfortunate for you to "think" you could stop your own dog from killing someone. and it's about *that quick from what I've read, seen, heard about.
so what makes you mr dog-controller over a pit (which BTW could kick YOUR
ass probably just as much) so, you're at work, kiddos are at home, wifey
is in the kitchen, the kiddos leave the front door open just a little bit, and
the unexected UPS man knocks on the door, and the dog goes apeshit for
him.......... it's a 3 minute battle, your kids watch as poor brown goes down
on your porch............ the wife is hysterical, trying to stop the dog..........
and now you're screwed.........
--Sherpa
I'll take my chances with most* other breeds, but being a parent with small
girls, I'd hafta be packing to go to someones house with a pit.

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 05:38 PM
Been to a rott fight latey?........I didnt think so.....:D
That's has nothing to do with their temperment. It's becuase they'd get taken apart in about 5 seconds. Rotts weren't meant to fight other animals. They were meant to take down Humans.
Want to talk about breeding for certain characteristics?
RD

racecar.hotshoe
02-26-2007, 05:41 PM
That's has nothing to do with their temperment. It's becuase they'd get taken apart in about 5 seconds. Rotts weren't meant to fight other animals. They were meant to take down Humans.
Want to talk about breeding for certain characteristics?
RD
I think if you read up on Rotts they were bred to kill bear...

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 05:41 PM
--Sherpa
I'll take my chances with most* other breeds, but being a parent with small
girls, I'd hafta be packing to go to someones house with a pit.
Sherpa do you know how ridiculous this sounds? Do you know how many ***boat members have come by my house with their kids? Do you know how many have brought their kids to my house for weekend visits?
Ask ANY OF THEM if EVER they felt their child was in any danger from my dog.. As well ask any of the kids if their were afraid of her? C'mon man.. I know it's easy to spout off on the internet, but honestly if you were to come by my house and the dog bothered ya that much I'd stick her in the bedroom for your very short stay.
RD

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 05:43 PM
I think if you read up on Rotts they were bred to kill bear...
Might have to do some reading again, I think I might be confusing Rotts with a doberman.. I thought they were bread to patrol prisons or something? Who knows, I'll read up on it when I get a chance. In either event they don't hold up too well against smaller faster dogs in a fight situation, that is the reason they aren't fought in the ghetto.
RD

racecar.hotshoe
02-26-2007, 05:45 PM
Might have to do some reading again, I think I might be confusing Rotts with a doberman.. I thought they were bread to patrol prisons or something? Who knows, I'll read up on it when I get a chance. In either event they don't hold up too well against smaller faster dogs in a fight situation, that is the reason they aren't fought in the ghetto.
RD
I just use my three to eat up 100lbs of dog food a week....And a few shoes that were left out.lol

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 06:03 PM
I'm a very smart dog owner, if I felt ever that my dog was getting snappish it would be time for him to go. I would never chance something to possibly happen to my children or anyone elses for that matter. My family and friends all love Oliver. He is a wonderful dog. I understand everyone's take on these dogs. He is part of our family and we love him. I'm not just going to get rid of him because of other pit bulls mishaps or wrong doings. I feel for those people that have been harmed by these dogs and killed, but just because of those instances, doesn't mean that all other pit bull dog owners must react and kill our dogs. That is rediculous to ask of us. I know a majority of pit bull dog owners are gang bangers and train their dogs to kill and hurt other, but we aren't!!!!
I just wanted to coment on this. Dog psychology and human psychology are very different. You should be proactive in learning the dog psychology (honestly it doesn't take as much time as you'd think). If you learn it, then your dog will never become "snappish" becuase it'll know that your the boss and it's low man on the totum pole. If your reactive then someday that dog WILL test the boundaries to see who's boss and your potentially going to be out one good dog.
RD

Ned S
02-26-2007, 06:31 PM
We kept our daughters pit bull at our home for about a year while their new home was being built. She is a very lovable dog, listens well, raised and trained properly and is very good around children.
Well one day when they were out of town and I heard all these news stories about children being mauled so I had to find out for myself. I got her out of her cage put on an old thick shirt and a pair of welding gloves.
Well let me tell you don't try this at home kids. All I did was get the dog to play, nothing to hurt her, just pester her a bit. A little teasing soon turned into a battle that would end in death without proper equipment. These dogs seem to be relentless, they will not quit attacking until their opponent is mauled or dead. The pitt just playing could have easily killed a child, she thought it was fun. I am glad the dog is in her new home now as we have neighbors with children and I would not want to be sued.
The best dog I have ever had was an old english sheepdog. With very little training she would stay in the yard and growl and herd visitors. One day I had a salesman that was trapped on my porch for an hour;) Guess he left his phone in the car.

Burn504
02-26-2007, 06:47 PM
most of the negative responses on this thread are from ignorant people or someone who has had a bad experience. When i was 2yrs old i was attacked by a cat. Tore my chest open and my hand. When i was like 9 i had a german shepherd jump on my back when i turned away from him. Point is... everyone has a story.. everyone knows someone who has been attacked by something.
Ive seen reports showing pitbulls at the top and Ive seen reports where they didnt even make the top 100 in dog attacks. Pitbull is a slang term for many different breeds of Terrier(which refers to 7-9 different breeds of them).
Here is mine. I got him when he was 7 weeks old. He is now 5. Doofus.. clutz.. docile.. child friendly... not food aggressive.. not animal aggressive. None of that. He wasnt trained especially for any of that other than common sense. He was taught not to bite.. he was taught not to jump... its all in the owner.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-013F.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-004F.jpg

SFV2RVR
02-26-2007, 07:28 PM
most of the negative responses on this thread are from ignorant people or someone who has had a bad experience. When i was 2yrs old i was attacked by a cat. Tore my chest open and my hand. When i was like 9 i had a german shepherd jump on my back when i turned away from him. Point is... everyone has a story.. everyone knows someone who has been attacked by something.
Ive seen reports showing pitbulls at the top and Ive seen reports where they didnt even make the top 100 in dog attacks. Pitbull is a slang term for many different breeds of Terrier(which refers to 7-9 different breeds of them).
Here is mine. I got him when he was 7 weeks old. He is now 5. Doofus.. clutz.. docile.. child friendly... not food aggressive.. not animal aggressive. None of that. He wasnt trained especially for any of that other than common sense. He was taught not to bite.. he was taught not to jump... its all in the owner.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-013F.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-004F.jpg
Amen! Nice 1st post Burn504. Welcome to the boards.:D

My Man's Sportin' Wood
02-26-2007, 07:52 PM
What do you mean I can't go??????
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-004F.jpg
That expression is priceless

Boa1277
02-26-2007, 07:59 PM
Wow, I truly am amazed at how many people truly do not understand the Pit Bull, I read your posts and I am baffled at how many of you are just spreading the drama a newspaper columnist creates everytime he want to sell a paper. If you truly do the research the people hurt or bitten by a pure bred pitbull is almost nill to none. The breed was bred to fight many many years went into this process, but it was bred to be dog aggressive not people aggresive, in fact if a pitbull ever showed any type of human aggression he was immediately culled by a true dogman. I will briefly explain how a true dog fight goes down you have two dogs and two handlers, the dogs are washed and weighed and if everything goes as planned they are placed in a pit with the handlers and the referee, the referee instructs the handlers to release their dogs and they usually cross the pit not growling not barking not showing their teeth, and start wrestling for a hold once the do get a hold they start working it until they either get a better hold or the other dog get out of the hold, now this is where it gets interesting, the two dogs fighting are actually having the time of their lives they are doing what they were bred for centuries to do, their tales are wagging. Now once one of the dogs even slightly turns away from the other dog the referee or one of the handlers will ask for a turn and the dogs are taken back into their prospective corner, the ref at this time will ask the owner of the dog that turned to release his dog, at which time the dog should cross a line called the scratch line and attempt to get a hold of the opponent. The whole time the other handler is holding his dog and just before the other dog get a hold he releases him, now at this time the dogs continue to do their thing. Until the Ref see a opportunity to have the handlers grab their animals. The whole time the handlers are right up next to their dogs if and I mean if the dogs were going to bite they would do while they were all worked up and in the middle of their fight. Guess what they do not, in fact if they did the true dog man would cull the dog. Also if one of the dogs does not want to fight anymore or even will not cross the scratch line the other dog is considered the victor. These dogs are not pushed to fight in fact if they dont want to fight they dont fight period. A true pure bred pitbull will not show human aggresive behavior, they make horrible watch dogs, strangers can come right up to the fence and pet them any time. Now the problem comes from pitbull mixes and people breeding them who are trying to make a quick buck, they dont do it properly and they dont cull the bad ones. Also the new fad is the so called Monster Pit, these are the pitbulls that are over 75lbs, I tell you right now if you have a pitbull over 75 lbs he has been cross bred somewhere in his lineage, the pitbull it a terrier and the size should be anywhere from 25 to 65lbs is standard and a huge one would be 70+lbs. I have never ever been to a dog fight but I have owned a few pitbulls, the first one I owned was a 3/4 Pit and 1/4 Shepard mix, guess what it bit my niece, luckily nothing permanent, I was astounded and very sad this went down, so I decided to really study the breed I purchased countless books and learned a lot and after I figured out, you need to purchase a dog from a true dogman and it needs to be a true pure bred, I realized I could own this dog again. I have had 3 pure bred pitbulls, they are the best dog in my opinion for me. Every dog breed has a specific type of owner, pitbull owners should be very active and very disciplined, they must excercise their dog daily they must take extra precautions that the dog does not get a chance to go after another dog and they must never ever leave a child unattended with the dog, it is not worth it, this goes for all breeds of dogs, I do not care how long you have owned the dog or how old or how sweet, the damn thing is a dog and you cannot read its mind, you never ever know what will make a dog bite or react so why take the chance. Especially with a pit bull or any other dog that is capable of doing alot of damage. If you really want to learn a good book to read is Richard Strattons The American Pit Bull Terrier.

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 08:13 PM
Well here's a video of a dog fight.. Not exactly the way you said it goes down, but none the less..
Dog fight (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ezjv20MzvE)
RD

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 08:18 PM
you know what lets actually watch some of that "fighting" in action.. Seriously I don't have video of my dog with my parents toy poodles (i'll get some soon enough) but to the guy that said they don't play gently? They are pretty intelligent animals, my dog wrestles pretty hard with a 7 lb crazy toy poodle yet it comes away unscathed everytime?
Pitbull vs Mini Shnauzer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jY5bVRkGyp4&mode=related&search=)
RD

Wmc
02-26-2007, 08:34 PM
unfortunate for you to "think" you could stop your own dog from killing someone. and it's about *that quick from what I've read, seen, heard about.
so what makes you mr dog-controller over a pit (which BTW could kick YOUR
ass probably just as much) so, you're at work, kiddos are at home, wifey
is in the kitchen, the kiddos leave the front door open just a little bit, and
the unexected UPS man knocks on the door, and the dog goes apeshit for
him.......... it's a 3 minute battle, your kids watch as poor brown goes down
on your porch............ the wife is hysterical, trying to stop the dog..........
and now you're screwed.........
--Sherpa
I'll take my chances with most* other breeds, but being a parent with small
girls, I'd hafta be packing to go to someones house with a pit.
I never said that my dog was attacking someone, I said if he got snappish, not as if he is attacking someone. I've had my dog for almost 10 years and NEVER has anything happened. It's like having a focking chihuahau, ok smart ass. I think you think your talking to some smart ass guy (with a bad ass pit bpull), but you not, you are talking with a wife, who has children and a husband and friends that love our dog.
We are all intitled to our opinions and I have one. I know all the statistics and read all the stories and here about them on the news. I feel badly for all those people who have been harmed. I am sorry for Mrs. Flyin Vees daughter, that breaks my heart. I know they have a harsh bite, that is very hard if at all to release. Fortunately for our family we have a wonderful pit bull in our home. If we didn't he would not be here.
So take your smart ass remarks and focked up scenarios and stick them where the sun don't shine. Oh and by the way the Verizon Fios guy loved my dog.

bigq
02-26-2007, 08:39 PM
I think if you read up on Rotts they were bred to kill bear...
Actually that is the Akita, had two of them and the male I would never leave alone with anyone unless i was there. The female was a peach though. A lot has to do with the temperment of the dog itself, just like a crazy human. That being saaid i do not trust a lot of dogs and would not leave my kids alone with any dog right from the get go. I have been attacked twice in my life one was a Saint Bernard and the other was a Shepard mix, the bernard was painful:( .
Both my Akitas were in dog fights once was my fault with the female and the other was on a walk with my male, oddly enough both times were pits. I was pissed about the female it was being egged on by three teenage guys that let the pit attack my dog in an ally. I heard it start and ran around the corner to see them cheering on the pit:mad: unfortunatly for them the Akita is no slouch in dog fights and was pretty much on top of the pit by the time i got there to pull her off and then this pit comes after me. So while kicking this dog the guys are yelling at me while I am trying to stop the fight and not get bit. Finally the owner pull his pit back and we got the hell out of there. I really wanted to bust there ass, but i am just to nice for that.:D
Anyway it could have been any of the more aggressive type breeds and I think it is a combo of owners and the actual temper of the dog, the breeding lines.

02HoWaRd26
02-26-2007, 09:06 PM
\. I was pissed about the female it was being egged on by three teenage guys that let the pit attack my dog in an ally. I heard it start and ran around the corner to see them cheering on the pit:mad: unfortunatly for them the Akita is no slouch in dog fights and was pretty much on top of the pit by the time i got there to pull her off and then this pit comes after me. So while kicking this dog the guys are yelling at me while I am trying to stop the fight and not get bit. Finally the owner pull his pit back and we got the hell out of there. I really wanted to bust there ass, but i am just to nice for that.:D
As you just said "The owners(three young kids) were egging this attack" the dog was not attacking to attack he was doing wrong yes but he was only being loyal to his owner...

C-2
02-26-2007, 09:06 PM
most of the negative responses on this thread are from ignorant people or someone who has had a bad experience.
FWIW
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you are correct - if somebody had a bad experience, then yes, there might be a negative response.
And how can a person who has had a bad experience be ignorant about it?
I'm not reading too many "I read it in the paper" stories which aren't backed up by personal experiences.
Just busting your arse, welcome to the site.:D

RiverDave
02-26-2007, 09:25 PM
FWIW
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you are correct - if somebody had a bad experience, then yes, there might be a negative response.
And how can a person who has had a bad experience be ignorant about it?
I'm not reading too many "I read it in the paper" stories which aren't backed up by personal experiences.
Just busting your arse, welcome to the site.:D
I had a bad experience with a mexican once.. Can we ban them too?
I think I made my point.
RD

C-2
02-26-2007, 09:36 PM
I had a bad experience with a mexican once.. Can we ban them too?
I think I made my point.
RD
First off, I already included Mexicans in the ban list (guns, smokers, rhino's and a few others too).
Re-read my statement, there is actually some logic to it, sans the dog argument, or even good/bad.
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: ECGC

C-2
02-26-2007, 09:40 PM
Check out this video!
Pit Bull simon says......
]
Where's the part where the pit bull rips the guys arms off? The anticipation was killing me.:D

Burn504
02-26-2007, 09:52 PM
FWIW
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you are correct - if somebody had a bad experience, then yes, there might be a negative response.
And how can a person who has had a bad experience be ignorant about it?
I'm not reading too many "I read it in the paper" stories which aren't backed up by personal experiences.
Just busting your arse, welcome to the site.:D
just like i said.. i had a bad experience with a cat and a German shepherd, but im not Ignorant enough to say all cats and german shepherds are bad..
Thanks for the welcome.

C-2
02-26-2007, 09:58 PM
just like i said.. i had a bad experience with a cat and a German shepherd, but im not Ignorant enough to say all cats and german shepherds are bad..
Thanks for the welcome.
Now that makes more sense.;)

Burn504
02-26-2007, 10:04 PM
Wow, I truly am amazed at how many people truly do not understand the Pit Bull, I read your posts and I am baffled at how many of you are just spreading the drama a newspaper columnist creates everytime he want to sell a paper. If you truly do the research the people hurt or bitten by a pure bred pitbull is almost nill to none. The breed was bred to fight many many years went into this process, but it was bred to be dog aggressive not people aggresive, in fact if a pitbull ever showed any type of human aggression he was immediately culled by a true dogman. I will briefly explain how a true dog fight goes down you have two dogs and two handlers, the dogs are washed and weighed and if everything goes as planned they are placed in a pit with the handlers and the referee, the referee instructs the handlers to release their dogs and they usually cross the pit not growling not barking not showing their teeth, and start wrestling for a hold once the do get a hold they start working it until they either get a better hold or the other dog get out of the hold, now this is where it gets interesting, the two dogs fighting are actually having the time of their lives they are doing what they were bred for centuries to do, their tales are wagging. Now once one of the dogs even slightly turns away from the other dog the referee or one of the handlers will ask for a turn and the dogs are taken back into their prospective corner, the ref at this time will ask the owner of the dog that turned to release his dog, at which time the dog should cross a line called the scratch line and attempt to get a hold of the opponent. The whole time the other handler is holding his dog and just before the other dog get a hold he releases him, now at this time the dogs continue to do their thing. Until the Ref see a opportunity to have the handlers grab their animals. The whole time the handlers are right up next to their dogs if and I mean if the dogs were going to bite they would do while they were all worked up and in the middle of their fight. Guess what they do not, in fact if they did the true dog man would cull the dog. Also if one of the dogs does not want to fight anymore or even will not cross the scratch line the other dog is considered the victor. These dogs are not pushed to fight in fact if they dont want to fight they dont fight period. A true pure bred pitbull will not show human aggresive behavior, they make horrible watch dogs, strangers can come right up to the fence and pet them any time. Now the problem comes from pitbull mixes and people breeding them who are trying to make a quick buck, they dont do it properly and they dont cull the bad ones. Also the new fad is the so called Monster Pit, these are the pitbulls that are over 75lbs, I tell you right now if you have a pitbull over 75 lbs he has been cross bred somewhere in his lineage, the pitbull it a terrier and the size should be anywhere from 25 to 65lbs is standard and a huge one would be 70+lbs. I have never ever been to a dog fight but I have owned a few pitbulls, the first one I owned was a 3/4 Pit and 1/4 Shepard mix, guess what it bit my niece, luckily nothing permanent, I was astounded and very sad this went down, so I decided to really study the breed I purchased countless books and learned a lot and after I figured out, you need to purchase a dog from a true dogman and it needs to be a true pure bred, I realized I could own this dog again. I have had 3 pure bred pitbulls, they are the best dog in my opinion for me. Every dog breed has a specific type of owner, pitbull owners should be very active and very disciplined, they must excercise their dog daily they must take extra precautions that the dog does not get a chance to go after another dog and they must never ever leave a child unattended with the dog, it is not worth it, this goes for all breeds of dogs, I do not care how long you have owned the dog or how old or how sweet, the damn thing is a dog and you cannot read its mind, you never ever know what will make a dog bite or react so why take the chance. Especially with a pit bull or any other dog that is capable of doing alot of damage. If you really want to learn a good book to read is Richard Strattons The American Pit Bull Terrier.
first of all ... What type of "pitbull" are you referring to?
like i said before there are more than 7 different Terrier breeds that are referred to as pitbulls. the pitbull you hear about and read in the news are not always the same kind that most owners have.
Saying if your pit is 75lbs it has been crossbred is also retarded... i have many friends with pits.. some are from the same litters and range from 50lbs to 80lbs easily. The females are generally larger.
I for one have a American Staffordshire Terrier. If you didnt know they were bred to be in the AKC.. they were bred to be family dogs. Back in the 60's and 70's they were advertised as such and many many homes had one. They are exceptionally good with children. Like someone else mentioned at NO TIME DURING BREEDING were pitbulls bred to be people aggressive. NEVER. Not only that they were also an image for the war. General Patton had a pitbull. President Roosevelt also had one for his family.
IGNORANCE....
**and just because i quoted you doesnt mean my whole post referred to you**

Burn504
02-26-2007, 10:06 PM
Some famous people to have owned pit bulls are: Helen Keller, Thomas Edison, General George Patton, President Theodore Roosevelt, Fred Astair, Jack Dempsey, Michael J. Fox, and Jan Michael Vincent.
FYI..
and taken from Wikipedia
"The pit bull is a medium-sized dog: males generally weigh 40-70 lbs." and like i said.. females are generally larger.
The American Temperament Test Society, Inc. (ATTS) breed statistics as of December 2005 show an 83.5% passing rate for the American Pit Bull Terrier and the American Staffordshire Terrier and an 84.7% passing rate for the Staffordshire bull terrier, as compared to an 81.2% average pass rate for all dog breeds.
Most people who own these breeds direct their dogs' plentiful energy toward nonviolent athletic tasks. Some people train their pit bulls for dog agility. Others involve their pit bulls in weight pulling competitions, obedience competitions or schutzhund. The pit bull often excels at these sports. Out of the 17 dogs who have earned UKC "superdog" status (by gaining championship titles in conformation, obedience, agility, and weightpull), nine have been pit bulls.
Pit bulls are increasingly being prevented from participating in these events, due to the introduction of local legislation requiring the breed to be muzzled and on leash at all times when in public — with no exceptions for dog sports or obedience competitions.
those are the facts people need to hear about.
oh and im originally from San Diego.. seems like a good majority of you guys are living in that neck of the woods. Cant wait to get back!

HTRDLNCN
02-26-2007, 10:08 PM
Like has been stated before,,its a combination of the
natural instincts and the idiot owners.
I chose to have malamutes all my life specifically
because they are NOT guard dogs, are not one person dogs
and were actually used by the natives to baby sit their
kids while they were hunting.
I have also never roughhoused with any of my dogs and have never
allowed them to even "playbite" with anyone at any time. I see many
people playing very rough with their dogs and thinking its all fun and
games. Dogs dont think like we do.
They will continually test you and remember every inch you give them.
I dont need a dog to guard me, I can do that all by myself.
I do not feel sorry in the least for anyone that gets
an aggresive/guard type dog to "protect" them when
the same dog later bites sombedy either stranger or freind.
THATS WHAT YOU GOT HIM FOR!!! Whats the big suprise
the he/she actually did what he/she was bred for?

topless
02-26-2007, 10:19 PM
I didn't read all the responses yet but it looks like I''m going to have a fight on my hands. See yA LATER:D

wsuwrhr
02-26-2007, 10:23 PM
lions
tigers
bears
:D
OH MY!!!

C-2
02-26-2007, 10:25 PM
I didn't read all the responses yet but it looks like I''m going to have a fight on my hands. See yA LATER:D
Pit haters had an early lead....then neutral parties threw some logic into the fight, which was quickly dismissed by the pit lovers....but something tells me tomorrow, it will be pit owner against pit owner.
The irony...:D

Burn504
02-26-2007, 10:28 PM
hope you guys dont mind the pics.. but thought you might enjoy them and maybe enlighten a few people.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-059S.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-060S.jpg
we were moving so we let the dogs play on the old sofa.. and yea they ripped it up!
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/DSC03873.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/DSC03870.jpg

YeLLowBoaT
02-26-2007, 10:34 PM
hope you guys dont mind the pics.. but thought you might enjoy them and maybe enlighten a few people.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-059S.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/MVC-060S.jpg
we were moving so we let the dogs play on the old sofa.. and yea they ripped it up!
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/DSC03873.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/burn504/DSC03870.jpg
I would not let ANY DOG near a young child.
Remember you let them tear up that old sofa when they just destroyed the new one.

wsuwrhr
02-26-2007, 10:35 PM
Don't worry about the dog, worry more about the owner.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63moparwaiting.jpg

wsuwrhr
02-26-2007, 10:35 PM
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63moparrasta.jpg

wsuwrhr
02-26-2007, 10:36 PM
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63mopar1.jpg

Burn504
02-26-2007, 10:36 PM
yea your pretty smart huh? that picture was taken over 3 years ago.. The sofa was already tore up so the damage you see is not all from the dogs....humans did more damage to that sofa than those dogs ever could of...and the dog has never tore anything up since. They tore it up from jumping on it and doing "circles" not with their teeth.
that dog looks like he just wants to eat that child for lunch huh?
teach your children well.. teach your pets well. and you wont have a problem. Its as much of the child knowing what he/she shouldnt do as much as the dog

wsuwrhr
02-26-2007, 10:36 PM
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63Dscf0019.jpg

wsuwrhr
02-26-2007, 10:37 PM
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63carbspacer2.JPG

C-2
02-26-2007, 10:39 PM
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63carbspacer2.JPG
SPAMMER!

wsuwrhr
02-26-2007, 10:43 PM
SPAMMER!
Just throwing out a naked bitch and some billet porn my friend.
I went through my pictures in my image center on HB.

YeLLowBoaT
02-26-2007, 10:52 PM
yea your pretty smart huh? that picture was taken over 3 years ago.. The sofa was already tore up so the damage you see is not all from the dogs....humans did more damage to that sofa than those dogs ever could of...and the dog has never tore anything up since. They tore it up from jumping on it and doing "circles" not with their teeth.
that dog looks like he just wants to eat that child for lunch huh?
teach your children well.. teach your pets well. and you wont have a problem. Its as much of the child knowing what he/she shouldnt do as much as the dog
Who says a dog has to attack to do damage? If you really think you know what a toddler( or dog) is going to do 100% of time, your full of BS. A 70 lb dog knocking a child over by mistake could be deadly.
I could post some pics of the aftermath of pit attacks... no one want to see those. So I won't.

Burn504
02-26-2007, 11:08 PM
Who says a dog has to attack to do damage? If you really think you know what a toddler( or dog) is going to do 100% of time, your full of BS. A 70 lb dog knocking a child over by mistake could be deadly.
I could post some pics of the aftermath of pit attacks... no one want to see those. So I won't.
we should all live our lives in a bubble...
who knows what any person or living thing is going to do 100% of the time.
I dont think you should ever get in a car.. you never know what another driver is gonna do. haha cmon man
So do you also think that every household that has a dog and a child that they should be seperated until the child is 18?

bigq
02-26-2007, 11:09 PM
\. I was pissed about the female it was being egged on by three teenage guys that let the pit attack my dog in an ally. I heard it start and ran around the corner to see them cheering on the pit:mad: unfortunatly for them the Akita is no slouch in dog fights and was pretty much on top of the pit by the time i got there to pull her off and then this pit comes after me. So while kicking this dog the guys are yelling at me while I am trying to stop the fight and not get bit. Finally the owner pull his pit back and we got the hell out of there. I really wanted to bust there ass, but i am just to nice for that.:D
As you just said "The owners(three young kids) were egging this attack" the dog was not attacking to attack he was doing wrong yes but he was only being loyal to his owner...
No I guarantee they would have fought, Akitas are not dog friendly . They are animals that are territorial and I am not saying that is a bad thing that is just the way it is. It's like saying you are not born gay it is learned. It is the responsibility of the owner to know the dog and I knew this before I got Akitas that they were aggresive to to her dogs. They are not all that bas though as long as the other dogs don't invade their space. I am sure there are other breeds that are the same.

ONAROLL
02-26-2007, 11:11 PM
Who says a dog has to attack to do damage? If you really think you know what a toddler( or dog) is going to do 100% of time, your full of BS. A 70 lb dog knocking a child over by mistake could be deadly.
I could post some pics of the aftermath of pit attacks... no one want to see those. So I won't.
I could too........and I took the photos..............

YeLLowBoaT
02-26-2007, 11:13 PM
Since finding info on the web its very hard to find a info you can trust....
So here is a almost 20 year study from the CDC.
79-96 (ftp://ftp.cdc.gov/pub/Publications/mmwr/wk/mm4621.pdf)
here is the none fatal injurys treated in ERs in 01. (http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5226a1.htm)
doing a fast search I could not find anything more current that was trust worthy.
I did notice that fatal dog attacks have been the 10-15 a year for a long time, but the number of non fatal attacks has gone way up. I'm not a expert, but I would say some of the reason is better medical care we have now.

Tom Brown
02-26-2007, 11:13 PM
A few days ago, I was walking to my car and the neighbor's dog came running over barking and snapping. It wasn't a pit bull. It was a big black dog that came up to my groin, or so.
The neighbor lady came running after the dog that had obviously just escaped and she apologized. The apology was nice but then she proceded to tell me what a sweet dog it was while she did her best to get it's teeth unclenched from my pant leg.
It was just as well I was wearing jeans. The dog's teeth marks didn't rip the jeans, they just poked through like pins, but if I had been wearing a suit like most days, I would have a mortal enemies for neighbors right now because I'd be making the owner pay for the damage and, let's face it, that one is going to end up in small claims court because nobody is going to stump up for that kind of coin for their innocent little dog that would never attack anyone.
I know some dog owners have a clue but they do not predominate. It is my opinion that dog owners are about as objective about their dogs as parents are about their children. It seems to me, they ought to be held just as responsible. That means, if a dog gets out and kills someone, the owner should go to jail for manslaughter. If the dog injures someone, the owner should be liable for assault. ... and there's no need for any, "Well, did the dead person have any dog placation training?" bullshit, either.
Control your focking dog or I'll control it with a Smith and Wesson doggie remote.

'78 gt boat
02-26-2007, 11:13 PM
Here is a pic of our 4 pits, and they are all boys. They are the most loveable dogs ever and they are also wussies unless you come into the backyard from over the fence then watch out. It all comes down to who the pack leader is in the family. The wife and I have the boys trained to walk behind us and listen to every word we say. That said you always have to keep an eye on any dog around small children no matter what breed. The closer they are to being eye to eye the more likely they are to want to challenge. Just watch the dog whisperer and see what he says about pits. Just my .02
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r224/RYDNDTY/SSL20438.jpg

YeLLowBoaT
02-26-2007, 11:18 PM
we should all live our lives in a bubble...
who knows what any person or living thing is going to do 100% of the time.
I dont think you should ever get in a car.. you never know what another driver is gonna do. haha cmon man
So do you also think that every household that has a dog and a child that they should be seperated until the child is 18?
1st its not your life your putting in jeopardy
2nd if it would stop young children from being killed, scared or crippled for life I am all for it. its a simple Q... which would you rather have a dog or the safty of your child.

Tom Brown
02-26-2007, 11:28 PM
1st its not your life your putting in jeopardy
2nd if it would stop young children from being killed, scared or crippled for life I am all for it. its a simple Q... which would you rather have a dog or the safty of your child.
There's no point trying to reason with dog owners, YB. You might as well try to tell a parent that their children's lousy marks in school may not be the fault of the teacher.
Pits aren't the only problem breed.
Here's the problem:
If I come flying over your fence and beat the shit out of you, I end up being taken care of. The police take me away, the courts judge and sentence me, and you won't be seeing me for quite some time, best case. If you want to, you can have a restraining order put in place keeping me away from you or I will land in jail again and the problem will not keep recurring.
If my dog goes flying over your fence and tears you up, I will get a visit from the police, a letter from the city citing dog control ordinances, and if you're hurt badly, I'll likely end up with a visit from the animal control people to assess the dog and my facilities. I, of course, will explain to all of these people that my dog would never hurt anyone. Worst case, and you will have to take me to court for this, I will be made to restrict the dog to a secure cage with a concrete base and perhaps even be restricted from walking it in the neighborhood, even while on a leash. If the dog jumps your fence and chews the shit out of you again, the dog will likely be put down and I will receive a fine of about $2500.
... so I can be a total moron, pay a small fine, and lose my dog meanwhile your balls and groin flesh are sitting in my mantle mixed in with the ashes of my sweet, deceased dog.
Beautiful.

Rexone
02-26-2007, 11:34 PM
Control your focking dog or I'll control it with a Smith and Wesson doggie remote.
Look at Tom gettin all militant n shit. :D
I see it's time for the annual and always entertaining ***boat Pitbull argument thread. ;)

neverfastenuff
02-26-2007, 11:36 PM
Pitbull wars I love it!!!! Being an owner of many pitbulls and a member of the pitbull club of BC canada years ago, going to Weight pulls, dog shows and even having friends that still breed and fight these dogs. I have a fair amount of knowledge on the subject. I have met with Richard Stratton probably one if not the foremost expert on the subject etc...I have petitioned the strata in the complex I used to live in when they tried to ban the breed and was successful at blocking the by-law..Pete the pitbull from "Our Gang" was a hero in that era..But this is a different era. Way back when the dog was developed it was never breed to be aggressive towards humans what so ever, it was breed for "Gameness" or the desire to fight to the finish without turning or giving up, not necessarily to the death...dogs that were people aggressive were frowned upon period...The problem nowadays is that many of these dogs and their recent ancestors have been bred to be aggressive towards humans ands its really ruined the purity of the breed and is now encouraged..hence people bitters etc...The dogs physical ability to do damaged in the pit and its tenacity or "gameness" is now used as a deterrent much like the rotti or the shepard except the difference is is if the pitbull saw a guy breaking into your house or another dog in the yard...he'd probably go after the dog...now there are exceptions to this as there are with every breed...Pitbulls can be great family dogs very loyal and loving, as were their original traits and also tobr ferocious in the pit...Are they a good dog now?? I'd have to say, and I'm a lover of the breed and love my dogs, 12 and 14 years old, yes and no. In the rite hands of a responsible owner who knows their dog you probably will never have a problem but no matter how docile the dog, the owner has to remember the capabilities of the breed and what they've become recently...and in the wrong hands or a nieve owner this breed as with any protection dog can be quite dangerous...I personally know my female Pitty doesn't like small children she never has, so I don't allow her around them...my male loves kids and hates other male dogs...get the point?? you have to know the dog as they are different....now would I let my kids around a dog I didn't know probably not....and i would be leery about letting my kids around even dogs I know regardless of breed...they are animals and Can possibly be unpredictable at times...and physically powerful dogs can do damage period.....everyone loves their dogs and most are in total disbilief when something bad happens....so be careful. ps. no dogs allowed on my boat they scratch the gel coat!!! just my opinion.:idea: :idea:

C-2
02-26-2007, 11:45 PM
Look at Tom gettin all militant n shit. :D
I see it's time for the annual and always entertaining ***boat Pitbull argument thread. ;)
Yuppers. Knew this would drag you out of the cave.
Pretty close battle so far.

Rexone
02-26-2007, 11:45 PM
Don't worry about the dog, worry more about the owner.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63moparrasta.jpg
Well said. :D

Rexone
02-26-2007, 11:46 PM
Yuppers. Knew this would drag you out of the cave.
Pretty close battle so far.
I've participated before but I think this year I will take a bye... :D

HM
02-26-2007, 11:48 PM
I've participated before but I think this year I will take a bisexual... :D
We always knew you swung both ways!

Tom Brown
02-26-2007, 11:49 PM
Look at Tom gettin all militant n shit. :D
I isolated that to make it easier for people to quote. :D
I live in a real nice neighborhood. At least, it used to be. We had kids playing on lawns and the streets all the time. Yeah... I know... kids shouldn't play in the street but this is Canada. The kids play street hockey here and sometimes I join them.
At least, I used to join them when they spent time outside. These days, they stay indoors because some jack hole moved in about a block away with eight dogs. These dogs are mean sons-a-bitches. When a car or, even worse, a person walks down the alley, these dogs freak out like rabid crazed monkeys. I can hear the barking from here. Seriously, I'm surprised they haven't chewed their way through the fence. They do get out sometimes.
I have a pretty strong hunch this situation with the dogs is temporary. It will be handled.
I can't say I'm really happy about the kids staying indoors, playing video games, and looking at penis pictures of chat room predators on their computers instead fo playing outside with their pals (of which I count myself one). These are great children and they love playing outside.
I guess it's no big deal for the dog owner. He knows his dogs wouldn't hurt anyone. It would be a shame if one or more of his dogs were to not make it home after escaping the back yard. I don't mind saying, that would be no big deal to me. :cool:

Rexone
02-26-2007, 11:50 PM
We always knew you swung both ways!
At least you're hoping...

Rexone
02-27-2007, 01:02 AM
I isolated that to make it easier for people to quote. :D
I live in a real nice neighborhood. At least, it used to be. We had kids playing on lawns and the streets all the time. Yeah... I know... kids shouldn't play in the street but this is Canada. The kids play street hockey here and sometimes I join them.
At least, I used to join them when they spent time outside. These days, they stay indoors because some jack hole moved in about a block away with eight dogs. These dogs are mean sons-a-bitches. When a car or, even worse, a person walks down the alley, these dogs freak out like rabid crazed monkeys. I can hear the barking from here. Seriously, I'm surprised they haven't chewed their way through the fence. They do get out sometimes.
I have a pretty strong hunch this situation with the dogs is temporary. It will be handled.
I can't say I'm really happy about the kids staying indoors, playing video games, and looking at penis pictures of chat room predators on their computers instead fo playing outside with their pals (of which I count myself one). These are great children and they love playing outside.
I guess it's no big deal for the dog owner. He knows his dogs wouldn't hurt anyone. It would be a shame if one or more of his dogs were to not make it home after escaping the back yard. I don't mind saying, that would be no big deal to me. :cool:
That's a shame Tom. Both for the kids and for the dogs. Irresponsible dog owners suck. :(

HM
02-27-2007, 01:21 AM
I isolated that to make it easier for people to quote. :D
I live in a real nice neighborhood. At least, it used to be. We had kids playing on lawns and the streets all the time. Yeah... I know... kids shouldn't play in the street but this is Canada. The kids play street hockey here and sometimes I join them.
At least, I used to join them when they spent time outside. These days, they stay indoors because some jack hole moved in about a block away with eight dogs. These dogs are mean sons-a-bitches. When a car or, even worse, a person walks down the alley, these dogs freak out like rabid crazed monkeys. I can hear the barking from here. Seriously, I'm surprised they haven't chewed their way through the fence. They do get out sometimes.
I have a pretty strong hunch this situation with the dogs is temporary. It will be handled.
I can't say I'm really happy about the kids staying indoors, playing video games, and looking at penis pictures of chat room predators on their computers instead fo playing outside with their pals (of which I count myself one). These are great children and they love playing outside.
I guess it's no big deal for the dog owner. He knows his dogs wouldn't hurt anyone. It would be a shame if one or more of his dogs were to not make it home after escaping the back yard. I don't mind saying, that would be no big deal to me. :cool:
Moronic dog owners bug the shit out of me too. I love when I am walking my dogs on a leash and their dogs come running up and get into with my dogs, then the dog owner tries to insist that their dog is "sweet" as you put it. I had a rhodesian ridgeback that changed it's demeanor around other dogs after it was attacked by another dog that was not on a leash. After that point, when dogs approached that were not on a leash, I kicked them square in the snout and they usually took off running. One lady got really pissed at me for kicking her Chow(that was off a leash) after it came running at us at a pretty good clip. I admit I made full contact on the snout...that Chow yelped about as loud as I ever heard and took off running. She tried to read me the riot act and I told her to put her fukking dog on a leash and she won't have a problem with me harming her dog...although her dog didn't look like it wanted anything to do with us after that. I walk my dogs all over my neighborhood, and there are a few streets I have to avoid because of "sweet" dogs that are always off of their leash.
I have owned many dogs of many different breeds. There are a lot of dogs in my family, and I have not seen where dog's just do something out of the blue. I have seen family members "Claim" their dog did something out of the blue, but in reality, there were signs. You can tell when a dog shows signs....then the owner will say..."Oh spot, you stop that growling you silly dog....he really is sweet...couldn't hurt a fly." Mathew Margolis (Uncle Matty) talks about the "once in a while behaviors" that many owners just brush off as no big deal...until that day their dog does something more...then it is a claim of "he has never done that before!" Reality is the dog wanted to do that on several occasions, but finally.....FINALLY acted out....and did NOT just act out of blue. I am not of the belief that my dogs couldn't hurt anything, just because they haven't. But, I am not blind to behaviors. I have an older sister who doesn't get it, even after her dog bit my daughter on the face...and I saw it coming, but was too far away to get there in time. I was screaming at everyone for being dumbasses...and in the end, I was the asshole. Yep, her dog bit my daughter on the face, and I am the asshole. My wife and I insist that we will never let our kids around her dog because she has already proved that she will bite them....and they give me the "training" bit. Well, there won't be a next time for my kids, but if I see her dog go after any children again, I am going to break its neck....literally....and this is just a "mix" dog. Realize this is coming from a person who owns a pit/mastiff mix. I have already gotten rid of one dog I owned because she was not good with kids. My shepard mix is on the way out as she is starting to get a bit skiddish....she is not getting aggresive, but I can see she gets uncomfortable around the kids and she needs to be gone well before that point. My pit/mastiff has had the best temperment of any dog I have had - but, he is not allowed around the kids unsupervised - mostly because the kids are more unpredictable than the dog at this point. But, I have been fairly successful at teaching him the command "Sick balls!" :D

boatsnblondes
02-27-2007, 02:37 AM
Well, I guess I will chime in on this one also. Pitts are strange dogs. One moment they are great dogs, the next they are shredding kids. Research is coming out that shows that pits have a kind of chemical imbalance. They are extremely dangerous dogs, and the the thing that triggers that danger is anyone's guess at this point. I do know this much, that homeowners insurance is now partially based on the type of dog you own, and to be covered in the instance of a dogbite, you must declare the dog. Once you declare certain "agressive" dogs, of which pits are the poster child, your insurance goes through the roof. And that is getting to be the trend more and more. Personally, I hate pits, and would have no problem shooting every useles one of them from now till the end of time. Those of you who own them, beware. They can snap at anytime for any reason. And while there are those on here, saying they are not the most aggressive dogs out there, I say BS. EVERY time you hear of a mauling, it's a pit. I pity the first boner to bring one of them useless mutts around here, it won't last a month. And other useless dogs? Rotts and dobies. I've had two German Shepherds...niether pitts, rotts, or dobies ever came close to them for sheer amazing dogness. Say what you will, if you own a pitt, your opening yourself up for a potentially amazing amount of trouble....

HaulinAss
02-27-2007, 04:13 AM
Let anyone sample any dogs dinner bowl that hasn't been properly trained and you'll get the same result.
Yes exactly

HaulinAss
02-27-2007, 04:17 AM
When I had my Rottie, she was 13 weeks old and my kids were babies. Every time I fed her, I would take her food away and then praise her so she wouldn't be food aggressive. It worked and she never ever did anything but look at anyone when they were around her food.
Hence,PROPERLY trained! :)

HaulinAss
02-27-2007, 04:20 AM
Most aggressive dogs have owners who think it is cool to have an intimidating animal, OR they are just too lazy to train a dog. I can not understand why some people want to own and animal or raise a child that is not a good citizen.
VERY Well Said!

Wmc
02-27-2007, 07:01 AM
I just wanted to coment on this. Dog psychology and human psychology are very different. You should be proactive in learning the dog psychology (honestly it doesn't take as much time as you'd think). If you learn it, then your dog will never become "snappish" becuase it'll know that your the boss and it's low man on the totum pole. If your reactive then someday that dog WILL test the boundaries to see who's boss and your potentially going to be out one good dog.
RD
Thank you for your comments. Between my husband and I we've owned 4 pitbulls and we know their psychology and the background they come from. Never have any of them put us or any one in a harmful situation. I was refering to sherpa's statement "snappish", and thinking what an assinine comment. All four were around people and children. Raised with love and they all knew who the boss is!!!

riverbound
02-27-2007, 07:17 AM
Well, I guess I will chime in on this one also. Pitts are strange dogs. One moment they are great dogs, the next they are shredding kids. Research is coming out that shows that pits have a kind of chemical imbalance. They are extremely dangerous dogs, and the the thing that triggers that danger is anyone's guess at this point. I do know this much, that homeowners insurance is now partially based on the type of dog you own, and to be covered in the instance of a dogbite, you must declare the dog. Once you declare certain "agressive" dogs, of which pits are the poster child, your insurance goes through the roof. And that is getting to be the trend more and more. Personally, I hate pits, and would have no problem shooting every useles one of them from now till the end of time. Those of you who own them, beware. They can snap at anytime for any reason. And while there are those on here, saying they are not the most aggressive dogs out there, I say BS. EVERY time you hear of a mauling, it's a pit. I pity the first boner to bring one of them useless mutts around here, it won't last a month. And other useless dogs? Rotts and dobies. I've had two German Shepherds...niether pitts, rotts, or dobies ever came close to them for sheer amazing dogness. Say what you will, if you own a pitt, your opening yourself up for a potentially amazing amount of trouble....
I would like for you to back up your claim and show us this "research" you claim. or are you just pulling this out of your ass??
Like has been said before, its more about the owner and how the Dog is raised than the type of Dog. Unfortuanately for pits and Rotts, Some owners chose to raise them for Fighting/ protection due to their size and strengths.
I have (had 1 passed this last week) 2 Rotties. they have been around since beofre my kids and I never worried about my kids around them. The dogs were raised properly and knew their place (which is VERY important for any dog to know). But if anyone they didnt knowe came up to my kids or wife (ex now) the dogs would get between the person and whoever they were protecting, until they were told it was ok. My cousins pitt is the same way, more of a visual deterent than anything.

wsuwrhr
02-27-2007, 07:25 AM
Control your focking dog or I'll control it with a Smith and Wesson doggie remote.
May I see a picture of this remote you speak of?
Somehow I am guessig it only has an off or mute button.
Brian

Evin Rude
02-27-2007, 07:42 AM
It seems to me, they ought to be held just as responsible. That means, if a dog gets out and kills someone, the owner should go to jail for manslaughter. If the dog injures someone, the owner should be liable for assault.
Soon, similar laws will be in place in Texas. Not soon enough to help the 3 young children and one grown man killed by pit's in the last few months. My lawyer advises that with all the negative publicity brought on by these maulings and deaths, it will be very easy to sue and win big judgments against dog owners.

STV_Keith
02-27-2007, 08:34 AM
OK, I feel that I need to weigh in here for a second. I don't normally get in on these fights, because no one wins, but between this and the gun control analogies being thrown around, I just have to put in my $.02. :)
First, I've been on the receiving end of an attack. At 9 years old, I was bit on the leg by a German Shepard. It was my neighbors dog that I had known for years. I was frequently in their house with the dog and out in the yard. This one Saturday, while the neighbor and I were out front play fighting, the dog ran up and bit me in the leg.
To make a long story short, I was out of 3rd grade for 3 months, had a skin graft and plastic surgery. I'll spare you the gory pics, but it wasn't the most wonderful few months of my life.
Fast forward 25 years...I am increasingly noticing that the recourse of many actions is to "ban" the action at hand. Why is that? Why should anyone tell me, or I tell anyone else, what they can and can't do/can and can't own?
You want a pit bull, have one. I know many that are super sweet, roll over when you put your hand out, etc. I have seen some mean ones too. The owner knows the potential - and ACCEPTS THE RESPONSIBILITY. If the dog does something wrong, then the owner should pay dearly for the actions of his/her chosen dog.
Same goes for guns. It's the owner/possessor that controls the action, not the weapon itself. BLAME THE OPERATOR for the actions of the weapon. Don't ban me from having a weapon because Joe Idiot can't handle it himself.
I guess the jist of my little rant is that the operator/owner should be held liable for their judgement calls. Don't prohibit people from having the pits, just severly punish those that own pits that have incidents. Severely punish those who use weapons in a non-appropriate manor. Punish the operator, don't limit the rest of the country/populace from their choices of ownership.
It's no different that trying to blame GM when someone gets run over at a cross walk by a Suburban.

HTRDLNCN
02-27-2007, 08:51 AM
and ACCEPTS THE RESPONSIBILITY. .
a little late,,noone accepts responsibility for their actions anymore..
from the idiot talking on the cell while veering across 4 lanes,to the
guy that was "only" stealing a few cars, to the moron breeding
dangerous dogs for the hell of it.. There is no easy answer.
We could line up all the morons and shoot them but then we
would be the bad guys..

C-2
02-27-2007, 09:14 AM
Imagine if we got rid of the Raider Nation, just wiped them and the team off the face pf the earth.
Three problems down....the channel, pitbulls and assualt rifles.
Maybe we can convince Phebus to use this as his campaign platform?:jawdrop: :jawdrop:

Old Texan
02-27-2007, 11:50 AM
I didn't read all the responses yet but it looks like I''m going to have a fight on my hands. See yA LATER:D
Topless, Topless, Topless don't you realize bringing Later's name into this is going to start a viscious rumor that when the derelict sunken boat is (if ever) resurrected it will be found to have a large section of the hull ripped out by a Pit Bull. Or perhaps a chewed through steering cable, a cable so strong only a Pit Bull could have chewed it. :eek: Alas once again a story tarnishing the reputation of this once proud breed. :devil:

RiverDave
02-27-2007, 04:46 PM
You know everytime one of these threads comes up I find myself thinking about it non stop. Not too many things make me angry on a message board anymore, but this subject always makes me see red. Not becuase I'm defending my pet, but rather becuase the people I'm usually defending it from are f'ing idiots.. Yes I flat out said it, all of you people that claim you'd shoot one on sight ask questions later, the entire breed should be put down, and everyone of them is a time bomb waiting to happen.. You people are f'ing idiots. I don't know where the hell you guys get your random statistics from, but to say their skewed is an understatement.
I'm going to lay this out for you in a NON DEBATABLE, FACTUAL basis.. If you continue to argue about it then god knows there's just no help for your dumb asses.
Lets look at the facts if you had problems with the plumbing in your house you'd call a plumber and ask him questions. If you had computer problems you'd call a computer expert and get them to fix it. Yet damn near EVERY SINGLE DOG EXPERT shouts from the roof tops that this is a GREAT Breed of dog. IT IS A GREAT FAMILY PET, THEY ARE GREAT AROUND CHILDREN, but somehow you know best. You say things like "They are mentally unstable" "Your nuts to let that dog around a kid" etc.. etc..
Well the fact of the matter is IT IS THE ONLY DOG that Human aggression was bread out of.
HERE IS SOME STATISTICS for the reading impaired. NOT from some pitbull lobyist group, nor is it from an anti pitbull group.
The NON DEBATABLE FACT is with regards to TEMPERMENT which is what we are talking about there is ONLY ONE authority with regards to breeds.
THE AMERICAN TEMPERMENT TEST SOCIETY takes a SCIENTIFIC APPROACH to testing the temperments of dogs, records the data and gives % rates on each breed.
AMERICAN PITBULL TERRIER = 542 dogs tested, 456 Passed, 86 Failed giving them a Passing rate as a BREED of 84.1%
AMERICAN STAFFORDSHIRE TERRIER (basically the same dog) = 521 dogs tested, 437 passed, 84 Failed giving them a passing rate of 83.9%
Pretty damn close to each other, so apparently the test is repeatable and accurate.
Now lets look at some other breeds.. Family pooches Someone had a Malamute on here lets take a look at there passing rate.. Gotta be light years ahead of the mentally disturbed monsters right?
Nope. About the same with regards to temperment. Got news for ya as well, a Malamute could flat maul a 5 - 6 year old kid just as quick as a pitbull.
ALASKAN MALAMUTE = 187 tested 158 passed 29 failed, passing rate 84.5%
How about BoatCops dogs.. I believe he has Bloodhounds, those are working dogs right there.. They gotta have leaps and bounds on pitbulls in terms of actual scientific data with regards to temperment compared to a full bred Pit.
Nope Surprisingly enough in real world tests the bloodhounds temperment comes in considerably lower. Granted they haven't tested that many of them yet so we'll let ole BoatCop slide.
BLOODHOUND= 32 Dogs Tested, 23 Passed, 9 Failed, 71.9% passing rate.
Lets throw JBB in the mix here.. Collies I believe? Safer around Children? Good Temperment, good family dogs, but is there TEMPERMENT comparable to a PITBULL?
Pretty close to a Pits.. just shy
COLLIE= 811 dogs tested, 642 passed, 169 failed, 79.2% passing rate.
Now lets throw everybodies Favorite River dog out there.. The age ole Golden Retriever. I've often heard how they have a Great TEMPERMENT
I guess they do! It's right up there just shy of a pitbulls!
GOLDEN RETRIEVER = 687 dogs tested, 576 passed 111 failed, 83.8% passing rate.
This Test is designed to put a dog in various situations to see how it will react. Everything from a friendly greeting, to a stranger coming up, to a person coming up in a threatening manner. The test is based upon the dogs reactions. It also includes other physical attributes, but more or less it puts the DOG as a BREED up in unsure circumstances (even firing off gunshots and seeing how it reacts and how quickly they pull themselves back together) and measuring their reactions etc..
THE BOTTOM LINE, THE NON DEBATABLE FACT is that the RECOGNIZED AUTHORITY on judging the TEMPERMENT OF DOGS rates Pits As good or slightly BETTER then the vast majority of other breeds.
People may have some bad experiences I can understand that, but the likelihood of that happening is no different then any other dog.
The guys that react with the "I'd shoot them if it even came towards me" are for lack of a better word... Pussies. Pit's scare them and in an effort to not be scared they must elevate their own threat level to that of beyond a Pit. I.E. You got a knife I got a gun typical Type "A" personallities. Ironically enough it's usually that same type /mentallity on most levels that picks up a Pit and makes it into what you read in the headlines.
They AREN'T mentally unstable.
They DON'T attack completely unprovoked. Just becuase YOU DON'T KNOW the reason doesn't mean there wasn't one.
They DO make great FAMILY dogs.
They ARE great around kids (as a breed)
Their "gameness" is what MAKES THEM GREAT AROUND kids.. They can take the ear pulling, tail pulling, wrestling etc.. that kids often do with dogs and not react in an aggresive manner.
Pretty much everythign else is bullshiat.. If you HAVEN'T OWNED one then shut up already. How come on here the people talking the most shit with regards to this subject are usually the least informed?
RD

YeLLowBoaT
02-27-2007, 04:56 PM
and who runs this "THE AMERICAN TEMPERMENT TEST SOCIETY" I know they compile all the reports from police, ERs, 1st responce right?
I think I'll stick to the "facts" that are provided by the CDC and animal control departments.
How can you tell how a breed acts by only testing 500 dogs? how many pits are there is the US? I don't have any idea, but I would say that there is atleast 25000, thats only 2 %
Also how did they select the dog to be tested? my guess is they went to local breeders... theres a big diff between a puppy mill and a AKC breeder.
Sorry RD, but those numbers are weak at best.

RiverDave
02-27-2007, 05:02 PM
YellowBoat, what part of they are THE AUTHORITY on testing the TEMPERMENTS of dogs did you miss? They are the only ones using a NON BIAST SCIENTIFIC APPROACH to testing the Temperment of a dog!
Do you know that in any dog bite case if their unsure of the breed then 99% of the time it's filed under pitbull? Do you know that if a Lab has a somewhat boxy head they don' call it a "Lab Mix" they call it a "Pit Mix?"
How can you say the #'s are skewed when in every uncertain scenario they file it under Pitbull?
How can that not make sense to you?
RD

YeLLowBoaT
02-27-2007, 05:25 PM
So what are thier methods? I would like to know. How did they select the animals they tested? Who did the test? At what age did they test them? At what time did they test them?
Lots of BIG Qs there.
500 dogs is not anywhere close to a large enough sample to make any type of wide scale statements. All that those numbers your listed said is that: "out of the dogs we tested, we got this result"
I'm sorry, there is just way to many varibles there to call it a scientific test.

RiverDave
02-27-2007, 05:30 PM
Well I'll tell you what's not a variable.. They didn't file every random dog under the brand "Pit bull"
As for the rest read up on it..
Their website is right here.
http://www.atts.org/index.html
Honestly I don't think it's going to matter much. You know what you know, and you hear what you want to hear. It doesn't much matter if all the experts are screaming the exact opposite of what you so confidently say. Your view is right and all the dog experts are wrong.
RD

Forkin' Crazy
02-27-2007, 05:36 PM
OK RD, since you are so fokking smart, ;) how about the severity of the bite? Would you like to get into that?
All dogs will bite. Seems the worst are dogs that ARE NOT use to children. Children can test the temperament of the most docile of dogs.
How can you say the #'s are skewed when in every uncertain scenario they file it under Pitbull?
How do you know that? :rolleyes:
I have a friend whose brother got mauled by his own pit. The dog was a house dog and even slept in the same bed with him, laid on the couch while he watched TV, etc. He snapped one day and damn near shredded his arm beyond repair.
Never heard of that happening with a lab, golden, shepherd, etc, etc.
Yea, I am a puss and an idiot because I would shoot one in a NY second. :rolleyes:
Oh brother...:sleeping:

Forkin' Crazy
02-27-2007, 05:39 PM
Honestly I don't think it's going to matter much. You know what you know, and you hear what you want to hear. It doesn't much matter if all the experts are screaming the exact opposite of what you so confidently say. Your view is right and all the dog experts are wrong.
RD
Yea and calling people that have an opinion opposite of yours f'ing idiots really makes you look intelligent!! http://www.***boat.com/ubb/graemlins/idea_2.gif
:jawdrop:

YeLLowBoaT
02-27-2007, 05:40 PM
did you actaully go to that web site and read what the test envoles? you might want to before you throw thier numbers around.
Its a certificate program. you have to pay $25 to go thru the test and get the cert....
then there is this from the FAQ:
3. Who may enter an ATTS temperament test?
All pure-bred dogs
All spayed or neutered mixed-breed dogs.
Mixed-breed dogs which are not spayed or neutered may enter and be tested but WILL NOT receive a certificate.
So you have to have your aminal fixed to go thru the test if its not a prue breed...
It did fill in some of the Qs I asked... like age and how the test is run...
Too bad I saw this...
10. May I retest my dog?
A dog may be retested after a 5-month waiting period.
A dog may attempt the temperament test only twice.
Retest of any dog requires full entry fee.
ATTS may on rare occasions request a retest of a dog. This requires no entry fee.
Really so it failed the test the 1st time... but passed the 2nd... is it a aggressive dog?
Thanks for giving me a link to completly discount thier figures.

YeLLowBoaT
02-27-2007, 05:43 PM
here is a cut and paste description... notice nowhere does it list a numerical value for the dogs reaction... not does it enovole feeding.
Description of the Temperament Test
The ATTS Temperament Test focuses on and measures different aspects of temperament such as stability, shyness, aggressiveness, and friendliness as well as the dog's instinct for protectiveness towards its handler and/or self-preservation in the face of a threat.
The test simulates a casual walk through a park or neighborhood where everyday life situations are encountered. During this walk, the dog experiences visual, auditory and tactile stimuli. Neutral, friendly and threatening situations are encountered, calling into play the dog's ability to distinguish between non-threatening situations and those calling for watchful and protective reactions.
Dogs must be at least 18 months old to enter this test. The test takes about eight to 12 minutes to complete. The dog is on a loose six-foot (6') lead. The handler is not allowed to talk to the dog, give commands, or give corrections.
Failure on any part of the test is recognized when a dog shows:
Unprovoked aggression
Panic without recovery
Strong avoidance
The ATTS Temperament Test consists of ten subtests divided into five subcategories:
Behavior Toward Strangers
Objective: To measure the dog's reaction to strangers in a non-threatening situation.
Subtest 1: Neutral stranger
A stranger to the dog approaches the handler, shakes hands with the handler and engages the handler in a brief conversation, ignoring the dog.
The purpose of this subtest is to evaluate the dog's reaction to passive socialization and the dog's protective instinct.
Subtest 2: Friendly stranger
A stranger to the dog approaches happily and briskly, is very friendly to the dog and pets the dog.
The purpose of this subtest is to evaluate the dog's active social skills.
Reaction to Auditory Stimuli
Objective: To measure the dog's reaction to auditory stimuli and the dog's investigative behavior.
Subtest 3: Hidden Noise
The handler/dog team approaches a hidden assistant who rattles a metal bucket filled with rocks and sets this bucket in the path of the team. The handler may encourage the dog to investigate the bucket only when asked to do so. The handler's focus must be on the bucket, not on the dog.
The purpose of this subtest is to test alertness and curiosity.
Subtest 4: Gunshots
The handler stops at a designated marker with his/her back towards a well hidden assistant. The assistant fires three shots using a .22 caliber starter pistol (SHOT-PAUSE-SHOT-SHOT).
The purpose of this subtest is to measure the dog's recovery response to a sudden noise.
Reaction to Visual Stimulus
Objective: To measure the dog's reaction to a sudden visual stimulus.
Subtest 5: Umbrella
The handler/dog team approaches an assistant sitting in a chair holding a closed umbrella parallel to the ground at a 90 degree angle to the approaching team. When the dog is five feet from the assistant, the umbrella is opened. The handler may encourage the dog to investigate the umbrella only when asked to do so. The handler's focus must be on the umbrella, not on the dog.
Tactile Stimuli
Objective: To measure the dog's reaction to unusual footing.
Subtest 6: Plastic Footing
Both the handler and the dog walk the entire length of a 15-foot by 6-foot clear plastic strip.
Subtest 7: Wire Footing
Only the dog will walk the entire length of a 12-foot by 3-foot unfolded exercise pen.
The purpose of these subtests is to measure the dog's sensitivity to unusual footing, its ability to recover from the fear of unusual footing and to measure its investigative behavior to the unusual footing.
Self Protective/Aggressive Behavior
Objective: These tests collectively evaluate the dog's capacity to recognize an unusual situation, its threshold to provocation, its protective instincts, and its propensity to realize when the situation becomes a threat.
Subtest 8: Non-Threatening
The handler/dog team stops at the designated marker. A weirdly-dressed stranger crosses the path 38 feet in front of the team.
The purpose of this subtest is to test the dog's alertness to an unusual situation.
Subtest 9: Threatening
The weird stranger advances 10 feet towards the stationary handler in a threatening manner.
The purpose of this subtest is to evaluate the dog's ability to recognize when an unusual situation turns into a provocation.
Subtest 10: Aggression
The weird stranger advances to within 18 feet of the stationary handler in an aggressive manner.
The purpose of this subtest is to evaluate the dog's protective instincts.
The stranger is never closer than 10 feet from the dog. The handler's 2 foot arm and the 6' lead is added in for a total of 18 feet. Aggression here is checked against the breed standard and the dog's training. A schutzhund trained dog lunging at the stranger is allowed, but if an untrained Siberian husky does the same, it may fail.
At the conclusion of the test, the handler will receive a critique about the dog's performance. Certificate will be mailed within 90 days of the test.
This copyrighted test may not be used in whole or part without the express written consent of the American Temperament Test Society.
Looks really scientific to me :rolleyes:

Just Electric
02-27-2007, 05:45 PM
punish the deed not the breed i have three and hands down the best dogs ive ever owned

Forkin' Crazy
02-27-2007, 05:53 PM
punish the deed not the breed i have three and hands down the best dogs ive ever owned
Could you say that a little louder? I couldn't quite make out what you were trying to convey.:sleeping:

Tom Brown
02-27-2007, 05:58 PM
Children can test the temperament of the most docile of dogs.
I know some dogs that will let children beat the shit out of them and they just take it.
Could you say that a little louder? I couldn't quite make out what you were trying to convey.:sleeping:
I guess saying it louder makes it more true. lol!

Old Texan
02-27-2007, 06:10 PM
RD, here's my opinion. I love dogs and in my 56 years I've owned a bunch. My closest to a pit bull was a pit chow mix that grew up around my kids and was the protector of all the neighborhood kids. That dog would have given his life for me or anyone in my family if called upon to protect. He was however somewhat threatening in appearance and many folks wouldn't come by beacuse they feared him. Didn't know him but feared him for what he was, a pit mix. Wasn't a big deal as I'd put him up to alieve their fears. A lot of folks are scared of dogs plain and simple.
Which brings me to the main point, dogs are DOGS. They all think pretty much the same and inspite of a lot of opinions aren't quite human. Therefore they are not infallible and in certain situations will go nuts, attack, freak out, lose their mind, what have you. They are all basically "dumb" animals, damn good friends and wonderful companions but still animals that rely on instinct and reaction to unpredictable triggering events than being creatures capable of thinking things out. We could go on forever at some of the great, neat, mindboggling, and wild, unbelievable things dogs do and have done, but the point is they are still DOGS. No matter the breed or linage.
SOOOOOOOOO what happens when they do freak out and do something vicious or "turn" on those around them, is they are being DOGS. I don't care about training, love, affection, caring, abuse, or other factors, they are DOGS. And dogs can and often times will go berserk. The differenece is when a toy poodle or my daughter's Sheltie go berserk, they can be subdued. When a 65+ lb Pit or other large breed go berserk, people likely get hurt, possibly badly hurt.
The fact is a lot of people, myself included, love dogs, can't and won't live without 'em. Gotta have 'em with me. My present pound hound Lab mix loves to ride in the boat, will get right up on the bow at speed and can ride in the back of my truck all day and night. BUT there are a whole lot of folks that don't like dogs, fear them, don't want them around or near them and will never believe some breeds are just plain killers. Might as well have a Grizzly bear is their opinion. And dogs sense this and in my opinion have their doggie guard up cause this strange creature's vibes tell poochie "they don't like me, I better be wary." Lots of folks like little dogs and fear big dogs. There's a lot of dogs that don't particularly care for people.There's all kinds of both dogs and people.
I've amazed a few folks in my day when their aggressive dogs have let me touch, pet, and jostle with them. It's cause I show no fear to a dog. But I'm also smart enough about when to avoid their territory and give 'em their space. That's what most who fear dogs don't do, they show fear and don't know how to back away. They forget they are DOGS. Dogs are only trying to survive and sometimes make bad decisions. Just like people, but in the end they are still.......Dogs

Boa1277
02-27-2007, 06:18 PM
first of all ... What type of "pitbull" are you referring to?
like i said before there are more than 7 different Terrier breeds that are referred to as pitbulls. the pitbull you hear about and read in the news are not always the same kind that most owners have.
Saying if your pit is 75lbs it has been crossbred is also retarded... i have many friends with pits.. some are from the same litters and range from 50lbs to 80lbs easily. The females are generally larger.
I for one have a American Staffordshire Terrier. If you didnt know they were bred to be in the AKC.. they were bred to be family dogs. Back in the 60's and 70's they were advertised as such and many many homes had one. They are exceptionally good with children. Like someone else mentioned at NO TIME DURING BREEDING were pitbulls bred to be people aggressive. NEVER. Not only that they were also an image for the war. General Patton had a pitbull. President Roosevelt also had one for his family.
IGNORANCE....
**and just because i quoted you doesnt mean my whole post referred to you**
True there are many types of terriers and there are many people that claim they have a pitbull and in my world there is only 1 type of pitbull and that is the American Pit Bull Terrier. APBT for short. I will tell you with out a doubt you will not find a pure APBT that is over 75lbs max. The dogs you are referring to are exactly what you have a American Staffordshire Terrier. This is not a APBT and you know it. The staff is a show dog and is bred for looks and conformation, the owners or the breeders could care less about what truly made the pitbull a great dog. You also should know that that 1 trait that is treasured above all else in the world of the APBT is Gameness. A true APBT is not human aggressive, that does not mean they like kids, in fact most of the time they will try and dominate a child. A true dogman will breed for gameness above all else, when a dog comes out and is human aggresive he will be culled period, Now the same does not hold true for a staff, if a staff is born and he is a show worthy dog, he can try and bite anyone that comes near and the breeder or owner will still fawn on him like he is a truly a good dog. This is a old old debate between pitbull and staffordshire terrier owners and it goes much deeper than what I am writing here, but I will say this The American Staffordshire Terrier is a whole different animal than the American Pitbull Terrier. (even though they look very much alike, usually the staff is a bigger animal) You will find more man biters in the staff side of the breed...I will guarantee that.

Forkin' Crazy
02-27-2007, 09:11 PM
I know some dogs that will let children beat the shit out of them and they just take it.
I guess saying it louder makes it more true. lol!
Yea, I had a Weimaraner (my favorite breed), and I raised him to be child tolerant. As some one said, I would mess with his food bowl when he was growing up, if he growled, he would get a slap. My 3 year old son use to climb all over him and he would never make a sound. He was a very good dog.:)
And yea, that guy had a loud bark!!! :)

RiverDave
02-27-2007, 09:34 PM
Forkin Crazy, if a dog fails the 1st time and passes the second well then one goes under the failed category and one goes under the passes category thus not affecting the percentages.
As far as me being so focking smart well atleast you got one thing right.
50 bucks a point on any IQ test you care to take if your feeling lucky.
As far as the ATTS not being scientific? They take each dog, and put it through a "given" set of parameters and measure the "variables" that gives you a clear end result. Your right that's not science at all..
Definately more scientific to say "Their mentally unstable, and are time bombs" with no basis for your argument.
As for as never happening with a retriever or a lab?
Tell that to Chuck in the keys.. Golden Retriever wandered the keys for years with no issues. Seen probably 1000's of golf carts and people over the years. One day a person that knows the dog drove past it in a golf kart, dog jumped in the cart and mauled him.. I think it was 50+ stitches across his chest?
I got attacked twice in my life by two random black labs..
There's a guy on this board who's childs face was ripped apart by a golden for no "apparent" reason. Child didn't do anything "apparent" to provoke it, why it happened we'll probably never know.
Biting power? Well men are more prone to get into accidents then women.. should we all be forced to drive economy cars becuase a truck can do more damage? Should people with lower IQ's not be allowed to work out becuase there is more of a chance they'll get into a fight and "potentially" (key word there so try to follow along) get into a fight? Bite power is a physical trait and that can't be changed.. Or should we erradicate entire breeds and species becuase they have physical traits that you don't feel are ok.
Your basis for all your arguments is retarded at best, and you have no basis for anything that you've said so far.. So scientifically speaking that'd make you an idiot.
RD

RiverDave
02-27-2007, 09:36 PM
Yea, I had a Weimaraner (my favorite breed), and I raised him to be child tolerant. As some one said, I would mess with his food bowl when he was growing up, if he growled, he would get a slap. My 3 year old son use to climb all over him and he would never make a sound. He was a very good dog.:)
And yea, that guy had a loud bark!!! :)
And in one sentance you pretty much discounted EVERY SINGLE THING YOU'VE SAID about Breed Specific tendancies.
Neva says your a dullard.
RD :D

HM
02-27-2007, 09:58 PM
How come on here the people talking the most shit with regards to this subject are usually the least informed?
RD
LOL....um, that is true for every thread. The arm chair quarter backs on this site an effing riot! Speaking of ACQs....where is Ktoy?

73kona455
02-27-2007, 10:02 PM
RD SUX .. nuff said :eek: :) :)

Forkin' Crazy
02-27-2007, 10:08 PM
Forkin Crazy, if a dog fails the 1st time and passes the second well then one goes under the failed category and one goes under the passes category thus not affecting the percentages.
Well if you are so smart, how did you get me mixed up with some one else? http://www.***boat.com/ubb/graemlins/idea_2.gif I never said anything about dogs failing.
As far as me being so focking smart well atleast you got one thing right.
50 bucks a point on any IQ test you care to take if your feeling lucky.
Here we go… :rolleyes: RD professing his own superior intellect. Right!!! Fock an IQ test. Let’s each of us take a boat apart, redo it, and put it back together.
As far as the ATTS not being scientific? They take each dog, and put it through a "given" set of parameters and measure the "variables" that gives you a clear end result. Your right that's not science at all..
Definately more scientific to say "Their mentally unstable, and are time bombs" with no basis for your argument.
I never said anything about that.
As for as never happening with a retriever or a lab?
Tell that to Chuck in the keys.. Golden Retriever wandered the keys for years with no issues. Seen probably 1000's of golf carts and people over the years. One day a person that knows the dog drove past it in a golf kart, dog jumped in the cart and mauled him.. I think it was 50+ stitches across his chest?
I never said a lab or golden, etc NEVER attacked any one. I was referring to severity of damage the animal was capable of. Get you facts straight little mister! You not only need to learn to read, but comprehend what you are reading. You are so smart. ;)
I got attacked twice in my life by two random black labs..
There's a guy on this board who's childs face was ripped apart by a golden for no "apparent" reason. Child didn't do anything "apparent" to provoke it, why it happened we'll probably never know.
See above.
Biting power? Well men are more prone to get into accidents then women.. should we all be forced to drive economy cars becuase (sic) a truck can do more damage? Should people with lower IQ's not be allowed to work out becuase (sic) there is more of a chance they'll get into a fight and "potentially" (key word there so try to follow along) get into a fight? Bite power is a physical trait and that can't be changed.. Or should we erradicate (sic) entire breeds and species becuase (sic) they have physical traits that you don't feel are ok.
WTF? That is your comparison? LMAO!! For such a person of superior intellect, you can’t spell for shit either!!! :eek:
Your basis for all your arguments is retarded at best, and you have no basis for anything that you've said so far.. So scientifically speaking that'd make you an idiot.
RD
More name calling. That really takes a superior intellect and IQ. Man I tell ya, I am out gunned here. I guess if name calling and attempted belittlement makes you feel that much more superior, than so be it!!! :rolleyes:

riverbound
02-27-2007, 10:09 PM
and who runs this "THE AMERICAN TEMPERMENT TEST SOCIETY" I know they compile all the reports from police, ERs, 1st responce right?
I think I'll stick to the "facts" that are provided by the CDC and animal control departments.
How can you tell how a breed acts by only testing 500 dogs? how many pits are there is the US? I don't have any idea, but I would say that there is atleast 25000, thats only 2 %
Also how did they select the dog to be tested? my guess is they went to local breeders... theres a big diff between a puppy mill and a AKC breeder.
Sorry RD, but those numbers are weak at best.
wouldnt that be like going to the PD or Jail system to get feedback on Humans??
Not to throw race in here, but if you took your Thought process and applied it to the human race, what would you think about Blacks and Mexicans??
Dont let a few bad apples spoil it for all of the breed. Just like Rotties, there are certain people that breed Pits to be aggresive due to their physical attributes. Doesnt mean ALL of them are horrible Killer dogs ready to snap.
My golden retrievers were WAY more sketchy areound kids than my rotties or pits EVER were. and my cocker spaniels had to be given away because of their temperment towards kids.

Forkin' Crazy
02-27-2007, 10:21 PM
Yea, I had a Weimaraner (my favorite breed), and I raised him to be child tolerant. As some one said, I would mess with his food bowl when he was growing up, if he growled, he would get a slap. My 3 year old son use to climb all over him and he would never make a sound. He was a very good dog.:)
And yea, that guy had a loud bark!!! :)
And in one sentance you pretty much discounted EVERY SINGLE THING YOU'VE SAID about Breed Specific tendancies.
Neva says your a dullard.
RD :D
What? :confused: I taught the dog not to be aggressive toward anyone messing with his food, because I know my son could possibly get to his food bowl. So that discounted everything I said about breed tendencies? Speaking of breed tendencies, when did I mention that specifically?
All I said is because of the anatomy of the pit, the damage would be far worse.
I think you need to find the breaks in the posts and when mine stop and other’s begin.
Can you not make a post using degrading and belittling comments aimed specifically toward others? I think you are showing your true colors. Seems as if you have to belittle other people to make you feel better about yourself. That is pretty sad. :sleeping:

396_WAYS_TO_SPIT
02-27-2007, 10:23 PM
I currently own 2 pits and they are very loyal. I have been breeding red noses for 12 years and have had all vicious dogs. None of them liked people,children or other animals. I never had an issue of my dogs hurting anyone that was welcome. My last pit broke my security door 5 times:eek: Then I finally fixed it with 1/4 steel to keep him in. He was so loyal that i could take his food and he would never raise a lip. THe difference is that I treat my dogs like my kids. I never disrespect them tand they always know that Im in charge. Its all how you raise a animal period! I have had frineds that owned pits with kids. Hell you couldnt go near the kids because they would tear your azz up.
I will always own a rednose pit. They are very smart and loyal as long as its a good bloodline. When people cross breed dogs they get very aggresive! Its too bad that alot of people dont know that:(

riverbound
02-27-2007, 10:32 PM
. THe difference is that I treat my dogs like my kids. :(
So...as soon as you found out you took off running saying it wasnt yours??
**sorry, had to ;)**

396_WAYS_TO_SPIT
02-27-2007, 10:55 PM
So...as soon as you found out you took off running saying it wasnt yours??
**sorry, had to ;)**
LMFAO:D Thats classic :D

Jbb
02-28-2007, 03:02 AM
Lets throw JBB in the mix here.. Collies I believe? Safer around Children? Good Temperment, good family dogs, but is there TEMPERMENT comparable to a PITBULL?
Pretty close to a Pits.. just shy
COLLIE= 811 dogs tested, 642 passed, 169 failed, 79.2% passing rate.
RD
Negative.....I have Shelties, not collies.....
RD SUX..
The Unique Sheltie Character
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Shetland Sheepdog must exhibit sensitivity and responsiveness
towards its owner in order to be considered to have true Sheltie
personality or temperament. Sensitivity means that a Sheltie seems
to be almost psychic in picking up and understanding the mood of its
owner. When the owner is in a playful mood, the Sheltie knows and
responds accordingly. When the owner is in a quiet mood, the Sheltie
is quite happy to sit quietly with the owner. When the owner is upset,
the Sheltie senses this and shows concern, sometimes with a worried
look or a few gentle licks. The Sheltie knows when its owner does not
want to be bothered and stays out of the way.
Shelties are usually easy to train because of this sensitivity and
responsiveness. They like to learn and please their owners. Sensitivity
does not mean that the Sheltie is overly sensitive, fearful or cowers
to sounds, people, objects etc., although it may appear that way if
they become very confused about what is expected.
Training can also be tricky with Shelties, however, as they usually try
their hardest to do what you want but because of their sensitivity they
can easily become confused if you become upset or impatient. They often
try to do something before you ask (anticipate) in order to avoid your
displeasure... if you are already frustrated and impatient, this only
makes matters worse. Realize that your Sheltie wants to do what you
ask... slow things down, go back to an easier task and let your Sheltie
be successful before you quit working... then praise, play and relax
with your Sheltie. Next time you work with your Sheltie, you may be
quite surprised that it has figured out what you want all by itself!
Shelties exhibit some rather unusual behaviors at times and if one is
not aware of these, they can be somewhat alarming. Many Shelties grin...
that’s right! Like a big smile on a person, Shelties sometimes bare
their teeth in a huge grin. Don’t mistake this for an aggressive curling
of the upper lip although it can look a bit like it. The situation it
occurs in should tell whether it is a grin or a snarl. When Shelties
are happy and relaxed or playing, they may grin. Some just smile, with
their lips closed.
Some Shelties talk to their people in whines, grunts, groans, and even
quiet growls, especially when being petted. Again, assess the situation.
If your Sheltie is relaxed, it is most likely talking to you, not being
aggressive.
Another unique trait that some Shelties have is to cross their front feet
when laying down. This can be quite an endearing behavior and females
look especially ‘ladylike’ when doing so. Some use their front feet like
hands to hold onto things such as chewies or to catch frisbees.
Your Sheltie may even have a sense of humor. Watch for little practical
jokes your Sheltie may play. You probably won’t believe this one until
it happens to you!
Some Shelties become quite upset when left alone. Some try to teach you
a lesson by soiling in the house when you leave them alone, even though
they have perfect house manners when you are home. Some bark or actually
throw themselves at the door when you are trying to leave. It may be
necessary to place your Sheltie in a crate/kennel when you go out for
the well-being of everyone involved. Remember that Shelties want to
be with you and are not happy when left alone for long periods of time.
Since Shelties were originally herding dogs, many still exhibit behaviors
related to herding such as biting and barking at moving feet or brooms,
mops and vacuum cleaners, circling people or objects, and chasing moving
objects such as other animals, birds, planes and cars. Obviously,
chasing cars can be fatal so don’t allow your Sheltie to do this.
In general, Shelties make great family pets. They can be very active and
playful, and they can be just as happy sleeping at your feet when you are
busy with other things. They do not require a lot of exercise... usually
a daily walk or two will be enough. Most Shelties are good with children
but there are some that would prefer to be left alone and will go off to
a place where they will be left alone. Shelties can be very protective
of their families, especially children of the family.

Mr. C
02-28-2007, 06:54 AM
Now lets throw everybodies Favorite River dog out there.. The age ole Golden Retriever. I've often heard how they have a Great TEMPERMENT
I guess they do! It's right up there just shy of a pitbulls!
GOLDEN RETRIEVER = 687 dogs tested, 576 passed 111 failed, 83.8% passing rate.
RD
DAMN, i guess i'm gonna have to put the little bitch down.
Everybody say a prayer for her please
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v722/wake6/657670194_l.jpg
In my best Borat voice NOT!!!!!
I'm pretty sure i got one of the 576 that passed, Whew.

wsuwrhr
02-28-2007, 08:04 AM
Mopar would like to comment......
"Can't we all get along"
Irie.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63moparrasta.jpg

Jetboatguru
02-28-2007, 08:13 AM
Like Forkin Crazy put it,
it is not that Pits are more prone to attacks (even though I feel they are) It is the severity of damage that they can dole out. When they snap they will devour.
How well your dog is trained around YOU is one thing. I take my dog to obedience training and leave her with the trainer for a week at a time. She is a perfect angel with this guy. When she is with me she is very obedient but not anywhere near the little princess she is with the trainer. I work with her when I have her. That being said, the dog knows when it can push the envelope. So to all the people that think because their dog is well mannered around THEM specifically, your dog can snap without you there. You may be able to be around your dog's food bowl while eating but your kid might be a different story.
To compare the Pitbull/owner to the Handgun/owner is ludicrous. A gun is an inanimate object. It has no feelings. It has no thoughts and it has no drive. The owner is ultimately responsible. A dog has a brain and it has it's own thinking process. Regardless of what it was ever taught or trained to do, it has the ability to snap and there is nothing anyone can do about it.

wright27
02-28-2007, 08:21 AM
first of all ... What type of "pitbull" are you referring to?
like i said before there are more than 7 different Terrier breeds that are referred to as pitbulls. the pitbull you hear about and read in the news are not always the same kind that most owners have.
Saying if your pit is 75lbs it has been crossbred is also retarded... i have many friends with pits.. some are from the same litters and range from 50lbs to 80lbs easily. The females are generally larger.
I for one have a American Staffordshire Terrier. If you didnt know they were bred to be in the AKC.. they were bred to be family dogs. Back in the 60's and 70's they were advertised as such and many many homes had one. They are exceptionally good with children. Like someone else mentioned at NO TIME DURING BREEDING were pitbulls bred to be people aggressive. NEVER. Not only that they were also an image for the war. General Patton had a pitbull. President Roosevelt also had one for his family.
IGNORANCE....
**and just because i quoted you doesnt mean my whole post referred to you**
A pure bred pit will not be 75 pounds. Also a American Staffordshire Terrier is not a pit bull.
TALK ABOUT IGNORANCE

syke-o
02-28-2007, 09:03 AM
thanks for all the information regarding my extremely dangerous dog, a staffordhire bull terrier... i cant believe i have had my dog around my 3 young children for so long, and have let them climb all over him, tug at his tail, throw the ball with him, and wreslte with him.... i will take him down to the vet tommorrow and have him put down since he is such a danger to me, my wife, my kids, and to society in general..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/syke-o/Family/197DCP_1368-med.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/syke-o/Family/197DCP_0950-med.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/syke-o/Family/IMG_36731.jpg

Boa1277
02-28-2007, 10:16 AM
A pure bred pit will not be 75 pounds. Also a American Staffordshire Terrier is not a pit bull.
TALK ABOUT IGNORANCE
Very Very True, Finally someone who has a clue. The problem began when the dog that took so many years to create was bred by the ignorant, and crossed into all these other breeds to create supposedly a tough german shepard or a tougher pitbull/mastiff that weighed 90lbs. The truth is the little 35 to 50# dogs are a hell of alot tougher than the so-called monsters 75lb crosses that all the gang bangers drug dealing types love to own. The true APBT has not been crossed and has not lost all of the traits the old time dogmen cultivated in them years and years ago. These dogs are very very hard to find. But if you look you can find them, they are not cheap. 2500 to 7500$ is very common.

wsuwrhr
02-28-2007, 12:33 PM
All three redheads syke-o?
Crazy.
Cool kids, cool pooch.
Brian
thanks for all the information regarding my extremely dangerous dog, a staffordhire bull terrier... i cant believe i have had my dog around my 3 young children for so long, and have let them climb all over him, tug at his tail, throw the ball with him, and wreslte with him.... i will take him down to the vet tommorrow and have him put down since he is such a danger to me, my wife, my kids, and to society in general..
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/syke-o/Family/IMG_36731.jpg

topless
02-28-2007, 12:37 PM
All three redheads syke-o?
Crazy.
Cool kids, cool pooch.
BrianBut that's a dangerous dog!! Run for the hills:jawdrop:

wsuwrhr
02-28-2007, 12:38 PM
Mopar would like to comment......AGAIN
"Worry more about my "dad" than me, I just do the barking that wakes him up."
Mopar
Don't wander into my house un-invited. Unlike RD's house, I have no revolving door and few friends with wife problems looking for a place to crash, if you don't have a key, your odds aren't very good. Your family may beat me a civil suit, but that is all you got.
Brian
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63moparrasta.jpg

wsuwrhr
02-28-2007, 12:42 PM
Right about now my vicouskillerattackdog is snoring on the couch.
Brian

wsuwrhr
02-28-2007, 12:43 PM
Ceasar Milan would undoubtedly have something to say on this subject. I think he is more than well qualified.

RiverDave
02-28-2007, 01:14 PM
Forkin Crazy, I'm going to go ahead and say I'm sorry for confusing you with another members posts. I only had a minute or two to respond last night so I wrote those responses pretty quickly. After reading them again this morning they come off alot worse then I was intending. That being said sorry again.
JBB, sorry I confused your shelties with collies as well. :D
396, as far as mixing breeds being aggressive and purebreds not, on what possible foundation can you say that? Often times there is so much inbreeding with regards to purebreds that it produces less then desirable results?
RD

RiverDave
02-28-2007, 01:16 PM
Ceasar Milan would undoubtedly have something to say on this subject. I think he is more than well qualified.
I think just about ANY dog expert would have alot to say about this. Ceasar Milan being one of the foremost would have alot to say about dogs "thinking on their own" and just randomly exhibiting behaviors.
RD

TAF
02-28-2007, 01:51 PM
Like Forkin Crazy put it,
it is not that Pits are more prone to attacks (even though I feel they are) It is the severity of damage that they can dole out. When they snap they will devour.
How well your dog is trained around YOU is one thing. I take my dog to obedience training and leave her with the trainer for a week at a time. She is a perfect angel with this guy. When she is with me she is very obedient but not anywhere near the little princess she is with the trainer. I work with her when I have her. That being said, the dog knows when it can push the envelope. So to all the people that think because their dog is well mannered around THEM specifically, your dog can snap without you there. You may be able to be around your dog's food bowl while eating but your kid might be a different story.
To compare the Pitbull/owner to the Handgun/owner is ludicrous. A gun is an inanimate object. It has no feelings. It has no thoughts and it has no drive. The owner is ultimately responsible. A dog has a brain and it has it's own thinking process. Regardless of what it was ever taught or trained to do, it has the ability to snap and there is nothing anyone can do about it.
I'm impressed. I've never heard it put so diplomatically. I'm surounded by Pit Bull owners here at work and am very scared of them. Aren't they able to sense that? Last night I was drinking beers w/ some work friends that have the biggest pitbull (its head is as wide as my body) I've ever been around. I enjoyed petting him but it always makes me nervous when he puts his head in yer lap / crotch. :jawdrop: :idea:

C-2
02-28-2007, 02:52 PM
This is a pit bull.
No it's not.
Yes it is, I'm an expert.
No, you're ignorant.
This shiat is funny.

wsuwrhr
02-28-2007, 02:58 PM
This is a pit bull.
No it's not.
Yes it is, I'm an expert.
No, you're ignorant.
This shiat is funny.
This shit is funny too..
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63moparrasta.jpg

topless
02-28-2007, 03:25 PM
This shit is funny too..
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63moparrasta.jpg
That's not a pit bull, it's some kind of Jamaican dog.:eek:

Forkin' Crazy
02-28-2007, 03:34 PM
Forkin Crazy, I'm going to go ahead and say I'm sorry for confusing you with another members posts. I only had a minute or two to respond last night so I wrote those responses pretty quickly. After reading them again this morning they come off alot worse then I was intending. That being said sorry again.
JBB, sorry I confused your shelties with collies as well. :D
396, as far as mixing breeds being aggressive and purebreds not, on what possible foundation can you say that? Often times there is so much inbreeding with regards to purebreds that it produces less then desirable results?
RD
It's all good bro!!! You just gave this "idiot" a bit of fun! :D I love a debate! :cool:
I can tell you are passionate about your opinion. Nothing wrong with that. If you or any other responsible dog owners want a Pit Bull, Staff , or what-have-you, more power to you!!! :)
But it's like putting a teenaged kid in a Corvette as far as insurance is concerned! :eek:
Oh yea, RD sux! :D

Boa1277
02-28-2007, 03:53 PM
396, as far as mixing breeds being aggressive and purebreds not, on what possible foundation can you say that? Often times there is so much inbreeding with regards to purebreds that it produces less then desirable results?
RD[/QUOTE]
It has been proven time and time again that pitbulls do not mix well with other dogs. The majority of these dogs end up as man biters. It seems as if one of the first traits that gets lost is the love of people when they are crossed. These dogs look like a pit but somewhere they have mixed blood. If you follow a line for example the Bolio strain of dogs you will see many many generations of dogs that carry the same traits. Game, small in stature, very very athletic, deep wind and yes they love people, in fact they like people so much they are very easily stolen. They are also lighting up the 3rd world and are demanding huge $ on the open market. Many a good dogmen have lost great dogs because people can walk right up to them and take them home. There also is a big difference in line breeding and inbreeding, it takes a geneticist to explain it but if you like I can cut and paste a definition for you. It is very boring and unless you truly want to become a foundation breeder you will probably fall asleep.

Biglue
02-28-2007, 03:57 PM
This shit is funny too..
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/63moparrasta.jpg
Brian, you better keep your dog where he can't get to people. That way when he snaps about the way you dress and accessorize him he can't maul an innocent victim. :D
Cool pooch BTW.
See what you did Alison....you just had to didn't you!?!?! :mad: :D

C-2
02-28-2007, 03:58 PM
That's not a pit bull, it's some kind of Jamaican dog.:eek:
No it's not.
I've owned 847 Jamaican dogs and that's clearly a Bahamian dog cuz it's got gameness. Jimmy Carter had one.
U B IGNORANT!!!!
:D :D :D :sqeyes: :D :D :D

topless
02-28-2007, 04:22 PM
No it's not.
I've owned 847 Jamaican dogs and that's clearly a Bahamian dog cuz it's got gameness. Jimmy Carter had one.
U B IGNORANT!!!!
:D :D :D :sqeyes: :D :D :DLook here Mr. Jamaican dog expert, I know a Jamaican dog when I see one.:D

NashvilleBound
02-28-2007, 04:24 PM
How about these...speaking of Pitbulls. The dog was fine just so you know.
http://www.***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=25237&stc=1&d=1172708581
http://www.***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=25238&stc=1&d=1172708581

wsuwrhr
02-28-2007, 04:29 PM
Mopar is a bitch BTW.
Brian, you better keep your dog where he can't get to people. That way when he snaps about the way you dress and accessorize him he can't maul an innocent victim. :D
Cool pooch BTW.
See what you did Alison....you just had to didn't you!?!?! :mad: :D

HTRDLNCN
03-04-2007, 01:48 PM
THE AMERICAN TEMPERMENT TEST SOCIETY takes a SCIENTIFIC APPROACH to testing the temperments of dogs, records the data and gives % rates on each breed.
AMERICAN PITBULL TERRIER =Passing rate as a BREED of 84.1%
AMERICAN STAFFORDSHIRE TERRIER passing rate of 83.9%
ALASKAN MALAMUTE = passing rate 84.5%
BLOODHOUND= 71.9% passing rate.
COLLIE= 79.2% passing rate.
GOLDEN RETRIEVER = 83.8% passing rate.
RD
dont know how accurate the numbers are but my girl has the best score in that group,doesnt do bad with attracting attention either :D
http://www.hotrodlincoln.org/jennaki.jpg

talkinghead
03-04-2007, 10:40 PM
Pit Bulls among other species should be made illegal to own or house in high density communities, period.
Quite a few cities have enacted such laws - and wisely so.
Pit Bulls and certain other species of dogs present way to much risk (injury or worse) to communities at large.

Boa1277
03-05-2007, 06:12 PM
Pit Bulls among other species should be made illegal to own or house in high density communities, period.
Quite a few cities have enacted such laws - and wisely so.
Pit Bulls and certain other species of dogs present way to much risk (injury or worse) to communities at large.
Let me guess you work for PETA or the Humane Society, if you dont I am sure they are hiring. Honestly I think people like you should be banned from society period!

repo man
03-05-2007, 06:44 PM
please don't tell me the ''it's not how they are raised''bullshit. that argument is getting old. Cesar millan ''the dog whisperer'' has a pack of pit bulls that were all killers that he rehab-ed. those savage killers are no longer a danger to your kids. all dogs are dangerous, only stupid think there's are not.

riverroyal
03-05-2007, 06:50 PM
doesnt mean I dont like the owners,but a few years back a pit attacked my golden retriever,he was a pup,maybe 3 months old.The pit ran down the beach and attacked him,the dog had holes every where.While I was loading my jetski to take the dog to the ER,the owner was trying to leave,we called 911.I really wanted to take a bat to the owners head,he was a scumbag,so my opinon of pit owners is a bit jaded

Burn504
03-05-2007, 07:06 PM
A pure bred pit will not be 75 pounds. Also a American Staffordshire Terrier is not a pit bull.
TALK ABOUT IGNORANCE
your obviously ignorant..
quoted from Wikipedia
"Pit Bull is a term used to describe several breeds of dogs with similar physical characteristics. The American Pit Bull Terrier and the American Staffordshire Terrier commonly fall under the category of "pit bull." There are several other breeds that can fall under the category of pit bull, including: the Argentine Dogo, the English Bull Terrier, the American Bulldog, and the Perro de Presa Canario. These breeds are usually not included by breed name in any Breed Specific Legislation (see below), but are usually included because of a broad definition and confusion as to what a pit bull actually is. All of these breeds as well as many others (including Great Danes, Newfoundlands and Rottweilers) are members of the Molosser family of dog breeds."
reading owns you because i have quoted this multiple times since like page 2 or 3.
unless you say American Pit Bull Terrier you are referring to the slang term used to generalize many breeds.
Maybes its a good things retards like you think an american staffordshire terrier isnt a pit. I bet if my dog bit you he'd be a Pit..lol
and according to Wikipedia "Characteristics
An American Pit Bull Terrier, a Pit Bull breed
An American Pit Bull Terrier, a Pit Bull breed
The pit bull is a medium-sized dog: males generally weigh 40-70 lbs. "
so im sure a 5lb difference would make him a cross breed..lol
mine weighs 55-60lb, but i could easily make him 80lbs if i wanted to work him out and feed him right.

Boa1277
03-06-2007, 06:58 PM
your obviously ignorant..
quoted from Wikipedia
"Pit Bull is a term used to describe several breeds of dogs with similar physical characteristics. The American Pit Bull Terrier and the American Staffordshire Terrier commonly fall under the category of "pit bull." There are several other breeds that can fall under the category of pit bull, including: the Argentine Dogo, the English Bull Terrier, the American Bulldog, and the Perro de Presa Canario. These breeds are usually not included by breed name in any Breed Specific Legislation (see below), but are usually included because of a broad definition and confusion as to what a pit bull actually is. All of these breeds as well as many others (including Great Danes, Newfoundlands and Rottweilers) are members of the Molosser family of dog breeds."
reading owns you because i have quoted this multiple times since like page 2 or 3.
unless you say American Pit Bull Terrier you are referring to the slang term used to generalize many breeds.
Maybes its a good things retards like you think an american staffordshire terrier isnt a pit. I bet if my dog bit you he'd be a Pit..lol
and according to Wikipedia "Characteristics
An American Pit Bull Terrier, a Pit Bull breed
An American Pit Bull Terrier, a Pit Bull breed
The pit bull is a medium-sized dog: males generally weigh 40-70 lbs. "
so im sure a 5lb difference would make him a cross breed..lol
mine weighs 55-60lb, but i could easily make him 80lbs if i wanted to work him out and feed him right.
I am sorry but he is right and you sound like the retard quoting the encyclopedia. If you truly knew anything about the bread you would not be popping off like you are because it truly makes you look ignorant. Staffs are not American Pit Bull Terriers, owners like yourself like to say you have a pit bull because it makes you tough or who knows why maybe you like controversy, I truly dont know, the American Staffordshire Terrier is a off shoot of the APBT and most of the characteristics of the true APBT has been lost in the Staff. The most important being gameness, and right after that their love of people. The staff shows more of the characteristics of a watch dog, and if your dog bit me he would still be a staff, he would probably be a dead staff but he definitely would be a staff. If you did decide to work your dog out he would lose weight, not gain it. I can see you really are a dog whisperer, maybe you should start your own show with Cesar.