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Sandbar Mike
03-15-2006, 09:02 AM
I'VE GOT TO POST THIS FOR A FRIEND; THIS IS NOTHING AGAINST AFTERSHOCK OWNERS.
My buddy Sal bought a 24 Aftershock a few years back. On a weekend trip to Bass Lake with his family, the boat completely delaminated. Sal had 6 small kids and 3 adults aboard when everybody was thrown forward, luck the injuries were minor. With the engine compartment partially submerged he was able to fire up the 496mag and idle back to the dock before sinking. He got it back on the trailer after pumping out all the engine compartment water. He said if you looked in the engine compartment while on the trailer you could see daylight straight through the 1/8" glass under the engine. Scary situation to say the least.
He took the boat back to Aftershock; they kept it for a while to see if it could be repaired or if it needed to be junked. Apparently what had happened was Aftershock had a bad inventory of resin which had been used on a few lay-ups that and had similar problems with a few other boats built around the same time frame. Maybe there are a few more Aftershock owners on here who can elaborate?? Anyway aftershock now has accepted that they will have to replace the hull completely. I think this is what any reputable manufacturer would do, not to mention repairing would have been extremely unsafe(Aftershock original idea).
6 months later he makes the trip down to Aftershock to pick up his boat. Sal is walking around the boat with our other buddy Kevin pointing out scratches and other flaw's in the gel & paint work. Apparently Aftershock had a custom painter come down to paint some skulls on the boat which were then clear coated. Typically when you paint on a boat you then clear coat the entire boat right?? Not these clowns, they boxed out around the painted skulls so now you see a box around skulls of clear coat. Aftershock told Sal to go ahead and take the boat, run it then bring it back and they'll fix all the nick's, scratches and f'd up interior that they pieced together. Sal takes it back pleased about how it ran, Aftershock took possession to fix punch list stuff and get it repaired back the right way. Sal now returns to pick up his boat and is told by who ever these clowns are that he owes them 6K for all the punch list (not extra) work they did, which was warranty work they should have been done to begin with. He refuses to pay; they refuse to give him his boat back. So he has been notified from an Aftershocks attorney that they put a lien on the boat and wont give it back to him a until he pays the 6K.
So 2 years back Sal buys a 65K 24ft aftershock that delaminates at 35 hours. He has paid cash for this boat. My advice to him was to get his attorney and nail these guys with punitive damages and the value of the boat. I'd tell them to shove the boat up their @ss. Way to go Aftershock; you sure made a fun family hobby of boating an absolute nightmare for this guy, dude almost got divorced over all this sh&t.
HOT BOATERS,LIKE I SAID THIS IS NOT A BASHING OF YOUR BOAT OR IT'S QUALITY.
This is advice on customer service at its worst.
Sal your welcome to ride with me this Summer in Havasu, being he won’t have his boat!
Thanks Rocky, I edited my miss spellings, I was in a little hurry! :D

phuggit
03-15-2006, 09:13 AM
I hate to read about this kind of crap. I don't have an answer for your friend, but I hope everything gets resolved and he can get out on the water to spend time with his family.

syke-o
03-15-2006, 09:14 AM
that is a shitty thing for your buddy sal to have to go through... i hope he gets his money back, or a boat that will be to his satisfaction without extra bogus charges..

Mrs. Bordsmnj
03-15-2006, 09:27 AM
We used to own an Aftershock. We called them out on all their short-cuts and made them fix them, which they always did. For the most part they always treated us good but I am pretty sure we would never purchase another one.
Not sure if she is still there but the chick in the accounting department was evil. We had several run-ins with her. :argue:
Whenever we had issues with them, we called our salesman and he always handled it.
Hope they get this handled. :(

phebus
03-15-2006, 09:30 AM
You talk of Aftershock having a painter come down and do some work. Was that done in addition to the warranty work, or was the boat brought back to the condition is was bought.
It would be nice to have the owner come on here and state all the facts.
I'm not doubting the story you have been told, it's just that I've been on here long enough to see the three sides of every story.

bigq
03-15-2006, 09:34 AM
any takers on how long till this gets pulled. :rolleyes:

Hardly Satisfied
03-15-2006, 09:37 AM
Sad to hear that anybody has to go though this Bull Sh!t

maxwedge
03-15-2006, 09:37 AM
any takers on how long till this gets pulled. :rolleyes:
I'll take the 7:30pm(CST) tonight slot please. :crossx:

Havasu Luvr
03-15-2006, 09:39 AM
any takers on how long till this gets pulled. :rolleyes:
F*ck Off ! ! Sandbar Mike is NOT like other PUSSY on these boards who post shit then delete....even if there is "3" sides to this story he will leave it up for all to see. Lets see if Carrera/Aftershock steps up to the plate. There is alot more details involved then most know. I too am curious.....

andy01
03-15-2006, 09:39 AM
Not the first person to own a Aftershock that I have read about that wasn't happy. There are very few boats I would own, if I had to do business with a company like this I would stop boating!!! Tell your friend to fight to the end. They should have just said don't worry about it for the summer of not having a boat.
Andy

Essex29
03-15-2006, 09:40 AM
any takers on how long till this gets pulled. :rolleyes:
You have to wonder why threads like this get pulled????? As a consumer I would want to know the other side :argue: and then the third side :rollside:
Was there a work order that he signed for the additional work to be done, if so, he would be liable, but if there wasn't, why are they holding his boat?

maxwedge
03-15-2006, 09:41 AM
F*ck Off ! ! Sandbar Mike is NOT like other PUSSY on these boards who post shit then delete....even if there is "3" sides to this story he will leave it up for all to see.
I was thinking more like pulled by Hot Boat.

BADBLOWN572
03-15-2006, 09:42 AM
Apparently Aftershock had a custom painter come down to paint some skulls on the boat which were then clear coated. Typically when you paint on a boat you then clear coat the entire boat right. Not these clowns, they boxed out around the painted skulls so now you see a box around skulls of clear coat. What a bunch of crap.
I am sorry to hear about your friend's problems. One thing that I do want to point out is that when you clear a boat, you do not clear the whole boat. Especially if it is white. If it is any shade of white or gray, over time the clear coat will turn the boat yellow.
99% of the time, what they do is spray the mold all white, then remove the tape and spray clear then colored gel behind the clear. That way the colors are all cleared, but the white is straight gel coat. If they did skulls on the exterior, they would not need to go back through and clear coat the whole boat. The portions of the boat that needed clear already had the clear applied in the mold. They would spray clear coat over the portion that was externally painted then wet sand it down to make sure that it flows smoothly into the rest of the colors. That is the way that every boat manufacturer that I have ever seen does it. Just my .02

mbrown2
03-15-2006, 09:44 AM
Your buddy should take them to court....they are already going to court on screwing another owner...
Just too bad Carerra even has to be afiliated with them....AShock's are definitely a tier 3-4 boat...and the way they run their business and the stories of owners or people who do business with them support this fact.

Havasu Luvr
03-15-2006, 09:46 AM
I was thinking more like pulled by Hot Boat.
Now that MAY happen ! ! I was just stating that it would not be pulled by Sandbar Mike
:)

bigq
03-15-2006, 10:00 AM
F*ck Off ! ! Sandbar Mike is NOT like other PUSSY on these boards who post shit then delete....even if there is "3" sides to this story he will leave it up for all to see. Lets see if Carrera/Aftershock steps up to the plate. There is alot more details involved then most know. I too am curious.....
I meant Hot Boat! now suck a dick! :hammerhea

bigq
03-15-2006, 10:01 AM
Now that MAY happen ! ! I was just stating that it would not be pulled by Sandbar Mike
:)
Roger

rivercrazy
03-15-2006, 10:01 AM
Did they put the gas fill inside the engine compartment too? :220v:

Havasu Luvr
03-15-2006, 10:06 AM
I meant Hot Boat! now suck a dick! :hammerhea
Hmmmmm?? :rolleyes: seems to me you already did :cool:

Mandelon
03-15-2006, 10:10 AM
Wasn't it Aftershock that had the guy with the fuel filler in the engine hatch issue last year? did that thread go bye bye too?

bigq
03-15-2006, 10:13 AM
Hmmmmm?? :rolleyes: seems to me you already did :cool:
I back away from my last statement in fear of another "gay thread". :p

mlt
03-15-2006, 10:19 AM
I have a 2003 AfterShock the boat is great and the only problem i have had was carpet threads in the gas tank they fixed it with no problems as for the boat being made i was there every day and they fixed everthing i asked.
as for this person was the boat put back the way it was or did he upgrade it?
all warranty are for replacement only not upgrades

MR HARLEY
03-15-2006, 10:24 AM
I have a 2003 AfterShock the boat is great and the only problem i have had was carpet threads in the gas tank they fixed it with no problems as for the boat being made i was there every day and they fixed everthing i asked.
as for this person was the boat put back the way it was or did he upgrade it?
all warranty are for replacement only not upgrades
1st post huh ?

mlt
03-15-2006, 10:29 AM
as Sandbar Mike ask (Maybe there are a few more Aftershock owners on here who can elaborate?? ) so i did this is only how i was treated, Is that OK with you Mr Harley

andy01
03-15-2006, 10:30 AM
Ias for the boat being made i was there every day and they fixed everthing i asked.
I love post like this, you buy a new boat and have "everything fixed" it shouldn't need to be fixed. You don't go buy a new Ferrari and they fix it before you drive it home. You pick it up and leave with it, only to take it back for service. I wouldn't buy a boat that had to be fixed when it was finished. Why do people buy boats from places like this? There are so many other boat companys that build "like boats" for "like Money" but don't have a line of customers standing out in front talking about how bad thier boat was put together.
Andy

Havasu Luvr
03-15-2006, 10:30 AM
1st post huh ?
Thinking the samething :messedup:

Mrs. Bordsmnj
03-15-2006, 10:30 AM
as Sandbar Mike ask (Maybe there are a few more Aftershock owners on here who can elaborate?? ) so i did this is only how i was treated, Is that OK with you Mr Harley
Huh? :confused:

Jordy
03-15-2006, 10:31 AM
as Sandbar Mike ask (Maybe there are a few more Aftershock owners on here who can elaborate?? ) so i did this is only how i was treated is that OK with you
Just a suggestion, but a little puncuation goes a long way around here. If people get a headache reading your posts, they'll be less likely to respond to them. ;)

Eliminator 4 Life
03-15-2006, 10:34 AM
Im sorry to hear about this. Why would you charge a customer 6k to fix his boat that you FAWKED up on god this is mind blowing. I think he should get an attorney and do exactly what you said to do with the boat. Its to bad some people dont stand behind there work..
Sal best of luck I hope you get all your money back and then some for P&S. Remember I know a good boat company who will take care of you if you ever want to get another boat again. :cool:

Mandelon
03-15-2006, 10:35 AM
Just a suggestion, but a little puncuation goes a long way around here. If people get a headache reading your posts, they'll be less likely to respond to them. ;)
C'mon JP, he did use a LITTLE punctuation. :rolleyes:

Jordy
03-15-2006, 10:37 AM
C'mon JP, he did use a LITTLE punctuation. :rolleyes:
Yeah, my bad. He did use some question marks inside the parentheses. Allow me to elaborate. Use a little more punctuation, and perhaps some complete sentences with proper sentence structure if you would like to make your point more clearly. How's that??? :D :D :D

MR HARLEY
03-15-2006, 10:38 AM
as Sandbar Mike ask (Maybe there are a few more Aftershock owners on here who can elaborate?? ) so i did this is only how i was treated, Is that OK with you Mr Harley
You know whats funny to me is that your first post came out in this thread.
This also was a good one
all warranty are for replacement only not upgrades
As I read it the buyer was takeing his boat back to be fixed after 35 hours and almost sinking it :rolleyes: among other things.
I have a 2003 AfterShock the boat is great and the only problem i have had was carpet threads in the gas tank they fixed it with no problems as for the boat being made i was there every day and they fixed everthing i asked.
You had to fix a new boat ?

mlt
03-15-2006, 10:40 AM
well i see ***boat.com i not a nice place to be, so i will go back to offshoreonly.com

Biglue
03-15-2006, 10:41 AM
This is gonna get get good.

BoatFloating
03-15-2006, 10:42 AM
1st post huh ?
Here is my 4674 post. The guys at Aftershock/Carrera fixed and never questioned anything I had issues with. There is always 3 sides to every story and trust me there is to this one also. Read it. They build him a new boat no questions asked and he adds things that he didn't have on the old boat. Again there is always he said she said and in the middle is the truth. But if they build anothe boat for you at no charge and you add things that cost extra then you have to pay. If he felt that they build crappy stuff why have them build another boat. Ask for your money and move on. If they refuse then sue them because you have a great case for damages and suffering.
I too had questions about Carrera joining Aftershock but the guys at the factory have been very good to me and even fixed things that I caused and at no charge. If I ever questioned the quailty I wouldn't put me or my family in my boat doing 90+ mph period. If I was Sal I would go after the resin supplier and mfg of the resin to recoup damages.
Just my .02 Let the bandwagon bashing begin.....

Biglue
03-15-2006, 10:42 AM
well i see ***boat.com i not a nice placeto be, so i will go back to offshoreonly.com
LMAO. Can anyone else hear this being said with a lisp?

Havasu Luvr
03-15-2006, 10:43 AM
well i see ***boat.com i not a nice place to be, so i will go back to offshoreonly.com
Hmmmm? you hangout in OSO with a Aftershock?

Jordy
03-15-2006, 10:44 AM
Hmmmm? you hangout in OSO with a Aftershock?
Dammit, I was thinking the same thing. You beat me to it though. :D :D :D

Havasu Luvr
03-15-2006, 10:47 AM
Dammit, I was thinking the same thing. You beat me to it though. :D :D :D
"Great Minds" sometimes think faster then others :rolleyes:

mlt
03-15-2006, 10:48 AM
My last word go F your self

Mrs. Bordsmnj
03-15-2006, 10:49 AM
My last word go F your self
LOL!!
Classic post! :rollside:

Havasu Luvr
03-15-2006, 10:49 AM
My last word go F your self
You're right. You do belong in OSO.....BYE

maxwedge
03-15-2006, 10:53 AM
You don't go buy a new Ferrari and they fix it before you drive it home. You pick it up and leave with it, only to take it back for service.
The meaning here is a little unclear, but my former roomate worked at a high end import dealer, and from what he told me, lots of new Ferarris are tempermental as hell, and the old ones are even worse. Appearently lots of them need major tweaking before they ever leave the showroom. Never heard of one delaminating though, unless you hit a pole at 160 on the PCH, of course. :crossx:

rivercrazy
03-15-2006, 10:53 AM
My guess is that MLT works at Aftershock

Jordy
03-15-2006, 10:55 AM
My last word go F your self
Wouldn't that be 4 words (although technically it should be 3)??? :D :D :D
That's gotta be some kind of a record. 4 posts and out, even though you know that's not the last we're going to see of Milt. Good stuff though. :D :D :D
I just wonder who he was directing that at. Lots of "your self"s in here. Guess we'll work on quoting after we get puncutation and grammar knocked out. :D :D :D

Dribble
03-15-2006, 10:56 AM
Three words for the boat owner.
Small Claims Court.
The limit is up to $7500.00 now. There is no point in paying an attorney $10,000 to deal with a $6000.00 dispute.

maxwedge
03-15-2006, 10:58 AM
Is it just me, or does anybody else suddenly have a strong desire to go post some shit at OSO? :D

Havasu Luvr
03-15-2006, 11:04 AM
That's gotta be some kind of a record. 4 posts and out, even though you know that's not the last we're going to see of Milt. Good stuff though. :D :D :D
I just wonder who he was directing that at. Lots of "your self"s in here. Guess we'll work on quoting after we get puncutation and grammar knocked out. :D :D :D
I believe it was directed towards you. You know how you like to make friends and influence people :rolleyes: :)

HighRoller
03-15-2006, 11:04 AM
My last word go F your self
Oh yeah? Well I've got one word for you:

BoatFloating
03-15-2006, 11:05 AM
My guess is that MLT works at Aftershock
I can tell those guys down there are not very computer savvy so I doubt that....

Jordy
03-15-2006, 11:06 AM
I believe it was directed towards you. You know how you like to make friends and influence people :rolleyes: :)
I seem to really know how to get in tight with the Aftershock guys too. The one with the boat with the gas fills in the bilge called my house once. Good stuff. :D :D :D

HighRoller
03-15-2006, 11:19 AM
I seem to really know how to get in tight with the Aftershock guys too. The one with the boat with the gas fills in the bilge called my house once. Good stuff. :D :D :D
That was the perfect opportunity for revenge. You should have started talking in a middle eastern accent and got him to believe that Aftershock had outsourced its customer service to India. He would have popped a blood vessel and expired on the spot :crossx: :crossx:

Benjhamina
03-15-2006, 11:29 AM
Sort of a similar story. I bought a used Eliminator 26 eagle last year and on my second trip out I got to Catalina and there was a 4X4 section of glass stripped off on the front just at the water line when floating. Not all the way through, maybe 1/8th of an inch, and no water was leaking but still pretty scary. We were in Catalina. Needless to say we took it easy on the way back and drove it straight to the Eliminator shop. After we got it worked out with them that the hull WAS still under warrantee they said it was obvious that we hit something and our ins. should take care of it. The insurance adjuster said it was obviously a defective hull and the manufacturer should take care of it. We got a third party boat shop involved and they couldn't determine the cause and neither could a marine surveyer. Cost on the repair was going to be $10,000 ish so I call Eliminator and pleeded with them and they sent the boat back through production for a fast fix and charged $3000. Easy desision to get the boat back on the water for the rest of the summer. I felt like they treated me right but who really knows. I know they have been wonderful with everything else including fixing a laundry list of things the previous owner neglected for free. Just .02
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/benjhamina/holeinboat2.jpg

purrfecttremor
03-15-2006, 11:36 AM
I do feel sorry for Sal but this whole thread has made My day!!!!
THANKS FOR THE ENTERTAINMENT MLT!!!!!!

BajaMike
03-15-2006, 11:45 AM
as Sandbar Mike ask (Maybe there are a few more Aftershock owners on here who can elaborate?? ) so i did this is only how i was treated, Is that OK with you Mr Harley
Can someone translate that to English for me??:confused:
:idea:

phebus
03-15-2006, 11:47 AM
How come this thread is in three different forums? I thought I was seeing double, or even triple. :hammer2:

BajaMike
03-15-2006, 11:48 AM
well i see ***boat.com i not a nice place to be, so i will go back to offshoreonly.com
Don't let the door.........
:rollside: :) :rollside: :)

BoatFloating
03-15-2006, 11:52 AM
How come this thread is in three different forums? I thought I was seeing double, or even triple. :hammer2:
I thought the same thing.... And who is Sale I thought his name was Sal? You guys are all over MLT with his grammar but how did you get thru the the email. I was lost at Sale...... I'll say it one last time if you question safety then you should of ask for your money not a new boat. Trust me if that happened to my boat cash in hand would be the only answer. Not build me a new boat and change colors and add more amps etc.....

Mandelon
03-15-2006, 12:42 PM
Truly, a Delaminator indeed. :p Glad you made it back alright. You must've hit something......yeah, like a wave. :skull:
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/benjhamina/holeinboat2.jpg[/QUOTE]

Jbb
03-15-2006, 12:54 PM
Wouldn't that be 4 words (although technically it should be 3)??? :D :D :D
That's gotta be some kind of a record. 4 posts and out, even though you know that's not the last we're going to see of Milt. Good stuff though. :D :D :D
I just wonder who he was directing that at. Lots of "your self"s in here. Guess we'll work on quoting after we get puncutation and grammar knocked out. :D :D :D
Unkle mlt....that you?... :p

intense
03-15-2006, 01:22 PM
Truly, a Delaminator indeed. :p Glad you made it back alright. You must've hit something......yeah, like a wave. :skull:
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/benjhamina/holeinboat2.jpg[/QUOTE]
Looks like it to me also :D

Big Warlock
03-15-2006, 01:25 PM
I agree with the cash in hand. Why have the same potential problem? I have been vocal about my opion on certain boat builders. I dislike it greatly when people buy something at a lesser value then expect it to reflect the same quality as the guy next to him driving a Formula, Scarab, Donzi, Fountain, etc. etc. Ok, you paid half price, you can see daylight through the hull and you strapped on 800 horsepower and ready for the river. Awesome!!!
Not saying this is the case, but I doubt I would be back for another boat if that was my experience. I do appreciate this thread for the fact that people start to talk about their experiences, good and bad.
Hey, Jordy drives a FORD and I think he's an ok guy? What the heck? :yuk:

Sandbar Mike
03-15-2006, 01:30 PM
I thought the same thing.... And who is Sale I thought his name was Sal? You guys are all over MLT with his grammar but how did you get thru the the email. I was lost at Sale...... I'll say it one last time if you question safety then you should of ask for your money not a new boat. Trust me if that happened to my boat cash in hand would be the only answer. Not build me a new boat and change colors and add more amps etc.....
Hey Rock, This is not aimed at you in any way bro. (I'm sure you know this)
I posted this in (3) forums to try and get feedback if any other HB members had this same problem with Aftershock.
Aftershock didn't offer to replace the hull; they were willing to repair the damaged portion only. From what I hear this happened to (3) other boats. Sal's question was safety at this point & Aftershock without a question would not refund his money. After arguing with them and sue threatening they finally agreed to replace the hull. The agreement was to replace the boat to its current condition. The skull paint was the original condition, they looked pretty cool before, now they have clear box out’s around them.
The Punch List Fix its Aftershock just completed was interior work that was jacked up, a few nicks & scratches, his old stereo and his old swim step. They didn’t tell him anything about the cost until he showed up to pick up the boat.$$$$$$$$$$$$$$Fu&kn BS
My bud Sal's hands are tied, all his money is tied up in this piece of sh&t boat which is sitting at Aftershock locked up. He recently went to Aftershock and called the local police. The Cop wanted to help but couldn't allow Sal on the property.
Sal is not online at home or he would be a registered HB member.

phebus
03-15-2006, 01:31 PM
This thread is worthless without more information.
All it did was feed the ***boat Lynchmob some scraps, and now thy're scrambling to find someone to hang.

Sandbar Mike
03-15-2006, 01:36 PM
I agree with the cash in hand. Why have the same potential problem? I have been vocal about my opion on certain boat builders. I dislike it greatly when people buy something at a lesser value then expect it to reflect the same quality as the guy next to him driving a Formula, Scarab, Donzi, Fountain, etc. etc. Ok, you paid half price, you can see daylight through the hull and you strapped on 800 horsepower and ready for the river. Awesome!!!
Not saying this is the case, but I doubt I would be back for another boat if that was my experience. I do appreciate this thread for the fact that people start to talk about their experiences, good and bad.
Hey, Jordy drives a FORD and I think he's an ok guy? What the heck? :yuk:
I couldn't agree with you more, what really sucks is he paid 65K for a 24' boat with a 496Mag. 2 Years ago :cry:

Dan Lorenze
03-15-2006, 01:36 PM
I'VE GOT TO POST THIS FOR A FRIEND; THIS IS NOTHING AGAINST AFTERSHOCK OWNERS.
Sale now returns to pick up his boat and is told who ever these clowns are that he owes them 6K for all the extra work they did, which was warranty work they should have been done to begin with. He refuses to pay; they refuse to give him his boat back.
Extra work or warranty work? It seems like that just might be the question of the hour. I know nothing about this situation but sounds to me like it's a question of what was warranty work and what was done to the boat above and beyond a complete fix. Was there any upgraded components that your friend was asking for? Hopefully everything's on paper and can be worked without paying lawers a dime, their fees come from somewhere...

unleashed
03-15-2006, 01:42 PM
Looks like he had a piece of shiat hull from the get go. IMO he should have asked for a refund. Why give a boat builder a chance to screw up another hull. Luckily you're boat didnt sink with your family aboard. :mad:
Deano
Unleashedclothing (http://www.unleashedclothing.com) :crossx:

Jordy
03-15-2006, 01:51 PM
Hey, Jordy drives a FORD and I think he's an ok guy? What the heck? :yuk:
Now that's how bad rumors get started. I wouldn't drive a Ford, especially a Ford diesel, even if it did come with a factory tailgate heater to keep your hands warm when you were pushing it. :D :D :D

Big Warlock
03-15-2006, 01:55 PM
And someone might have gotten a Donzi. There are rumors everywhere!!! :crossx:

Sandbar Mike
03-15-2006, 01:57 PM
Sal lives t2 houses down from me in Fillmore, and I saw first hand what happened to his boat and pointed out the crap work around the skulls. He is getting majorly screwed in this deal! :mad: :mad: :mad: All he wants is a boat to take his family out in to have a good time. Nobody deserves to be treated like this!
I'm glad I'm not full of shi&t.

NorCalCat
03-15-2006, 01:59 PM
It is not only Aftershock that treats their clients this way...More to come...

Big Warlock
03-15-2006, 02:03 PM
Hey, call me when you get done goofing off with regard to a Friday night St. Patty Day idea. That is if you have one. Peeps are looking for a place to meet. :cool:

Tom Brown
03-15-2006, 02:05 PM
We used to own an Aftershock.
I really liked your boat. It was beautiful and plenty comfy to ride around in.
You and J were awesome to cruise us around the Parker Strip too. For that I will always be grateful.
I hope that Stoker is treating you well. It looks like a fantastic boat too. :)

unleashed
03-15-2006, 02:09 PM
It is not only Aftershock that treats their clients this way...More to come...
:) :) :) ?????
Deano
Unleashedclothing (http://www.unleashedclothing.com) :crossx:

Mrs. Bordsmnj
03-15-2006, 02:12 PM
I really liked your boat. It was beautiful and plenty comfy to ride around in.
You and J were awesome to cruise us around the Parker Strip too. For that I will always be grateful.
I hope that Stoker is treating you well. It looks like a fantastic boat too. :)
Thanks Tom! :rollside: I think we finally have all the bugs worked out of the Stoker so it should be good to go. I have to admit though, I sure missed having a turn-key boat at times last season. :mad: If nothing else, our old Aftershock always ran. But then when the Stoker is running fantastic, I laugh at the Aftershock...... :rollside: :D :boxed:

Tom Brown
03-15-2006, 02:13 PM
I hear turn-key can be a difficult feature to find in a used jet boat.

Boa1277
03-15-2006, 02:15 PM
I love post like this, you buy a new boat and have "everything fixed" it shouldn't need to be fixed. You don't go buy a new Ferrari and they fix it before you drive it home. You pick it up and leave with it, only to take it back for service. I wouldn't buy a boat that had to be fixed when it was finished. Why do people buy boats from places like this? There are so many other boat companys that build "like boats" for "like Money" but don't have a line of customers standing out in front talking about how bad thier boat was put together.
Andy
I have been around boats for 30yrs and you show me a new boat that doesnt have at least 3 things wrong with it and I will kiss your ass. Boats are not cars and I have yet to have seen a boat built as well as a ferrari. I dont care if it is a Skater or a Schiada, or even a Bayliner they all have something wrong with them!!! Thats a fact.

F26
03-15-2006, 02:16 PM
so they sale him a screwed up boat, then screw up the gel, and now they are screwing him too?
sounds like the only reputation aftershock has may be a history of inbreeding amongst each other
we should keep this thread going until they make it right for this guy Sale!

NorCalCat
03-15-2006, 02:19 PM
:) :) :) ?????
Deano
Unleashedclothing (http://www.unleashedclothing.com) :crossx:
Like I said, more to come. I am making the drive tomorrow after work to pick my boat up. call John to get the skinny or even better yet call Brad. They have about a day and 1/2 to figure it out.
You ever seen the Tasmainian Devil?

Tom Brown
03-15-2006, 02:20 PM
Boats are not cars and I have yet to have seen a boat built as well as a ferrari.
I wonder if the Ferrari comparison was a good one. What if it was a custom car builder who built to spec? Custom cars look great but how many cars at the custom car shows have a problem or two? I would think it would be pretty much all of them.

Biglue
03-15-2006, 02:22 PM
I wonder if the Ferrari comparison was a good one. What if it was a custom car builder who built to spec? Custom cars look great but how many cars at the custom car shows have a problem or two? I would think it would be pretty much all of them.
Shit even Toyota who sets the world standard has a few flaws in EVERY vehicle.

unleashed
03-15-2006, 02:28 PM
Like I said, more to come. I am making the drive tomorrow after work to pick my boat up. call John to get the skinny or even better yet call Brad. They have about a day and 1/2 to figure it out.
You ever seen the Tasmainian Devil?
Tasmanian Devil....ouch I take it you're not the best looking guy! :D
Hope they get it solved...if not dont take it out on my boat...its sitting there right now! :)
Deano
Unleashedclothing (http://www.unleashedclothing.com)

Stoneman
03-15-2006, 02:43 PM
Shit even Toyota who sets the world standard has a few flaws in EVERY vehicle.
last two I got have been Flawless.

KACHINA KEN
03-15-2006, 02:49 PM
You're right. You do belong in OSO.....BYE
His post does not reflect the OSO attitude at all.

rivercrazy
03-15-2006, 03:27 PM
last two I got have been Flawless.
Ditto. That makes 4.

Kahuna
03-15-2006, 03:54 PM
You get what you pay for period. My first boat is an AfterShock 21 skier and it is a great boat for the money. If you want serious kiss your ass service you need to pay a lot more money when you buy the boat. :crossx:
Also before the boat goes in for warranty work I would have had them make it very clear to what they would be doing and what the cost, if any, would be. Always get it in writing before anyone does any work on something you own, especially something that they can keep locked up in their yard.

Tom Brown
03-15-2006, 04:01 PM
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/benjhamina/holeinboat2.jpg
Even boats that hit trees and piers at WOT don't delaminate like that. There's no way those layers were bonded properly.
Look at these crashed boats. They tore but didn't delaminate like that.
http://www.carlsonspeed.com/~tombrown/QuickLink/boat%20wreck%203.jpg
http://www.carlsonspeed.com/~tombrown/QuickLink/boat%20crash.jpg
I'll bet this boat didn't lose much more than some gel skidding up on those rocks.
http://www.carlsonspeed.com/~tombrown/QuickLink/96581.jpg

dicudmore
03-15-2006, 06:49 PM
:220v: :220v:

weekendwarrior
03-15-2006, 07:51 PM
[QUOTE=Tom Brown]Even boats that hit trees and piers at WOT don't delaminate like that. There's no way those layers were bonded properly.
Look at these crashed boats. They tore but didn't delaminate like that.
Those boats hit trees. When you hit something going acroos the water it can peel a layer down and the water grabs it and peels it back till it eventually rips off. I've seen it happen lots of times and on more than just Eliminators. I would have to say it can happen to all boats. Mostly in the spring when there are logs in the water. :rollside:

Keyser
03-15-2006, 07:57 PM
Hey Rock, This is not aimed at you in any way bro. (I'm sure you know this)
I posted this in (3) forums to try and get feedback if any other HB members had this same problem with Aftershock.
Aftershock didn't offer to replace the hull; they were willing to repair the damaged portion only. From what I hear this happened to (3) other boats. Sal's question was safety at this point & Aftershock without a question would not refund his money. After arguing with them and sue threatening they finally agreed to replace the hull. The agreement was to replace the boat to its current condition. The skull paint was the original condition, they looked pretty cool before, now they have clear box out’s around them.
The Punch List Fix its Aftershock just completed was interior work that was jacked up, a few nicks & scratches, his old stereo and his old swim step. They didn’t tell him anything about the cost until he showed up to pick up the boat.$$$$$$$$$$$$$$Fu&kn BS
My bud Sal's hands are tied, all his money is tied up in this piece of sh&t boat which is sitting at Aftershock locked up. He recently went to Aftershock and called the local police. The Cop wanted to help but couldn't allow Sal on the property.
Sal is not online at home or he would be a registered HB member.
I live 2 doors down from sal and I remember when he brought the boat home. I dont remember the skulls being original condition. After he bought the boat he took it down to the body shop and had them do a tribal flame paint job on the boat and on his 2500 so they would match. They both came out nise and after a few local trips he took it to Bass Lake and all this stuff started to happen. As you said after dealing with Aftershock for some time they agreed to replace the hull and his paint which is why he add the skulls. I think he had something like 9 skulls done which came out nice but I noticed the clear was boxed and the front skull you could feel the paint difference, like a small step up. I hate asking him about it when I see him cause he gets real upset as I think any of us would. All he wants is something to take his family out in that he can be proud of!!!

Parkertime
03-15-2006, 08:10 PM
I think Sal should forget about getting another Aftershock and go with a Force. John and Brad have treated me with nothing but quality work!

SnakeWrench
03-16-2006, 07:09 AM
Heres the deal. If the work order that Aftershock has is signed by the customer, and the customer agreed to it, He has to pay. If they never had a signed work order, than call the Police and have the boat picked up. If there is no work order, they have nothing to hold the boat for. What does the WRITTEN estimate say?

yeah,right
03-16-2006, 07:39 AM
Heres the deal. If the work order that Aftershock has is signed by the customer, and the customer agreed to it, He has to pay. If they never had a signed work order, than call the Police and have the boat picked up. If there is no work order, they have nothing to hold the boat for. What does the WRITTEN estimate say?
Police can't do anything. They don't need a written estimate to hold the boat. Only a judge or jury can decide from here. It sucks, but it's the law and that jack off Jeff from Afterpuke knows it. He is the biggest criminal in the boat industry. Ask around to some of the suppliers that he has ripped off. The boats are so cheap for two reasons. One being that they don't pay their bills. There are no less than 6 suppliers (trailers, engines, billet, gas tanks) that this prick has stiffed out of huge bills. He uses the legal system to tie things up for years in order not to pay. The other reason the boats are so cheap is they are just cheaply built, period. Go ahead and defend them all you want Rocky, the guy is a crook, PERIOD. Buy an Aftershock and you get what you pay for.

Dribble
03-16-2006, 08:10 AM
Police can't do anything. They don't need a written estimate to hold the boat. Only a judge or jury can decide from here.
100% correct

Flashover
03-16-2006, 08:13 AM
Police can't do anything. They don't need a written estimate to hold the boat. Only a judge or jury can decide from here. It sucks, but it's the law and that jack off Jeff from Afterpuke knows it. He is the biggest criminal in the boat industry. Ask around to some of the suppliers that he has ripped off. The boats are so cheap for two reasons. One being that they don't pay their bills. There are no less than 6 suppliers (trailers, engines, billet, gas tanks) that this prick has stiffed out of huge bills. He uses the legal system to tie things up for years in order not to pay. The other reason the boats are so cheap is they are just cheaply built, period. Go ahead and defend them all you want Rocky, the guy is a crook, PERIOD. Buy an Aftershock and you get what you pay for.
WOW!!! You must have had some sort of history with them to be this pisssed off.

Keyser
03-16-2006, 08:14 AM
Police can't do anything. They don't need a written estimate to hold the boat. Only a judge or jury can decide from here. It sucks, but it's the law and that jack off Jeff from Afterpuke knows it. He is the biggest criminal in the boat industry. Ask around to some of the suppliers that he has ripped off. The boats are so cheap for two reasons. One being that they don't pay their bills. There are no less than 6 suppliers (trailers, engines, billet, gas tanks) that this prick has stiffed out of huge bills. He uses the legal system to tie things up for years in order not to pay. The other reason the boats are so cheap is they are just cheaply built, period. Go ahead and defend them all you want Rocky, the guy is a crook, PERIOD. Buy an Aftershock and you get what you pay for.
Ok. but in Sals defense, he thought he was buying a quality product from a reputable company. After all htey have ads in one of our favorite magazines. Unless you get online and really research a company how do you know that they might screw you. Granted if your buying a high ticket item like this you need to do a little research but he did what he thought was sufficiant!

yeah,right
03-16-2006, 08:37 AM
WOW!!! You must have had some sort of history with them to be this pisssed off.
Not me personally. Just a really good friend of mine that is one of the venders. These are facts, not my opinions. I just can't stand people that use the judicial system to rip people off. F#@* Aftershock.

yeah,right
03-16-2006, 08:39 AM
Ok. but in Sals defense, he thought he was buying a quality product from a reputable company. After all htey have ads in one of our favorite magazines. Unless you get online and really research a company how do you know that they might screw you. Granted if your buying a high ticket item like this you need to do a little research but he did what he thought was sufficiant!
Not saying anything about your friend personally. Just that if the price seems too good to be true, than it probably is. If your friend really did shop around and do his research, then his final decision on the Aftershock was probably based on price.

meaniam
03-16-2006, 10:04 AM
Not saying anything about your friend personally. Just that if the price seems too good to be true, than it probably is. If your friend really did shop around and do his research, then his final decision on the Aftershock was probably based on price.
Price or not when you manufacture a motor vehicle or vessel. You have a responsibility to assure the safety of your customers from defects. Again his boat for some reason stopped launching people forward. Engine compartment started filling up with water due to lamination or fiberglass failure. It may not be as big of a deal in havazoo. But if it happened in a large body of water like Powell and someone was injured and they couldn’t start the engine. To keep the boat a float. It sinks. Then imagine the problem.
The manufacture I am sure is thankful no one was hurt like that and im sure they can imagine the different outcomes. And im sure that’s why said manufacture probably was more then glad to have the opportunity to build the boat.
Were the skulls on the 1st boat or was that added in addition to the 2nd boat. And with out it being on a due bill it could go either way. Manufacture probably has a stronger hand. (For that I am sorry.)
If the manufacture was instructed to go and do airbrushing by the customer. Which was not noted in an agreement? Then customer will most likely be forced to pay. On service work verbal hold up in court as long as writer has notes. Writer does not need signature.
I would suggest finding out what storage fees are. im sure the bill is already at least a few hundred more then the 6k originally thought
Wishing the guy an his family the best,
Mike

H20 Toie
03-16-2006, 10:16 AM
So i guess aftershock does not have the pull of other manufactures on hb, i am suprised this thread has lasted this long.

CARRERA
03-16-2006, 11:44 AM
So i guess aftershock does not have the pull of other manufactures on hb, i am suprised this thread has lasted this long.
It's only a matter of time......................

spectras only
03-16-2006, 12:42 PM
Ditto. That makes 4.
I'm sure you can find some here :) http://www.automotive.com/used-cars/recalls/01/toyota/index.html

1stepcloser
03-16-2006, 02:44 PM
While the state doesnt specifically govern watercraft repair or maintainance, the rules for the automotive industry are quite specific regarding a signed estimate before work is begun. I would bet that a decent attorney could use this to regain possesion of the boat id there was no estimate in advance.
Essentially, if Sal did not agree to the costs prior to any work being done, he is only obligated to pay up to the original estimated amount.
BARCLAYS OFFICIAL CALIFORNIA CODE OF REGULATIONS
TITLE 16. PROFESSIONAL AND VOCATIONAL REGULATIONS
DIVISION 33. BUREAU OF AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR
CHAPTER 1. AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR DEALERS AND OFFICIAL STATIONS AND ADJUSTERS
ARTICLE 7. DISCLOSURE REQUIREMENTS FOR AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR DEALERS
This database is current through 02/24/2006, Register 2006, No. 8.
s 3353. Written Estimate Required for Repair or Maintenance; Exceeding Estimate; Authorization Required.
No work for compensation shall be commenced and no charges shall accrue without specific authorization from the customer in accordance with the following requirements:
(a) Estimate for Parts and Labor. Every dealer shall give to each customer a written estimated price for parts and labor for a specific job.
(b) Estimate for Auto Body or Collision Repairs. Every dealer, when doing auto body or collision repairs, shall give to each customer a written estimated price for parts and labor for a specific job. Parts and labor shall be described separately and each part shall be identified, indicating whether the replacement part is new, used, rebuilt, or reconditioned. The estimate shall also describe replacement crash parts as original equipment manufacturer (OEM) crash parts or non-OEM aftermarket crash parts.
(c) Additional Authorization. The dealer shall obtain the customer's authorization before any additional work not estimated is done or parts not estimated are supplied. This authorization shall be in written, oral, or electronic form, and shall describe the additional repairs, parts, labor and the total additional cost.
(1) If the authorization from the customer for additional repairs, parts, or labor in excess of the written estimated price is obtained orally, the dealer shall also make a notation on the work order and on the invoice of the date, time, name of the person authorizing the additional repairs, and the telephone number called, if any, together with the specification of the additional repairs, parts, labor and the total additional cost.
(2) If the authorization from the customer for additional repairs, parts, or labor in excess of the written estimated price is obtained by facsimile transmission (fax), the dealer shall also attach to the work order and the invoice, a faxed document that is signed and dated by the customer and shows the date and time of transmission and describes the additional repairs, parts, labor and the total additional cost.
(3) If the authorization from the customer for additional repairs, parts, or labor in excess of the written estimated price is obtained by electronic mail (e-mail), the dealer shall print and attach to the work order and invoice, the e-mail authorization which shows the date and time of transmission and describes the additional repairs, parts, labor and the total additional cost.
(4) The additional repairs, parts, labor, total additional cost, and a statement that the additional repairs were authorized either orally, or by fax, or by e-mail shall be recorded on the final invoice pursuant to Section 9884.9 of the Business and Professions Code. All documentation must be retained pursuant to Section 9884.11 of the Business and Professions Code.
(d) Estimated Price to Tear Down, Inspect, Report and Reassemble. For purposes of this article, to "tear down" shall mean to disassemble, and "teardown" shall mean the act of disassembly. If it is necessary to tear down a vehicle component in order to prepare a written estimated price for required repair, the dealer shall first give the customer a written estimated price for the teardown. This price shall include the cost of reassembly of the component. The estimated price shall also include the cost of parts and necessary labor to replace items such as gaskets, seals and O rings that are normally destroyed by teardown of the component. If the act of teardown might prevent the restoration of the component to its former condition, the dealer shall write that information on the work order containing the teardown estimate before the work order is signed by the customer.
The repair dealer shall notify the customer orally and conspicuously in writing on the teardown estimate the maximum time it will take the repair dealer to reassemble the vehicle or the vehicle component in the event the customer elects not to proceed with the repair or maintenance of the vehicle and shall reassemble the vehicle within that time period if the customer elects not to proceed with the repair or maintenance. The maximum time shall be counted from the date of authorization of teardown.
After the teardown has been performed, the dealer shall prepare a written estimated price for labor and parts necessary for the required repair. All parts required for such repair shall be listed on the estimate. The dealer shall then obtain the customer's authorization for either repair or reassembly before any further work is done.
(e) Revising an Itemized Work Order. If the customer has authorized repairs according to a work order on which parts and labor are itemized, the dealer shall not change the method of repair or parts supplied without the written, oral, or electronic authorization of the customer. The authorization shall be obtained from the customer as provided in subsection (c) and Section 9884.9 of the Business and Professions Code.
(f) Unusual Circumstances; Authorization Required. When the customer is unable to deliver the motor vehicle to the dealer during business hours or if the motor vehicle is towed to the dealer without the customer during business hours, and the customer has requested the dealer to take possession of the motor vehicle for the purpose of repairing or estimating the cost of repairing the motor vehicle, the dealer shall not undertake the diagnosing or repairing of any malfunction of the motor vehicle for compensation unless such dealer has complied with all of the following conditions:
(1) The dealer has prepared a work order stating the written estimated price for labor and parts, as specified in subsection (a) or (b), necessary to repair the motor vehicle; and
(2) By telephone, fax or e-mail, the customer has been given all of the information on the work order and the customer has approved the work order; and
(3) The customer has given oral, written or electronic authorization to the dealer to make the repairs and the dealer has documented the authorization as provided in subsection (c) and Section 9884.9 of the Business and Professions Code.
Any charge for parts or labor in excess of the original written estimated price must be separately authorized by the customer and documented by the dealer, as provided in subsection (c) and Section 9884.9 of the Business and Professions Code.
(g) Definitions. As used in this section, "written" shall mean the communication of information in writing, other than by electronic means; "oral" shall mean the oral communication of information either in person or telephonically; "electronic" shall mean the communication of information by facsimile transmission (fax) or electronic mail (e-mail).
Note: Authority cited: Sections 9882 and 9884.9, Business and Professions Code. Reference: Sections 9884.8, 9884.9, 9889.50 and 9889.52, Business and Professions Code.
HISTORY
1. Amendment filed 6-26-74; designated effective 8-1-74 (Register 74, No.
26).
2. Amendment of subsection (b) and new subsection (c) filed 6-9-78; effective
thirtieth day thereafter (Register 78, No. 23).
3. Repealer and new section filed 10-27-82; effective thirtieth day thereafter
(Register 82, No. 44).
4. Redesignation of former Article 7 (Section 3365) to new Article 7 (Sections
3353-3358) filed 2-22-83; effective thirtieth day thereafter (Register 83,
No. 9).
5. Amendment of subsections (d) and (d)(1) filed 5-9-96; operative 6-8-96
(Register 96, No. 19).
6. Amendment of subsection (a) and Note filed 10-20-97; operative 11-19-97
(Register 97, No. 43).
7. Amendment of section and Note filed 5-2-2002; operative 6-1-2002 (Register
2002, No. 18).
16 CA ADC s 3353
END OF DOCUMENT
(C) 2006 Thomson/West. No Claim to Orig. U.S. Govt. Works.

Dribble
03-16-2006, 03:21 PM
While the state doesnt specifically govern watercraft repair or maintainance, the rules for the automotive industry are quite specific regarding a signed estimate before work is begun. I would bet that a decent attorney could use this to regain possesion of the boat id there was no estimate in advance.
Essentially, if Sal did not agree to the costs prior to any work being done, he is only obligated to pay up to the original estimated amount.
BARCLAYS OFFICIAL CALIFORNIA CODE OF REGULATIONS
TITLE 16. PROFESSIONAL AND VOCATIONAL REGULATIONS
DIVISION 33. BUREAU OF AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR
CHAPTER 1. AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR DEALERS AND OFFICIAL STATIONS AND ADJUSTERS
ARTICLE 7. DISCLOSURE REQUIREMENTS FOR AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR DEALERS
This database is current through 02/24/2006, Register 2006, No. 8.
s 3353. Written Estimate Required for Repair or Maintenance; Exceeding Estimate; Authorization Required.
No work for compensation shall be commenced and no charges shall accrue without specific authorization from the customer in accordance with the following requirements:
(a) Estimate for Parts and Labor. Every dealer shall give to each customer a written estimated price for parts and labor for a specific job.
(b) Estimate for Auto Body or Collision Repairs. Every dealer, when doing auto body or collision repairs, shall give to each customer a written estimated price for parts and labor for a specific job. Parts and labor shall be described separately and each part shall be identified, indicating whether the replacement part is new, used, rebuilt, or reconditioned. The estimate shall also describe replacement crash parts as original equipment manufacturer (OEM) crash parts or non-OEM aftermarket crash parts.
(c) Additional Authorization. The dealer shall obtain the customer's authorization before any additional work not estimated is done or parts not estimated are supplied. This authorization shall be in written, oral, or electronic form, and shall describe the additional repairs, parts, labor and the total additional cost.
(1) If the authorization from the customer for additional repairs, parts, or labor in excess of the written estimated price is obtained orally, the dealer shall also make a notation on the work order and on the invoice of the date, time, name of the person authorizing the additional repairs, and the telephone number called, if any, together with the specification of the additional repairs, parts, labor and the total additional cost.
(2) If the authorization from the customer for additional repairs, parts, or labor in excess of the written estimated price is obtained by facsimile transmission (fax), the dealer shall also attach to the work order and the invoice, a faxed document that is signed and dated by the customer and shows the date and time of transmission and describes the additional repairs, parts, labor and the total additional cost.
(3) If the authorization from the customer for additional repairs, parts, or labor in excess of the written estimated price is obtained by electronic mail (e-mail), the dealer shall print and attach to the work order and invoice, the e-mail authorization which shows the date and time of transmission and describes the additional repairs, parts, labor and the total additional cost.
(4) The additional repairs, parts, labor, total additional cost, and a statement that the additional repairs were authorized either orally, or by fax, or by e-mail shall be recorded on the final invoice pursuant to Section 9884.9 of the Business and Professions Code. All documentation must be retained pursuant to Section 9884.11 of the Business and Professions Code.
(d) Estimated Price to Tear Down, Inspect, Report and Reassemble. For purposes of this article, to "tear down" shall mean to disassemble, and "teardown" shall mean the act of disassembly. If it is necessary to tear down a vehicle component in order to prepare a written estimated price for required repair, the dealer shall first give the customer a written estimated price for the teardown. This price shall include the cost of reassembly of the component. The estimated price shall also include the cost of parts and necessary labor to replace items such as gaskets, seals and O rings that are normally destroyed by teardown of the component. If the act of teardown might prevent the restoration of the component to its former condition, the dealer shall write that information on the work order containing the teardown estimate before the work order is signed by the customer.
The repair dealer shall notify the customer orally and conspicuously in writing on the teardown estimate the maximum time it will take the repair dealer to reassemble the vehicle or the vehicle component in the event the customer elects not to proceed with the repair or maintenance of the vehicle and shall reassemble the vehicle within that time period if the customer elects not to proceed with the repair or maintenance. The maximum time shall be counted from the date of authorization of teardown.
After the teardown has been performed, the dealer shall prepare a written estimated price for labor and parts necessary for the required repair. All parts required for such repair shall be listed on the estimate. The dealer shall then obtain the customer's authorization for either repair or reassembly before any further work is done.
(e) Revising an Itemized Work Order. If the customer has authorized repairs according to a work order on which parts and labor are itemized, the dealer shall not change the method of repair or parts supplied without the written, oral, or electronic authorization of the customer. The authorization shall be obtained from the customer as provided in subsection (c) and Section 9884.9 of the Business and Professions Code.
(f) Unusual Circumstances; Authorization Required. When the customer is unable to deliver the motor vehicle to the dealer during business hours or if the motor vehicle is towed to the dealer without the customer during business hours, and the customer has requested the dealer to take possession of the motor vehicle for the purpose of repairing or estimating the cost of repairing the motor vehicle, the dealer shall not undertake the diagnosing or repairing of any malfunction of the motor vehicle for compensation unless such dealer has complied with all of the following conditions:
(1) The dealer has prepared a work order stating the written estimated price for labor and parts, as specified in subsection (a) or (b), necessary to repair the motor vehicle; and
(2) By telephone, fax or e-mail, the customer has been given all of the information on the work order and the customer has approved the work order; and
(3) The customer has given oral, written or electronic authorization to the dealer to make the repairs and the dealer has documented the authorization as provided in subsection (c) and Section 9884.9 of the Business and Professions Code.
Any charge for parts or labor in excess of the original written estimated price must be separately authorized by the customer and documented by the dealer, as provided in subsection (c) and Section 9884.9 of the Business and Professions Code.
(g) Definitions. As used in this section, "written" shall mean the communication of information in writing, other than by electronic means; "oral" shall mean the oral communication of information either in person or telephonically; "electronic" shall mean the communication of information by facsimile transmission (fax) or electronic mail (e-mail).
Note: Authority cited: Sections 9882 and 9884.9, Business and Professions Code. Reference: Sections 9884.8, 9884.9, 9889.50 and 9889.52, Business and Professions Code.
HISTORY
1. Amendment filed 6-26-74; designated effective 8-1-74 (Register 74, No.
26).
2. Amendment of subsection (b) and new subsection (c) filed 6-9-78; effective
thirtieth day thereafter (Register 78, No. 23).
3. Repealer and new section filed 10-27-82; effective thirtieth day thereafter
(Register 82, No. 44).
4. Redesignation of former Article 7 (Section 3365) to new Article 7 (Sections
3353-3358) filed 2-22-83; effective thirtieth day thereafter (Register 83,
No. 9).
5. Amendment of subsections (d) and (d)(1) filed 5-9-96; operative 6-8-96
(Register 96, No. 19).
6. Amendment of subsection (a) and Note filed 10-20-97; operative 11-19-97
(Register 97, No. 43).
7. Amendment of section and Note filed 5-2-2002; operative 6-1-2002 (Register
2002, No. 18).
16 CA ADC s 3353
END OF DOCUMENT
(C) 2006 Thomson/West. No Claim to Orig. U.S. Govt. Works.
Actually, none of these sections apply to this transaction. The reason is because these sections are prefaced by the statement "The Automotive Repair Dealer Shall". The B&P Code contains legal definitions of Automotive Repair Dealers and of Motor Vehicles. A boat does not meet the definition of a motor vehicle as described in the 9880 section of the B&P Code and a boat repair facility is not an Automotive Repair Dealer as described in that same section. The BAR has kicked around the idea of getting into the boat repair regulation business but in this era of smaller government, decided it was a bad idea.
That being said there are sections in the Harbors and Navigation Code that deal specifically with this problem. There is currently no enforcement agency, but these sections can be used in a civil case. Also keep in mind that the original automotive written estimate statute was drafted using elements of civil contract law that still apply. So to paraphrase. Yes he should have gotten a written estimate but no he can't cite these sections in court.

Keyser
03-16-2006, 04:09 PM
Price or not when you manufacture a motor vehicle or vessel. You have a responsibility to assure the safety of your customers from defects. Again his boat for some reason stopped launching people forward. Engine compartment started filling up with water due to lamination or fiberglass failure. It may not be as big of a deal in havazoo. But if it happened in a large body of water like Powell and someone was injured and they couldn’t start the engine. To keep the boat a float. It sinks. Then imagine the problem.
The manufacture I am sure is thankful no one was hurt like that and im sure they can imagine the different outcomes. And im sure that’s why said manufacture probably was more then glad to have the opportunity to build the boat.
Were the skulls on the 1st boat or was that added in addition to the 2nd boat. And with out it being on a due bill it could go either way. Manufacture probably has a stronger hand. (For that I am sorry.)
If the manufacture was instructed to go and do airbrushing by the customer. Which was not noted in an agreement? Then customer will most likely be forced to pay. On service work verbal hold up in court as long as writer has notes. Writer does not need signature.
I would suggest finding out what storage fees are. im sure the bill is already at least a few hundred more then the 6k originally thought
Wishing the guy an his family the best,
Mike
NO the skulls weren't on the first boat, but he had custom flames put on the first boat about a month before all this happened, so the skulls were to replace the custom paint from the first hull. The other thing that got me was that it seems like they sprayed the interior of the second boat grey. His first hull had white interior and a white hull, the second has grey interior and a grey hull but they kept the bright white steering wheel that now doesn't even come close to matching. Just shotty work all around.

GHT
03-16-2006, 07:06 PM
Bump!!!!!!!!!!! For the New Guy... "HULKSTIR"

purrfecttremor
03-16-2006, 07:12 PM
I think Hulkster fled in a hurry :hammer2:

GHT
03-16-2006, 07:15 PM
No Sh1t.... "Message to self, "don't piss off Riodog".

Keyser
03-17-2006, 07:14 PM
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/3294Sal1-med.jpg http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/3294Sal2-med.jpg http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/3294Sal3-med.jpg http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/3294Sal4-med.jpg
These photos were taken from a video Sal took of the boat after he got back from Bass Lake. How would you like this to happen to you while your family was on board!!!!!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

dicudmore
03-17-2006, 07:43 PM
thats some carnage

H20 Toie
03-18-2006, 01:30 AM
yea well how would yo ulike it if the funckin gas tamnbks came lose in tjhe boat ant cpmmander knew ther was aproblewm and didnot tell yo even when you r 6mo girl wa sin the boat th efin bastards could have kiled mey daughter but do they give a func no the sonno f a bicthes should be shot
'

jbone
03-18-2006, 08:48 AM
yea well how would yo ulike it if the funckin gas tamnbks came lose in tjhe boat ant cpmmander knew ther was aproblewm and didnot tell yo even when you r 6mo girl wa sin the boat th efin bastards could have kiled mey daughter but do they give a func no the sonno f a bicthes should be shot
'
Ouch!
Did you do this on purpose, or are you feeling the effects of St. Patty's Day?
J :p

H20 Toie
03-18-2006, 09:16 AM
Ouch!
Did you do this on purpose, or are you feeling the effects of St. Patty's Day?
J :p
I must have drank something that messed up my spelling :)

RP1
03-18-2006, 09:17 AM
yea well how would yo ulike it if the funckin gas tamnbks came lose in tjhe boat ant cpmmander knew ther was aproblewm and didnot tell yo even when you r 6mo girl wa sin the boat th efin bastards could have kiled mey daughter but do they give a func no the sonno f a bicthes should be shot
'
please translate... that really hurts to read :rolleyes:

SnakeWrench
03-18-2006, 09:53 AM
I know that the BBB still regulates and if you call them, they can direct you how to attack the situation. I can't just keep a customers boat without a signed work order and can't charge them extra without previous approval from the customer. If he is keeping the boat without a work order, it is illegal,PERIOD! It's like someone steeling your car and when the police show up, them saying, "he owes me money". The police will arrest the guy for steeling a car. Call the BBB and let them know what's going on.

Keyser
03-18-2006, 10:03 AM
Well, one of the really screwed up things is that they say he owes something like $6000.00 for interior. He told them that the upper part of the interior , like the backs of seats and the side panels, didn't match in color with the lower parts like they were supposed to. So AFTERSHOCK says He owes them for for interior work!!! How can this be possible on a new boat?!

73beast
03-18-2006, 06:51 PM
Keyser,
"How can this be possible on a new boat?!"
It's really pretty simple Keyser, THEY'RE TRYING TO STUFF HIM!
Guess we ought to bring this back to the top just so no one forgets!
Rio> trying to be helpful!
Still stiring the pot,Rio?????

Dribble
03-18-2006, 08:09 PM
I know that the BBB still regulates and if you call them, they can direct you how to attack the situation. I can't just keep a customers boat without a signed work order and can't charge them extra without previous approval from the customer. If he is keeping the boat without a work order, it is illegal,PERIOD! It's like someone steeling your car and when the police show up, them saying, "he owes me money". The police will arrest the guy for steeling a car. Call the BBB and let them know what's going on.
The BBB doesn't regulate. They mediate.

yeah,right
03-18-2006, 10:26 PM
I know that the BBB still regulates and if you call them, they can direct you how to attack the situation. I can't just keep a customers boat without a signed work order and can't charge them extra without previous approval from the customer. If he is keeping the boat without a work order, it is illegal,PERIOD! It's like someone steeling your car and when the police show up, them saying, "he owes me money". The police will arrest the guy for steeling a car. Call the BBB and let them know what's going on.
The BBB doesn't regulate anything. It's not even a governmental agency. They can't do a thing to them.
Just as I said before, the police can't do anything either, at least not without a court order.

yeah,right
03-18-2006, 10:32 PM
The BBB is a joke. If you don't become a "member", they act like any stupid complaint against you is true.
That's what I'm saying. The BBB is a "for profit" business, just like any other business out there. Many people are fooled into thinking it has some authority. It's a joke.

MUDXPRT
03-19-2006, 06:36 AM
yea well how would yo ulike it if the funckin gas tamnbks came lose in tjhe boat ant cpmmander knew ther was aproblewm and didnot tell yo even when you r 6mo girl wa sin the boat th efin bastards could have kiled mey daughter but do they give a func no the sonno f a bicthes should be shot
'
It's getting really old with all your posts reading like this, If you have a drinking problem I feel sorry for the people it is affecting around you. :rolleyes:

H20 Toie
03-19-2006, 06:43 AM
It's getting really old with all your posts reading like this, If you have a drinking problem I feel sorry for the people it is affecting around you. :rolleyes:
Not to worry i have no problem with my drinking. :cool:

MUDXPRT
03-19-2006, 07:07 AM
Not to worry i have no problem with my drinking. :cool:
I apologize then, glad it is all in good fun. :)

Keyser
03-19-2006, 09:21 AM
Keyser,
"How can this be possible on a new boat?!"
It's really pretty simple Keyser, THEY'RE TRYING TO STUFF HIM!
Guess we ought to bring this back to the top just so no one forgets!
Rio> trying to be helpful!
I understand that, but I just have seen all this happen and I dont understand how anybody can have balls that big and not expect any legal recourse.

FREIND OF AA AND TA
03-19-2006, 10:14 AM
Not to worry i have no problem with my drinking. :cool:
WHAT??? THAT IS SOO FUNNY!!!!

Biglue
03-19-2006, 10:32 AM
It's getting really old with all your posts reading like this, If you have a drinking problem I feel sorry for the people it is affecting around you. :rolleyes:
Someone needs to a little more drinking. I understood that post just fine. :D

roostwear
03-19-2006, 11:24 AM
[QUOTE=1stepcloser]While the state doesnt specifically govern watercraft repair or maintainance, the rules for the automotive industry are quite specific regarding a signed estimate before work is begun. I would bet that a decent attorney could use this to regain possesion of the boat id there was no estimate in advance.
Essentially, if Sal did not agree to the costs prior to any work being done, he is only obligated to pay up to the original estimated amount.
>
>
QUOTE]
You have the right idea, but as a few noted, this relates to auto repair, not boats. What DOES apply to ALL service related businesses in California is what is called the Professional Business Standards. They are quite similar to automotive, and in this respect the same..... you must have a noted acceptance by the customer of the repairs AND amount to be binding. A signature is required on at least one document with an upsell (or add/change order) noted by who approved it, how and when. No signature and related notations, and they're F'ed.

FLEA DIDDY
03-19-2006, 11:28 AM
Someone needs to a little more drinking. I understood that post just fine. :DDamn Lue, since you have that comp fixed your all over the place while at home, lol Nice talkin on the phone with ya, I think we'll be able to make it next month.

kanedog
04-09-2006, 11:05 PM
What were the water conditions at the time of delamination.......