RIVERDAVE needs to upgrade SUBS

[rivercrazy]

Here are next years Kicker Solobaric "X" Subs. Apparently they are supposed to hit even harder than the old ones. Bigger magnet, voice coil, and different cone material. Gotta upgrade to stay on top! LOL! :D :D :D
http://free.***boat.net/gallery/Gearhead_Garage/Other_Equipment/sbsub.JPG
http://free.***boat.net/gallery/Gearhead_Garage/Other_Equipment/G3.JPG
[ November 06, 2002, 10:20 AM: Message edited by: rivercrazy ]

[Livin Large 27Hallett]

I heard the same thing, they wanted to put four of the 12 inch in my boat.

[rivercrazy]

Its got a way bigger looking magnet and basket (but it still looks smaller than other long-exursion subs like the W7 and the like). They say it weights in at 100lbs or more. Power handling is 10K watts, and it ships with replacement parts (like the MTX RFL152).
http://free.***boat.net/gallery/Gearhead_Garage/Other_Equipment/ksbs.JPG
[ November 06, 2002, 12:23 PM: Message edited by: rivercrazy ]

[Havasu Hangin']

I think he's gonna need another Kraco amp...
BTW...ever see a Brahma in action (http://www.adireaudio.com/Files/brahma.avi)? Not bad for a mere 1,600 watts power handling, and 1/3 the price of a W7...

[rivercrazy]

Yea. I've heard those Brahma's are pretty awesome. I still think the new JBL GTi Subs are the best and loudest I've heard so far. The only problem with them is they need a butt load of power. 1200 watts each to em and they don't even break a sweat.
If RD wanted to remain the King, these roundy rounds would be the way to go.
http://free.***boat.net/gallery/Gearhead_Garage/Other_Equipment/W15GTI.JPG
[ November 06, 2002, 12:50 PM: Message edited by: rivercrazy ]

[ROZ]

"DD" drivers are a good SPL value as well.

[rivercrazy]

What are those DD's Roz. I've also heard that Shockers are pretty loud also. Never heard those however....

[77charger]

will he need that nitrous bottle too?

[Charley]

Ok, I'm not really a "Sound" guy anymore...but....Just out of curiosity what does a driver like that cost? My experience is that you want a big voice coil, and a just big enough magnet. the bigger the magnet the less efficient a driver gets.....which helps explain the 10k power handling capacity of that beast, but if it's 3db less efficient you might have to put as much as twice the power to it to get the same sound pressure level! I could be wrong, and this is an opinion from a former "sound" guy....but if this driver costs like2-3x as much as the smaller guy I would rather have 2-3 of the smaller ones. 2 of the smaller drivers placed closely together and on the same plane can also create driver coupling giving you 1-3db more output! 3db is like doubling your amps output! So maybe I'm missing the point on this new fangled thing but a 100 lb single sub driver sounds like a better boat anchor.....is it even dual voice coil? do you need 2? 200 extra pounds of weight... holy crap...not to mention the 20k of power you need. Ok..... this is really not my arena anymore...FLAME ME! :D

[rivercrazy]

Yea RD, from my understanding, these are next years Solobarics. I also think this is a 15" sub but are available in 12" also. My gut tells me the older L5 and L7 will still be available. The X model is more of a SPL competition sub.
Charley, 100lb each is really-really heavy. But - Go big or go home! LMAO

[rivercrazy]

The rule of thumb I've learned about volume output is you can get 3db more volume by doubling amplifer power or doubling cone surface area. db is measured exponentially. a 3db increase is effectively 2X as loud (or something like that)

[Havasu Hangin']

Charley:
..... this is really not my arena anymore...FLAME ME!Ask & you shall recieve! http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/happy/happy03.gif
j/k.
Actually, those big subs are meant for big marketing campaigns and big competitions...just like NASCAR, if they win competitions, the consumers will go out & buy the brand...also, the engineers test with cutting edge competition equipment.
I don't know about those Kickers, but the new "bad boys" by JL (W7's) retail for about a grand each.
I disagree about the "smaller is better"...but I think in general, you need a system that works toward your goals. Is louder better? Only if that's all you're interested in. Are those extra 6dbs worth the headache of extra amps, batteries and boxes? Maybe...
Many people don't realize that one good quality 10" will be louder (and higher SQ) than a couple cheap 10's (or maybe even cheap 15's). Power, cone area, sesitivity, and install and are all important to the performance.
Like I posted awhile ago, there was a guy who hit over 169 db in competition with a single 10" woofer!
Charley:
but if it's 3db less efficient you might have to put as much as twice the power to it to get the same sound pressure level!Loud doesn't necessarily equal SPL. A bullhorn is loud, but has little SPL. Same loudness? Probably. Same SPL? I doubt it.
By definition Sound Pressure Level is created by the Xmax in the speaker. You can build a very efficient sub (sensitive- needs less power), but it will have less Xmax...which means less SPL. Bass SPL is important in a boat, since there are no accoustics...and you don't get the benefit of a "sound stage" like in a house or car. That's why mids & highs are such efficient speakers...very little Xmax is needed.
One way we used to cheat in audio competitions (before they banned it) is to build a small box and direct horns into it...the dbs were very high in that little enclosure...which just happens to be where we placed the mic... http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/happy/happy06.gif
I agree that audio trade-offs are needed in boats. You can't have everything. However, I think since space is at a premium, power is very important.
What I do, is look at my boat, and try to imagine where I can shoe-horn more audio into it...but that's just me... http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/happy/happy34.gif
[ November 07, 2002, 10:05 AM: Message edited by: Havasu Hangin' ]

[rivercrazy]

With 5 amps, 4 subs, and a crap load of comps and the 8" midrange, do you have anymore room? Can you mount a 2nd alternator and a few more batteries without sinking the HHTugboatBarge? Maybe you need to got down in pitch on that prop to get her up on plane? J/K LOL! :D :D :D

[ROZ]

rivercrazy:
What are those DD's Roz. I've also heard that Shockers are pretty loud also. Never heard those however....This is their Beast 9900 series
http://www.ddaudio.com/images/productPics/9900a_side.jpg
http://www.ddaudio.com/images/productPics/9900a_front.jpg
1500 RMS 3000 Max
Their 9500 series was the line I orig. spoke of:
http://www.ddaudio.com/images/productPics/9500_front.jpg
http://www.ddaudio.com/images/productPics/9500_side.jpg
1200RMS 2500 Max sub for 550 is pretty good.
Havasu Hangin hit it right on the nose. X-max and enclosure design is where it's at when looking for dramatic peaks in output shooting for high SPL in competition...Usually a blurp at the greatest spl frequency that the vehicle and system can produce.

[ROZ]

rivercrazy
Its got a way bigger looking magnet and basket (but it still looks smaller than other long-exursion subs like the W7 and the like). They say it weights in at 100lbs or more. Power handling is 10K watts, and it ships with replacement parts (like the MTX RFL152).For those who haven't seen the RFL152:
http://www.mtx.com/caraudio/images/subRFL.jpg
http://www.mtx.com/caraudio/images/subRFL_2.jpg
Looks like a 12" cone with huge surround.
[ November 07, 2002, 10:34 AM: Message edited by: ROZ ]

[rivercrazy]

Jeez those all look like heavy subs. I thought my Perfects were heavy!

[ROZ]

Anyone want a new pair of Juggs :D
I know there's a lot of good gear out there, but I still love these things.
Nevermind, I can't post a pic from their site.
http://www.mmatsproaudio.com/images/pics/sbn2002/sbn2002sun19.jpg
http://www.mmatsproaudio.com/images/jugg1.jpg
[ November 07, 2002, 11:02 AM: Message edited by: ROZ ]

[Havasu Hangin']

Well...I'm not a speaker designer...nor do I claim to be...but...
In competition, Watts = SPL
Like Roz said, if you are designing a sub for a 10,000 watt "burp"...then you need a motor, suspension, and enclosure that can handle it.
For the everyday driver, most people go with a sub that has a smaller motor and looser suspension (and uses a smaller enclosure)...unless you need 175 dbs of a narrow bass frequency?
As for the Tugboat...she keeps gettin' lower and lower in the water every year...
RC- maybe I should tow a barge behind it...

[rivercrazy]

Someone needs to engineer a small generator that can be connected in line with the drive shaft for a REAL power source. That way, us stereo idiots will never run short on power. Hull integrity might become an issue but what the hell. Or a quiet turbine powered motor similar to an APU on an aircraft.
HH, just carry less beer and ice to compensate for the increased weight. Or just bring the hard stuff. Or if your like me, go on a diet!

[Charley]

HH, I didn't say smaller was better when it came to subs, or at least I didn't mean to.... what I meant to say is that(especially in Cars) I have always preferred 4 x 8" subs to 2 x 10" subs or 4 x 10" subs to 2 x 12" subs...etc... I agree it's all about the box and the driver...my point was a huge magnet can be a bad thing....especially if you don't wanna install any entirely different charging system to have your stereo sound good...one of the reasons I lost interest in the whole care audio deal was in my opinion there was an extremely minimal difference between a $5,000 system and a $35,000 system ....and I will not change my mind on that one :D :p ....Now i understand the whole "I want the best of the best" but it seems to me like you get to a point and it's just F-ing silly.....by the way I would put a Servo-Drive woofer up against any sub on the market hehehe :p

[Havasu Hangin']

rivercrazy:
HH, just carry less beer and ice to compensate for the increased weight. Or just bring the hard stuff. Or if your like me, go on a diet!No way! My priorities:
1. Beer
2. Bacardi
3. Grey Goose
4. Pizza
5. Boat Audio
I think I'm gonna need a bigger boat...dieting is not an option...
Charley:
...an extremely minimal difference between a $5,000 system and a $35,000 system..Ageed...my whole system was less than $2K (and it'll move your hair)...and that's including those damn MB Quarts ($600)...

[Charley]

Havasu Hangin':
rivercrazy:
HH, just carry less beer and ice to compensate for the increased weight. Or just bring the hard stuff. Or if your like me, go on a diet!No way! My priorities:
1. Beer
2. Bacardi
3. Grey Goose
4. Pizza
5. Boat Audio
I think I'm gonna need a bigger boat...dieting is not an option...
Charley:
...an extremely minimal difference between a $5,000 system and a $35,000 system..Ageed...my whole system was less than $2K (and it'll move your hair)...and that's including those damn MB Quarts ($600)...How could you put bacardi AND Beer above the goose! :rolleyes:
[ November 07, 2002, 11:58 AM: Message edited by: Charley ]

[Havasu Hangin']

Charley:
How could you put bacardi AND Beer above the goose!1-3 are interchangeable...depending on how the planets are aligned (and who's buying)...

[rivercrazy]

I couldn't agree more with ya Charley. Nothing approaches the Grey Goose! That stuff is the bomb. An expensive bomb but the bomb nonetheless.
BTW. You guys are way off base on your priorities. Very pretty girls should make the top of your list. Leaving them off the list = Full Blown Liberache Gay!!!! LMAO :D :D :D :D

[Havasu Hangin']

rivercrazy:
...You guys are way off base on your priorities. Very pretty girls should make the top of your list. Leaving them off the list = Full Blown Liberache Gay!!!!Gay? Or married?
I pleading the fifth (while I'm drinking a fifth)...

[rivercrazy]

LMAO. Drinking a 5th. Is that enough to catch a buzz or is your internal organs hyper-efficient due to consistently tough olympic type workouts?

[Havasu Hangin']

rivercrazy:
LMAO. Drinking a 5th. Is that enough to catch a buzz or is your internal organs hyper-efficient due to consistently tough olympic type workouts?Uh...no. To properly train for alcohol consumption, one must consume alcohol. If that were an Olympic sport...I would have the gold medal by now...
As a famous philosopher once said, "sure alcohol kills brain cells, but only the weak ones."

[Charley]

Havasu Hangin':
rivercrazy:
...You guys are way off base on your priorities. Very pretty girls should make the top of your list. Leaving them off the list = Full Blown Liberache Gay!!!!Gay? Or married?
I pleading the fifth (while I'm drinking a fifth)...LMAO