PDA

View Full Version : **Have you heard that the 496HO.......



nextasex
11-12-2003, 06:32 PM
package is not supposed to be equipped with Deep Cycle batteries?????? I didn't, neither have a few dealers I talked to. I was just informed that the PCM 555 (ECM) is not supposed to run off of deep cycle batteries and can malfunction or something. I just want to know if any one of you people that frequent these boards have heard anything like this...
If this is true, how do we run stereos and other accessories if we cannot have deep cycle batteries. Do we charge the deep cycles everyday after use on an outboard charger, since we cannot use the engine to charge them?
Thanks,
Frank :confused: :confused:

Havasu Hangin'
11-12-2003, 06:36 PM
Who told you that?
What does a deep cycle battery do to the ECM that a marine battery doesn't?

nextasex
11-12-2003, 06:37 PM
HH, isn't a marine battery a deep cycle battery?

Havasu Hangin'
11-12-2003, 06:43 PM
Originally posted by nextasex
HH, isn't a marine battery a deep cycle battery?
No, not really. A marine battery just has more shock resistance.
A deep cycle marine battery is designed to be discharged lower, without losing any capacity when it's re-charged.
I just understand how the electrical system will know what kind of battery it's charging.

Dr. Eagle
11-12-2003, 07:00 PM
Originally posted by Havasu Hangin'
No, not really. A marine battery just has more shock resistance.
A deep cycle marine battery is designed to be discharged lower, without losing any capacity when it's re-charged.
I just understand how the electrical system will know what kind of battery it's charging.
I read something like this somewhere, but not that specific. The one I read said that they recommend a marine starting battery for that purpose and not a deep cycle because it does not provide as stong a current for the starter. It does not make sense that there would be an issue with deep cycle vs. starting and the engine computer...to me anyway.
The only thing I am sure of as it relates to batteries and engine computers is that Mercury insisted on a separate battery for each of my twin 502s, because starting the second engine off of the same battery would cause the computer on the other engine to shut down.

Havasu Hangin'
11-12-2003, 07:19 PM
Originally posted by Dr. Eagle
I read something like this somewhere, but not that specific. The one I read said that they recommend a marine starting battery for that purpose and not a deep cycle because it does not provide as stong a current for the starter....
Sounds like more Merc mumbo jumbo. The same thing could happen with a partially-charged starting battery.
If you have a deep cycle that meets the minimum CCA's for your engine, how would that make a difference? Your starter and ECM don't care...as long as it is supplied the correct voltage and amps, right?
Most marine "deep cycle" batteries are more like hybrids...true deep cycles are more like those big, heavy, lead acid trolling motor batteries.

nextasex
11-12-2003, 07:31 PM
Originally posted by Havasu Hangin'
Sounds like more Merc mumbo jumbo. The same thing could happen with a partially-charged starting battery.
If you have a deep cycle that meets the minimum CCA's for your engine, how would that make a difference? Your starter and ECM don't care...as long as it is supplied the correct voltage and amps, right?
Most marine "deep cycle" batteries are more like hybrids...true deep cycles are more like those big, heavy, lead acid trolling motor batteries.
That' what I thought, but not according to Merc.
Supposedly a letter or bulletin was sent to all dealers and manf, that deep cycles are not to be installed..with the 496
:confused:

mike37
11-12-2003, 07:48 PM
i have dual batts on mine all is ok so far

rivercrazy
11-12-2003, 08:01 PM
Hey Frank. I also have the same motor. Been running blue top deep cycle optima's since day 1. 86 hours and no problems.
I've even run the batteries down below 10.5 volts and the engine still fired right up.

nextasex
11-12-2003, 08:21 PM
Thanks for the info guys, Anybody else running two deep cycle batteries with the 496 engine? I thought this was the normal set up.
Thanks,
Frank

Dr. Eagle
11-12-2003, 08:42 PM
Originally posted by Havasu Hangin'
Sounds like more Merc mumbo jumbo. The same thing could happen with a partially-charged starting battery.
If you have a deep cycle that meets the minimum CCA's for your engine, how would that make a difference? Your starter and ECM don't care...as long as it is supplied the correct voltage and amps, right?
Most marine "deep cycle" batteries are more like hybrids...true deep cycles are more like those big, heavy, lead acid trolling motor batteries.
Nah the starting/deep cycle thing I read somewhere in some boating mag. I didn't buy the BS though...my deep cycles worked fine. I had deep cycle batteries on my engines and for my accessories (3 strings).
The single battery on twins thing was in the merc installation manual.

BoatPI
11-12-2003, 08:44 PM
Nwever heard such a thing. If MErc dealer sid so, have them produce a tech bulliten from Fon Du Lac.
As far as batteries, this issue has been discussed. Starting batteries should be used as such in boats. Big motors need the CCW to turn them over and keep voltage up for ignition.
My all time favorite "Optima" I have never seen any battery crank as long or last as long in the Havasu environment. I have had one for 7 years. No battery can top this. If it looses charge, just top off with a standard charger, then keep topped with a "Battery Tender". Another best buy item, sold a Pep Boys and other places.

fastvdriver
11-12-2003, 08:58 PM
Originally posted by nextasex
That' what I thought, but not according to Merc.
Supposedly a letter or bulletin was sent to all dealers and manf, that deep cycles are not to be installed..with the 496
:confused:
I'm a merc service center and have not heard of or seen any such info I'm also a Indmar service center and they also have not said anything about this issue. I have install many dual battery set ups that are running deep cycles and dry cells the best use for the space are the dry cells and they work the best. I will contact Merc just to be sure.:p

Faster Daddy
11-12-2003, 09:47 PM
I run 2 deep cycles with my 496 ho and don't have any problem. I will ask Mike at Temecula Marine if he has heard anything. He is a Merc Master Tech with Smartcraft Cert and will make any calls needed to verify this info, I'll let you know what he says.
Nextasex, my question is does this have somthing to do with your boat running in "limp" mode (can't remember what merc calls it) at the Lavey Regatta? I've been curious as to what caused the problem. Maybe someone elses post?

nextasex
11-12-2003, 10:43 PM
fastvdriver, thanks for checking up on this issue with your Merc contact.
Faster Daddy, it's me that has been having the guardian mode(limp mode) problems. Still NOT resolved, nothing like writing boat payment checks while my boat is at the shop. I would definetely appreciate it if you did call Mike at Temecula Marine. I would love to hear an answer from a Merc Master Tech. I knew for a fact I wasn't the only one running deeps, that's the way it came from the manufacturer and am sure that's what all boat manf are doing.
Frank
:confused:

Faster Daddy
11-12-2003, 11:19 PM
Nextasex, I actually talked to Mike about the problems you were having before I picked up my new ride. He assured me that he would be able quickly be able to identify the problem. In fact he told me to call him if I was out of town and he would walk me through the reset proceedure. PM me and let me know how to get a hold of you. His shop is only 15 mins from my house, I'll drive over tomorrow and talk with him.

fastvdriver
11-13-2003, 08:47 AM
Originally posted by nextasex
fastvdriver, thanks for checking up on this issue with your Merc contact.
Faster Daddy, it's me that has been having the guardian mode(limp mode) problems. Still NOT resolved, nothing like writing boat payment checks while my boat is at the shop. I would definetely appreciate it if you did call Mike at Temecula Marine. I would love to hear an answer from a Merc Master Tech. I knew for a fact I wasn't the only one running deeps, that's the way it came from the manufacturer and am sure that's what all boat manf are doing.
Frank
:confused:
Just got off the phone with Merc. the only reason that they don't like the deep cycles is that most of them don't have the CCA rating that they want which is 750 CCA. if you are having a problem with the ECM it may be from the voltage that it is seeing which is not a issue with the battery as long as the battery has 12 volts or more. some issues due come in with the added lights and radio's that cause a major draw on the ele. system that the alt. can't keep up with. :)

Chase
11-13-2003, 08:57 AM
I have a VOLVO Penta system in my boat c/w MPI Vortec, and the owners manual specifies that I should not run a deep cycle as well. I was surprised to read it and have thought the same thoughts as many of you here have. However now that Fastv has posted what he has I can see why they say that, however if there are no problems...what diffrence would it make??

prosthogod
11-13-2003, 11:25 AM
I don't have a Merc contact , but I do have duel deep cyclers, duel coolers, duel axels, duel sponsons, a wife with duel Ds,etc. I think you get the idea.:D :D

fastvdriver
11-13-2003, 12:50 PM
Originally posted by Chase
I have a VOLVO Penta system in my boat c/w MPI Vortec, and the owners manual specifies that I should not run a deep cycle as well. I was surprised to read it and have thought the same thoughts as many of you here have. However now that Fastv has posted what he has I can see why they say that, however if there are no problems...what diffrence would it make??
no diffrence in the battery as long as you are not having any trouble turning the motor over. the CCA rating is also for the hole US so in the colder parts of the country you may need the extra cranking amps to turn over the cold motor.

nextasex
11-13-2003, 05:51 PM
for all the responses gentlemen. I think we figured it out that it's the CCA's that make the difference. Once again, thanks for your time..
Frank:wink:

HighRoller
11-13-2003, 09:40 PM
You can have the best of both worlds by running a dual battery isolator.Use a deep cycle for the stereo and a car battery for starting and the discharge circuits are seperate.You could run a golf cart battery for the stereo and a car battery for the engine.The great thing is that after the engine is started the isolator sends charging current to both batteries.And most of them have a master cutoff so you can turn off battery power when the boat is parked or stored for long periods.You wouldn't use a deep cycle battery to start your car so why use one to start your car engine in your boat?

Havasu Hangin'
11-14-2003, 04:59 AM
Originally posted by HighRoller
You can have the best of both worlds by running a dual battery isolator.
An isolator will have a minimum of 1/2 volt drop across each diode. I switched mine to Perko switches (no voltage drop), because I need every bit of juice I can get to run the stereo (1 marine starting and 2 deep cycles).
When you are watching the voltage gauge dive (with the bass), a 1/2 volt will seem like alot.
Originally posted by HighRoller
You wouldn't use a deep cycle battery to start your car so why use one to start your car engine in your boat?
Lots of guys run the Yellow Top Deep Cycle in thier cars.
An Optima Blue Top Deep Cycle has 750 CCA and 870 MCA. I would not hesitate running this as a starting battery...the only diference is a little more reserve (120 minutes vs 110 minutes) and a little less CCA (750 vs 800) from the marine starting batteries.
I would worry about the CCA...not the word "deep cycle".

rivercrazy
11-14-2003, 08:43 AM
I gots 3 blue tops. Two of the three are well over 3 years old and the still perform like they are brand new. I use one just for starting and never had a problem (even when leaning on the 1 starting battery for a "bit" of stereo.