Drug Testing .....

[Keithb87]

If your Boss told you 4 weeks ago that he was going to do a Drug Test on all of the Drivers in the Company between 12-8 and 12-12-2003....
And 2 weeks ago 11-24 thru 11-28-2003 you were at a party and someone offered you Marijuna.... would you smoke it????
And if you answered yes,
Would you be pissed at your boss (who gave you plenty of warning) for letting you go?
:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

[78Eliminator]

Well, IMO, if you can't say no when you know it will cost you your job, then you have a problem.

[JetBoatRich]

Just say no, easier said then done I guess. Hopefully it wasn't you:( .
I had to let an employee go last year, he knew we tested after accidents. He had an accident and tested positive after the accident and was mad at us:mad: when he was releived of his job.
Not long befor that, we tested a bunch of drivers and I even through myself in the loop everyone passed even him. When he tested positive he blamed it on a trip to Havasu with a bunch of us two months prior:eek!: Told the big boss, don't know what he was doing but they can test me anytime and get the same results.
:D :D

[JetBoatRich]

Originally posted by 78Eliminator
Well, IMO, if you can't say no when you know it will cost you your job, then you have a problem.
The job and if you have a family at home relying on you, should not have to think about it.

[Keithb87]

No, I'm the Boss.. I just can't imagine that one of my Drivers could be so Stupid.
I gave all of them 4 weeks notice that The Anual Drug Test was comming up.
This one IDIOT Fails and his excuse was he was at a party 2 weeks ago.
It just pisses me off. I try to help these Dumb Asses and they just **** Up. :mad: :mad:

[JetBoatRich]

Originally posted by Keithb87
It just pisses me off. I try to help these Dumb Asses and they just **** Up. :mad: :mad:
You hate it when they are a person that really works hard, on the other end it can help you for the below PAR worker.
Tough to loose your job, especially a week before Christmas. :o

[bigd1]

I'm smoking a blunt as I read this... Good think I'm not a truck driver!

[vdrivenman]

we get randomly tested and anytime you are in a mva(motor vehicle accident) it is automatic. your fault or their's !
also anytime you are hurt on the job, EVEN if you are assaulted by someone else( YOU) get drug tested !
How ferked up is that.
about theonly time your not tested is in a use of force case, that is unless it involves an accident, like spinning someone outin a chase.
Geez warned and still failed the test ! how irresponsible !

[Blown 472]

where do I sign up and what time should I be there?

[ratso]

Yeah bigd1, good "think":D
Take another hit.

[v-drive]

A few years back I had a young machinist that could do no wrong. I caught him and another employee smokin shit out behind a portable we have. I walked them both out in the same hour. After that we instigated mandatory drug testing for every new hire and random drug testing throughout the year and we don't have one complaint about it. Yeah a few people walked but what is more surprising is the amount of people that walk out of an interview when they find out there is drug testing .
:cool: v-drive

[hboldno7]

Well, i hope he at least had a fun time at the party two weeks ago.

[Clown]

If You smoke REEFER
You understand how to work around the system.
Plenty of -------------- works wonders!:D
Dont want the DR.s or the other kind to Figure out what we do to make a cover.
The thing that pisses me of is that the Other Jag that you work with does Coke On friday knight and by monday morning its out of His system.:mad:
And you just take a hit to Relax, And you get nailed:mad:

[JetBoatRich]

Clown, what are you saying:D
Shouldn't matter what someone does on their own time as long as it does not affect their work:eek: or put someone or themselves in danger :rolleyes: does not seem to work that way anymore and employers expect their employees to be able to do their job. There could be a liability issue if a banned substance or alcohol in found their system on a job related accident.
Personally I really don't care what people do on their own time, but if there are rules you may want to follow them to keep your job. :cool:

[brianwhiteboy]

can I have his job? I want a driving position :eek:

[Kilrtoy]

Drug testing is good,
i dont want to be around some idiot who is high or coming down from the night before.
I think they should just pop in and say your being tested come with me.......
DOPE is stupid,
you wont work around a drunk so why would you work around a doper......

[H20Advantage]

I highly doubt smoking one joint or taking a couple of hits would be in his system two weeks after he did it.
Smoke one whole joint and you may find something up to 13 days afterwards. A hit would not stay in the system that long.
A heavy user who stops may have a positive test up to five weeks afterwards.
Take what he said witha very large grain of salt.... I call BULLSHIT on his one time use.:rolleyes:

[superdave013]

Originally posted by vdrivenman
we get randomly tested and anytime you are in a mva(motor vehicle accident) it is automatic. your fault or their's !
also anytime you are hurt on the job, EVEN if you are assaulted by someone else( YOU) get drug tested !
How ferked up is that.
about theonly time your not tested is in a use of force case, that is unless it involves an accident, like spinning someone outin a chase.
Geez warned and still failed the test ! how irresponsible !
That's not ferked up at all.
I don't even want to hear a cop cry about a drug test. All cops should be able to pass one at any given day (and I'm sure you can) with out any notice. I mean, come on, don't you guys arrest people for doing drugs? If so then you (not just you but all cops in general) better not be freaking using them.
And yes, I agree that he was not real smart to fail a test he knew about.

[Jbb]

A few years back when they started drug testing everyone in the transportation industry we had 1 year warning ...We all had to go to monthly meetings and sign a form stating that we knew it was coming ....Every month for 12 months ...The company said ...If you have a problem ...come to us now and we will pay for treatment to get you on the right track before testing began.....We lost over 40% of the Mechanics in our system when they started testing .....And the union spent money trying to re instate those fired when it was Federal guidelines put in place requiring termination....I have a tough time felling sorry for people in these type positions ...and I didnt think the union spent the members money wisely in trying to defend an impossible set of circumtances...

[Ducatista]

Originally posted by Keithb87
No, I'm the Boss.. I just can't imagine that one of my Drivers could be so Stupid.
I gave all of them 4 weeks notice that The Anual Drug Test was comming up.
This one IDIOT Fails and his excuse was he was at a party 2 weeks ago.
It just pisses me off. I try to help these Dumb Asses and they just **** Up. :mad: :mad: Its certainly not your fault, he just fu%ked up. It's a shame, but I wouldn't lose to much sleep about it, you did your part in giving them fail warning. Some people just don't get it....I hope he doesn't have a family to support, but he made his own bed.........

[coolchange]

I got hurt on the job several years ago. Broke my pelvis in 3 places, changed my life. The guy that caused it I'm sure would have tested positive. When I went to a new job last summer and found out what was goin on sometimes I told those guys if I saw any of it " I WILL RAT YOU OUT IN A HEARTBEAT" Don't need some dumbsh1t trying to kill me again and most importantly F with my familiy.

[25 Eagle]

When I run a add for guys I put in the add that we drug test. We also do pre employment testing, which cost me like 25 bucks a head. I ask this guy if he can pass and he says no problem so I send him down to take a wiz quiz. The lady at the lab calls and says the ass has "cold pee" and doesn't want to re-test. What a jerk off.

[jbtrailerjim]

I don't feel sorry for this guy. He's an idiot for doing drug's in the first place and he's really an idiot for continuing to do drug's when he was given fair warning that you were going to start random drug screening. **** em I wouldn't lose any sleep over this guy. You gave him a chance and he obviously didn't care.
Jim<-------Ain't down with drug users.

[LUVNLIFE]

I don't really care what anybody does as long as it doesn't effect me. I work in the underground industry. wet utilities, our jobs are usually pretty deep and dangerous. Not only do I count on my fellow workers not to be jacked up and hurt me, but if there is an emergancy I count on them to be the first responders. I don't need anyone standing there going WOW Man. Don't mean to piss anyone off just my .02.

[mickeyfinn]

Personally I would rather see a skills test given for 5 minutes before work each day. Maybe some kind of computer simulator. If you drive or work heavy equipment this would be easy enough to do. Most manufacturers of heavy equipment have already developed a computer simulation of some sort anyway. I would much rather work side by side with the guy who smoked a joint last night to relax than work with the guy who has a cold and is numb because of all the antihistimine in his system which is over the counter and legal. My opinion is that the only reason that marijuana is not legal in this country today is because there is no test available to tell if you are stoned "right now". If there was an easy way to give you a dui for driving stoned I believe it would be legal and the liquor industry would be struggling.

[j-rod]

I will sell clean some clean urine! I'm also in a D.O.T program but if you tell someone that are going to tested in the next month and they screw up, the only one to blame is themself

[Kilrtoy]

I don't really care what anybody does as long as it doesn't effect me.
Thats the problem youu never know when some dumb ass doper on his own time will affect you.
Mickey finn
your wrong with a name like that I thought you would knoiw better.
Weed is very easy to tell
INCREASED HEART RATE
Blood shot eyes
Breath
Blood
All very easy.
Everyone thinks Weed is a depressant,
its not
its a Stimulant......

[AzDon]

It's my understanding that the definition of "random" in the current DOT drug testing regulations is that employees are chosen randomly and then sent for testing at the end of their shift. Before my company changed ownership, they would send notice to all terminals that the random list was ready and the manager was to request it when he was prepared to send ANY of his employees within 48 hours. Present company's random setup is similar. Also "post accident" is mandatory!
In the 80's, I worked with a guy in L.A. that went to his company paid 2 year physical and did the pee test. It came back that he wasn't on any kind of drugs, but he WAS asked to explain how it was possible that he was pregnant!

[mickeyfinn]

Originally posted by Kilrtoy
I don't really care what anybody does as long as it doesn't effect me.
Thats the problem youu never know when some dumb ass doper on his own time will affect you.
Mickey finn
your wrong with a name like that I thought you would knoiw better.
Weed is very easy to tell
INCREASED HEART RATE
Blood shot eyes
Breath
Blood
All very easy.
Everyone thinks Weed is a depressant,
its not
its a Stimulant......
I agree that all of the above indicate you may be stoned. So would offering the guy a stale cheeto and if he asks for more he is definitely stoned!!. All of the things you mentioned are things you would find if someone were stoned. Blood shot eyes could be dust in the eyes or just tired. Breath-well I have smoked some weed that wasn't worth a shit but would make you smell like a stoner. as for blood that is the problem. Finding a concentration to say for sure you are stoned "RIGHT NOW". alcohol leaves your system almost linearly with how impaired you are. Marijuana stays in your blood longer even though you are no longer impaired.

[Kilrtoy]

Drug testing is not to see if your impared unless the cops give it too you for driving.
Drug testing in the work place is to determine if the dumb ass uses drugs......

[Jordy]

My favorite was always (this happened quite a few times) when you go to hire someone and give them a quick once over, inform them that a pre-employment screen is required and ask if they're going to have a problem with it. Everyone that ever failed were the ones that would be like "No way, I never do drugs" or "Not a chance in hell." Had half a dozen guys play this little game at the company's expense... I don't get it, because they know they're going to get caught, just fess up and stop wasting everyone's time on the deal.

[Scream]

Shouldn't matter what someone does on their own time as long as it does not affect their work or put someone or themselves in danger does not seem to work that way anymore and employers expect their employees to be able to do their job. There could be a liability issue if a banned substance or alcohol in found their system on a job related accident.
I'm kinda new here, but I'm puttin my .02 worth in.
On one hand, it shouldn't matter to an employer what an employee does on his or her time. Privacy is an issue we must all deal with in our own way. That's another post for another time. As for drug testing fairness, think about it from an employers viewpoint, especially a California employer.
In California, our Workers Comp insurance has risen 200% in the last 2 years. Coupled with lopsided legislation from our wonderful state government, we have the worst workers comp system in the country. California employers not only have to pay through the nose to insure thier employees, they have no rights when it comes to an employee injury. If an employee gets injured on the job, regardless if he uses drugs on the job, at home, or got some second hand smoke, it's the employers finacial burden. If an employee gets injured away from work, comes to work and hurts himself further, it's the employers finacial burden. If an employee decides he doesn't like his boss, he claims a back ache, goes to treatment, takes weeks off of work, and eventually sues for thousands, it's the employers financial burden.
Here's another little tid bit...If an employee leaves work for the day, heads home, gets into an accident on his way and hurts or kills someone and is found to have drugs or alchohol in his system, guess who get's the blame...Certainly not the bonehead with a peer pressure issue, I can tell you that...
Do I sound bitter here?

[jerry billet]

I've had guys walk out of an interview because of the test requirement. Yes, even when your ad states testing, and the ointeview and all and they still fail. Who are they trying to kid.
The random requires us to send only 10% . randomly picked from the crew. A driver could go a copuple of years between tests. Screw that. We send everyone for testing on a quarterly basis.
Get no hassles from the drivers as they know this when hired. In last seven years, only lost one driver to this, who came to us prior to his testing, and quit so he did not have it on his record. Had some smarts.

[JetBoatRich]

H20Advantage posted this on RRL, just hang it next to the sign that said we drug test.
Drug Chart (http://www.health.rutgers.edu/Drugs/DrugChart.htm)

[Kilrtoy]

hair traps the stuff the best....

[diggler]

I used to smoke a lot of pot way back in college. I stopped it so I could pass interview drug screening tests. Well, all of the sudden I realized that even though I'd never be tested for drugs again as an electrical engineer unless I changed jobs I still never went back to it. The reasons....
1. CRS Disease - "Can't Remember Shit"
2. Lives actually depend on my calculations and settings advised. In a public utility, someone could get fried waaaaay to easy if you tell a lineman the wrong information and he relies upon it.
I still don't have a problem with it, but I like to remember what I' doing at any one instance. Knock yourselves out everyone if my life or job doesn't depend on you.

[drbones]

Ok..I have to speak here...
Pre employment screening it fine...
Post accident is fine...
BUT RANDOM is not .....it is not fair..and it should not be legal..
There should be reasonable cause to issuse a drug screen...not just random...
I look at it like this...would you want at random..the police to come to your home and just walk in and start going through your shit..??
No way..you would be pissed...they have to have a warrant to come and search your home....and they have to have reasonable cause to gain the warrant from the judge....
Same way with random drug testing...they are searching your personal being..with out reasonable cause...and at random....
Again..drug testing is a good thing...but we need to change how we go about it...
Like I said... Pre-employment (GOOD)
Post-accident (GOOD)
But random...(BAD)...come on ppl...the next thing you know...the police will be able to come search your home at random...just because they want to...
I know some ppl will disagree with me...but you still know I'm speaking the truth :D
Ok I had to edit my post to include...that if the person is warned in advance that they will be given a drug screen on a specified date ..and they fail...that is nobody's fault but the person that failed..

[JetBoatRich]

I heard there is a way to flush your system, with all the warnings for him he should have been prepared:( to face the consequences for his actions

[MJ19]

Originally posted by 78Eliminator
Well, IMO, if you can't say no when you know it will cost you your job, then you have a problem.
Ditto...he's got a drug problem and the party story is an old one...he had plenty of warning, if he's that stupid then I'd let him go :rolleyes:

[Liberator TJ1984]

All for Drug Testing !!! do it all the time here at our work !!!
Matter of fact they should test everyone getting any kind of job no mater what before they could hire you..
espescially test all those on any type of Government aide !!! Food Stamps , Govt. Housing . etc...etc...
You fail , you lose your support !!!
Bunch of Losers
all for random testing too...
This ought to be good:mad: :yuk:
oh yea....some of the Majors are already doing DNA hair samples as we are fixing to go to soon ....

[Jordy]

Originally posted by drbones
But random...(BAD)...come on ppl...the next thing you know...the police will be able to come search your home at random...just because they want to...
I'm confused how the police get involved with this?
If you're working for a private business and they are paying you a wage to perform a job, they have the right to hire you and fire you when and however they want. They also have the right to test you for illicit substances that will hinder your on the job performance. It has nothing to do with the police.
Much like the fuss thrown on here when the moderators started editing posts and removing porn from the boards. There were all kinds of mention of freedom of speech. Sorry doesn't work here as it's an entity run by a private organization. They can do whatever they want to the board. Don't like it? Find another place to play.
Same with work, don't like the policy? Go work for another outfit that doesn't care what the employees do. Come to work stoned or drunk or whatever turns your crank. I'd bet that outfit won't be around long because when one of their employees kills someone on the job while under the influence of something and end up in court and it becomes common knowlege that the employer looked the other way regarding all the recreational drug users, they're cooked.
Personally, I have nothing to hide so test away. When I was working for a heavy dirt/paving contractor I always felt better knowing that the people running equipment around me weren't loaded up. Now if they could only do a pre-employment common sense test... :D

[drbones]

We have random here where i work...
and I give them hell every time.....
but i do agree with you
""Matter of fact they should test everyone getting any kind of job no mater what before they could hire you..
espescially test all those on any type of Government aide !!! Food Stamps , Govt. Housing . etc...etc...""
So you are saying that you would not mind the police to coming search your home..anytime they feel like it?
Random is evasion of your right to privicy....they are accusing you of being a doper with out just cause...and you are guilty till you pass the piss test
it is not the idea that they will find anything...
it is what will be allowed to do next...????
when you go to that random test...and the guy in front of you smells like beer....and passes...because they dont scan for it....
and they guy that has been 100% on time to work...does his job 100%...and decided he would smoke a joint..then a week later has a random test..and fails...while the drunk is still working and comes to work with hang over..is late all the time....calls off sick...only does half ass work..because he is hung over and dont feel like working...he should keep his job..because buying beer is legal...
but I would rather work with the guy that smoked a joint last week..or even lastnight...then to trust the hung over guy..who is holding his head..instead of the safety line....
Sorry for the long ass post's..... :D but I'm sure ppl can see where i stand :D

[Blown 472]

what about the people that use it on the weekends say take a hit or two on a friday and dont come to work stoned but yet get fired for having it in them??

[drbones]

jordanpaulk
i was just using the police as a example...
your body is yours....same as your home...to search your body or your home the police need reasonable cause...
unlike your employer..who does not need reasonable cause to search the inside of your body...LOL....they can just come up to and say time to search you....
So to me..they are saying i'm guilty..till i prove them wrong...
unlike a court system..that has to prove you are guilty...and not you prove you are not...
And you are right this jsut might get good... :D

[78Eliminator]

Jordy and Liberator, I am in 100% agreement. I think if it is not random, you might as well not do it at all. A non random drug test, just "weeds" out the drug users that are not complete morons. While this is a good start, you still are going to have people that are using potentially working for you. The ONLY way to drug test, is to tap you on the shoulder and make you piss RIGHT THEN. I know a guy who smoked pot THE NIGHT BEFORE the test and drank some wonder drink he bought at a smoke shop (right next to the bongs) and passed his pre-employment test. He smokes pot every lunch. I found this out when we were driving back from lunch and he lit up while on the road!! :eek:

[Jordy]

Originally posted by drbones
So you are saying that you would not mind the police to coming search your home..anytime they feel like it?
What police? This isn't the police. This has nothing to do with the police. The police are a government entity. Your employer (in the private sector) is not.
Random is evasion of your right to privicy....they are accusing you of being a doper with out just cause...and you are guilty till you pass the piss test
You don't have a right to privacy in an employment situation. You give up that right by collecting a check.

[Jordy]

Originally posted by drbones
unlike your employer..who does not need reasonable cause to search the inside of your body...LOL....they can just come up to and say time to search you....
Yes they can. And they have that right. They can search for cause, like coming into work drunk. If they suspect it, they can send you out for a breathalizer. Or they can draw names randomly and go that route. I don't have a problem with it as I have nothing to hide.

[drbones]

Ok jordanpaulk ...LOL
so you are saying that your employer has the right to search you for something you might not have done on a work day...
that is envading your rights....
But the our goverment can not search you with out a warrant...
so the employer has more rights??
I know you understand my point...LOL
All I'm saying is...ppl have rights..and the goverment gave them to us to protect us.....
the employers also needs to protect them selfs....but also should be required respect the employee's rights... :D
same as the goverment....the employers have no more rights then the goverment...but the way it is going they will have before long

[v-drive]

drbones, The last time I looked drinking or being hungover wasn't tolerated. I for one person do not allow it in our facility and I send people home for alcohol abuse . It is also documented and if the problem persists the person is dealt with accordingly.
I've seen alcoholism first hand and your right, it's bad but until it is made illegal it does get treated differently..v-drive

[Jordy]

Originally posted by drbones
Ok jordanpaulk ...LOL
so you are saying that your employer has the right to search you for something you might not have done on a work day...
that is envading your rights....
But the our goverment can not search you with out a warrant...
so the employer has more rights??
This would be so much easier if you would realize that the two have nothing to do with each other. Not a ****ing thing at all.
I know you understand my point...LOL
No I don't. Your point doesn't make any sense because one doesn't have anything to do with the other. Unless you have something to hide randoms shouldn't bother you.
All I'm saying is...ppl have rights..and the goverment gave them to us to protect us.....
The government gave us those rights to protect us from the government. Study your history book and you'll realize that the people who drafted the Constitution and Bill of Rights just revolted fromt he rule of a king where nobody had any rights. Your rights protect you from the government. That's it.
the employers have no more rights then the goverment...but the way it is going they will have before long
Yes they do. And they should. And they always have had more rights. They sign the front of the paycheck.

[drbones]

The alcohol is treated different....and most place just send them home to sober up....
If they are going to test 1 person random..they should test all same day...not just one... :D
I have worked at a place that only tested the men on one shift...
they never tested the females until 3 days later....and never tested the other shifts...
Would anyone call that fair random testing....??

[drbones]

I dont feel like arguing my point...
LOL..
if no one understands it..I guess that is why it is MHO... :D
and I dont have anything to hide....I have been taking the tests for the last 12 years...never failed one yet....
But it is not right to single out one person for test.....with out cause...
so let the employers run this country and throw all the goverment out..
....nuff said... :D

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

should a person be terminated for getting a ticket for speeding on the way to work? speeding is against the law too!!!
Omega
(not a toker anymore but can't remember the last time he heard about someone smoking themselves to death in one setting..........)
make it legal and tax the crap out of it. everybody wins!!!

[diggler]

One thing a lot of the folks are forgetting, that are against random testing, is that marijuana is against the law. These laws were created by representatives that WE elected. Sure, you can do what you want with your body anytime you want, if you can get away with it and there are no statutory rules, or common laws against such activity.
WE made these rules/laws, and enforcement of these laws cannot be argued against, regardless if we're in favor or not.
An employer has every right to ensure the safety of their personnel and limit their liability in a reasonable way. Random drug testing is one of these methods.
Imagine if there were no regulations on pot. The company would still be liable for their stoned employees hurting a third party negligently. (I'm forming a parallel here to a legal substance, alcohol). As long as the employee is acting in the scope of their work, within the hours and spatial boundaries, and are motivated at least in part by furthering the interests of their employer, the company will ALWAYS be held liable.
Shit, if I owned a company, I'd exercise my right and ensure that my employees were clean and their private activities did not put my livelihood at risk.
So go ahead and get stoned, (hell I used to do it all the time before I realized I could hurt someone seriously), and take your chances.

[Jordy]

Originally posted by OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET
should a person be terminated for getting a ticket for speeding on the way to work? speeding is against the law too!!!
If you get enough of them and lose your license and your job requires you to have a license? Yeah, you should lose your job. Any other tough questions?
WTF ever happened to accountability and personal responsibility? :confused:

[AZKC]

Originally posted by JetBoatRich
I heard there is a way to flush your system, with all the warnings for him he should have been prepared:( to face the consequences for his actions
So its ok to use as long as you test clean :cool: So why test at all:confused: And what about false positives :) But your right JBR there are many ways to study for the test.

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

Originally posted by jordanpaulk
If you get enough of them and lose your license and your job requires you to have a license? Yeah, you should lose your job. Any other tough questions?
WTF ever happened to accountability and personal responsibility? :confused:
what about a 'no tolerance' program??? one ticket you're fired. damn law breakers!!!!!
Omega

[Blown 472]

Originally posted by jordanpaulk
If you get enough of them and lose your license and your job requires you to have a license? Yeah, you should lose your job. Any other tough questions?
WTF ever happened to accountability and personal responsibility? :confused:
What if you are doing something in your own home that will harm noone and by the time it is time for work it wears off?

[v-drive]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by drbones
[B]The alcohol is treated different....and most place just send them home to sober up....
Maybe now but more and more companies are becoming more responsible. Oh yeah the times they are a changin..v-drive
think about this. It's my company and I hired you . I decide how it is run not you!.

[superdave013]

All I know is I would rather be around some one that's smoked some weed then some ****ing drunk.
As a matter O fact there is someone that is active on this thread right now that was all ****ing drunk at the OP6 @ Havasu this summer. He was rude to my wife and I don't even think he knows he did it. I bet if he would have smoked a few joints and did a few less jello shots that would not have happened.

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

Originally posted by superdave013
All I know is I would rather be around some one that's smoked some weed then some ****ing drunk.
As a matter O fact there is someone that is active on this thread right now that was all ****ing drunk at the OP6 @ Havasu this summer. He was rude to my wife and I don't even think he knows he did it. I bet if he would have smoked a few joints and did a few less jello shots that would not have happened.
you ****ing dope smoking hippie you!!!;) :D how you been Dave?
Omega

[superdave013]

Originally posted by OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET
you ****ing dope smoking hippie you!!!;) :D how you been Dave?
Omega
doin good. just sitting here reading all these closet stoners go back and forth about the drug thing.
What do you think Omega, I say over half of these guys have smoked or still do smoke some weed. I'll also take a chance and say that some of them have put a straw up their nose a time or two also.

[78Eliminator]

Originally posted by superdave013
All I know is I would rather be around some one that's smoked some weed then some ****ing drunk.
Well, true for the most part. Most people who are in large crowds who have smoked, just kinda kick back and observe. Pot doesn't really relieve you of your inhibitions like booze, so I completely understand your point. But here is another point. I have been pretty ****ed up in my time, and I have done some stupid stuff, but I have NEVER hit on anyones signifigant other, EVER. Don't sit here and excuse it on the alcohol. Chances are, they will just use it as an excuse. A bad person is a bad person without the booze. Personally, the more I see people act like shit heads in public when drunk, the more I want to never drink again. I don't like to be associated with ass holes like that.

[drbones]

Dang I just can't keep my mouth shut...LOL
I will ADMIT ...the employer is responable for it's employee's actions...when they are on the job!!...But how ever the employer does not own the said employee, when the employee is off duty..
Why dont they just install camara's in all employee's homes and vehicals and sidewalks,,,,or better yet lets implant a device to monitor all actions of said employee....
That way if you work at Ameritech(SBC) and use 10-10-220 for longdisatnce...they can fire you for not using there service...
The work place and home is 2 different places...
I have the up-most respect for my employer....if not for him ..I would not have the modest life that I have..and I do every thing I can to improve and help build our company...we strive to be the best.....
But the line has to stop somewhere... or the ppl will become a druid collection of mindless bee's
As far as pot be illegal that is fine and dandy..but I would change that...from recent studies....and not some 1920's goverment....there is far more deadly drugs that are sold OTC..I dont need to name them....but
Most people already have a fixed opinion on pot and its use. Their opinion is based either on their own use of this drug or on information they have heard in school, on the news, or read in newspapers or magazines. (dang I sound like a supporter)
But all of this really has nothing to do with random testing..
till the test can determin if the person is on pot right at that point in time..not that yes they have smoked pot in the last 2 weeks...
and includes all ppl employed at the work place..from the CEO to the parking lot sweeper....all to be tested on a random day...with out warning to anyone..

[v-drive]

You would most likely be right Dave but if you are calling us hypocrites you're wrong. I have learned alot of things the hard way but I've learned them. ...v-drive

[superdave013]

Justin, this person didn't hit on my wife. He was just shall we say, less then nice to her. Anyone who knows her knows that even though she's not a super model that she is one of the nicest, sweetest person you could ever meet.
She didn't tell me about it untill we had left and had the boat on the trailer.
All I know is that if you're an ass hole when drunk, it's a good chance that you're just an ass hole deep down inside.

[superdave013]

Originally posted by v-drive
You would most likely be right Dave but if you are calling us hypocrites you're wrong. I have learned alot of things the hard way but I've learned them. ...v-drive
v drive, I'm not calling anyone by name a hypocrite. And yes, I learned the hard way too.

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

Originally posted by superdave013
doin good. just sitting here reading all these closet stoners go back and forth about the drug thing.
What do you think Omega, I say over half of these guys have smoked or still do smoke some weed. I'll also take a chance and say that some of them have put a straw up their nose a time or two also.
I'm gonna go with more than half. I say at least 60%. the hypocrits seem to be quite active. I don't see what the problem is with it myself. Alcohol is much worse.......ever seen anyone die from marijuana poisoning?
Omega

[78Eliminator]

Originally posted by superdave013
Justin, this person didn't hit on my wife. He was just shall we say, less then nice to her. Anyone who knows her knows that even though she's not a super model that she is one of the nicest, sweetest person you could ever meet.
She didn't tell me about it untill we had left and had the boat on the trailer.
All I know is that if you're an ass hole when drunk, it's a good chance that you're just an ass hole deep down inside.
I agree 100%. Supermodel or not, I'm sure she is/was nice and deserves to be respected as a person and for the fact that she is your wife. Sorry someone was rude.... :frown:

[78Eliminator]

Originally posted by OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET
IAlcohol is much worse.......ever seen anyone die from marijuana poisoning?
Omega
Well, I have thought that the FBI was after me, does that count?
Yeah, I think if the Gov leagalized it and stamped a little tax on it, it would benefit the US, cut down on the prison population and keep people from smoking stuff that is dusted with PCP (did I mention that the FBI has my house bugged, I JUST KNOW IT)
:D

[Liberator TJ1984]

Originally posted by superdave013
doin good. just sitting here reading all these closet stoners go back and forth about the drug thing.
What do you think Omega, I say over half of these guys have smoked or still do smoke some weed. I'll also take a chance and say that some of them have put a straw up their nose a time or two also.
I admit yes I have:wink: many moons ago
but I still have friends 40 yrs. old that cannot hold jobs because it "infringes " on their right to "Party" so what if they ain't got a pot to piss in
There is a time to be young and stuipid :D but you gotta Nut up and leave it behind some time the choice is yours
ps..I do have some Independantly employed friends that do drugs all the time ...but they got where they are of Daddy's Money

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

Originally posted by superdave013
All I know is that if you're an ass hole when drunk, it's a good chance that you're just an ass hole deep down inside.
like grandma always used to say......alcohol doesn't bring out anything that isn't already there. otherwise the bottle would be dancing!!!!:D
Omega

[drbones]

Originally posted by OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET
I'm gonna go with more than half. I say at least 60%. the hypocrits seem to be quite active. I don't see what the problem is with it myself. Alcohol is much worse.......ever seen anyone die from marijuana poisoning?
Omega
I never seen anyone Die or OD on marijuana...might go black for a couple seconds from holding it to long...LOL...Hell I dont have a problem saying I have partakin in a few OZ's in my life.....
But that is still not my point...
hell what was my point...i done forgot now :D

[AZKC]

Originally posted by 78Eliminator
Well, I have thought that the FBI was after me, does that count?
Yeah, I think if the Gov leagalized it and stamped a little tax on it, it would benefit the US, cut down on the prison population and keep people from smoking stuff that is dusted with PCP (did I mention that the FBI has my house bugged, I JUST KNOW IT)
:D
Not only that but their right outside your door Neo:)

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

Originally posted by 78Eliminator
Well, I have thought that the FBI was after me, does that count?
Yeah, I think if the Gov leagalized it and stamped a little tax on it, it would benefit the US, cut down on the prison population and keep people from smoking stuff that is dusted with PCP (did I mention that the FBI has my house bugged, I JUST KNOW IT)
:D
LOL.....it can tend to make you a little paranoid yes.....I still think as long as someone is not at work under the influence or it is not harming their performance it doesn't hurt anything.
Omega

[Tom Brown]

Originally posted by JETBOAT BRIAN
.....We lost over 40% of the Mechanics in our system when they started testing .....
Ah ha! Now we know the real reason all those busses burned. The mechanics were spending their time under the busses using torches to heat up hub caps full of heroin.

[Keithb87]

WOW!!!
I didn't expect such a large turn out on this one. I see all of the points made for and against Drug Testing. The Insurance Carrier that we use for our Trucks requires that all new drivers be tested and at least 1 test for all people driving the trucks at least once a year. I Try to give my Drivers ample warning but it never fails. at least one a year falls to their own stupidity.:(
If one of my trucks were involved in an accident and the driver was found to have drugs in his system in this Sue - Crazy world, I'm sure that we would be out of Buiness.
I am a recovering addidict to Marajuna and Meth. 4 1/2 years clean to date. :D
I figure If I can come to work every day and not do Drugs, Then Why can't all of the others that work for me?
It's a decision I made a long time ago to kick the habbit and do the Straight Thing. But because of my past dealings with Drugs, I can also understand the addiction and therefore I try to help those that I am involved with to straighten up their act as well. Maybe I am only enabeling them to do drugs by giving them warning of Random Testing.
At any rate it sucks to have to let someone go expically so close to Christmas, but as many of you have stated... It's his Fault.
Thanks for all the input,
Keith (looking for a new Driver) B87
:D

[drbones]

Keithb87
One last questions...do you provide insurance for your employee's?
if so..does the plan include a rehab program?
Where i work..if someone would fail the test ..they are offered a rehab program and then after completing the program.. they take a drug screen every 30days for the next year....
They are allowed to work on the condition that they do the rehab program and pass all the drug screens...all of this with out a pay loss...

[Keithb87]

Yes they have insurance available. But the Drug/ alchol / mental Health Benefit is limited.
The rule on a dirty UA is they can't return to work until they provide a clean UA. So basicly, any rehab is on their own.

[drbones]

Guess the ppl here are really lucky then..to have option like we have

[CA Stu]

People on dope are easy to spot. You never know who's going to show up. One day they're happy, the next, pissed off, the next, sick, etc.etc.
I would rather not have stoned, drunk, or speeding people driving around on the freeway; life's short enough as it is.
If I'm out to buy video games, DVDs, Cds, or a sound system, I don't give a crap if the salesman has a buzzo.
I do find the commercials that portray pot as a drug that will make you run over kids on bicycles offensive, though. I mean, come on. The part that pisses me off is that people that were never exposed to pot take these commercials as gospel, and think that stoners are going around killing children. It's not true.
In society, responsible people with some financial depth and a decent net worth for the most part view potheads as college kids that can't be conscientious adults.
I would never go into a business arrangement with a pothead/ drug user, I know I would end up holding the bag. Been there, done that.
Sober folks for the most part are more dependable.
It all comes down to maturity, IMHO. There is a time and place for most things, and a time to put away childish things and accept responsibility as an adult.
It's amazing how hard the good life is to come by for dopers, and how easy it is to have a great life for the non-drug user.
/soapbox
CA Stu <-- has dealt with this issue for years, hopefully a bit wiser now.
PS I enjoy this board. Lots of insightful posts. Sometimes.

[H20Advantage]

Heres a little question for the masses on a real world scenario that happened to me a month or so ago. We all talk about am employer and employees rights about drug use. Bottom line what we do for work somehow affects customers down the road. We are all in the business of selling or getting goods to the customer.
At the end of the summer we came home from Havasu and found one of the upstairs bathroom toilets decided to add a water feature to my downstairs family room. This in turn caused me to get new carpet for this downstairs room.
We went to a carpet company we have used in the past and ordered our new carpet. They hire out for install and so comes the day that my carpet is being installed.
Two guys show up in their mid 40's, typical 909ers. Not the best groomed guys in the world but personable and appeared to be professional. I see one of the two go into my downstairs bathroom when they come in and don't think anything of it. He comes out and they begin to replace the carpet.
I checked on them off and on and shoot the shit with them and so forth. Jobs done well and they leave.
I or my kids don't go into that bathroom the rest of the day. the next day I walk in and am washing my hands. I look down at the rim of the sink and see a brown piece of paper. I reach and pick it up and immediately set it down because my hands are wet and I know what it is.
The item I picked up was a bindle. For those who don't know a bindle is a piece of magazine page folded to hold drugs. I opened the bindle and found what I recognized to be cocaine. I know this because I have an extensive background in drug detection.
At first I could not believe what I found then I was pissed. Not only did this bastard come into my home and use drugs in my own bathroom he left it there for my children to get into. It would be one thing I guess if I had a party and expected people to have this type of behavior but this is a person I hired via another company to provide a service and he comes into my house to provide that service.
Thank God my children are not of the age where they pick things up and put them in their mouths.
Besides the two felony charges the guy could be facing - Possession of a controlled substance and Child Endangerment. What kind of lawsuit has the carpet company now been opened up to and do you think I'll go back and do business with them..
You think drug testing would have possibly caught this before it happened (I realize he is an independant contractor).....What's your opinion?

[mickeyfinn]

Originally posted by riodog
Mickeyfinn, contrary to popular belief, and while it is 'legal' to purchase over the counter antihistimine without a RX, it is NOT legal to operate a motor vehicle on any public highway "under the influence". DUI= anything that alters or impares. In the case of construction equiptment-how bout a 651 cat commin at you at about 40 mph, on a downhill, with a stoner at the wheel! eek! or even a warehouse forklift operator-on dust- causing an injury resulting in death, = criminal negligent homicide. Check it out!Riodog
I never intended to imply that it was legal to use otc drugs and drive, however it is done every day by millions of americans and almost never prosecuted. My point was that for an employer to randomly, prehire or otherwise drug test is not necessarily the best policy. The best policy would be to identify people who are impaired while at work. This could be done by skills testing. As for the comment someone made about people forgetting that drug use is illegal:
So is are a lot of other things but you never hear of an employer financing an investigation to prove that an employee engages is sodomy or oral states where that is illegal, why? because they don't necessarily affect that employees production or impair that person's ability to do their job. A person who sits at home after a long day and smokes a hog leg before dinner is not impaired when he/she returns to work the next day and to fire someone for doing so is wrong. I see no difference in doing this and firing someone because you saw them drunk saturday afternoon. (They may have been sober all day sunday). The only difference is the fact that the alcohol is legal which should be an issue between the individual and the law enforcement not their employer.

[drbones]

Originally posted by mickeyfinn
I never intended to imply that it was legal to use otc drugs and drive, however it is done every day by millions of americans and almost never prosecuted. My point was that for an employer to randomly, prehire or otherwise drug test is not necessarily the best policy. The best policy would be to identify people who are impaired while at work. This could be done by skills testing. As for the comment someone made about people forgetting that drug use is illegal:
So is are a lot of other things but you never hear of an employer financing an investigation to prove that an employee engages is sodomy or oral states where that is illegal, why? because they don't necessarily affect that employees production or impair that person's ability to do their job. A person who sits at home after a long day and smokes a hog leg before dinner is not impaired when he/she returns to work the next day and to fire someone for doing so is wrong. I see no difference in doing this and firing someone because you saw them drunk saturday afternoon. (They may have been sober all day sunday). The only difference is the fact that the alcohol is legal which should be an issue between the individual and the law enforcement not their employer.
DAMN well said...that is it...
To identify people who are impaired while at work...that is the key....not spying on what they do at home or any other place not job related....

[canuck1]

The way I look at this is what you do from 5-9 is your bus, what you do from 9-5 is mine. I will not allow drug testing for my employees, period. I don't care who we are working for its not going to happen, I have pull 100+ man crews off of sites over this.
But I also will not allow anyone to smoke pot or drink while working, if I see it or one of my PM's does that person/company is gone, no warnings no chances gone.

[superdave013]

Originally posted by H20Advantage
Heres a little question for the masses on a real world scenario that happened to me a month or so ago. We all talk about am employer and employees rights about drug use. Bottom line what we do for work somehow affects customers down the road. We are all in the business of selling or getting goods to the customer.
At the end of the summer we came home from Havasu and found one of the upstairs bathroom toilets decided to add a water feature to my downstairs family room. This in turn caused me to get new carpet for this downstairs room.
We went to a carpet company we have used in the past and ordered our new carpet. They hire out for install and so comes the day that my carpet is being installed.
Two guys show up in their mid 40's, typical 909ers. Not the best groomed guys in the world but personable and appeared to be professional. I see one of the two go into my downstairs bathroom when they come in and don't think anything of it. He comes out and they begin to replace the carpet.
I checked on them off and on and shoot the shit with them and so forth. Jobs done well and they leave.
I or my kids don't go into that bathroom the rest of the day. the next day I walk in and am washing my hands. I look down at the rim of the sink and see a brown piece of paper. I reach and pick it up and immediately set it down because my hands are wet and I know what it is.
The item I picked up was a bindle. For those who don't know a bindle is a piece of magazine page folded to hold drugs. I opened the bindle and found what I recognized to be cocaine. I know this because I have an extensive background in drug detection.
At first I could not believe what I found then I was pissed. Not only did this bastard come into my home and use drugs in my own bathroom he left it there for my children to get into. It would be one thing I guess if I had a party and expected people to have this type of behavior but this is a person I hired via another company to provide a service and he comes into my house to provide that service.
Thank God my children are not of the age where they pick things up and put them in their mouths.
Besides the two felony charges the guy could be facing - Possession of a controlled substance and Child Endangerment. What kind of lawsuit has the carpet company now been opened up to and do you think I'll go back and do business with them..
You think drug testing would have possibly caught this before it happened (I realize he is an independant contractor).....What's your opinion?
I hope you reported this to the place you bought the carpet from. I would be hella pissed if I was you.
Ok, I'll go on the record here and say that I don't give a rat's ass if someone smokes a little weed in their own house or sitting around the campfire at the river.
But when people do any thing that affects others (drugs or just about anything else) that's where to draw the line.
It's hard to say if a test would have stopped that. Maybe random testing. But we all know that if they only do pre emplyment tests that would not stop it. That guy is past the point of doing drugs. When people do that kind of shit they are so far gone that the drugs are now doing them.
Drunks bug me but tweekers are on my #1 most hated list. They are also very easy to spot.

[Jbb]

Originally posted by Tom Brown
Ah ha! Now we know the real reason all those busses burned. The mechanics were spending their time under the busses using torches to heat up hub caps full of heroin.
Busses Burn Brown......Accept it as a part of life.....
Not much gets past you though....Cookin up a hit under a bus leads to torching a plastic brake airline....which in winter is full of alcohol to keep the moisture from freezing.....End result.......A pretty blue flame ...and singed eyebrows and a large lump of charcoal....some have emerged from under the burning bus claiming to have found the true meaning of God......Go Figure!

[Tom Brown]

Originally posted by JETBOAT BRIAN
Busses Burn Brown......Accept it as a part of life.....
Sure... but in Atlanta they're going up like Israeli coffee houses.

[CA Stu]

Originally posted by H20Advantage
Heres a little question for the masses on a real world scenario that happened to me a month or so ago.
SNIP
Besides the two felony charges the guy could be facing - Possession of a controlled substance and Child Endangerment. What kind of lawsuit has the carpet company now been opened up to and do you think I'll go back and do business with them..
You think drug testing would have possibly caught this before it happened (I realize he is an independant contractor).....What's your opinion?
My opinion is skip all the legal crap, head straight to the shop this jackoff works at, and ask him at the top of your lungs who the **** does he think he is to come into your house, do dope in your bathroom, and then leave a bindle of dope where your kids could find it?
I'm sure your outrage and indignance as a responsible father will have the asshole staring at his boots, and probably looking for a job....
Sorry that happened to you,
Good Luck
CA Stu

[Kilrtoy]

My opinion is skip all the legal crap, head straight to the shop this jackoff works at, and ask him at the top of your lungs who the **** does he think he is to come into your house, do dope in your bathroom, and then leave a bindle of dope where your kids could find it?
HELL YEAH.
Also get a speeding ticket get fired, Now that is a streach,
BUT THEN AGAIN
if he was driving my company car that I pay for and pay for insurance and is my ass that gets sued and loses everything for his dumb ass,
I might agree with that....
NEVER SEEN ANYONE DIE FROM WEED
HOW DO YOU SPELL BOB MARLEY......
I think thats it.....

[canuck1]

[
NEVER SEEN ANYONE DIE FROM WEED
HOW DO YOU SPELL BOB MARLEY......
I think thats it..... [/B][/QUOTE]
Better check your facts

[Kilrtoy]

THEY ARE CORRECT,
YOU KNOW HOW THEY STATE WHAT THE OPINION IS (MEDICAL) AND WHAT REALLY HAPPENED HAS ALREADY BEEN PROVEN,
LUNGS HEART...

[superdave013]

Originally posted by Kilrtoy
THEY ARE CORRECT,
YOU KNOW HOW THEY STATE WHAT THE OPINION IS (MEDICAL) AND WHAT REALLY HAPPENED HAS ALREADY BEEN PROVEN,
LUNGS HEART...
I lost my best friend this year to lung cancer. Yes, he smoked just about everything that would burn in his youth. Was a heavy cigerett smoker up to the end.
A co worker died two days ago from the same thing. Never smoked weed in his life. He did smoke alot though, but it was just cigars and marborl (sp) reds.

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

Originally posted by Kilrtoy
[B]
NEVER SEEN ANYONE DIE FROM WEED
HOW DO YOU SPELL BOB MARLEY......
I think thats it.....
ever seen anyone die from marijuana poisoning was the question!!! I don't think it is possible to smoke yourself to death in one setting. you can drink yourself to death in one evening if you consume enough........
Omega

[Wicky]

I always like telling my employees we have a new insurance carrier and they will be testing next week. You should see the looks on their faces. Then I tellum I'm just joking!!! Bwwwwwahahahahaha.
Unfortunately, two years ago, the local ski resort really did start testing. Now, there is an entirely new staff that can't do half of what the old staff used to do and accidents have gone UP!!!!
You can thank the Lobbyists from the Timber and Alcohol industry for "Refer Madness" and all the brainwashing that has gone on for the last 50 years.
P.S. FACT: Bob Marley died from skin cancer. And yes, he was half white.

[BiggusJimbus]

Actual fact...
Bob Marley died from a brain tumor.
The cancer spread from a foot injury that had been incurred earlier, but Marley refused amputation of his foot or any surgery to slow the spread of the disease.
Pot is illegeal because it remains politically unsound to take a stand for the protection of personal freedoms.
I love all the people here that would sit up half the night pounding beers, go in to work hungover the next day railing against the evils of pot.
For years I smoked on a almost daily basis. I smoked with Presidents and CEO's of companies. People of all levels brilliance (and stupidity, of course). People that could buy and sell most of the wealthiest people on this board if they wanted. I also spent those years working 50-70 hours a week or more.
Now, I'll smoke maybe a handful of times a year. Not having the disposable income due to starting my own business had as much to do with that as anything. Then I found that I just couldn't go back to the old ways. And that's fine for me. Turns out I don't miss it that much.
Now, of course, these situations had little to do with safety related situations, so it's not particularly relevant to the original topic. But ultimately, the concepts come down to the same things. Responsibility as it relates to liberty.
In my opinion, it get's down to personal liberties and responsibilities. If people were responsible for their actions, the liberties wouldn't have to be forcibly reduced.
I think an earlier poster had it right. If you can't do your job because of your actions, then you have a problem and should address it.
If there was more emphasis on responsibility and less on protection and "fairness", a great deal of the problem would work itself out.
Of course too many people are just stupid and worthless, and there's not much to be done about that. That they do drugs or drink just enhances their negative qualities.
Anyway, just my opinion.

[totenhosen]

Now if weed was legal would you guys care if he had some in his system? Would you treat it like alcohol?

[JetBoatRich]

Originally posted by BiggusJimbus
Of course too many people are just stupid and worthless
LOL, that is the truth;)

[Kilrtoy]

but they have a meaning in life.
Its too remind us how good we all are.....

[Dr. Eagle]

Originally posted by Kilrtoy
but they have a meaning in life.
Its too remiond us how good we all are..... :D

[BiggusJimbus]

I see it as more of a reason to hold up our end of the deal.
Never give up authority to an imbecile.
That's your responsibility.

[zooza]

Originally posted by Blown 472
what about the people that use it on the weekends say take a hit or two on a friday and dont come to work stoned but yet get fired for having it in them??
LEGALIZE IT!!!:) :D :) :D :cool: ;) :wink: :) :)