Co Poisoning in the channel

[Mr.Havasu]

check out this poll that is on line in the Havasu news herald on line.
http://www.havasunews.com/HAVASUNEWS/myheadline.asp?S=463&P=732227&PubID=12117
I voted none of the above, but looks like I'm in the minority.
We should all vote just in case they are going to use this poll to shut down the channel on busy week ends.
The poll is on the left side of the page at the bottom. the link shows the results on my computer because I already voted, Hopefully it shows the poll and you can vote on your computers.

[RiverToysJas]

I wish going to one-way traffic on busy weekends was an option, because that's what I'd vote for!!! ;)
RTJas :D

[GASHGAZER]

50% + want to close the channel!!?? That is proposterous, the channel is where the money is... if the City is smart, they would never do anything so stupid. I can see the sensor idea and maybe a courteious public warning about the CO levels. Just because a couple dumb ass kids got ridiculously drunk and out of control, why should it impede our hangouts? Should we suck on fumes all day, but isn't that part of boating?? What's next cattylic converters on top of the mufflers?!! Give me a friggin break!! Take a close look at who lobbys for the muffler laws... hmm, could it be the major makers and distributors of the parts...
If everyone would just pull their heads out their asses and enjoy Havasu for what is it and kill the attitude, we can turn the clock back a few years and go back to good ol fun without all the 50 breathing down our backs.... I know this is a rambling message, but I can only type as slow as I think....

[HavasuDreamin']

Close copper canyon on the holiday weekends. Done.
Close the sandbar on holiday weekends. Done.
Close the channel on holiday weekends. Next.
Close Steamboat on holiday weekends after all the channel, copper, and sandbar people move the party there. Next.
Pretty soon the whole lake will be closed down for holiday weekends. Havasu loses millions in tourist money. This is not the answer.
HD :cool:

[Ducatista]

Good info, thanks. I voted for signals & flashing lights when levels are dangerous, in the minority too. Geez 52% want to close the channel on busy weekends.....there goes Steamboat down the toilet! I kinda like the one way traffic idea but that was not a choice, hell I don't know if that would even help. Since we are not big fans of the channel on summer weekends, it may not be a big thing for us. But alot of people love it & I would hate to see them lose that privilege. Its a great place to party with friends and is nice for the kids etc. LE needs new air boats with proper exhaust noise restrictions of course! That would move the air around.

[GASHGAZER]

I know that the 2-strokers that cruise the channel supposedly don't make a substantial contribution to the CO levels, but maybe if they just don't let the stanky smoky things through, we'd be able to see who is getting a little woozy. Especially those dam rentals that aren't tuned worth a dam and just spew 50:1 all over the place. I know that most if not all the guys on here with a "***boat" keeps it in top notch tune, at least I know I do. And reading the stereo section, most guys have either banks of batteries or on-board generators... Instead of jumping to close things, maybe they should look further into the real sources.
By the way, I havn't seen copper closed in while, I've only seen them put that buoy line up on the holidays for an emergency corridor... which is an ok idea, cus I've seen a few near deaths pulled out of there....

[Mr.Havasu]

I would have voted for one way traffic if that was an option also. However I don't know if that would really make a difference. I think the fans and flashing lights will only cost the city money and to be honest I don't think a person who is really drunk enough to be dangerous would notice the warning signs.
Personally, I think if they would open up the sand bar again, we would all go there. where there is plenty of fresh air and the problem would be solved.

[HavasuDreamin']

Originally posted by GASHGAZER
I know that the 2-strokers that cruise the channel supposedly don't make a substantial contribution to the CO levels, but maybe if they just don't let the stanky smoky things through, we'd be able to see who is getting a little woozy.
That will never happen. ;) How can you discriminate against one group without proof that they are the problem. That would be like saying don't let any boats larger than 25' in the channel. http://www.riverratlife.com/forums/board/ubb/graemlins/nono.gif
According to sources more familiar with the problem, it is the large cam shaft motors that create the bulk of the CO in the channel. I say you spec out every camshaft in the channel and those with more lift than say mid 500's aren't allowed in. http://www.riverratlife.com/forums/board/ubb/graemlins/point2.gif

[NOTALENT]

I would like to know how many of those people voting to close the channel are actually boaters???

[Ducatista]

Good point....you got the "snow-bearders" voting right now!

[C-2]

I think you can vote more than once! :D :D :D

[HighRoller]

The problem has nothing to do with CO or alcohol or one way traffic. It has to do with TOO MANY F%^ING PEOPLE ON THE LAKE!!!!!!!If 50 million people insist on jamming themselves into an area designed for a thousand, WTF do you think is gonna happen? I'm still in favor of limiting the number of boats on the lake on any given weekend. They can make "controlled access points", link them by computer and when they reach the magic number BANG! Nobody else gets on until somebody leaves. It might suck for those who get stoned at the ramp gate, but since people refuse to control themselves something has to be done. It's either that or have the whole place shut down eventually.

[NOTALENT]

I would not mind the limiting fact, as long as people with residencys are aloud on all the time..kind of like Lake Arrowhead but maybe a littles less strict .

[Ivan Dan]

On-Line Poll Results
"What do you think is the best option for dealing with carbon monoxide concentration in the Bridgewater Channel?"
51.4%
Closing the Channel to boat traffic during busy weekends?
27.4%
Prohibit boats from idling in the Channel? $
8.6%
None of the above?
7.6%
Install air monitors and signal lights and alarms to alert people when CO concentrations are dangerously high?
4.9%
Strict enforcement of the "No Swimming" restriction in the Channel?
1495 total votes
I voted to Install air monitors and signal lights and alarms to alert people when CO conecntrations are dangerously high

[GASHGAZER]

That's a good idea for now, but what if your that last boat that can't get on... picture that you've just driven 4 hours, spent $$ on hotel, waiting in 110 degree weather and get denied... you don't think tempers will flair?? Havasu is a big place with lots of water, and the channel is part of the fun. For the most part I enjoy sandbar and being able to walk around and socialize and watch the attractions. And once I am on the water, I don't get off until way after sundown...
BTW I was not trying to segregate one group of vessel (river lice), but if there is visible pollution coming from a boat, they should be denied access. Let's face it, when it's hot as hell on a non-windy day, that smoke just sits. And to the lamen, that is construed as CO, even though CO is oderless and colorless. Plus that stuff just stanks!! I'm just all about having fun and relaxing... and hiding the keys while I enjoy the day with a couple coldies of course

[GASHGAZER]

Also, how can you prevent boats from idleing in the channel?? Do they mean the boats that are already beached?? Cus the traffic is always moving, whether it's a snails crawl, it moves.

[HavasuDreamin']

Originally posted by HighRoller
I'm still in favor of limiting the number of boats on the lake on any given weekend.
That isn't going to work either. The problem with that is diagnosed in your post. Hypothetically speaking, if it is determined that the lake can hold 5,000 boats, and 5,000 boats are allowed on, but then decide to all hang in the channel, and sandbar, then you are still faced with the same problem.

[HavasuDreamin']

Originally posted by GASHGAZER
Let's face it, when it's hot as hell on a non-windy day, that smoke just sits. And to the lamen, that is construed as CO, even though CO is oderless and colorless.
Playing devils advocate, what if they did ban the 2 strokes. My bet is the channel is still over the safe CO limit because of all the 540 chevys with large cams either cruising through slowly, or idleing to recharge the batterys, etc. Now you still have the same problem.
The only way to ensure there is a safe CO level is to reduce the amount of CO emmissions in that "area" either through (1) less CO emissions, or (2) dispersing the current high CO levels through fans, etc.
What if they limited the amount of boats that could be in the channel at one time in addition to monitoring the idleing of boats while in the channel. IE.....one in, one out.
HD

[RiverKitty]

Results of Poll:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/414poll.JPG
Funny, I never posted this article until now but since the subject came up....again, I figured now would be as good as time as any to post it. This article was pulished by "Soundings Magazine", which interestingly enough, is mainly distributed to the Eastern Coast. The photographer in the article is ME!!! If you want to take a better look at the pic, go here (http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/414MemorialWeekend2003.jpg). Warning: The pic is "kinda" large! The article was published, October 2003 and the pic was taken Memorial Weekend 2003.
In this pic you can clearly see a light blue fog of CO across the channel.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/414SoundingsMagazine.jpg
Although installing monitors & warning lights might cost the City some extra money in the beginning, I think it may well be worth it in the long run. No different than installing Carbon Monoxide Sensors in our homes....but a little pricier! I feel it would help boaters to be a lot more aware of their surroundings. I know if I looked over and saw a red light showing that the carbon monoxide poisoning was dangerously high, I would take whatever measures necessary to lower it. That combined with one way traffic as well as no boats idling in the channel should drastically reduce the amount of CO poisoning in the atmosphere surrounding the channel. However, one cannot force a fellow boater to act responsibly. The City can only do so much; the rest is up to us.

[Chase]

There was just an article relating to this in a recent power boat magazine as well....

[Keith E. Sayre]

If you close down the channel, copper canyon, sandbar and eventually Steamboat, people won't come here anymore.
If noone comes to Havasu, we'll be bankrupt tonight. Not
tommorrow, not next week, but tonight--early!
Unfortunately, we have elderly folks here in town who hate
the boaters that come on weekends. These kind old people
are probably the ones voting to shut down the channel. They're
the same kind folks that recently voted NO to extra funding for
our kids in the school system so that we could have classes with less than 35 kids in them, and voted to build the aquatic
center rather than buy our kids school buses, and the same ones who are now complaining about the boat noise.
We need to figure up a solution to the channel CO problem
or else we'll lose it completely.
Keith Sayre
Conquest Boats
Lake Havasu City

[Laveyman]

You post crack me up Keith. These old coots cannot hear a fire engine's siren when it is directly behind them on Hwy 95, but they're bitching about boat noise?!?!?!!! I wish Wilbur and Maude would go back to Alberta, Canada and leave these decisions to those that live there full-time. Friggin snowbirds.

[RiverKitty]

Originally posted by Keith E. Sayre
We need to figure up a solution to the channel CO problem
or else we'll lose it completely.
Ok, so what can we do? How can we be proactive as a community??? Is there someway to let our voices be heard??? Any ideas??? Anybody???

[Ziggy]

Apparently the biggest problem seems to be dispursing the poluted air because the largest levels of CO occur when there is very little wind and hot temps. The addition of the new condo/stores along the channal added to the problem.
I suggested over a year ago that they either install some sort of wind producing fans and/or that the LE use fan boats while patroling. These were early on suggestions I voiced WELL before the issue was escalated.
Limiting the number of boats on this lake would be ignorant. There'd be a good chance that 50% of the allowed boats would end up in the channal anyhow so that, IMO, would not do any good and piss off a whole lot of other boaters that spent time and money to be there. Its not that small of a lake. Limiting the number of boats in the channal might be of benefit, or limiting boat parking to one shore(upwind side) of the channal....but even this seems silly considering the wonderful improvements they've made for us to tie up to.
The city officials would be smart to rethink the closing of the other "hotspots" where adequate ventilation is prevelant and add a few patrols to monitor what was previously considered unruley. I'm sure the old blue hairs would rather see that the channal was less provocative and this behavior be relegated back to the sandbar or away from the shorelines in general.
I once was golfing on the island with a couple old coots from Canada when a boat on the lake went by WOT--one of the old guys says something to the effect of wasting money, blah, blah, blah.....I asked him why he belittled a sport he knows nothing of.......he only could say it seemed like non-sense........this is their mentality and many are the visiting people voting on what our summertime activities should be while they're grinding away on their farms---WE can't let them guide OUR boating future.
It just baffles me to no extend how little common sense is used to determine/diagnose problems of this nature, there are solutions if they'd actually think like a human rather than a brain dead "yessir, yesmaam" society. Not only do lawsuits create frivilous financial burdens on cities but it narrows the humans thinking process.
My $2.02 worth of rant. :o)

[Jungle Boy]

Call me crazy, but looking at that photo with the boats jammed in there and the blue fog, I can't say that it would be very fun hanging out there. Not much of a weekend in the fresh air and beauty of Havasu.