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Advantage
01-30-2001, 08:37 PM
Hot Boaters,
I need your assistance. I am in the process of purchasing a boat. Much like Stingray with the 28' Sunsation, I am unsure about which manufacturer to pursue. I have read about several manufacturers including Advantage. The salesmen considers the Advantage the Ferrari of boating, of course. C'mon, is this true?! Does anyone know the performance numbers for a 27' Victory Closed Deck with either the 502 Mag (415 HP) or its 494 HO (425 HP) replacement? Also, how does this boat handle the rough water?
I can get a 27' Victory with a 496 HO powerplant, refrigerator, shore power, sink, blender, cockpit cover, choice of exhaust, and my own paint job for about $70K. Does this seem like a fair price relative to the competition?
I appreciate your feedback regarding my questions.

Zombie
01-31-2001, 06:15 PM
Have you researched Eliminators? I have a 250
Eagle and love it. It's great in the chop, flies over it. Awesome gelcoat, fit and finish, and weight.

Advantage
01-31-2001, 07:45 PM
Zombie,
Thanks for the tip! I'll look at Eliminators and see what they have to offer. I suspect there are several great manufacturers. Dare I say Baja. I primarily boat on the Mississippi in Minnesota. The muscle boat market here is dominated by Formula, Baja, and an occassional Fountain. I want something different; something that will kick those Baja's butts. By the way, what sort of powerplant configuration are you running in your 25' Eliminator? What's kind of top end to you achieve? Thanks.

Zombie
02-01-2001, 06:08 PM
Advantage, my boat, with a stock 454 mag, 26 pitch 4 blade Bravo 1 prop, in 2ft chop achieved 74.2 mph on GPS! Sounds unbelievable doesn't it. I did quite a bit of research before purchasing it, and am glad I did. I also was in the market for a Baja (Hammer), but after doing the math and seeing the difference in quality, the choice became clear. My buddy has a 252 Baja Islander, 454 mag+Procharger, and I still beat him soundly. P.S. the 252 is now for sale! I can't say enough about their step hulls and gelcoat. I like having something different, there are alot of Bajas out there.

Advantage
02-01-2001, 06:44 PM
Wow, that's fast for a 25' boat with a 454 Mag! Perhaps I'll give Eliminators a more thorough look. All my friends run Baja's from 21' Hammers to 33' Outlaws. It would be great to have something unique, not to mention kick their butts. Thanks for the information. Ha, your buddy with the Baja feels shame -- that's why he's selling. Do you mind telling me what kind of options you purchased with your boat?

mydonzi
02-01-2001, 07:05 PM
You don't sound sold yet! Don't rush! Shop and above all ride, like I told Stingray, numbers all sound good, especially from a dealer, hell even everyones posts about speeds on GPS. seeing + believing=buying!
I owned a Formula and moved up to a Donzi 28' and she rocks, but I only bought after a trip to Florida and an awesome ride in what I would buy!
By the way, Baja's look GREAT over my shoulder!
Good luck and happy boating! Dan

Advantage
02-01-2001, 07:11 PM
No, I've read the reports of your boat in Stingray's conversations. You have an impressive Donzi. Are you running twin 350 Mags? Believe me, I am not buying a Baja like all my buds. I want to show up on the river one calm summer day and kick the living snot out of them. Have you read or know about the Advantage line of boats? What do you think of them?

B-rad502
02-01-2001, 08:10 PM
Try the message board on arizona***boats.com. They have a recent post from Chad who has a new 27 Victory with an 800 hp Paul Pfaff motor. He does not sound too impressed with the boat. I've heard that the 27 takes A LOT of power to go fast at all. For 70k you could get a loaded down Sleekcraft 28 or a Magic 29 which are real nice boats. Do your research! Good luck!

Advantage
02-02-2001, 04:06 PM
Man, I can't thank you enough. I checked out your recommendation and Chad is not a satisfied customer. His 27' Victory fell well below his performance expectations. I went one step further and talked to Chad on the phone. His 27' Victory is not at all like Advantage's 32' Victory Factory II racer; of course, that's what the salesmen would have you believe. The 27' hull is simply not designed for speeds in excess of 70 mph. Thanks again for the information. I guess it's back to the drawing board. If only I could afford the 32' Victory with twin 500 EFI's (94.7 mph). Perhaps I'll look at Sunsation.

Zombie
02-02-2001, 06:34 PM
Advantage, my boat came with all the goodies except for the stereo, which I wanted to do myself. Take a look at the Sunsations, they are great looking boats, and reasonably priced. One of the things I didn't care for though, was how narrow the boat is. The cockpit is really cramped.

B-rad502
02-02-2001, 08:18 PM
Advantage, I would also go check out Sleekcraft and Magic if you live out West. The 28' Sleek is going for around 66k with a 496 HO and the Magic 29 is running around 67k with the 496 HO. Very reasonable prices for a well built boat. The Sunsation is also an awesome boat as I stated in the other thread. Good luck, wish we were in the market for a new one right now!
Brad http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif
Originally posted by Advantage:
Man, I can't thank you enough. I checked out your recommendation and Chad is not a satisfied customer. His 27' Victory fell well below his performance expectations. I went one step further and talked to Chad on the phone. His 27' Victory is not at all like Advantage's 32' Victory Factory II racer; of course, that's what the salesmen would have you believe. The 27' hull is simply not designed for speeds in excess of 70 mph. Thanks again for the information. I guess it's back to the drawing board. If only I could afford the 32' Victory with twin 500 EFI's (94.7 mph). Perhaps I'll look at Sunsation.

B-rad502
02-02-2001, 08:18 PM
Advantage, I would also go check out Sleekcraft and Magic if you live out West. The 28' Sleek is going for around 66k with a 496 HO and the Magic 29 is running around 67k with the 496 HO. Very reasonable prices for a well built boat. The Sunsation is also an awesome boat as I stated in the other thread. Good luck, wish we were in the market for a new one right now!
Brad http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif
Originally posted by Advantage:
Man, I can't thank you enough. I checked out your recommendation and Chad is not a satisfied customer. His 27' Victory fell well below his performance expectations. I went one step further and talked to Chad on the phone. His 27' Victory is not at all like Advantage's 32' Victory Factory II racer; of course, that's what the salesmen would have you believe. The 27' hull is simply not designed for speeds in excess of 70 mph. Thanks again for the information. I guess it's back to the drawing board. If only I could afford the 32' Victory with twin 500 EFI's (94.7 mph). Perhaps I'll look at Sunsation.

B-rad502
02-02-2001, 08:20 PM
OOPS, damn computer!!

Advantage27
02-02-2001, 08:49 PM
I am the owner of a 1999 Advantage 27' Victory. I am very pleased with the performance. I have a 502 and Bravo I performance outdrive. The boat will do an honest 66-68 mph. I take mine in the ocean quite a bit and have made a few trips to Catalina Island. I am very happy with this boat and think you should reconsider it as a choice for you next hot boat.

Advantage
02-03-2001, 09:50 AM
Thanks for all the great feedback. My fiance thought I was absolutely NUTS for joining a hot boat forum. In fact, she thinks I spend way too much time on the internet looking at boats already. Well, just look at all the great endorsements we're receiving for Magic, Donzi, Sleekcraft, Advantage, etc. I've learned quite a bit about the manufacturers. One things for sure -- people are passionate about their boats!
Advantage27,
You do an honest 66-68 mph? Was this on a GPS or the radar gun? In talking with several Advantage owners, the best they seem to get out of ther 27' Victory (502 Mag) is 64 mph. In fact, one guy with a '99 Victory had to procharge his 502 Mag with 5 lbs. of boost to get 72 mph. Now, I don't need to be the fastest guy on the river, but I certainly don't want to get beat by my friends' 25' Baja Outlaws either?

Advantage
02-03-2001, 09:57 AM
B-rad502,
I live in St. Paul, Minnesota and do the majority of my boating on the St. Croix and Mississippi rivers. Our market here is dominated by Baja, Formula, and an occassional Fountain. Like I said before, I want something different, fast, and spacious. Currently, I am not looking at twin engine configurations. Do you have any other boat manufacturers in mind? You know, perhaps Eliminator out of Dubuque, Iowa is the answer?

B-rad502
02-04-2001, 05:47 PM
Advantage,
I would go to offshoreonly.com (yes, another performance boating site with a message board!) and tell those guys where you live and see what they recommend. There are a lot of folks from the Eastern half on that board and I'm sure they could give you a lot of good feedback. Good luck! http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

StingRay
02-05-2001, 10:54 AM
Advantage, these sights are great are they not?! You learn the most going to where the wealth of knowledge lies, and that's with our fellow aqua-nuts.
Here's info you could use: I got my latest quote from my nearby Sunsation dealer on Friday. A 2001 28'8" Intimidator, plain white hull for my own graphics, 496HO (72mph), tabs, bolsters, silent-choice, boo-koo other stuff standard, and I pick up (Mich) for $62450+ tax/title. Same package with the HP500 (78-80mph) for $73500. These prices are on the table for me until the end of "boat-show season". Plus they offered to take my Stingray 230SX and go pro-active on selling it to help the buyer (me) while awaiting new manufacture (8-10 weeks). If it doesn't sell by chance, we renegotiate a trade-in price. As you saw under my Sunsation topic, "Brip" got a 2000 PowerQuest 280 loaded with a 502MAG (68-69mph) for 64K and some change.
I say this to provide a yardstick by which to gauge others. Good luck, happy hunting and don't ignore your instincts after all is said and done. I'll keep watching and reading
I can almost hear the thunder and feel the lightning. The time grows near... http://free.***boat.net/ubb/cool.gif

mydonzi
02-05-2001, 11:23 AM
Just remember while were talking numbers a dealer usually has no more than 1.5 to 2 percent play on delivery price with out factory assistance!
Dan

Advantage
02-05-2001, 06:27 PM
Thanks for all the great feedback. You're right, these forums are a great way to disseminate information. I'm more knowledgeable about the manufacturers; however, I am more confused now in which boat to buy. I am going to give the Sunsation a serious look. That's an impressive price considering the performance, length, and list of other goodies.
What goodies did you all get? Did that include shore power, refrigerator, pump-out porta potti, lab finished props, and trailer? And, does that price include a custom paint job? Lastly, are you now considering an HP500. Now that would be one damn fast boat. Thanks for all the great feedback.
My only concern is that there is not a Sunsation dealer within 500 miles of this place. I live in St. Paul, Minnesota and would have to drive a significant way for warranty work. Any ideas???

MNLavey
02-09-2001, 11:50 AM
Advantage,
I would definitely put some weight into the location of the nearest dealer. We bought a 1999 Lavey Craft and though we've been generally happy with the boat and its performance, there were a few things where it would have been nice to have a dealer nearby.
Just something else to think about! Good luck with your decision!

27Fever
02-09-2001, 01:20 PM
Advantage,
I have a 27 Fever and love it. I am running a 500 EFI and the boat will run 74 full of gas and friends, no gas two people 77-78. I have ridden in my friends 27 Fever with a 502 mpi. Great ride but the boat was topped out at 71. What ever boat you get I strongly suggest the 500 EFI with XZ out drive. This package is great, and will perform. Also I love passing the Baja's

32fever
02-10-2001, 12:05 PM
Advantage,
I can understand your need to be unique. That was a concern of mine last year when shopping for a boat. You don't necessarily need a unique brand, but some unique paint can work, too. I am new to the board, so hopefully I am not reiterating things already discussed. We live close to where Powerquests are made. They are very well built boats. I looked at those and Baja and the PQ seem to have better fit and finish and an edge in quality, although having owned a 27' Baja, those are great boats. I never had a lick of trouble with mine with a 454 mag.
Sunsations are painted by a guy not far from us, Mitcher T and boy does he do awesome work. If you are looking at a Sunsation, make sure you consider having him do some custom work, it won't cost much more. He did a 27' Profile (the guy that owns it says they are junk, FYI..he's ready to move up or on) with a beautiful tiger cat type paint job on a yellow boat. It gets more looks than anything else around, people look away from huge Cats and the like at Poker runs and take pictures of his boat instead.
Anyway, in a nutshell, what I found to be the case is the Sunsations are a little narrower beam, so tend to be less stable, Fountain, well you deal with the whole loss of length issues, Active Thunders are great rough water boats, but someone in our area has had their new 37 in the factory for hull cracks mor than on the water. That really bites with a 200k boat. He's bumming rides in Nordics, which seem to be great boats. 3 people here have 35 Flames with 500EDFI's and they are fast and realiable. The 28 Heat I would think would be the same and ride well. (We have a dealer in town here with a left over 28 from 2000 yet with a 502 and triple axle trailer). For your boating, a Sunsation would be a great boat, PQ, Baja, Nordic, or Fountain (but I'm biased here..LOL).
The drawback with boats, especially here in MI, you just can't go to your dealer and hop in for a test drive anytime you want. It's a pain to go for a test in a new boat.
My advice is to opt for the best engine you can, 500 EFI or 500HP if you can swing that. It's well worth the extra money. I have 2 502's in my boat, and Fuel Injection is the hot ticket. Turn and go. I'd get 500 EFI's or 575's in the next time. You can say you will add stuff lster to go faster, but if you can't afford it now, it's not usually any easier later.
Remember, a lot of the fun is just in looking at all the boats!
PS..Formulas are also awesome boats if you can afford the extra prices, but they do have some special rates right now.
Mark
[This message has been edited by 32fever (edited February 10, 2001).]

Advantage27
02-15-2001, 11:01 PM
I have gotten 67 on gps in the salt water. i ususally boat around the Long Beach, CA area. I tend to get close to 64 at Havasu like the others when I run the river. One thing is that the conditions are much different in these two places, Long Beach is 65-75 and at sea level and Havasu is usually 100-110 and at a higher elevation so go figure. All I have to say is that I am very please with the performance of my boat. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif

Advantage
02-16-2001, 08:13 AM
Advantage27 and Fever32,
Thanks for the replies. Your information is appreciated. I am still shopping around and have not yet made a decision. Like I said before, I want something that's different than everyone else's boat. Like Fever32 said, perhaps a custom paint job would satisfy the uniqueness bug. You're right, this would be a great way to stand out among the run of the mill. Thanks again for the information and I will keep you guys informed of my progress. All I need is a unique boat that hauls ass! Why the heck is this so darn difficult, ugh!
[This message has been edited by Advantage (edited February 16, 2001).]

riverracerx
02-22-2001, 01:32 PM
Advantage, try looking at a Nordic. I just bought a 2001 Nordic 28' Heat. It has a 502 for power. It will do 70mph, (only in chop) and about 64-65 in smooth water.
The reason why the Advantages are slower is because they are a heavier boat. Don't get me wrong, they build a nice boat but if you are in Havasu looking at boats, go down two blocks and visit Nordic's shop. They do everything in house and have complete quality control over everything from the trailer to the interior. I love my boat. I traded in a '96 Nordic 22' foot for the new one. Just beware of the promised delivery dates, no matter who you go to. If they say they can do it in four weeks, go somewhere else. A quality boat can't be built in four weeks. Just be patient, it will be worth it in the end! Good luck with your purchase.

32fever
02-22-2001, 08:58 PM
Advantage,
Hey, I know where you are coming from. Sure is hard to find the right boat. It's like I tell my wife, no one boat is ever right. That's why we need more than one. Right now, we only have one, but I'm working her on a second. If we ever have the money, I gotta make my move.
In 5 years or so, she may have to sleep with one eye open. hehehe
Mark

Advantage
02-27-2001, 07:13 PM
32Fever,
Yeah, it's hard to find that perfect boat. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/frown.gif I find something I like about each manufacturer. However, it's been fun looking, dreaming, and discussing options with this board. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif The more research I do the more confused I become. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/confused.gif Now I'm not sure if buying a 27'-28' new boat with a big single engine (say 500EFI) or a 30'-32' used boat with twin engines (454 or 502 Mags) is the best bet. The boats I am looking at are approximately $70-$79K. Any suggestions would be appreciated? Thanks. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif

riverracerx
02-28-2001, 12:00 PM
My 28' Nordic was $79 out the door. Loaded w/ a 502. I love it. But it all comes down to personal opinion about style. If you don't like the way it looks, you won't buy it. Then you have to see how they build it. Good luck w/ your hunt. It is fun. I shopped for two years for my boat. I had to wait for the new step bottom, and I am glad I did. Let me know if you have any other questions. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif

riverracerx
02-28-2001, 12:03 PM
My 28' Nordic was $79 out the door. Loaded w/ a 502. I love it. But it all comes down to personal opinion about style. If you don't like the way it looks, you won't buy it. Then you have to see how they build it. Good luck w/ your hunt. It is fun. I shopped for two years for my boat. I had to wait for the new step bottom, and I am glad I did. Let me know if you have any other questions. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif

roln 20s
03-07-2001, 06:11 PM
Advantage,
I do not know if you have purchased a boat or not, but here is so info that you can use. I am an obsessive performance boater (without a performance boat- we have a malibu ski boat) but I do research daily incase I win the lottery today. I live in AZ so frequently visit Lake Havasu. The performance boat scene there is huge. I recently flew to LA attended the Los Angeles boat show. The others who have posted info for you seem very accurate from what i know. At the boat show, I talked to a gentleman who worked for hot boat on the side and said that Bob Leach (eliminator) makes a great boat. I visited the factory and truely was impressed. The 250 eagle xp which one guy had (on this forum) is a great boat. The performance and quality is there. I have riden in this boat at havasu with a hp 500 efi and we pushed 80 on gps. The ride was great. If this boat interests you, you may want to look at one of their newer models, the 260 which would be my pick. At a foot longer, the cockpit leg space and room is worth it. With the 496 HO you are in your price range and the HP 500 efi is also at the top side of your price range. This boat is built for speed, looks, comfort, hey its a family boat that performs. Another company to look into, (probably my favorite) is DCB (dave's custom boats). THe boats that Dave produces are beyond amazing. His knowledge of boating and experience in the industry shows through his creations. The 28 Extreme will do a gps verified 75 with a HP 500 efi. The boat might be a little stepper in price (not exactly sure) but the quality you are paying for is unprecident in the industry. When visited this factory, outside of san diego, ca, the boats being produced were for people on the east/ midwest. They only make about 40 boats a year and Dave (owner) says that quality is more important than quantity. He could sell a 100 a year, but choices not to. THe wait for a boat is about 8-12 weeks during prime season. It is definately worth it. THe hot boat guys also spoke extremely highly of DCB also, check em out. The eliminator dealer in PHX, AZ just recently started selling sunsations, they are great boats. THe 288 is a great boat, especially for the money. The nordic ads (80 + mph with the 502 mag) are off, as the nordic owner stated (64-67 mph) but the boats are also great. Advantage is a great boat, but I know the guy who had the 27 victory with the pfaff motor and it is a great looking, quality boat however not designed to make other boats in your rear view. THe pfaff owner, since you talked to him, you probably know but he purchased a SIC Howard. This company is also impecible in quality, performance and customer service. The family owning the company are great and willing to work with anyone to make their dreams reality. I've been in many boats, and it is fun to shop but I would have a hard time picking a boat also, I agree with the guy who said that you need more than one. Good luck in your search, and remember that it is your money. Look closely to magazine tests and editor opinions, they do not lie. Check out DCB though, I can't praise their work enough, Dave has a family of loyal workers who dedicate themselves as much as he does.
Good luck,
Patrick
P.S. roln 20s refers to my truck and has nothing to do with boats, eacpet the fact that it is my tow vehicle

h2oedits
03-26-2001, 11:42 PM
Great posts! And thanks for the vote of confidence about Editors shooting straight....
A few thoughts:
The 27’ Victory is a beautiful boat, very well built -- but not the fastest boat in its class, if that's what you're looking for.
Definitely check out DCB, Howard, and Ultra's new 28’ Stealth. Also very pleased with Sunsation's 28, Lavey's 29 NuEra, and Nordic's Heat. All of these are well built, stylish, and FAST.
K. Spaise
Hot Boat

riverracerx
03-27-2001, 09:37 PM
http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif All I can say is I love my new 2001 Nordic 28' Heat. It is a great running boat. You can see it in the channel at Havasu April 6th-8th. Or check it out at:
http://www.riverracerx.com
Check out this site. I am sure you will like it!!

likwidsukr
11-27-2003, 10:47 AM
Hell Yeah good info even old info

spectras only
11-27-2003, 02:46 PM
Advantage , everyone has a favorite here, but nobody mentioned Velocity. They may not be the prettiest hulled boats;) ,but since you've mentioned wanting something different ,I would get a 26 without any graphics and you chose your own powerplant and paint scheme .Their hulls are faster than most hulls mentioned here and I've seen them in action at pokerruns:p . My choice would be a Donzi 26 ZX with single or 28ZX with twin small blocks.They're pretty fast hulls also. I heard the same complaint [ too slow] from Baja owners who would change if they could sell theirs first:p . For serious bluewater a Donzi,Formula or baja 29 or larger [with HP500's] would be better than the california boats though IMHO;)

P P R
12-11-2003, 11:35 AM
wow , alot of smack talken here. I own an outlaw (baja) and i could post, and back up larger speed #'s then you guys are talken about. And when the water gets rough, it only gets better.

KCook
12-12-2003, 10:32 PM
HELLLLOOOOO spectras only and P P R! The last post by Advantage was back in '01 :confused:
Kelly Cook

spectras only
12-13-2003, 05:38 PM
I'll reply again in 2005 ,in case Advantage forgot to look;) :p

91nordic29
01-01-2004, 06:40 AM
Originally posted by riverracerx
Advantage, try looking at a Nordic. I just bought a 2001 Nordic 28' Heat. It has a 502 for power. It will do 70mph, (only in chop) and about 64-65 in smooth water.
The reason why the Advantages are slower is because they are a heavier boat. Don't get me wrong, they build a nice boat but if you are in Havasu looking at boats, go down two blocks and visit Nordic's shop. They do everything in house and have complete quality control over everything from the trailer to the interior. I love my boat. I traded in a '96 Nordic 22' foot for the new one. Just beware of the promised delivery dates, no matter who you go to. If they say they can do it in four weeks, go somewhere else. A quality boat can't be built in four weeks. Just be patient, it will be worth it in the end! Good luck with your purchase.
1991 nordic 28'9", 515 cu, 68 mph. love it.
in my opinion, these boats have the coolest looking "set" in the water. cockpit sits low, nose up. tough looking boat. this will be unique for sure where you are!:cool:

SHAKE-YO-AZZ
01-26-2004, 12:59 AM
[quote]Advantage, my boat, with a stock 454 mag, 26 pitch 4 blade Bravo 1 prop, in 2ft chop achieved 74.2 mph on GPS! Sounds unbelievable doesn't it. I did quite a bit of research before purchasing it, and am glad I did. I also was in the market for a Baja (Hammer), but after doing the math and seeing the difference in quality, the choice became clear. My buddy has a 252 Baja Islander, 454 mag+Procharger, and I still beat him soundly. P.S. the 252 is now for sale! I can't say enough about their step hulls and gelcoat. I like having something different, there are alot of Bajas out there. [\quote]
What boat is this that does 74.2 in 2ft chop with a stock 454mag??????
:D

Kachina26
01-26-2004, 06:17 AM
Originally posted by SHAKE-YO-AZZ
[quote]Advantage, my boat, with a stock 454 mag, 26 pitch 4 blade Bravo 1 prop, in 2ft chop achieved 74.2 mph on GPS! Sounds unbelievable doesn't it. I did quite a bit of research before purchasing it, and am glad I did. I also was in the market for a Baja (Hammer), but after doing the math and seeing the difference in quality, the choice became clear. My buddy has a 252 Baja Islander, 454 mag+Procharger, and I still beat him soundly. P.S. the 252 is now for sale! I can't say enough about their step hulls and gelcoat. I like having something different, there are alot of Bajas out there. [\quote]
What boat is this that does 74.2 in 2ft chop with a stock 454mag??????
:D He has through transom exhaust:D